Marrk said:

Thought provoking, but ultimately much more to dislike than to enjoy on this one.

do you mean the music or the lyrics or both?

robinhood said:

Marrk said:

Thought provoking, but ultimately much more to dislike than to enjoy on this one.

do you mean the music or the lyrics or both?

Lyrics.

It just doesn't sit right with me. People can try to explain away Prince's naive worldview all they like, but my opinion of it won't ever change.

Marrk said:

robinhood said:

do you mean the music or the lyrics or both?

Lyrics.

It just doesn't sit right with me. People can try to explain away Prince's naive worldview all they like, but my opinion of it won't ever change.

sure, i can respect that. do you like the music? i think its really soothing and chill.

robinhood said:

Marrk said:

Lyrics.

It just doesn't sit right with me. People can try to explain away Prince's naive worldview all they like, but my opinion of it won't ever change.

sure, i can respect that. do you like the music? i think its really soothing and chill.

I like everything on TRC musically.

robinhood said:

here's another context which is interesting to me:

Like a thief in the night, my Lord come and strike
Leave nothing but ashes 2 the left, dust 2 the right
Holocaust aside, many lived and died
But when all truth is told, would U rather be dead or be sold?

could he be saying that the Lord is responsible for many deaths and many saved lives, not including the holocaust? because he doesnt believe the Lord is responsible for the Holocaust?

Maybe, though I can't think of a reasonable theological justification (ie. emotions aside) for how God is responsible for all life and death except for the holocaust...

Also, the first line is actually a biblical reference (ie. "For you yourselves know quite well that Jehovah’s day is coming exactly as a thief in the night."-1 Thessalonians 5:2) and it is referring to the end of days, so I think the holocaust is more a reference to who lives and dies when all's said and done and it's 'game over', so to speak.

maybe better to die by the hand of the Lord than be sold as slaves?

Sold 2 the one who can now mate
The displaced bloodline with the white jailbait
Thinkin' like the keys on Prince's piano will be just fine

the keys on Prince's piano are black and white yes?

That's true, it may even be drawing a parallel of sorts between the slaves of Egypt and those of America, being that the slaves that Moses led were obviously willing to die rather than continue living in bondage.

My comment was more drawing on his reference to "the one"; ie. who is "the one" in this context? When humans mess things up to the extent that they are selling each other like property, are we effectively tipping the scales and handing over control to the Devil? But being that I don't actually believe in the Devil, my attempted interpretation here is sketchy at best.

"The one" of course might be as straightforward as one of the slave owners and it may not have any further esoteric or biblical implications.

And yes, all of that aside, I've always thought the piano line was a bit of an "ebony, ivory" reference that lets the heavy stuff go for the time being and segues nicely into a lighter ending to the track, both musically and lyrically.

Yeah, we gon' be fine

So there it is - 4 all 2 see
Now what's beyond U and me
Depends my friends primarily
On how U view your role in eternity

If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
Then one day she might be queen

still wondering how the previous lines relate to being a pharaoh's muse?

There are a couple of other lines earlier on in the track that explain that, I feel:

Take a load off sweetie darling
Let me run agenda through your hair
There's so much information 4 the next generation
Who gonna drop it if U're not there?

and

Get busy, big baby cuz when dem devil come
Dem devil come dressed as light
Maybe they gon' fool the untrained mind
But nobody I know gon' bite

The idea being that the muse needs to be up on all of this if she's going to make it as queen.

You could even go back to the symbol album for that one, this time to Sexy MF:

Why all the cosmic talk?
I just want u smarter than I'll ever be
When we take that walk

all that aside, wouldnt it be funny if he just makes this stuff up as he goes and doesnt give it a second thought once he's done with it?

hehehe...I wouldn't be surprised.

Still, I think he'd be tickled (if not a little bemused) by the idea that his lyrics create so much debate

Chiquetet said:

There are a couple of other lines earlier on in the track that explain that, I feel:

Take a load off sweetie darling
Let me run agenda through your hair
There's so much information 4 the next generation
Who gonna drop it if U're not there?

and

Get busy, big baby cuz when dem devil come
Dem devil come dressed as light
Maybe they gon' fool the untrained mind
But nobody I know gon' bite

The idea being that the muse needs to be up on all of this if she's going to make it as queen.

