purpledoveuk said:

HonestMan13 said:

It didn't stop you from buying a copy. Did it? Only you can be responsible for what you do at the end of the day Prince isn't pulling your strings.

True - but I'm Not the one who has spent years voicing my disdain for this type of company, I've no printed a 'holier than thou' lifestyle or chastised those without clean lifestyles - Prince has jumped into bed with for a quick buck with the very John than he has been ranting about for years. I would have bought whatever he sold it to as I had no choice if I wanted the album...some may well say why not strike up a worthwhile deal that fits the image he all wants us to see...Big Issue?

Let's say that I agree with you...

This would mean Prince sold his principles for several millions of dollars to continue doing what he loves doing.

You on the other hand sold yours for a CD (that about 5 minutes after is was released could've been found online).

We all live in glass houses.

Perspective?

skywalker said:

robinhood said:

oh dont worry. i love sell-outs. i love when they spend their WHOLE CAREER spouting PRINCIPLES about LIFE then turn around and reneg on ALL of them in one fell swoop, just so they can get paid. i love it because it reveals the intentions they had all along, and how none of what they EVER sang about, meant anything to them at all, well, at least not as much as the MONEY. and thats ok with me.

Seriously? Prince "sold out" long ago and it remains his biggest, most blatantly commercial, and obvious grab for money ever. Or did you forget?

[img:$uid]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss73/shawnsolo3000/batdance.jpg[/img:$uid]

[img:$uid]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss73/shawnsolo3000/princedoublefacejoker.jpg[/img:$uid]

This was at the request of Jack Nicholson who is a bring Prince fan feeling Prince should do the soundtrack especially since they were using prior Prince releases in certain scenes during filming. Prince was taking a break after Lovesexy and this opportunity presented him with the chance to do a Prince album that wouldn't be a Prince album. It was a soundtrack with music by Prince.

HonestMan13 said:

I see your point and you are right - I am a victim of Princes greed, I had no choice but to follow Prince into the lions den through his greedy and soul-selling actions .

Seriously though you'd think that if somebody had dedicated several years of thier career moaning about how The Man sticks it to people like him that he wouldn't bend over and let The Man stick it right up his poop shoot for a few dollars...why not give it away with his favourite work of fiction Watchtower....at least the worst that's ever done is tell readers that its ok to bother other people during mealtimes by knocking on their doors.

Finally we can agree
[Edited 7/15/10 6:37am]

abigail05 said:

TheSkinMechanic said:

Speak for yourself.

That's like saying Prince is taller than pretty much all of us.

Patently untrue.

It's infinitely debatable. In this case I meant that Prince seems to be able to play the Music Industry game better than anyone who's ever played.

And again, that's why I'm still here. Good music or bad, it never gets dull.

If you were specifically talking about Prince in regard to the music business, then OK, I misunderstood.

I don't agree that Prince "seems to be able to play the Music Industry game better than anyone who's ever played", but I concede that there has been some good moves from him and/or his advisors.

HonestMan13 said:

skywalker said:

Seriously? Prince "sold out" long ago and it remains his biggest, most blatantly commercial, and obvious grab for money ever. Or did you forget?

[img:$uid]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss73/shawnsolo3000/batdance.jpg[/img:$uid]

[img:$uid]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss73/shawnsolo3000/princedoublefacejoker.jpg[/img:$uid]

This was at the request of Jack Nicholson who is a bring Prince fan feeling Prince should do the soundtrack especially since they were using prior Prince releases in certain scenes during filming. Prince was taking a break after Lovesexy and this opportunity presented him with the chance to do a Prince album that wouldn't be a Prince album. It was a soundtrack with music by Prince.

Surely, you can justify/explain a newspaper give away just as easily. The facts about Batman are actually this:

Jack Nicholson wanted the director Tim Burton to use Prince songs for two scenes. Baby, I'm a Star and 1999 were used as temp tracks. The idea was to get permission from Prince for these song, and Warner Bros. got the idea to have Prince do new songs. Prince was financially hurting because the Lovesexy tour was so expensive that it actually lost money and stood to make a lot of money by doing an entire album. He mostly took songs he had laying around and reworked them to tie in thematically with the movie.

