Cerebus said:

Really cool that people are still hearing some of this stuff (possibly) for the first time. Really sad that it's still being sold for large sums of money. It's all easily found for free, so unless you want a shiny plastic cover there really isn't a need to pay for it.

i wanted a nice shiny plastic cover, inlay and printed discs ...worth it tho....prefer if the dosh went 2 prince...but it was worth it

Optimus2 said:

Cerebus said:

Really cool that people are still hearing some of this stuff (possibly) for the first time. Really sad that it's still being sold for large sums of money. It's all easily found for free, so unless you want a shiny plastic cover there really isn't a need to pay for it.

i wanted a nice shiny plastic cover, inlay and printed discs ...worth it tho....prefer if the dosh went 2 prince...but it was worth it

It bothers me (and some others, I gather) that this is still happening, but if the price was comfortable for you, so be it. It's not like you're the only one doing it - you were just the one willing to create a thread about it. I just hope it was at least a somewhat reasonable price. (Did you already mention that and I missed it?)

Cerebus said:

Optimus2 said:

i wanted a nice shiny plastic cover, inlay and printed discs ...worth it tho....prefer if the dosh went 2 prince...but it was worth it

It bothers me (and some others, I gather) that this is still happening, but if the price was comfortable for you, so be it. It's not like you're the only one doing it - you were just the one willing to create a thread about it. I just hope it was at least a somewhat reasonable price. (Did you already mention that and I missed it?)

in english money 45 pounds......however as comfitable as i am payin that.....maybe it shouldnt be so expensive considering its only a bootlegg...i mean last year i paid that 4 rave in2 the joy fantastic...AND THAT WAS AN ORIGINAL!!!

Optimus2 said:

Cerebus said:

It bothers me (and some others, I gather) that this is still happening, but if the price was comfortable for you, so be it. It's not like you're the only one doing it - you were just the one willing to create a thread about it. I just hope it was at least a somewhat reasonable price. (Did you already mention that and I missed it?)

in english money 45 pounds......however as comfitable as i am payin that.....maybe it shouldnt be so expensive considering its only a bootlegg...i mean last year i paid that 4 rave in2 the joy fantastic...AND THAT WAS AN ORIGINAL!!!

Well, I have two thoughts on that. First, 45 pounds seems like a lot of money for a boot to me. But I guess it's only about $10 (American) per disc when you break it down. I've just never, ever been a bootleg purchaser, so it's hard for me to wrap my head around such things.

Second, it's just as criminal that Prince hasn't kept small pressings of Rave In2 The Joy Fantastic in circulation so that people don't have to pay such ridiculous prices.

Cerebus said:

Optimus2 said:

in english money 45 pounds......however as comfitable as i am payin that.....maybe it shouldnt be so expensive considering its only a bootlegg...i mean last year i paid that 4 rave in2 the joy fantastic...AND THAT WAS AN ORIGINAL!!!

Well, I have two thoughts on that. First, 45 pounds seems like a lot of money for a boot to me. But I guess it's only about $10 (American) per disc when you break it down. I've just never, ever been a bootleg purchaser, so it's hard for me to wrap my head around such things.

Second, it's just as criminal that Prince hasn't kept small pressings of Rave In2 The Joy Fantastic in circulation so that people don't have to pay such ridiculous prices.

yeah ur right....prince is the only artist im aware of...were fans have this problem...and we have 2 find cds etc by other means........he and warner should release a 12 inch collection themselves...wudda been sooo cool....oh well this transformer can dream ....got more chance of me heading back 2 cybertron...tut

Cerebus said:

Optimus2 said:

i wanted a nice shiny plastic cover, inlay and printed discs ...worth it tho....prefer if the dosh went 2 prince...but it was worth it

It bothers me (and some others, I gather) that this is still happening, but if the price was comfortable for you, so be it. It's not like you're the only one doing it - you were just the one willing to create a thread about it. I just hope it was at least a somewhat reasonable price. (Did you already mention that and I missed it?)

Bizarre... Why not just make your own art since that's precisely what happened. It's not like the pressed shit is legit Prince artwork.

I would never pay for a boot.

Spinlight said:

Cerebus said:

It bothers me (and some others, I gather) that this is still happening, but if the price was comfortable for you, so be it. It's not like you're the only one doing it - you were just the one willing to create a thread about it. I just hope it was at least a somewhat reasonable price. (Did you already mention that and I missed it?)

