Hello there org-ers. I read somewhere some time ago that this would be the original sequence/versions on the unreleased 1986-album by Camille:

Rebirth Of The Flesh (4:53 only one version available as far as we know, so that's clear)

Housequake (SOTT version 4:41)

Strange Relationship (SOTT version 4:00)

Feel U Up (long stroke 6:30)

Shockadelica (extended 6:12)

Good Love (version as on Bright Lights Big City 5:11)

If I Was Your Girlfriend (SOTT-mix without the intro 4:48)

Rockhard In A Funky Place (version as on Black Album 4:31)

But how can we be sure? Did somebody know close by? Why not f.e. the 7 min MoQuake as there are also extended mixes on both Feel U Up + Shockadelica. What I also find fascinating is that the Camille-album was supposed to be released without any mention of Prince on the record or sleeve. No problem, I get that. But was puzzles me is that all tracks have the upspeeded Camille-voice to enhance the suspence, except for Strange Relationship which is undeniable the voice of Prince singing normal ...... ???!!! Anyway, just some questions which are puzzling. On the other hand, it would have been one of his greatest album ever recorded/released if it did come out. To that effect you should gather the sequence onto a cdR for yourself to hear the original concept of the album. I asure you, you will be playing that CD loads of times.

[Edited 9/5/10 6:01am]

[Edited 9/5/10 6:02am]

[Edited 9/5/10 6:16am]

there's been fan made configs of the cd for over 10 years. one that i did added the black album on the end

the moquake mix is a dub mix and probbaly done at a later date than the original. it omits most of the vocals, thus why it wouldn't fit, whereas whilst some tracks are called "extended" versions they are really just the full length versionsn of tracks with the 7" b sides being edited versions, so feel u up and shockadelica are just the full length versions really, so it's pretty much the normal versions of tracks on the album

cinnamonboy said:

Hello there org-ers. I read somewhere some time ago that this would be the original sequence/versions on the unreleased 1986-album by Camille:

Rebirth Of The Flesh (4:53 only one version available as far as we know, so that's clear)

Housequake (SOTT version 4:41)

Strange Relationship (SOTT version 4:00)

Feel U Up (long stroke 6:30)

Shockadelica (extended 6:12)

Good Love (version as on Bright Lights Big City 5:11)

If I Was Your Girlfriend (SOTT-mix without the intro 4:48)

Rockhard In A Funky Place (version as on Black Album 4:31)

But how can we be sure? Did somebody know close by? Why not f.e. the 7 min MoQuake as there are also extended mixes on both Feel U Up + Shockadelica. What I also find fascinating is that the Camille-album was supposed to be released without any mention of Prince on the record or sleeve. No problem, I get that. But was puzzles me is that all tracks have the upspeeded Camille-voice to enhance the suspence, except for Strange Relationship which is undeniable the voice of Prince singing normal ...... ???!!! Anyway, just some questions which are puzzling. On the other hand, it would have been one of his greatest album ever recorded/released if it did come out. To that effect you should gather the sequence onto a cdR for yourself to hear the original concept of the album. I asure you, you will be playing that CD loads of times.

[Edited 9/5/10 6:01am]

[Edited 9/5/10 6:02am]

[Edited 9/5/10 6:16am]

No.

No? Ok, maybe you're right: it was slightly speeded up, but not as much as the other tracks. I mean, Prince's voice is much more clearly throughout the track, wouldn't you say?

You guys are really debating the speed of the tape now???? LOL

ernestsewell said:

You guys are really debating the speed of the tape now???? LOL

Not a debate.

I don't understand why some people ALWAYS have to change the tune of a discussion here. It's always the same (and mostly, it's the same person actually!). If you don't care about the subject or you find it exagerrated or whatever, then simply move on to the next thread. Yes, I AM actually discussing the speed of the tape, or if you would have read better: the speed of Prince's voice. So what are you gonna do about it, Sewell - arrest me?

cinnamonboy said:

I don't understand why Ernest ALWAYS has to change the tune of a discussion here. It's always the same (and mostly, it's Ernest actually!). If you don't care about the subject or you find it exagerrated or whatever, then simply move on to the next thread. Yes, I AM actually discussing the speed of the tape, or if you would have read better: the speed of Prince's voice. So what are you gonna do about it, Sewell - arrest me?

