" it is an interesting theory I give you that but I can in no way believe it"

I dont believe it as well !! I dont even believe in the devil !!

It's just a nice theory to play around with. And i think this really should be allowed on a Prince site...

Regarding all the hand gestures that have been posted by someone else:Imho thats all BS !!! I dont believe in all this "illuminati" stuff!!!

When i said that Prince uses occult imagery i was talking about the ancient "sun sign" that is on the Lovesymbol CD or the "golden dawn" inspired stage set (the endorphine machine) that he used back in 1995 or his references to the "akashic chronicles" etc... "Occult" does mean "esoteric" in this contetxt!

[Edited 2/28/11 6:29am]

I think its more a case of Prince balancing the profane with the sacred by singing that backwards message. Its almost like absolving the guilt of writing something crude!

However, it must be noted that around the same time Prince was recording tracks from the Appolonia 6 album and some of these have occult/esoteric references:

The album cover is quite creepy with Appolonia beckoning the viewer seductively with a focused expression (dare I say it reminiscent of like a witch). Also the contrast with sweet and innocent Susan with the teddy bear.

A Million Miles (I Love You) > refers to beign burnt at the stake (a punishment for witches). It also has the line 'Where's the dawn? Darkness is death, Don't die, live forever and say you love Him'.

Ooh She She Wa Wa > The intro sequence features a rabbit (usually a hare is referenced in witchcraft) and praying for all the people on Neptune. Susan's character is also like an uninitiated child being initiated by Apples and Brenda! The beat and the chant like sound is reminiscent of a worship dance.

Susan also says 'I'm Aquarius' - referring to a belief in astrology which some may consider esoteric.

Great song though - i love the way it suddenly changes and slows down for the second section.

[Edited 2/28/11 11:41am]

[Edited 2/28/11 11:42am]

Soulstar77A said:

^^ But this is exactely what has been mentioned in my original post ?!?!?!?!?

"The backmasking at the end? Certainly a wink at religious zealots who claim that rock is evil, and that Satan hides messages in backwards lyrics"

And do you really think Prince is that kind of facile? Sounds cool when played backwards?? Sorry imho this is way to easy for a real explanation! Then Prince could have used just any kind of sound effect... Why should he use laughter if there are so many better sounding effects?

And why would he use "laughter" when he's so "devotional"?? Sorry, this doesnt fit!

[Edited 2/27/11 14:34pm]

So basically, the one time he explicitly addresses the issue of backwards messages by putting in a message about God..... he's joking?

How do you know all the supposed occult messages, which I'm sure even you agree have to be taken with a grain of salt at the very least, weren't also jokes?

Why is there laughter? It's just as reasonable to believe that he's laughing because he knows that someone went to the effort of trying to find a satanic message only to find the opposite. So he's laughing at the listener.

Srsly. The man dedicates albums to God from pretty much day one and you think it's more reasonable to assume he's worshipping the occult??

This 'laughter' we're referring to, would I be right in assuming it's the 'ah, ah, ah, ah, ah' part - because I never took this to be laughter, at all.

NouveauDance said:

This 'laughter' we're referring to, would I be right in assuming it's the 'ah, ah, ah, ah, ah' part - because I never took this to be laughter, at all.

I'm trying to give people the benefit of the doubt for some things. Although to be fair the darling nikki message does sound pretty creepy when played the right way round and i'm pretty sure it's laughter

I mean there's no reason his sparkly clothes here

[img:$uid]http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/5921/109493091.jpg[/img:$uid]

aren't a reference

to these ones

[img:$uid]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v67/ecnirp2004/Prince/oscars85-2.jpg[/img:$uid]

therefore prince is giving a message to the true believers that he's still all about the Satan.

Well except the fact that that would be nonsense.

I really should get around to listening to that Time song backwards and seeing how evil that bit actually sounds

[Edited 2/28/11 12:35pm]

Yes we're talking about that "ah, ah, ah" part! If it is not laughter what is it then?? Let me guess, just a cool sounding effect

During the backward message Prince could also have said "I know God will come soon" or "Jesus will come soon".But instead of that he used the word "lord". (I dont even dare to mention now that Satanists often refer to Satan as their "lord" ) Combine that with the colour "purple", the "dotted line he signs on" and the "Reign" instead of the "Rain" and you have a very nice theory about a Faustian pact for fame and fortune (And Purple Rain did both for him!).