You could even go back to the symbol album for that one, this time to Sexy MF:

Why all the cosmic talk?
I just want u smarter than I'll ever be
When we take that walk

cuz apparently she doesnt have thoughts of her own and must certainly be dumber than him unless he educates her? lol - classic prince. but i think i understand where he's coming from.

the Sexy MF mention reminds me of this reference to another card, apart from the Queen:

"next time you play a card it better be a ace mother fucker or you can lay face down"

"when that devil come dressed as light,

he didnt bite once, he bit twice, alrite

the devil wit da blues jeans on, (she so 'nice')

and the man in the hat with the shiny white grin,

that hat man wow such a wide wide brim

cock-a-doodle eyes, not one but two,

but only the one knows who's lookin at who"

i agree with prince when he says the truth comes like a thief in the night.

interesting discussion and thanks again for sharing your thoughts.

robinhood said:

cuz apparently she doesnt have thoughts of her own and must certainly be dumber than him unless he educates her? lol - classic prince. but i think i understand where he's coming from.

Ooo, controversial I want to defend him but...but...oh, Prince. lol

He'll get it sorted eventually, truly he will...

i agree with prince when he says the truth comes like a thief in the night.

indeed

interesting discussion and thanks again for sharing your thoughts.

and thank you

I've been poolside here for some time, it was nice to take a dip

Ankhesenamun said:

Love this song..

Sorry if going off topic but I really don't want to start a new thread. What do u folks think about Sensual Everafter and Mellow? I think with this album to understand it, you really have to look at it as a whole and understand Prince's mind at that time.

If u were wondering I love the 2 songs I just listed along with the one being talked about. They both along with this one are very intoxicating.

Ankhesenamun said:

robinhood said:

love this slow jam, so cool and chill, such a sweet smooth vocal performance, and the lyrics are great too (imo)

do you like this song? and what do you make of the lyrics?

If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
Then one day she might be queen
If like Sheba, she then could bring presents and wine
The helix - he might get between them
In other words - intertwine
With the ebony and milk of her thighs
If she could be muse and let him decide
Perhaps she'll let him decide

If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
There is nothing, nothing he wouldn't give her, see? (No)
4 the future of the nation rests in her belly
And if the Proverb of the 31 and verse 10
Becomes the song she sings again and again
She might be queen

If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
One day she might be queen

Take a load off sweetie darling
Let me run agenda through your hair
There's so much information 4 the next generation
Who gonna drop it if U're not there?
And whether the enemy makes a run on the palace
Or whether the enemy does not
The children will be laced with the protection of the word of God
The opposite of NATO is OTAN
And if the number 13 is such a bad luck number
When there's no such thing as luck
Then the berries, talons, arrows and stars
All are superstitions, what the ....
Get busy, big baby cuz when dem devil come
Dem devil come dressed as light
Maybe they gon' fool the untrained mind
But nobody I know gon' bite
Like a thief in the night, my Lord come and strike
Leave nothing but ashes 2 the left, dust 2 the right
Holocaust aside, many lived and died
But when all truth is told, would U rather be dead or be sold?
Sold 2 the one who can now mate
The displaced bloodline with the white jailbait
Thinkin' like the keys on Prince's piano will be just fine
Yeah, we gon' be fine

So there it is - 4 all 2 see
Now what's beyond U and me
Depends my friends primarily
On how U view your role in eternity

If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
Then one day she might be queen

If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh

(if she could inspire him like Sheba did King Solomon)

Then one day she might be queen

(the choice of being with him and he making the eternal choice of being with him (eternally kingdom of heaven))

If like Sheba, she then could bring presents and wine

(sheba went on a journey because she heard of a King (solomon); for whom he was wise with the divine wisdom of proper judgement, compassion for the kingdom and love for all- before he fell with 10,000 women... he did manage to take care of everything from top to bottom in the Kingdom because his whole being was the choices thru the service of GOD within the choices)

The helix - he might get between them

(helix is the body dna... .Y and X chromosome mixed with the divine energy of conception)

In other words - intertwine

(Intertwine - conception / creation of a baby thru divine intervention of God's will)

With the ebony and milk of her thighs

(THIS IS SELF EXPLANATORY and needs no input)

If she could be muse and let him decide

(This is about him deciding when they would get married)

Perhaps she'll let him decide

(She pushing him into deciding to get married)

If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh

(If she could just inspire him and not bring him down - she would be queen in his kingdom - (kingdom within (heart) "in my house there are many mansions (within the body the kingdom of divine love... the unification of Jehovah GOD's baptism in the word)

There is nothing, nothing he wouldn't give her, see? (No)