Don't get your panties in a twist, big girl. But it's a moot point, isn't it? The album is the album, and the songs that were intended for it were Camille songs. That was your question, and I'm not sure what else you hope to get through the discussion. "Well THAT doesn't sound as much like Prince as THAT one does." Who cares?! It's all Prince. Camille isn't some magical person or engima - it's Prince doing what he does best, putting on a disguise and putting out more music, or at least attempting to.

If you google the SOTT album on wikipedia, you'll at least find this:

Two of the album's songs were first recorded in 1982: "Strange Relationship" and "I Could Never Take the Place of Your Man". Prince did additional work on both for their placement on the Dream Factoryproject and involved Wendy & Lisa on the former. When the project was canceled, "Strange Relationship" was further updated for Camille.

Your question was "how can we be sure?". Well, here's how. First you go to www.google.com Type "Prince Camille". See the first result that says "Unreleased Prince Projects"? Yeah, THAT. Click it.

Now see the list? Yeah, see where it says "Camille"? Yeah, THAT. Click it. And here's what you'd find:

Camille is an unreleased album by Prince, recorded in 1986. The album was planned to consist of 8 tracks recorded by the singer in a funky, sped up vocal. The album was to be released under the name Camille (who would not be pictured on the cover) and not as a Prince album. Much of the music has been released officially in some form or another, however, one song, "Rebirth of the Flesh" remains unreleased in its original form. In 2001, a live rehearsal of "Rebirth of the Flesh" recorded with the Sign "☮" the Times band was released on Prince's Web site. This version, however, had profanity edited from the lyrics. The album was canceled weeks prior to its release in favor of the more ambitious Sign "☮" the Times album. The concept itself was also abandoned and most of the tracks were incorporated intoCrystal Ball, which evolved into Sign "☮" the Times.

1. "Rebirth of the Flesh": Prince recorded this song at Sunset Sound on October 28, 1986, on the same day as "Rockhard in a Funky Place". When the Camille album was shelved, the song was slated for inclusion on Prince's next album project, Crystal Ball. It was going to be the opening track segueing into "Play in the Sunshine". The NPG Music Club made a 1988 Lovesexy Tour rehearsal recording available in September 2001, which means that all the Camille tracks have now been officially released, although the original studio version remains unofficially released on bootlegs.
2. "Housequake"
3. "Strange Relationship"
4. "Feel U Up": This outtake was recorded toward the end of 1981 and was taped in sequence with "Irresistible Bitch". Both songs were re-recorded later. "Feel U Up" was re-recorded in 1986 and the lyrics of both recordings are very similar. The track was finally released in 1989 as the B-side of "Partyman".
5. "Shockadelica": Originally written (unsolicited) by Prince in response to Jesse Johnson's then-forthcoming album titled Shockadelica (1986) because that album had no song to match/compliment what Prince felt was such a great album title. "Shockadelica" was later included as a B-side of "If I Was Your Girlfriend".
6. "Good Love": Released on the Bright Lights, Big City film soundtrack in 1988.
7. "If I Was Your Girlfriend"
8. "Rockhard in a Funky Place": Also included on The Black Album (1987) project.

Two other songs were credited to Camille after the album project was abandoned. The first was "Scarlet Pussy", which was released as the B-side of the 1988 single "I Wish U Heaven" featuring a black label with the artist Camille credited in deep peach. Also, "U Got the Look", which appeared on Sign "☮" the Times and was also released as a single. The video was recorded in France while Prince was on tour and the video was later added into the film Sign "☮" the Times.

Prince would later resurrect the character of Camille for the 1988 Lovesexy tour. Within the show, "Camille" sang in a low tone, with Prince's vocal filtered to sound slower. It is often reported in error that "Camille" is simply Prince with a sped up vocal style. Prince has used this technique on numerous occasions, uncredited to Camille. Prince confirms in the Lovesexy tour book that "Camille" is the creator of "The Black Album".

We can be sure because there were a lot of folks around at any given time. Engineers, band members, whoever. People take notes, keep journals. Recording studios keep logs and make tickets and write receipts for studio time and what was accomplished there, if anything. That's how we know. That's how Per Nilson, Alex Hahn, Dave Hill and the dozens of other folks who have written books on Prince know what was on the Camille project, or what was on Dream Factory or Crystal Ball, or why Vanity left, or that Morris was on cocaine, etc etc. It's not a big secret world. It's still business at the end of the day, and folks record/write down/journal everything around them.