As i said one hundred times before - it's just nice to play around with this theory !!! I dont belive that Prince worships the devil nor do i claim this! It's just all good fun! (At least for me this is way more entertaining than to discuss always the same silly topics like his favourite food, hair-do, dress, new girlfriend and so on )

What i do claim is, that Prince has used A LOT of occult imagery (or "esoteric" if you prefer that expression) in his work! A good example for this is the strange "symbol" which is printed on the Lovesymbol CD. It consists of an alchemical "sun sign" (circle with a dot in it), a crescent moon (you dont even want to know what it stands for) and some flames (dito). I would post a picture but i dont have one at the moment! If somebody has a scan handy, it would be nice if that person could post it here! (You can find a picture of the alchemical "sun sign" here for example http://www.spelwerx.com/symbols.html)

There are many many more examples for occult imagery and references in Princes work but i leave it at that for now.....

[Edited 2/28/11 13:01pm]

Soulstar77A said:

Yes we're talking about that "ah, ah, ah" part! If it is not laughter what is it then??

Let me guess, just a cool sounding effect

i'm with you here, it's definitely laughter when played the right way round.

During the backward message Prince could also have said "I know God will come soon" or "Jesus will come soon".But instead of that he used the word "lord". (I dont even dare to mention now that Satanists often refer to Satan as their "lord" ) Combine that with the colour "purple", the "dotted line he signs on" and the "Reign" instead of the "Rain" and you have a very nice theory about a Faustian pact for fame and fortune (And Purple Rain did both for him!) ...

maybe. But sure any Christian is just as likely to say Lord.

The song Darling Nikki itself has defintely got some good faustian/woman as satan interpretations but sure so do a million other songs. I wouldn't extend it beyond that song on Purple Rain.

and as for purple, that's MUCH more likely being used as a royalty thing rather than a reference to satan.....

oh what the hell...

God was the flipside to Purple Rain! If that's not proof I don't know what is!!!

As i said one hundred times before - it's just nice to play around with this theory !!! I dont belive that Prince worships the devil nor do i claim this! It's just all good fun! (At least to me this means way more fun than to discuss always the same silly topics like his favourite food, hair-do, new girlfriend and so on )

ah yeah, fair enough

What i do claim is, that Prince used A LOT of occult imagery (or "esoteric" if you prefer that expression) in his work! A good example for this is the strange "symbol which is printed on the Lovesymbol CD. It consist of an alchemical "sun sign" (circle with a dot in it), a crescent moon (you dont want to know what it stands for) and some flames (dito).... I would post a picture but i dont have one at the moment! If somebody has a scan handy, it would be

nice if that person could post it here!

He also loves his conspiracy theories. I can't imagine his interest is especially deep or well-researched

jaawwnn said:

as for purple, that's MUCH more likely being used as a royalty thing rather than a reference to satan.....

Ok i could argue now that "Satan" is the royal highness of Hell.... but of course i dont do!

Soulstar77A said:

jaawwnn said:

as for purple, that's MUCH more likely being used as a royalty thing rather than a reference to satan.....

Ok i could argue now that "Satan" is the royal highness of Hell.... but of course i dont do!

oh man

reading all the lyrics to Purple Rain (the song) as Purple Reign (the song about THE REIGN OF SATAN) is just ridiculous (in the best possible way)

I think all the proof you need that it's not about satan is that he still plays it today!

[Edited 2/28/11 13:22pm]

jaawwnn said:

I think all the proof you need that it's not about satan is that he still plays it today!

You definitely have a point here! Damn.....

Every great "rock act" in history has a rumoured story about a pact with the devil:

The Beatles got one, The Stones got one, Led Zeppelin has one - so Prince just needs to have one as well! Dont you think??

Okay should we start to discuss the "The Time"-backward message now?It says "Here we come 4 you!"

[Edited 2/28/11 14:16pm]

802 said:

I'm sorry, but this is one ridiculous thread. There's no backwards occult message in this song.

Oh, and Prince didn't worship Satan during this period, or any period of his life.

I totally second that thought. Prince is a man of God.

I'm surprised no one has chirped in with the stuff about the Golden Dawn yet.

Back in the 90s, all Prince's stuff about the dawn and gold and alchemy - I remember it was a thing that he was part of the Golden Dawn and a follower of Aleister Crowley etc

I'd actually respect Prince a lot more if this were true.