(upon unification - everything, as a man's responsibility would be supported / nourished to her)

4 the future of the nation rests in her belly

(The future baby of 2045)

And if the Proverb of the 31 and verse 10

(If she submitted unto him, as he submitted to GOD Jehovah)

Becomes the song she sings again and again

(The Song of Solomon - Beloved to Beloved foreverlasting life)

She might be queen

(Queen again the Kingdom within - true love unified with God Jehovah)

If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
One day she might be queen

Take a load off sweetie darling

(Stop trying to push him into marriage and just go with the flow)

Let me run agenda through your hair

(Agenda through the hair = thoughts of destiny)

There's so much information 4 the next generation

(Truth to be seeded to the generations to come from the baby to be born, as with the two into one)

Who gonna drop it if U're not there?

(If she never stops fearing enough to actually allow him to guide her... then at some point, she may not be there to be with him)

And whether the enemy makes a run on the palace

(Enemy (temptation) tries to enter his heart)

Or whether the enemy does not

(Enemy (temptation) does not enter his heart)

The children will be laced with the protection of the word of God

(The seed / DNA TRUTH OF GOD will be within them and protect them when the DEVIL tries to tempt or pursuade)

The opposite of NATO is OTAN

NATO/OTAN * The system of the Seed of CAIN (the first SIN)

And if the number 13 is such a bad luck number

(13 is not bad luck. it does not exist (12 disciples and Jesus Christ is 13)

When there's no such thing as luck

(that is explained - there is no such thing as luck - there is only the faith in GOD and the service thru his WILL to do the right thing)

Then the berries, talons, arrows and stars

(The Seal of the Unites States include global talisman's from symbolism in a system)

All are superstitions, what the ....

(GOD Jehovah did not invent a man made system... therefore, it isn't truth)

Get busy, big baby cuz when dem devil come

Dem devil come dressed as light

(STUDY THE WORD OF GOD for THE TRUTH is TRUTH but there are sheeps in wolves clothing)

Maybe they gon' fool the untrained mind

(Untrained = Does not study the WORD of GOD and can be fooled by people, who speak to know but are only fooling those, who don't know the WORD of GOD)... to be told lies.

But nobody I know gon' bite

(All the people he will have around her and he, KNOW the WORD of GOD and TRUTH)

Like a thief in the night, my Lord come and strike

(When God Jehovah comes- he will come like a thief in the night)... REVELATIONS New World Translation Bible

Leave nothing but ashes 2 the left, dust 2 the right

(New World Translation - REVELATIONS - what will become)

Holocaust aside, many lived and died

(Example - WHEN GOD JEHOVAH comes - will you be with GOD JEHOVAH in TRUTH or be extinct)

But when all truth is told, would U rather be dead or be sold?

(Simple: Do you follow or do you lead?) Either you know the truth or you don't.

Sold 2 the one who can now mate

(Will you make the choice to be with the right one)

The displaced bloodline with the white jailbait

(The Seed of Either ADAM or the Seed of Satan - will you continue with GOD JEHOVAH bloodline or will you allow yourself to remain in SIN the Bloodline of Satan)

Thinkin' like the keys on Prince's piano will be just fine

(Allow him to TUNE INTO the instructions of GOD JEHOVAH and let him guide you in the decisions together).

Yeah, we gon' be fine

(They will be fine, if she allows him to guide her into the TRUTH)

So there it is - 4 all 2 see

(self explanatory)

Now what's beyond U and me

(It's up to GOD JEHOVAH if you are in the TRUTH or if you are LYING and DYING)

Depends my friends primarily
On how U view your role in eternity

(It's up to you to choose not to choose and simply STUDY THE WORD OF GOD - TRUTH you live OR stay in a system of lies and DIE, simple)

If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
Then one day she might be queen

(See above ... at Beginning Endlessly - take care, me).

nice point of U.

Chiquetet said:

He'll get it sorted eventually, truly he will...

who knows. maybe he will, or maybe he wont. either way its safe to say a woman should be loved with humility, not spoken down to.

seems to be a big difference between real love, and ego parading as love.

robinhood said:

Chiquetet said:

He'll get it sorted eventually, truly he will...

who knows. maybe he will, or maybe he wont. either way its safe to say a woman should be loved with humility, not spoken down to.

seems to be a big difference between real love, and ego parading as love.