Now before you go and get your knickers in a bigger twist, think about the fact that you have almost all the 411 in front of you that you wanted.

You're welcome.

cinnamonboy said:

Why not f.e. the 7 min MoQuake as there are also extended mixes on both Feel U Up + Shockadelica.

MoQuake is a remix, done later. Without checking any sources, I'm going to refer to memory and say that Feel U Up and Shockadelica 'extended' versions are the original versions, which were later edited down for single edits.

ernestsewell said:

cinnamonboy said:

I don't understand why Ernest ALWAYS has to change the tune of a discussion here. It's always the same (and mostly, it's Ernest actually!). If you don't care about the subject or you find it exagerrated or whatever, then simply move on to the next thread. Yes, I AM actually discussing the speed of the tape, or if you would have read better: the speed of Prince's voice. So what are you gonna do about it, Sewell - arrest me?

Don't get your panties in a twist, big girl. But it's a moot point, isn't it? The album is the album, and the songs that were intended for it were Camille songs. That was your question, and I'm not sure what else you hope to get through the discussion. "Well THAT doesn't sound as much like Prince as THAT one does." Who cares?! It's all Prince. Camille isn't some magical person or engima - it's Prince doing what he does best, putting on a disguise and putting out more music, or at least attempting to.

If you google the SOTT album on wikipedia, you'll at least find this:

Your question was "how can we be sure?". Well, here's how. First you go to www.google.com Type "Prince Camille". See the first result that says "Unreleased Prince Projects"? Yeah, THAT. Click it.

Now see the list? Yeah, see where it says "Camille"? Yeah, THAT. Click it. And here's what you'd find:

Camille is an unreleased album by Prince, recorded in 1986. The album was planned to consist of 8 tracks recorded by the singer in a funky, sped up vocal. The album was to be released under the name Camille (who would not be pictured on the cover) and not as a Prince album. Much of the music has been released officially in some form or another, however, one song, "Rebirth of the Flesh" remains unreleased in its original form. In 2001, a live rehearsal of "Rebirth of the Flesh" recorded with the Sign "☮" the Times band was released on Prince's Web site. This version, however, had profanity edited from the lyrics. The album was canceled weeks prior to its release in favor of the more ambitious Sign "☮" the Times album. The concept itself was also abandoned and most of the tracks were incorporated intoCrystal Ball, which evolved into Sign "☮" the Times.

1. "Rebirth of the Flesh": Prince recorded this song at Sunset Sound on October 28, 1986, on the same day as "Rockhard in a Funky Place". When the Camille album was shelved, the song was slated for inclusion on Prince's next album project, Crystal Ball. It was going to be the opening track segueing into "Play in the Sunshine". The NPG Music Club made a 1988 Lovesexy Tour rehearsal recording available in September 2001, which means that all the Camille tracks have now been officially released, although the original studio version remains unofficially released on bootlegs.
2. "Housequake"
3. "Strange Relationship"
4. "Feel U Up": This outtake was recorded toward the end of 1981 and was taped in sequence with "Irresistible Bitch". Both songs were re-recorded later. "Feel U Up" was re-recorded in 1986 and the lyrics of both recordings are very similar. The track was finally released in 1989 as the B-side of "Partyman".
5. "Shockadelica": Originally written (unsolicited) by Prince in response to Jesse Johnson's then-forthcoming album titled Shockadelica (1986) because that album had no song to match/compliment what Prince felt was such a great album title. "Shockadelica" was later included as a B-side of "If I Was Your Girlfriend".
6. "Good Love": Released on the Bright Lights, Big City film soundtrack in 1988.
7. "If I Was Your Girlfriend"
8. "Rockhard in a Funky Place": Also included on The Black Album (1987) project.

Two other songs were credited to Camille after the album project was abandoned. The first was "Scarlet Pussy", which was released as the B-side of the 1988 single "I Wish U Heaven" featuring a black label with the artist Camille credited in deep peach. Also, "U Got the Look", which appeared on Sign "☮" the Times and was also released as a single. The video was recorded in France while Prince was on tour and the video was later added into the film Sign "☮" the Times.