@ markpeg: Oh this so two pages ago man...

Just read the whole thread and then we can talk okay?

[Edited 2/28/11 14:29pm]

NouveauDance said:

I'm surprised no one has chirped in with the stuff about the Golden Dawn yet.

Back in the 90s, all Prince's stuff about the dawn and gold and alchemy - I remember it was a thing that he was part of the Golden Dawn and a follower of Aleister Crowley etc

I'd actually respect Prince a lot more if this were true.

Too funny....

But hey i did mention this in my first post on this page -> the "golden dawn" inspired stage set (the endorphine machine) that he used back in 1995

[Edited 2/28/11 14:33pm]

If looking through a square made by your fingers means you're a Satanist, then every single motion picture director and professional photographer in history are/were Satanists.

Oh, snap!

Explain this cloak then . . .

It defies any form of explanation, except its Prince in it.

NouveauDance said:

This 'laughter' we're referring to, would I be right in assuming it's the 'ah, ah, ah, ah, ah' part - because I never took this to be laughter, at all.

Same here

OMG this thread

yes, actually what had happened was, prince just got done porkin' the devils sister. sooo he felt like he owed the devil something, so he decided to write the most dark devislish song he could possibly think of at the moment. and that is how darling nikki came to be. soo evviilllll

When u hold the album cover up side down notice the #666 with a penus in front of it.

Also the word EVIL underneath.

jason7sh said:

802 said:

I'm sorry, but this is one ridiculous thread. There's no backwards occult message in this song.

Oh, and Prince didn't worship Satan during this period, or any period of his life.

802, you are wrong, this isn't a rediculous thread and google can not answer everything. In fact, Google sometimes reference this site as a source. You don't know what Prince has done in his life because you don't know him. No need to be defensive about this question, it's a legitimate question. Explain this cloak then . . .

no, but it can answer your question. I googled "backwards message in darling nikki" and the first hit is

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_backmasked_messages

which lists darling nikki

and says

silkylee said:

THE ALL SEEING EYE OCCULT SYMBOL!

I think you're on to something there..... People have eyes...

"It's NOT the devil's sign like we're here with the devil. It's an Italian thing I got from my Grandmother called the "Malocchio". It's to ward off the Evil Eye or to give the Evil Eye, depending on which way you do it. It's just a symbol but it had magical incantations and attitudes to it and I felt it worked very well with Sabbath. So I became very noted for it and then everybody else started to pick up on it and away it went. But I would never say I take credit for being the first to do it. I say because I did it so much that it became the symbol of rock and roll of some kind." Ronnie James Dio (named after mobster Johnnie Dio).

_______________________________________________________________________________

Prince recorded that in 1983, which is around the time fundamentalists were going on about "Stairway to Heaven" having satanic messages when you play it backwards. There were laws actually being passed regarding backwards masking!

It's ludicrous now to think about a rock band being taken to court because of a flippin' song. But at the time, kids killing themselves over music was taken very seriously. Ozzy had to deal with a similar situation. In the 90s, you'll remember Marilyn Manson being the poster boy of evil after Columbine happened, but he wound up in the Michael Moore movie and sounded coherent and intelligent.

You also have cases like the West Memphis 3, where they put three kids behind bars because there's an assumption that they were sacrificing little boys because they listened to metal, but there has never been any absolute proof on them committing the crime, it's only recently they've been able to introduce DNA into the case after almost 20 years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backmasking

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvvLL_oAvus

Bottom line is that Prince was poking fun at the fundamentalists and people who look for secret messages in songs. He decided to intentionally put the message in there and made it about the Lord.

^^ Very interesting and informative post! I have to check out the Memphis 3 case that you mention

802 said:

NouveauDance said:

This 'laughter' we're referring to, would I be right in assuming it's the 'ah, ah, ah, ah, ah' part - because I never took this to be laughter, at all.

Same here

Again: What it is then if it is not laughter?? "

This "Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha" still sounds like laughter to me. Especially when it is played with the correct speed....

TheFreakerFantastic said:

I think its more a case of Prince balancing the profane with the sacred by singing that backwards message. Its almost like absolving the guilt of writing something crude!

However, it must be noted that around the same time Prince was recording tracks from the Appolonia 6 album and some of these have occult/esoteric references:

The album cover is quite creepy with Appolonia beckoning the viewer seductively with a focused expression (dare I say it reminiscent of like a witch). Also the contrast with sweet and innocent Susan with the teddy bear.