Bizarre... Why not just make your own art since that's precisely what happened. It's not like the pressed shit is legit Prince artwork.

I would never pay for a boot.

I don't get it either. I've been a ravenous music collector from age 14 on and I've NEVER understood it. I would always pick up the boots and look at them, then look at the price and realize I could buy three (or more) official albums for the same amount. Screw that! By the time I actually understood why people would be willing to pay so much Audiogalaxy was rolling strong. I'm pretty sure that I've still never purchased a bootleg by any artist. But hey, some people feel the need and I'm not going to judge that. I just hope their conscience is cool with the fact that they gave somebody money for something that they don't actually own, without putting any in the pocket of the person who does.

In the mid 80's when i first started to collect music seriously, we had to pay for bootlegs, if you really wanted everything from an artist. There was no downloading then, i remember going to record fairs and buying tapes of Prince concerts etc, my first copy of The Black Album was on tape. As the years rolled on cd replaced the tapes, but we still had to buy them, if we wanted them.

But in this day and age, there is no excuse to be buying bootlegs really. Even a technophobe like me has managed to work out how to search, download and listen for free (with a few pointers from good people).

Places like ioffer are crazy, and it is sad to see the prices people are paying.

I'm very grateful for the internet, and the ability to download.

errant said:

the Beautiful extended club mix always has skips in it, no matter how many times I come across this hoping that it has no errors.

Same here. The following tracks have skips on my version:

"TMBGITW (Beautiful Extended Club Mix)" @ ~2:20/3:10

"Gett Off (Damn Near 10 Minutes)" @ ~5:05/5:50/9:08

These are minor flaws, but I hear them everytime.

I've downloaded the set several times over the years. Always the same problems on those two tracks.

Wondering if the skips are on Timothy's "original" CD-Rs...

What ever happened to (T11@mindspring.com)?

I remember he was some kind of engineer or something at P Park and he stole a bunch of tapes and made $$ off of it.

If Prince can't get the 12" stuff out to the people, someone has to. That's how I see it. Stuff like the Mountains extended version, Kiss, Pop Life, Shes Always In my Hair etc needs to be heard. That is what made him stand so far out from any of his peers.

JoeyCococo said:

What ever happened to (T11@mindspring.com)?

I remember he was some kind of engineer or something at P Park and he stole a bunch of tapes and made $$ off of it.

If Prince can't get the 12" stuff out to the people, someone has to. That's how I see it. Stuff like the Mountains extended version, Kiss, Pop Life, Shes Always In my Hair etc needs to be heard. That is what made him stand so far out from any of his peers.

do u know what he stole? what type of songs? and from what period? how fascinating

I love all of you on this forum. I don't come here as often as I use to, but when ever I do ya'll always drop something new on me. I had never heard of T's 12" archive. It's nice to know that these songs can still be had. I once had em' all on vinyl then along came life. And no I don't love you just because ya'll put it out there, I read some of the funniest and most informative stuff about Prince right here on this forum. Thank you all and Happy New Year!

Optimus2 said:

JoeyCococo said:

What ever happened to (T11@mindspring.com)?

I remember he was some kind of engineer or something at P Park and he stole a bunch of tapes and made $$ off of it.

If Prince can't get the 12" stuff out to the people, someone has to. That's how I see it. Stuff like the Mountains extended version, Kiss, Pop Life, Shes Always In my Hair etc needs to be heard. That is what made him stand so far out from any of his peers.

do u know what he stole? what type of songs? and from what period? how fascinating

from what I remember, he mostly worked at the NPG store and occasionally got thrown a bone to do some engineering work or something. my assumption (big one, of course, since I haven't bothered to think or read about T in many years) is that a lot of what he had came from tapes/discs that were sent over to the store to be played or from hot chicks he knew that he would parade around in front of Prince who would then try to impress them by giving them a tape.

errant said:

Optimus2 said:

do u know what he stole? what type of songs? and from what period? how fascinating

from what I remember, he mostly worked at the NPG store and occasionally got thrown a bone to do some engineering work or something. my assumption (big one, of course, since I haven't bothered to think or read about T in many years) is that a lot of what he had came from tapes/discs that were sent over to the store to be played or from hot chicks he knew that he would parade around in front of Prince who would then try to impress them by giving them a tape.

ha ha... T is around and posts in places. And he did also hang out with musicians that worked for Prince back then, and would get to hear/see/get things that way too (demo cassettes, cd's, videos). I'm glad he let that clear Rebirth of the Flesh mp3 out a few years ago. I only have a snippet in full wav quality though.