Prince would later resurrect the character of Camille for the 1988 Lovesexy tour. Within the show, "Camille" sang in a low tone, with Prince's vocal filtered to sound slower. It is often reported in error that "Camille" is simply Prince with a sped up vocal style. Prince has used this technique on numerous occasions, uncredited to Camille. Prince confirms in the Lovesexy tour book that "Camille" is the creator of "The Black Album".

We can be sure because there were a lot of folks around at any given time. Engineers, band members, whoever. People take notes, keep journals. Recording studios keep logs and make tickets and write receipts for studio time and what was accomplished there, if anything. That's how we know. That's how Per Nilson, Alex Hahn, Dave Hill and the dozens of other folks who have written books on Prince know what was on the Camille project, or what was on Dream Factory or Crystal Ball, or why Vanity left, or that Morris was on cocaine, etc etc. It's not a big secret world. It's still business at the end of the day, and folks record/write down/journal everything around them.

Now before you go and get your knickers in a bigger twist, think about the fact that you have almost all the 411 in front of you that you wanted.

You're welcome.

OK, very nice all this. Actually, I have had the Wikipedia-page of all unreleased Prince-projects as a bookmark for years, so yes I read this story several times. But does it say anywhere what versions of the tracks are supposed to be there? No, it doesn't, does it? THAT was the initial question I was just wondering about and wanted to explore (with people I can talk with). But that has always been your problem up till this very day, Ernest: just keep your asswipe-nose budding in where it's not wanted. You're the one who's one pathetic little girl here actually......

[Edited 9/5/10 9:31am]

Last time I discussed about this it wasn't absolutely clear that the version of Good Love was the one from BLBC instead of the one on Crystal Ball (98).

vitriol said:

Last time I discussed about this it wasn't absolutely clear that the version of Good Love was the one from BLBC instead of the one on Crystal Ball (98).

Yes, I couldn't find any reference to this either, but it has been said in the past that the version of Good Love on Camille is the shorter version, where as the 'Good Love pt.2' section was added later when the album metamorphised into Crystal Ball.

Regarding Strange Relationship: The different speed and inclusion of the song may have more to do with Camille as a project than meets the eye. It's very possible that Strange Relationship begat the entire Camille idea when Prince decided to up the tempo of the already re-recorded track by speeding up the tape. He would later on do the same for U Got The Look. An educated guess would be that Prince liked the odd sound of the sped up version of Strange Relationship, which had been revisited a couple times since 1982, and it fostered the idea to quickly record those five Camille-specific songs in such a short time.

The fact that Camille was thought of, recorded and brought to fruition so fast is probably exactly what killed the project. Prince hadn't spent enough time on the Camille LP to "fall in love" with it as his next album and second-guessed it out of existence.

NouveauDance said:

vitriol said:

Last time I discussed about this it wasn't absolutely clear that the version of Good Love was the one from BLBC instead of the one on Crystal Ball (98).

Yes, I couldn't find any reference to this either, but it has been said in the past that the version of Good Love on Camille is the shorter version, where as the 'Good Love pt.2' section was added later when the album metamorphised into Crystal Ball.

Its never been confirmed, but I'd be pretty surprised if the BLBC version was not the same as the version on Camille.

For a start, long version is the only one known to exist in 1988.

Secondly, an edit in 1998 could simply be Prince trying his luck with WB, to see what he could get away with.

Thirdly, prince's later "extensions" has always been sloppy, Its usually very obvious when the extended versions are simply the longer original recordings (ie Pop Life, Fill U up, She's always in my hair) rather than extended in a separate recording session (ie Lets Work, Kiss and Thieves In The Temple)

The CB version sounds like an edit of the BLBC version, rather that the BLBC version sounding like a extended version of the CB version.

^I already knew all that.

But I think I read a post by Borisfishpaw stating that the CB version was in fact done back in 1986 and that one could very well be the version on Camille.

Can I just say that, based on that tracklisting, Camille would have been one awesome album?!

savoirfaire said:

Can I just say that, based on that tracklisting, Camille would have been one awesome album?!

Hell yeah it would have!

Camille would have been a fucking awesome album and I would have loved to have seen how Prince went about promoting it visually.

Regarding "Strange Relationship", I can never decide which version I prefer - the SOTT version or the original Dream Factory version with the sitars and such. They both rock.