A Million Miles (I Love You) > refers to beign burnt at the stake (a punishment for witches). It also has the line 'Where's the dawn? Darkness is death, Don't die, live forever and say you love Him'.

Ooh She She Wa Wa > The intro sequence features a rabbit (usually a hare is referenced in witchcraft) and praying for all the people on Neptune. Susan's character is also like an uninitiated child being initiated by Apples and Brenda! The beat and the chant like sound is reminiscent of a worship dance.

Susan also says 'I'm Aquarius' - referring to a belief in astrology which some may consider esoteric.

Now I have to pull out that album again... Which is a good thing!

[Edited 3/1/11 1:36am]

alandail said:

jason7sh said:

no, but it can answer your question. I googled "backwards message in darling nikki" and the first hit is

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_backmasked_messages

which lists darling nikki and says

"Hello, how are you? Fine, fine. 'Cause I know that the Lord is coming soon. Coming, coming soon", followed by thirty-seven "hah"s.

WIKIPEDIA SUCKS!

It's: "Hello, how are you? I'M FINE 'Cause I know that Lord is coming soon, AGAIN", followed by thirty-seven "hah's"

Soulstar77A said:

^^ Very interesting and informative post! I have to check out the Memphis 3 case that you mention

Check out "Paradise Lost" on DVD and the sequel, it's been out for a while. It's a good documentary worth checking out. The wm3 dot org site has info. Celebs like Johnny Depp have taken part in protests, signed stuff to raise money, and worn "Free the WM3" t-shirts a while back. It kind of drops off for a while, then makes its way back in the news.

It really makes you think about the justice system in America, and anyone who is up for the death penalty should be there when there's 100 percent evidence. The guy in Arizona... there's absolute evidence, no doubt who did it, and whatever the state decides, so be it. But when the evidence isn't so ironclad and there's some reasonable doubt? It becomes a civil liberties issue. If you've seen "12 Angry Men", pretty much the same principle, except someone's life is on the line here.

If they did do it, and the DNA evidence supports it, then fine. But any sort of reasonable doubt destroys the credibility of the court system.

And if you watch the documentary about Roman Polanski, he left as a fugitive because the court wanted to make an example out of him as a celebrity, not just because he sexually assaulted a teenage girl. She's even said enough is enough and feels more violated by the media dredging this up than by what he did to her.And to me, a woman in her 50s who can forgive an incident over 30 years ago should be dismissed. But because he fled, if he ever steps foot in the US again, they're putting him away.

silkylee said:

When u hold the album cover up side down notice the #666 with a penus in front of it.

Also the word EVIL underneath.

I can't see EVIL underneath the penus, do I need glasses?

Soulstar77A said:

TheFreakerFantastic said:

I think its more a case of Prince balancing the profane with the sacred by singing that backwards message. Its almost like absolving the guilt of writing something crude!

However, it must be noted that around the same time Prince was recording tracks from the Appolonia 6 album and some of these have occult/esoteric references:

The album cover is quite creepy with Appolonia beckoning the viewer seductively with a focused expression (dare I say it reminiscent of like a witch). Also the contrast with sweet and innocent Susan with the teddy bear.

A Million Miles (I Love You) > refers to beign burnt at the stake (a punishment for witches). It also has the line 'Where's the dawn? Darkness is death, Don't die, live forever and say you love Him'.

Ooh She She Wa Wa > The intro sequence features a rabbit (usually a hare is referenced in witchcraft) and praying for all the people on Neptune. Susan's character is also like an uninitiated child being initiated by Apples and Brenda! The beat and the chant like sound is reminiscent of a worship dance.

Susan also says 'I'm Aquarius' - referring to a belief in astrology which some may consider esoteric.

Now I have to pull out that album again... Which is a good thing!

[Edited 3/1/11 1:36am]

It's a cool album!

Its interesting that references to "the dawn" are made as early as this period, well before the 90's songs that are well known to have mentions of "the dawn."

I think the PR or UTCM film has 'May you live to see the dawn' at the end too, leaving some people to speculate that he belonged to a freemasonry type group such as the Order of the Golden Dawn...

Its worth noting that some Prince iconography feature an all seeing eye - a common icon used by freemasons, however the jury is out.....

[Edited 3/1/11 13:30pm]