Don't get me wrong, I love that he did it. I love that he dressed up half Joker/half Batman. I love the album....it made me a Prince fan. Prince has done some VERY blatantly commercial moves to sell his music , I would argue that none have really compromised the art.

But be honest, Prince jumped on board with the mega marketing/money making machine that was the Batman 1989 juggernaut. It was done artistically, but was a big "sell out" move none the less.

As I said, Prince has done some hard selling of his music before and after, but none as blatant or obvious as the tie in to Batman. Wearing the Bat symbol and painting your face like The Joker says it all....

[Edited 7/15/10 20:05pm]

purpledoveuk said:

HonestMan13 said:

Let's say that I agree with you...

This would mean Prince sold his principles for several millions of dollars to continue doing what he loves doing.

You on the other hand sold yours for a CD (that about 5 minutes after is was released could've been found online).

We all live in glass houses.

Perspective?

I see your point and you are right - I am a victim of Princes greed, I had no choice but to follow Prince into the lions den through his greedy and soul-selling actions . Seriously though you'd think that if somebody had dedicated several years of thier career moaning about how The Man sticks it to people like him that he wouldn't bend over and let The Man stick it right up his poop shoot for a few dollars...why not give it away with his favourite work of fiction Watchtower....at least the worst that's ever done is tell readers that its ok to bother other people during mealtimes by knocking on their doors. Finally we can agree [Edited 7/15/10 6:37am]

Nope! You can't keep on blaming Prince for everything, whilst ignoring your own choices and actions. Your comment should have read "I am a victim of my OWN greed". You bleat on about him not having principles and associating his cd with a certain publication, yet you didn't apply your own principles and refuse to buy the publication. You wanted the cd straight away, so you set your apparent morals to one side. That makes you a hypocrite and removes any substance from your accusations!

People round here act like they've never done anything questionable, always do the right thing and would never do anything for their own personal gain......yeah RIGHT!

[Edited 7/16/10 1:34am]

You say "wanted the cd straight away" how else was it available ? illegal download (which is what this is all about), eBay by someone who had no right to sell it let alone at sone of the prices on there.

I'm not attacking him as much as you think...I'm just surprised that he's so outspoken and on the moral highground all day that he couldn't find a better output to go with his beliefs.

Put it this way, I'm hugely against animal cruelty and unnecessary animal testing - I did a HND, Hons Degree and Masters in subjects regarding biology, genetics, ecology etc etc and specialised in Toxicology. When I left uni my girlfriend and I were in debt through student fees / student loans (due to the shit education system here) and I got offered a very lucrative job by a company that I knew very little about except they wanted me for my toxicology know-how. It became apparent during the interview/chat with the Director that this place involved elements of animal testing. I continued the chat but politely declined the job at the end to their disbelief. That job could have set me up for many many years, could have cleared 3 yes of debt in a matter of months for both of us but I stuck to my beliefs. Now I'm not a multi-million dollar recording artist who didn't need the money, who records songs warning about corporate greed, selling out, greed for money...if I can be strong willed enough in times of need why couldn't ol' Wibbly Watchtower over there in times of luxury. He could have had x amount of reputable/'appropriate' outlet lining up...but he went for the titty tabloid with a shady rep - just seemed odd that's all.


.
[Edited 7/16/10 7:39am]

Perhaps he's a fan of News in Briefs.

purpledoveuk said:

You say "wanted the cd straight away" how else was it available ? illegal download (which is what this is all about), eBay by someone who had no right to sell it let alone at sone of the prices on there. I'm not attacking him as much as you think...I'm just surprised that he's so outspoken and on the moral highground all day that he couldn't find a better output to go with his beliefs. Put it this way, I'm hugely against animal cruelty and unnecessary animal testing - I did a HND, Hons Degree and Masters in subjects regarding biology, genetics, ecology etc etc and specialised in Toxicology. When I left uni my girlfriend and I were in debt through student fees / student loans (due to the shit education system here) and I got offered a very lucrative job by a company that I knew very little about except they wanted me for my toxicology know-how. It became apparent during the interview/chat with the Director that this place involved elements of animal testing. I continued the chat but politely declined the job at the end to their disbelief. That job could have set me up for many many years, could have cleared 3 yes of debt in a matter of months for both of us but I stuck to my beliefs. Now I'm not a multi-million dollar recording artist who didn't need the money, who records songs warning about corporate greed, selling out, greed for money...if I can be strong willed enough in times of need why couldn't ol' Wibbly Watchtower over there in times of luxury. He could have had x amount of reputable/'appropriate' outlet lining up...but he went for the titty tabloid with a shady rep - just seemed odd that's all. . [Edited 7/16/10 7:39am]