I love what you said here.

robinhood said:

Chiquetet said:

He'll get it sorted eventually, truly he will...

who knows. maybe he will, or maybe he wont. either way its safe to say a woman should be loved with humility, not spoken down to.

seems to be a big difference between real love, and ego parading as love.

Yes, granted, I was being a bit facetious there (or was it wishful thinking?), but I do believe that he genuinely is - and always has been - on a spiritual quest to understand the truth. To many it seems like his stopover in organised religion is a step backwards, but I feel it's just where he needs to be right now. I doubt he'll stay put for too long.

Knowing him admittedly only through his music, I still feel he's closer to understanding what you speak of regarding love than a great percentage of the population, despite the obvious paradox of him evidently not yet 'walking the walk'.

mayrain said:

Sorry if going off topic but I really don't want to start a new thread. What do u folks think about Sensual Everafter and Mellow? I think with this album to understand it, you really have to look at it as a whole and understand Prince's mind at that time.

If u were wondering I love the 2 songs I just listed along with the one being talked about. They both along with this one are very intoxicating.

"2 all his good brothers the Wise One spoke highly of his Muse, because her
love 4 the one true God was growing with every passing day. So he said, "2
all a good night", sent them 2 bed early and invited his Muse 2 join him in
the Sensual Everafter."

"If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
There is nothing, nothing he wouldn't give her, see? (No)"

Luke 4:5-7

⁵The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. ⁶And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. ⁷So if you worship me, it will all be yours."

*

Prince's music is very seductive, it lends a soothing vibe to a questionable lyrical intent.

sort of like a spell which partially blinds you to what is actually being said, making it easier to interpret his intent as strictly noble, because you'd like to think it is.

or like when you've had too much to drink, your ability to discern between paths is blurred, and open to error.

cuz when dem devil come, dem devil come dressed as light, but nobody i know gon bite.

Chiquetet said:

robinhood said:

who knows. maybe he will, or maybe he wont. either way its safe to say a woman should be loved with humility, not spoken down to.

seems to be a big difference between real love, and ego parading as love.

Yes, granted, I was being a bit facetious there (or was it wishful thinking?), but I do believe that he genuinely is - and always has been - on a spiritual quest to understand the truth. To many it seems like his stopover in organised religion is a step backwards, but I feel it's just where he needs to be right now. I doubt he'll stay put for too long.

Knowing him admittedly only through his music, I still feel he's closer to understanding what you speak of regarding love than a great percentage of the population, despite the obvious paradox of him evidently not yet 'walking the walk'.

one thing i do really like about Prince is his ability to move at a glacial pace, spiritually.

oh how it thrills me

robinhood said:

mayrain said:

Sorry if going off topic but I really don't want to start a new thread. What do u folks think about Sensual Everafter and Mellow? I think with this album to understand it, you really have to look at it as a whole and understand Prince's mind at that time.

If u were wondering I love the 2 songs I just listed along with the one being talked about. They both along with this one are very intoxicating.

"2 all his good brothers the Wise One spoke highly of his Muse, because her
love 4 the one true God was growing with every passing day. So he said, "2
all a good night", sent them 2 bed early and invited his Muse 2 join him in
the Sensual Everafter."

"If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
There is nothing, nothing he wouldn't give her, see? (No)"

Luke 4:5-7

⁵The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. ⁶And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. ⁷So if you worship me, it will all be yours."

*

Prince's music is very seductive, it lends a soothing vibe to a questionable lyrical intent.

sort of like a spell which partially blinds you to what is actually being said, making it easier to interpret his intent as strictly noble, because you'd like to think it is.

or like when you've had too much to drink, your ability to discern between paths is blurred, and open to error.

cuz when dem devil come, dem devil come dressed as light, but nobody i know gon bite.

So are u saying that if Prince's "muse" worships him like he is god(which we know he isn't)......she'll get the keys to his kingdom? But not really because there are other things attached to worshipping a fasle god. U seem to know like me that there is only 1 true God and it's not a human. Ur posts are very thought provoking which is something I love very much.........meaning I love to think and use the brain God gave me. Thank you for this insight Robinhood.

robinhood said:

"If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
There is nothing, nothing he wouldn't give her, see? (No)"

Luke 4:5-7

⁵The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. ⁶And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. ⁷So if you worship me, it will all be yours."

Interesting take on it...it took me a minute to see the parallel (which is probably the point you were making )

I do love Sensual Everafter and Mellow, desert temptations aside, and I think they work really nicely within the flow of the album.