Militant said:

Camille would have been a fucking awesome album and I would have loved to have seen how Prince went about promoting it visually.

Regarding "Strange Relationship", I can never decide which version I prefer - the SOTT version or the original Dream Factory version with the sitars and such. They both rock.

He should have recorded the First Avenue version (from the 4 Those of U On Valium boot) and put that on there! But as far as the two you mentioned, the earlier one w/ the sitars is what's awesome for me.

ernestsewell said:

Militant said:

Camille would have been a fucking awesome album and I would have loved to have seen how Prince went about promoting it visually.

Regarding "Strange Relationship", I can never decide which version I prefer - the SOTT version or the original Dream Factory version with the sitars and such. They both rock.

He should have recorded the First Avenue version (from the 4 Those of U On Valium boot) and put that on there! But as far as the two you mentioned, the earlier one w/ the sitars is what's awesome for me.

I like the version from the Lovesexy Dortmund show too.

Umm... wasn't there an actual promo of this album that existed internally? With all the Camille versions in their final sequence? I'm pretty sure there is. A lot of the versions used on Camille are just slightly different than some of the others that are floating around or were used on later albums. And I believe there's a couple songs that fade into each other at their end/beginning. I'm probably wrong as usual. Don't know a dang thing about tape speeds, though.

[Edited 9/6/10 0:28am]

Cerebus said:

Umm... wasn't there an actual promo of this album that existed internally? With all the Camille versions in their final sequence? I'm pretty sure there is. A lot of the versions used on Camille are just slightly different than some of the others that are floating around or were used on later albums. And I believe there's a couple songs that fade into each other at their end/beginning. I'm probably wrong as usual. Don't know a dang thing about tape speeds, though.

Probably, since a test pressing of a possible Camille single was made with Shockadelica and Housequake on it.

Cerebus said:

Umm... wasn't there an actual promo of this album that existed internally?

Apparently, but it has never turned up, and no recording has been made available, so we do the best we can.

Cerebus said:

Umm... wasn't there an actual promo of this album that existed internally? With all the Camille versions in their final sequence? I'm pretty sure there is. A lot of the versions used on Camille are just slightly different than some of the others that are floating around or were used on later albums. And I believe there's a couple songs that fade into each other at their end/beginning. I'm probably wrong as usual. Don't know a dang thing about tape speeds, though.

[Edited 9/6/10 0:28am]

A testpressing was made and even had a cat. #...

Neversin.

Neversin said:

Cerebus said:

Umm... wasn't there an actual promo of this album that existed internally? With all the Camille versions in their final sequence? I'm pretty sure there is. A lot of the versions used on Camille are just slightly different than some of the others that are floating around or were used on later albums. And I believe there's a couple songs that fade into each other at their end/beginning. I'm probably wrong as usual. Don't know a dang thing about tape speeds, though.

[Edited 9/6/10 0:28am]

A testpressing was made and even had a cat. #...

Neversin.

OK. Cool. I have that (as MP3s, of course).

Cerebus said:

I have that (as MP3s, of course)

You most likely have a patchwork jobbie like everyone else.

NouveauDance said:

Cerebus said:

I have that (as MP3s, of course)

You most likely have a patchwork jobbie like everyone else.

Nope. 99% certain that it's the internal test pressing version. It's not the same as the patchwork jobbie, which I also have.

Cerebus said:

NouveauDance said:

You most likely have a patchwork jobbie like everyone else.

Nope. 99% certain that it's the internal test pressing version. It's not the same as the patchwork jobbie, which I also have.

Interesting. AFAIK, it is not circulating, but I would LOVE to be proved wrong!

vitriol said:

^I already knew all that.

But I think I read a post by Borisfishpaw stating that the CB version was in fact done back in 1986 and that one could very well be the version on Camille.

It could well be. But there isn't a shed of evidence to say which version was on the Camille album.

ernestsewell said:

cinnamonboy said:

I don't understand why Ernest ALWAYS has to change the tune of a discussion here. It's always the same (and mostly, it's Ernest actually!). If you don't care about the subject or you find it exagerrated or whatever, then simply move on to the next thread. Yes, I AM actually discussing the speed of the tape, or if you would have read better: the speed of Prince's voice. So what are you gonna do about it, Sewell - arrest me?

