if they were actually released on the intended albums would we still see them as such great songs or is it just the outtake status which makes them special?

Moonbeam Levels should absolutely be on 1999 in place of Free.

Genesia said:

Moonbeam Levels should absolutely be on 1999 in place of Free.

I have to agree with that

I think it's pretty undeniable that there are MANY great outtakes, some of which are definitely better than corresponding era album tracks. Some were never part of any planned album, but still kick serious ass all over any NUMBER of album tracks. Then there are some outtakes that deserved to be outtakes, but would still make a nice collected release if compiled together.

Genesia said:

Moonbeam Levels should absolutely be on 1999 in place of Free.

Yes indeed.

I think of the hundreds of various outtakes, snippets and varied versions that are out there, there are probably a good 30 to 40 songs that are absolutely top shelf material. I consider many of them to be better than songs that made the album sessions they were recorded during.

That's to mention some of the web based releases that have never officially been available on a silver CD.

That being said, that does leave HUNDREDS of songs that to my ears could never emerge from the vault and I'd be just fine.

(Of course, the fact that Prince has hundreds of unreleaseed songs is crazy enough to begin with, but that's another story)....

ravein2thejoy said:

if they were actually released on the intended albums would we still see them as such great songs or is it just the outtake status which makes them special?

I think the fact that they are outtakes and were at one point difficult (relatively speaking) to get your hands on gave them an air of awe and mystery which they wouldn't otherwise have had.

I remember being a bit dissapointed with Moonbeam Levels the first time I heard it - it's still a great song but nothing like the song I was led to expect. The way it was talked about with such reverence I guess it could never have lived up to the hype.

On the whole though, a great song is a great song regardless of where it appears.

I can't imagine Purple Music for instance being received with any less enthusiasm had it appeared on <insert name of whatever album it was supposed to appear on>

I don't think that anyone worships Living 2 Die

A little from column A, a little from column B.

NouveauDance said:

A little from column A, a little from column B.

paisleypark4 said:

I think "I miss you" should definitely have been on "For You". I started loving that song all over again back in 2004 - for some reason after his Grammy performance I really could picture... dare I say it? Beyonce singing this song.

Fenwick said:

Genesia said:

Moonbeam Levels should absolutely be on 1999 in place of Free.

Yes indeed.

I think of the hundreds of various outtakes, snippets and varied versions that are out there, there are probably a good 30 to 40 songs that are absolutely top shelf material. I consider many of them to be better than songs that made the album sessions they were recorded during.

Also Prince has a bad habit of over mixing his tracks. A lot of his songs sounded better in their early raw stages.

paisleypark4 said:

Genesia said:

Moonbeam Levels should absolutely be on 1999 in place of Free.

I have to agree with that

Genesia said:

Moonbeam Levels should absolutely be on 1999 in place of Free.

Yes indeed. Moonbeam Levels is FAR superior to Free.

ravein2thejoy said:

if they were actually released on the intended albums would we still see them as such great songs or is it just the outtake status which makes them special?

50/50.

I have to agree that Moonbeams was and is still a incredible song. Me personally, I feel that "Let's pretend we are married" should've been edited down to say 4 min and Moonbeams would've fit perfectly on side two on 1999. The song just screams Queen and it sooooooo represents Prince's sound on the 1999 album beautiful, complex, bizarre, and funky all at the same time... Aaron6ix

I believe Extra Lovable and Feel U Up were recorded during the Controversy sessions, if so they should of replaced Ronnie Talk to Russia and Annie Christian, the two cuts that I skip, lol!!

[Edited 10/21/10 10:26am]

SEANMAN said:

Genesia said:

Moonbeam Levels should absolutely be on 1999 in place of Free.

Yes indeed. Moonbeam Levels is FAR superior to Free.

I'm not really a big fan of either song. Which lends credence to the idea that Prince's ENTIRE unreleased music catalogue is important. The "vault" tracks are no different than the album tracks. I'm sure somebody likes/dislikes every song to some degree. In most cases there's probably a large number of people who would fall to either side with a few sprinkled across the middle for good measure.

Abdul said:

they should of replaced Ronnie Talk to Russia and Annie Christian, the two cuts that I skip,

NouveauDance said:

Abdul said:

they should of replaced Ronnie Talk to Russia and Annie Christian, the two cuts that I skip,

He always looks so genuinely pissed off there, and her so genuinely surprised.