As for whether or not fans are being coerced into thinking Prince is something he's not by way of his sweet, sweet music , ultimately the world keeps spinning regardless of whether we see him as a learned prophet or a sleazy patriarchal ego-maniac (or even a sleazy, patriarchal prophet...), so unless he turns up at my door tomorrow night with a copy of the Watchtower and a dinner reservation, I'm going to err on the side of optimism - no harm, no foul, right?

robinhood said:

one thing i do really like about Prince is his ability to move at a glacial pace, spiritually.

oh how it thrills me

Well, Miranda, if he's moving at a glacial pace, where does that leave the majority of the population who rarely give a thought to spiritual exploration?

Snippets of lyrics from his work across his whole career suggest that he's gained a great deal of knowledge and some understanding, but it seems to remain predominantly a mental (or at best, creative) exercise for him - although I'd be delighted to be wrong about that.

The JW faith gives him a safety net, an assurance of everything working out in the end, but that can be a temptation in itself to stop searching (then you can hit glacial speed )

He strikes me as a bit of a spiritual pinata - holding all of this wisdom inside but not knowing how to put it into action...

...and no, I'm not suggesting the answer is that we all take to him with sticks

(Admittedly, I see the irony in my comment, as, unless anyone here knows him personally, this is all just a mental exercise in and of itself anyway)

mayrain said:

robinhood said:

"2 all his good brothers the Wise One spoke highly of his Muse, because her
love 4 the one true God was growing with every passing day. So he said, "2
all a good night", sent them 2 bed early and invited his Muse 2 join him in
the Sensual Everafter."

"If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
There is nothing, nothing he wouldn't give her, see? (No)"

Luke 4:5-7

⁵The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. ⁶And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. ⁷So if you worship me, it will all be yours."

*

Prince's music is very seductive, it lends a soothing vibe to a questionable lyrical intent.

sort of like a spell which partially blinds you to what is actually being said, making it easier to interpret his intent as strictly noble, because you'd like to think it is.

or like when you've had too much to drink, your ability to discern between paths is blurred, and open to error.

cuz when dem devil come, dem devil come dressed as light, but nobody i know gon bite.

So are u saying that if Prince's "muse" worships him like he is god(which we know he isn't)......she'll get the keys to his kingdom? But not really because there are other things attached to worshipping a fasle god. U seem to know like me that there is only 1 true God and it's not a human. Ur posts are very thought provoking which is something I love very much.........meaning I love to think and use the brain God gave me. Thank you for this insight Robinhood.

thats ok i'm enjoy the conversation too ,

but it just occured to me that i may have missed something...

where does it say in either Muse 2 the Pharoah or Sensual Everafter that the muse is Prince's?

he refers to the 'wise-one' in Sensual, and speaks of himself in the 3rd person in Muse 2 the Pharaoh.

the more i look into these lyrics it appears to me that the 'person' doing the speaking is not Prince.

either way, if she is loving her god more and more each day, who would tempt her with an invitation into the 'sensual everafter' ? and why?

and who or what would dare suggest that she can have everything she wants is she but follow him and be his muse?

where i come from, all the really smart ladies see straight through those ruses.

Chiquetet said:

robinhood said:

"If she could be muse 2 the pharaoh
There is nothing, nothing he wouldn't give her, see? (No)"

Luke 4:5-7

⁵The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. ⁶And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. ⁷So if you worship me, it will all be yours."

Interesting take on it...it took me a minute to see the parallel (which is probably the point you were making )

I do love Sensual Everafter and Mellow, desert temptations aside, and I think they work really nicely within the flow of the album.

As for whether or not fans are being coerced into thinking Prince is something he's not by way of his sweet, sweet music , ultimately the world keeps spinning regardless of whether we see him as a learned prophet or a sleazy patriarchal ego-maniac (or even a sleazy, patriarchal prophet...), so unless he turns up at my door tomorrow night with a copy of the Watchtower and a dinner reservation, I'm going to err on the side of optimism - no harm, no foul, right?

probably not, but if naivety leads to disappointment, he'd be responsible for his part in leading all those pretty faces to believe otherwise, imo

robinhood said:

mayrain said:

So are u saying that if Prince's "muse" worships him like he is god(which we know he isn't)......she'll get the keys to his kingdom? But not really because there are other things attached to worshipping a fasle god. U seem to know like me that there is only 1 true God and it's not a human. Ur posts are very thought provoking which is something I love very much.........meaning I love to think and use the brain God gave me. Thank you for this insight Robinhood.