I've never asked him for anything all this time, because if it's his copies (as in they are in his possession) he can share it if he wants, sell it if he wants. I know he has stuff I'd love to hear!

Optimus2 said:

just recieved a copy god ud think it was an original release...with the casing and the way the discs are printed...what an amazing collection!!!......the songs sound amazing 2 nice crisp and clear ....however bit dissapointed in some 12 inch versions...most are just added instrumentals...with no added lyrics....thought the housequake (7 min mno quake)...was a waste of bloody time....no singin at all ..however im in love with God (Instrumental)...beautiful ...what u guys think of it?

Blasphemy! The MoQuake is great!!

T's archive? I don't actually have it, I got it via lossless FLAC for free off the internet, which is dead.

I also own most of the 80s maxi singles on vinyl.

[Edited 12/30/10 11:22am]

A vast majority of the 12 inches and a good number of the cd maxis can be found in any major city with a good used record store, as well as on the internet. There's only a small percentage of this stuff that's really rare. And that rare stuff can be found other ways if you're not interesting in putting money in a bootleggers pocket (although that's really not much different than putting money in a used record store owners pocket when you get right down to it - just feels more honest to me).

Cerebus said:

A vast majority of the 12 inches and a good number of the cd maxis can be found in any major city with a good used record store, as well as on the internet. There's only a small percentage of this stuff that's really rare. And that rare stuff can be found other ways if you're not interesting in putting money in a bootleggers pocket (although that's really not much different than putting money in a used record store owners pocket when you get right down to it - just feels more honest to me).

I own all the vinyl 12" outside of Let's Work... but I still apreciated the work it took to find pristine vinyl, and put it to CD on audiophile standard equipment. That's what T did. I don't have the money for a real high quality turntable, I do have a regular one from the 80's that I listened to even today!
And my 12" prince stuff has been played over and over, and is currently in storage.

ufoclub said:

Cerebus said:

A vast majority of the 12 inches and a good number of the cd maxis can be found in any major city with a good used record store, as well as on the internet. There's only a small percentage of this stuff that's really rare. And that rare stuff can be found other ways if you're not interesting in putting money in a bootleggers pocket (although that's really not much different than putting money in a used record store owners pocket when you get right down to it - just feels more honest to me).

I own all the vinyl 12" outside of Let's Work... but I still apreciated the work it took to find pristine vinyl, and put it to CD on audiophile standard equipment. That's what T did. I don't have the money for a real high quality turntable, I do have a regular one from the 80's that I listened to even today!
And my 12" prince stuff has been played over and over, and is currently in storage.

I understand the work he did to create the release. I've done geeky stuff like that with some Prince recordings myself. But anytime I've done that it's been freely distributed to friends or the internet. The idea of making money off somebody elses recordings has never entered my mind. And "pristine vinyl"? I don't know how anybody gets any kind of credit for doing that. Like I said, a majority of this stuff is pretty easily found if you really want to own it. Most copies still sound pretty damn good. Many of them are in great condition. Anybody could do the same work to make the converted records sound "better" with just a little bit of a learning curve. I guess it just makes more sense to me with something like unreleased tracks, rehearsals or concerts (although I'll still never pay for them myself). Still, glad people are hearing these great tunes.

Cerebus said:

ufoclub said:

I own all the vinyl 12" outside of Let's Work... but I still apreciated the work it took to find pristine vinyl, and put it to CD on audiophile standard equipment. That's what T did. I don't have the money for a real high quality turntable, I do have a regular one from the 80's that I listened to even today!
And my 12" prince stuff has been played over and over, and is currently in storage.

I understand the work he did to create the release. I've done geeky stuff like that with some Prince recordings myself. But anytime I've done that it's been freely distributed to friends or the internet. The idea of making money off somebody elses recordings has never entered my mind. And "pristine vinyl"? I don't know how anybody gets any kind of credit for doing that. Like I said, a majority of this stuff is pretty easily found if you really want to own it. Most copies still sound pretty damn good. Many of them are in great condition. Anybody could do the same work to make the converted records sound "better" with just a little bit of a learning curve. I guess it just makes more sense to me with something like unreleased tracks, rehearsals or concerts (although I'll still never pay for them myself). Still, glad people are hearing these great tunes.