Cerebus said:

NouveauDance said:

He always looks so genuinely pissed off there, and her so genuinely surprised.

She was. They didn't tell her ahead of time that he was going to do that.

Genesia said:

Cerebus said:

He always looks so genuinely pissed off there, and her so genuinely surprised.

She was. They didn't tell her ahead of time that he was going to do that.

I think I knew that, but it still amazes me every time I see her head, like, snap back and to the side. He kind of pauses for a second, too. Like, "oh shit". But he never breaks character. Just an awesome scene. Pretty good movie, too.

days o wild should have definatly been on GOLD

replacing...hmm dunno about that

mebbes we march?

jonylawson said:

days o wild should have definatly been on GOLD

replacing...hmm dunno about that

mebbes we march?

It doesn't need to replace anything - Days of Wild was removed at the last minute and wasn't replaced by another song. It originally appeared (along with an NPG Operator segue) inbetween "We March" and "The Most Beautiful Girl In The World".

ravein2thejoy said:

if they were actually released on the intended albums would we still see them as such great songs or is it just the outtake status which makes them special?

Mostly the latter.

If Moonbeam Levels had appeared on 1999 instead of Free, everyone would be going on about how good Free was and that Prince should have put it on the album instead!

I think a lot of fans view Prince's outtakes with rose-tinted glasses, and I particularly disagree with the fan-mindset that views most outtakes as masterpieces and most released tracks as rubbish. It's ridiculous! Personally, I think Prince gets his choices right over 90% of the time.

"The Beautiful Ones" IS a better song than "Electric Intercourse". "Darling Nikki" IS a better choice than "G-Spot". Also, a lot of the time, tracks are discarded because they're too similar to another slightly better (or more appropriate) track. i.e. you couldn't include "Free" AND "Moonbeam Levels" on the same album, just as you couldn't really include "Crucial" and "Adore" on the same record. It just wouldn't really work in that context. However, I do agree that it's a great shame that a lot of these tracks never saw some kind of release as B-sides etc. "All My Dreams" is a great track, but Prince was right not to include it on Parade. It worked perfectly on Dream Factory instead, and of course when that was shelved, so was "All My Dreams" as it didn't fit with the Sign O' The Times tracks. It's all about context and making sure albums hold together cohesively. So some great tracks will inevitably fall by the wayside because they don't fit with whatever the current album concept/vibe is.

BorisFishpaw said:

ravein2thejoy said:

if they were actually released on the intended albums would we still see them as such great songs or is it just the outtake status which makes them special?

Mostly the latter.

If Moonbeam Levels had appeared on 1999 instead of Free, everyone would be going on about how good Free was and that Prince should have put it on the album instead!

I think a lot of fans view Prince's outtakes with rose-tinted glasses, and I particularly disagree with the fan-mindset that views most outtakes as masterpieces and most released tracks as rubbish. It's ridiculous! Personally, I think Prince gets his choices right over 90% of the time.

"The Beautiful Ones" IS a better song than "Electric Intercourse". "Darling Nikki" IS a better choice than "G-Spot". Also, a lot of the time, tracks are discarded because they're too similar to another slightly better (or more appropriate) track. i.e. you couldn't include "Free" AND "Moonbeam Levels" on the same album, just as you couldn't really include "Crucial" and "Adore" on the same record. It just wouldn't really work in that context. However, I do agree that it's a great shame that a lot of these tracks never saw some kind of release as B-sides etc. "All My Dreams" is a great track, but Prince was right not to include it on Parade. It worked perfectly on Dream Factory instead, and of course when that was shelved, so was "All My Dreams" as it didn't fit with the Sign O' The Times tracks. It's all about context and making sure albums hold together cohesively. So some great tracks will inevitably fall by the wayside because they don't fit with whatever the current album concept/vibe is.

Boris you are a fucking genius.

100% spot on.

That's why I miss the days of the old 12 inch single.

A lot of those cuts made the 12 inches of the past like She's Always In My Hair.

NouveauDance said:

Abdul said:

they should of replaced Ronnie Talk to Russia and Annie Christian, the two cuts that I skip,

Outtakes are indeed overrated but I'm quite sure that you can pretty easily create an outtake compilation that is much more worthwile than the stuff he releases nowadays.