thats ok i'm enjoy the conversation too ,

but it just occured to me that i may have missed something...

where does it say in either Muse 2 the Pharoah or Sensual Everafter that the muse is Prince's?

he refers to the 'wise-one' in Sensual, and speaks of himself in the 3rd person in Muse 2 the Pharaoh.

the more i look into these lyrics it appears to me that the 'person' doing the speaking is not Prince.

either way, if she is loving her god more and more each day, who would tempt her with an invitation into the 'sensual everafter' ? and why?

and who or what would dare suggest that she can have everything she wants is she but follow him and be his muse?

where i come from, all the really smart ladies see straight through those ruses.

[Edited 8/18/10 20:41pm]

robinhood said:

but it just occured to me that i may have missed something...

where does it say in either Muse 2 the Pharoah or Sensual Everafter that the muse is Prince's?

he refers to the 'wise-one' in Sensual, and speaks of himself in the 3rd person in Muse 2 the Pharaoh.

the more i look into these lyrics it appears to me that the 'person' doing the speaking is not Prince.

either way, if she is loving her god more and more each day, who would tempt her with an invitation into the 'sensual everafter' ? and why?

and who or what would dare suggest that she can have everything she wants is she but follow him and be his muse?

where i come from, all the really smart ladies see straight through those ruses.

I've always thought that the main text of the love story that's weaved through the album is a Divine one, although I believe there is a subtext which suggests that he's also looking for a muse with which to emulate such a relationship.

Certainly Muse 2 The Pharaoh and Sensual Everafter suggest a Divine union between The Wise One and his Muse - I feel it speaks perfectly about the connection between Christ and Mary Magdalene; eg.

2 all his good brothers [disciples?] the Wise One [Jesus]

spoke highly of his Muse [Magdalene], because her

love 4 the one true God was growing with every passing day.

So he said, "2 all a good night", sent them 2 bed early and

invited his Muse 2 join him in the Sensual Everafter.

But as I mentioned earlier, I would be surprised (though not completely) if that's what Prince was writing about, given that it's generally considered a big no-no in Christian circles.

Then again, biblical romances are a rare occurrence anyway (let alone seemingly Divine references to a Pharaoh as The Wise One), so I don't actually think this was a strict JW interpretative piece.

As for there being a more personal subtext, I think Mellow speaks for itself there Not that I don't think Christ could speak of "wet circles round the toy", but, well...ahem.

Then Deconstruction and Wedding Feast seem to continue the main story, whereas She Loves Me 4 Me is surely more personal.

I feel there are actually many layers to the work - religious, spiritual/esoteric, race politics, personal love, etc...

In my opinion too many, in that he was trying to solve all of the world's problems in one album and thus jumped from one topic to the next rather frantically - symptomatic perhaps of the way he thinks, I guess, as presumably it all made sense to him.

That said, if you try not to analyse it and just kick back and play it, nothing changes the fact that it's still just blissful to listen to

all still imho, of course...

mayrain said:

robinhood said:

thats ok i'm enjoy the conversation too ,

but it just occured to me that i may have missed something...

where does it say in either Muse 2 the Pharoah or Sensual Everafter that the muse is Prince's?

he refers to the 'wise-one' in Sensual, and speaks of himself in the 3rd person in Muse 2 the Pharaoh.

the more i look into these lyrics it appears to me that the 'person' doing the speaking is not Prince.

either way, if she is loving her god more and more each day, who would tempt her with an invitation into the 'sensual everafter' ? and why?

and who or what would dare suggest that she can have everything she wants is she but follow him and be his muse?

where i come from, all the really smart ladies see straight through those ruses.

WOW! I never thought about it that way. U didn't miss anything . I just always thought it was Prince speaking and that he was the pharaoh and the wise one. WOW u have just added a whole new layer to the cake.

either that or i just peeled another layer off the onion, but it sure is interesting isnt it?

mayrain said:

So are u saying that if Prince's "muse" worships him like he is god(which we know he isn't)......she'll get the keys to his kingdom? But not really because there are other things attached to worshipping a fasle god. U seem to know like me that there is only 1 true God and it's not a human.

robinhood said:

...where does it say in either Muse 2 the Pharoah or Sensual Everafter that the muse is Prince's?

...either way, if she is loving her god more and more each day, who would tempt her with an invitation into the 'sensual everafter' ? and why?

and who or what would dare suggest that she can have everything she wants is she but follow him and be his muse?