I understand what you are saying and your point of view. By the way, I'm English, so I know all about the education system in this country

I'm entirely in agreement with your actions over the company that was involved in animal-testing. I couldn't work for a company like that either. But, I don't think the Mirror is involved in anything as serious as that, is it? And, what exactly is "shady" about it? I'm no supporter of tabloids (or any newspaper, I've simply never bought them), but the Mirror is hardly offensive! Its not part of the certainly shady Murdoch empire, campaigned against the invasion of Iraq and hilariously caused controversy Stateside when George W Bush was re-elected, with a frontpage that asked "How can 59,054,087 people be so DUMB?". Neither is it a "titty tabloid", I think you'll find that's the Sun! I'm not defending the Mirror, nor am I a supporter, but people seem to be much maligning it just because its cool to attack any media.

There needs to be balance. Likewise with your opinion on how Prince distributed this album. Why is is selling out? Surely, it is just smart business with a win for everyone. Its not about politics. Its not about supporting the Mirror. It IS about money, but just because Prince attacks corporates doesn't mean he should forego the right to earn his money. And, whilst he may be rich, he has MASSIVE expenses PLUS he is independent, so has to finance many things himself which a label would have shelled millions on. The risk is now all his, so accusations about selling out are nonsense. Securing himself financially and minimising the risks on his business decisions is more like it. You know how many artists end up broke? It takes years to amass a fortune like his, but it can be lost extremely quickly! Comparing the likes of multi-national, corporate machine with an independent musician is a bit of a stretch! Its not the same thing at all.

You shouldn't feel bad about buying it - as I said, I don't buy newspapers and don't really care about the Mirror (except that it provides jobs for many people), but I don't think my purchasing it ONCE is going to make any difference to their fortunes. Prince knows this - sure, they made some extra money for ONE DAY, but that's it - he can't be accused of "supporting" the paper. In fact, when you look at the circulation figures, the Mirror's sales increased by just over 30% on Saturday, but immediately returned to normal on Monday. So, increase in revenue for one day, no increase in regular readership. And its not surprising.

Prince, however, distributed more then 6 times as many cds as he would selling them through the usual channels and the fans got it for a measly 65p. It was a success for Prince and his fans, but an essentially temporary thing for the Mirror.

Anyways lol Its all good man. I mean you no harm - we both cool in my book

jtfolden said:

Timmy84 said:

How much does the Mirror sell over there? I'm sure it didn't rise because of Prince's album...

To be fair, it probably did pull in some extra buyers... but how many is the question? I'd be extremely surprised if more than a few thousand, if that.

I wasn't aware the price of that specific issue went up, though...

"A few thousand"??!!

Actually, their sales on the Saturday went up by 35%, selling almost 400,000 more copies than on any other Saturday. It is, reportedly, the most successful promotion in their 100-year history!

And the price did not go up. The Mirror is always more on a Saturday, usually due to more content and supplement.

Jesus......the cynics on here - if someone shows you a bunch of flowers, do you ask where the funeral is?!

Mindflux said:

jtfolden said:

To be fair, it probably did pull in some extra buyers... but how many is the question? I'd be extremely surprised if more than a few thousand, if that.

I wasn't aware the price of that specific issue went up, though...

"A few thousand"??!!

Actually, their sales on the Saturday went up by 35%, selling almost 400,000 more copies than on any other Saturday. It is, reportedly, the most successful promotion in their 100-year history!

And the price did not go up. The Mirror is always more on a Saturday, usually due to more content and supplement.

Jesus......the cynics on here - if someone shows you a bunch of flowers, do you ask where the funeral is?!