Don't get your panties in a twist, big girl. But it's a moot point, isn't it? The album is the album, and the songs that were intended for it were Camille songs. That was your question, and I'm not sure what else you hope to get through the discussion. "Well THAT doesn't sound as much like Prince as THAT one does." Who cares?! It's all Prince. Camille isn't some magical person or engima - it's Prince doing what he does best, putting on a disguise and putting out more music, or at least attempting to.

If you google the SOTT album on wikipedia, you'll at least find this:

Your question was "how can we be sure?". Well, here's how. First you go to www.google.com Type "Prince Camille". See the first result that says "Unreleased Prince Projects"? Yeah, THAT. Click it.

Now see the list? Yeah, see where it says "Camille"? Yeah, THAT. Click it. And here's what you'd find:

Camille is an unreleased album by Prince, recorded in 1986. The album was planned to consist of 8 tracks recorded by the singer in a funky, sped up vocal. The album was to be released under the name Camille (who would not be pictured on the cover) and not as a Prince album. Much of the music has been released officially in some form or another, however, one song, "Rebirth of the Flesh" remains unreleased in its original form. In 2001, a live rehearsal of "Rebirth of the Flesh" recorded with the Sign "☮" the Times band was released on Prince's Web site. This version, however, had profanity edited from the lyrics. The album was canceled weeks prior to its release in favor of the more ambitious Sign "☮" the Times album. The concept itself was also abandoned and most of the tracks were incorporated intoCrystal Ball, which evolved into Sign "☮" the Times.

1. "Rebirth of the Flesh": Prince recorded this song at Sunset Sound on October 28, 1986, on the same day as "Rockhard in a Funky Place". When the Camille album was shelved, the song was slated for inclusion on Prince's next album project, Crystal Ball. It was going to be the opening track segueing into "Play in the Sunshine". The NPG Music Club made a 1988 Lovesexy Tour rehearsal recording available in September 2001, which means that all the Camille tracks have now been officially released, although the original studio version remains unofficially released on bootlegs.
2. "Housequake"
3. "Strange Relationship"
4. "Feel U Up": This outtake was recorded toward the end of 1981 and was taped in sequence with "Irresistible Bitch". Both songs were re-recorded later. "Feel U Up" was re-recorded in 1986 and the lyrics of both recordings are very similar. The track was finally released in 1989 as the B-side of "Partyman".
5. "Shockadelica": Originally written (unsolicited) by Prince in response to Jesse Johnson's then-forthcoming album titled Shockadelica (1986) because that album had no song to match/compliment what Prince felt was such a great album title. "Shockadelica" was later included as a B-side of "If I Was Your Girlfriend".
6. "Good Love": Released on the Bright Lights, Big City film soundtrack in 1988.
7. "If I Was Your Girlfriend"
8. "Rockhard in a Funky Place": Also included on The Black Album (1987) project.

Two other songs were credited to Camille after the album project was abandoned. The first was "Scarlet Pussy", which was released as the B-side of the 1988 single "I Wish U Heaven" featuring a black label with the artist Camille credited in deep peach. Also, "U Got the Look", which appeared on Sign "☮" the Times and was also released as a single. The video was recorded in France while Prince was on tour and the video was later added into the film Sign "☮" the Times.

Prince would later resurrect the character of Camille for the 1988 Lovesexy tour. Within the show, "Camille" sang in a low tone, with Prince's vocal filtered to sound slower. It is often reported in error that "Camille" is simply Prince with a sped up vocal style. Prince has used this technique on numerous occasions, uncredited to Camille. Prince confirms in the Lovesexy tour book that "Camille" is the creator of "The Black Album".

We can be sure because there were a lot of folks around at any given time. Engineers, band members, whoever. People take notes, keep journals. Recording studios keep logs and make tickets and write receipts for studio time and what was accomplished there, if anything. That's how we know. That's how Per Nilson, Alex Hahn, Dave Hill and the dozens of other folks who have written books on Prince know what was on the Camille project, or what was on Dream Factory or Crystal Ball, or why Vanity left, or that Morris was on cocaine, etc etc. It's not a big secret world. It's still business at the end of the day, and folks record/write down/journal everything around them.

Now before you go and get your knickers in a bigger twist, think about the fact that you have almost all the 411 in front of you that you wanted.

You're welcome.

You're quite the condescending know-it-all dickhead, arent you?