I've just had another thought - maybe it was a play on words?

Muse \Muse\, v. t.

1. To think on; to meditate on. [1913 Webster]

Come, then, expressive Silence, muse his praise. --Thomson. [1913 Webster]

2. To wonder at. [Obs.]

--Shak. [1913 Webster]

Source: The Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48

That offers a whole new meaning to the line

If she could b Muse 2 the Pharaoh
There is nothing, nothing he wouldn't give her, c?

What if, rather than suggesting she worship a false idol, the whole point of the line is if she is "Muse 2", or meditates on, wonders upon, "the Pharaoh" - the King, the Wise One, etc... - then she gets the keys to the kingdom, invited into the Sensual Everafter; she becomes Queen, a spiritual ascension (or doctrine-appropriate equivalent), rather than in a romantic sense...?

Chiquetet said:

I've always thought that the main text of the love story that's weaved through the album is a Divine one, although I believe there is a subtext which suggests that he's also looking for a muse with which to emulate such a relationship.

Certainly Muse 2 The Pharaoh and Sensual Everafter suggest a Divine union between The Wise One and his Muse - I feel it speaks perfectly about the connection between Christ and Mary Magdalene; eg.

2 all his good brothers [disciples?] the Wise One [Jesus]

spoke highly of his Muse [Magdalene], because her

love 4 the one true God was growing with every passing day.

So he said, "2 all a good night", sent them 2 bed early and

invited his Muse 2 join him in the Sensual Everafter.

But as I mentioned earlier, I would be surprised (though not completely) if that's what Prince was writing about, given that it's generally considered a big no-no in Christian circles.

Then again, biblical romances are a rare occurrence anyway (let alone seemingly Divine references to a Pharaoh as The Wise One), so I don't actually think this was a strict JW interpretative piece.

As for there being a more personal subtext, I think Mellow speaks for itself there Not that I don't think Christ could speak of "wet circles round the toy", but, well...ahem.

Then Deconstruction and Wedding Feast seem to continue the main story, whereas She Loves Me 4 Me is surely more personal.

I feel there are actually many layers to the work - religious, spiritual/esoteric, race politics, personal love, etc...

In my opinion too many, in that he was trying to solve all of the world's problems in one album and thus jumped from one topic to the next rather frantically - symptomatic perhaps of the way he thinks, I guess, as presumably it all made sense to him.

That said, if you try not to analyse it and just kick back and play it, nothing changes the fact that it's still just blissful to listen to

all still imho, of course...

1st thing that comes to mind for me is what Jesus is said to have said: "My Kingdom is not of this world"

i interpret that to mean that His Kingdom is of the Spirit.

guess i'm not sure where the SENSUALeverafter ties in to that whole scenario... seems to be more one of Prince's beliefs than anything else

maybe he's channeling a sex-addict who uses spiritual concepts to lure and trap a mate, whom he refers to as a muse in an attempt to compliment her into believing she is a worthy servant. who knows

i find it extremely difficult to criticize prince on a musical level, so i agree if you just kick back and listen its great to listen to, but i dont let it switch my mind into romanticizing his concepts as if it's all about him.

i can appreciate the possibility of divine union between man and woman, but for me he has clearly put the woman in a submissive position which doesnt seem that divine to me.

that might be more to do with JW beliefs, i dont know, but it might be fair to say they've been his personal beliefs even before he converted.

he sings a woman's praises to get what he wants, essentially. apparently he'll even use spiritual concepts to get it too.

the devil does wear prada after all, or gucci, or dior...

nothings changed there

imho too

robinhood said:

i can appreciate the possibility of divine union between man and woman, but for me he has clearly put the woman in a submissive position which doesnt seem that divine to me.

that might be more to do with JW beliefs, i dont know, but it might be fair to say they've been his personal beliefs even before he converted.

he sings a woman's praises to get what he wants, essentially. apparently he'll even use spiritual concepts to get it too.

Sadly, I'm beginning to think you are closer to the truth with this one.

I just looked at the text from the start of the album, as well as what leads into Muse, and my theory about The Wise One being of Divine order is out the window...

With the accurate understanding of God and His law

they went about the work of building a new nation:

The Rainbow Children.

The Wise One who understood the law

that was handed down from God long ago

reflected the true meaning 2 his woman every day.

And she surrendered her discerning of it into his care

and keeping 4 she trusted he would lead in the right way.