Also:

When T released this crap, there was no artwork. He put the CDRs in paper sleeves and drew a doodle on them. lol. The 20 bucks a disc was just for his own workmanship.

Do all copies have the same skip on "Face Down (A Capella)?"I believe the song is about 2:21 seconds long but on this collection it's closer to three minutes. On all the copies I've heard at about 2:05 it skips back to about 1:36 which extends the song by about 29 seconds.

rialb said:

Do all copies have the same skip on "Face Down (A Capella)?"I believe the song is about 2:21 seconds long but on this collection it's closer to three minutes. On all the copies I've heard at about 2:05 it skips back to about 1:36 which extends the song by about 29 seconds.

That seems to be a big jump. It seems that people have skips on different tracks.

Mine is on Gett Off Damn Near 10 Mins Mix, and it is only (approx) 1 second.

Apart from that, no problems.

[Edited 12/30/10 15:41pm]

ufoclub said:

ha ha... T is around and posts in places. And he did also hang out with musicians that worked for Prince back then, and would get to hear/see/get things that way too (demo cassettes, cd's, videos).

Yep. I remember T from AMP and I'd sometimes chat with him at NPGMC - he had some great behind-the-scenes stories from his time at the store and especially when he was at Paisley Park!

JoeyCococo said:

What ever happened to (T11@mindspring.com)?

I remember he was some kind of engineer or something at P Park and he stole a bunch of tapes and made $$ off of it.

If Prince can't get the 12" stuff out to the people, someone has to. That's how I see it. Stuff like the Mountains extended version, Kiss, Pop Life, Shes Always In my Hair etc needs to be heard. That is what made him stand so far out from any of his peers.

T never worked at Paisley Park, only in his imagination!

Spinlight said:

Cerebus said:

I understand the work he did to create the release. I've done geeky stuff like that with some Prince recordings myself. But anytime I've done that it's been freely distributed to friends or the internet. The idea of making money off somebody elses recordings has never entered my mind. And "pristine vinyl"? I don't know how anybody gets any kind of credit for doing that. Like I said, a majority of this stuff is pretty easily found if you really want to own it. Most copies still sound pretty damn good. Many of them are in great condition. Anybody could do the same work to make the converted records sound "better" with just a little bit of a learning curve. I guess it just makes more sense to me with something like unreleased tracks, rehearsals or concerts (although I'll still never pay for them myself). Still, glad people are hearing these great tunes.

Also:

When T released this crap, there was no artwork. He put the CDRs in paper sleeves and drew a doodle on them. lol. The 20 bucks a disc was just for his own workmanship.

Actually I have both issues of the 12" archive he put out, from him personally, and I thought they all had nice cd labels taken from artwork elements appropriate from the period. I can double check the older one, but I do know the last one he issued has nice color labels. He once even asked me to design artwork for his Dream Factory release, which I thought had gone unused but I did see the design pop up with a different font superimposed here a while back. It has a train, and Wendy and Lisa in a picture frame as part of the collage. Anyone have that version?

ufoclub said:

Spinlight said:

Also:

When T released this crap, there was no artwork. He put the CDRs in paper sleeves and drew a doodle on them. lol. The 20 bucks a disc was just for his own workmanship.

Actually I have both issues of the 12" archive he put out, from him personally, and I thought they all had nice cd labels taken from artwork elements appropriate from the period. I can double check the older one, but I do know the last one he issued has nice color labels. He once even asked me to design artwork for his Dream Factory release, which I thought had gone unused but I did see the design pop up with a different font superimposed here a while back. It has a train, and Wendy and Lisa in a picture frame as part of the collage. Anyone have that version?

yeah I wanted the remastered version of partyman....but not the instrumental 1....think its called the video mox.....its only on the 1st version.....not on the 2nd (wich i have

Optimus2 said:

just recieved a copy god ud think it was an original release...with the casing and the way the discs are printed...what an amazing collection!!!......the songs sound amazing 2 nice crisp and clear ....however bit dissapointed in some 12 inch versions...most are just added instrumentals...with no added lyrics....thought the housequake (7 min mno quake)...was a waste of bloody time....no singin at all ..however im in love with God (Instrumental)...beautiful ...what u guys think of it?

I think it is great to hear all of the 12 inches on CD is just incredible.