Her children in subjection 2 her, and she in subjection 2 the Wise One.

The Wise One in subjection 2 the only Begotten One.

All is in subjection 2 God.

As prophesized, the Wise One and his woman were tempted by

the Resistor. He, knowing full well the Wise One's love 4 God,

assimilated the woman first and only.

Quite naturally, chaos ensued and she and 5 others were banished

from the Rainbow…4ever

The Wise One who understood the law that was handed down

from God long ago, held fast in his belief that the Lord

would bring him another one who loved him so.

I think this is intended as a prophesy moreso than a historical account, which is why we can't 'fit' it to anything.

I realise the whole album talks about the Theocratic Order in several places and I have my issues with that (or, more specifically, have my own take on it, which is internal rather than external), but the way he states it here, it becomes obvious that he sees The Wise One as being a human man, presumably some kind of Adam II (the Rainbow apparently being the new Eden).

So according to this interpretation, the Resistor (serpent II) preys on the woman, because he knows that the man couldn't possibly fall for his tricks. The woman (Eve II) is 'assimilated' and in this version, is the only one of them banished...

Thus the 'Wise One' waits for God to send him another, presumably more submissive, one who he can mould and guide and...hmmm...

Quite frankly I liked this album better when I applied my own personal interpretation to it, so I think I'll just go back to that now and let Prince preach whatever is convenient the Truth in his eyes.

Chiquetet said:

robinhood said:

i can appreciate the possibility of divine union between man and woman, but for me he has clearly put the woman in a submissive position which doesnt seem that divine to me.

that might be more to do with JW beliefs, i dont know, but it might be fair to say they've been his personal beliefs even before he converted.

he sings a woman's praises to get what he wants, essentially. apparently he'll even use spiritual concepts to get it too.

Sadly, I'm beginning to think you are closer to the truth with this one.

I just looked at the text from the start of the album, as well as what leads into Muse, and my theory about The Wise One being of Divine order is out the window...

With the accurate understanding of God and His law

they went about the work of building a new nation:

The Rainbow Children.

The Wise One who understood the law

that was handed down from God long ago

reflected the true meaning 2 his woman every day.

And she surrendered her discerning of it into his care

and keeping 4 she trusted he would lead in the right way.

Her children in subjection 2 her, and she in subjection 2 the Wise One.

The Wise One in subjection 2 the only Begotten One.

All is in subjection 2 God.

As prophesized, the Wise One and his woman were tempted by

the Resistor. He, knowing full well the Wise One's love 4 God,

assimilated the woman first and only.

Quite naturally, chaos ensued and she and 5 others were banished

from the Rainbow…4ever

The Wise One who understood the law that was handed down

from God long ago, held fast in his belief that the Lord

would bring him another one who loved him so.

I think this is intended as a prophesy moreso than a historical account, which is why we can't 'fit' it to anything.

I realise the whole album talks about the Theocratic Order in several places and I have my issues with that (or, more specifically, have my own take on it, which is internal rather than external), but the way he states it here, it becomes obvious that he sees The Wise One as being a human man, presumably some kind of Adam II (the Rainbow apparently being the new Eden).

So according to this interpretation, the Resistor (serpent II) preys on the woman, because he knows that the man couldn't possibly fall for his tricks. The woman (Eve II) is 'assimilated' and in this version, is the only one of them banished...

Thus the 'Wise One' waits for God to send him another, presumably more submissive, one who he can mould and guide and...hmmm...

Quite frankly I liked this album better when I applied my own personal interpretation to it, so I think I'll just go back to that now and let Prince preach whatever is convenient the Truth in his eyes.

"And she surrendered her discerning of it into his care

and keeping..."

i believe in theocracy, just not at anyone else's expense or exclusion.

unfortunately the JW's tend to preach an exclusive belief rather than an inclusive one.

i think i'm beginning to understand a bit better now why he chose this particular religion/cult.

maybe they support his ideas of superiority over others.

i'm also beginning to wonder if all these characters in this rainbow children story are archetypes in his own mind

might also be possible that he is all of those characters, the different aspects of his psyche and nature laid out for all to see

played out like a play with different scenes, his own inner battles, betrothals and betrayals in a split-screen symphony of musical color and religious odor

Max said:

robinhood said:

who knows. maybe he will, or maybe he wont. either way its safe to say a woman should be loved with humility, not spoken down to.

seems to be a big difference between real love, and ego parading as love.

I love what you said here.

cheers