Wall said:

Mindflux said:

Utter rubbish! So, a man of a given age is not allowed to make music that is current? What are they supposed to do, stay in a time-warp, or start making "genuine compositions" - whatever that means?! Are none of Prince's myriad songs "genuine compositions"?!! The ability to read or write music is clearly not a requirement for composing good music. You mention this as though it is some sort of hinderance, whilst also lauding his 80s efforts and calling it "genuine art". Well, he couldn't read music back then either - didn't stop him making some of the greatest music we've heard!

Sting is not doing anything innovative (unless you call making an album with instruments that are centuries old "innovative" lol) and most of his recent output has been quite boring. He's still a talented musician nonetheless. And, whilst nothing Prince has done recently has matched the innovation of his 80s output, I still find enjoyment in his music, whether he is reaching back to his early sound or doing something more contemporary. All artists take influence from other music and Prince has been one of those who have taken many influences and weaved them in to his music. What, exactly, is wrong with him making a tune in a certain style? You talk of the "rarified air" of certain artists, yet their music changed and "followed" over time too. And, so what if its a club track, designed to make people dance, what's wrong with that? (and all "club music" is not disposable - depends on the kind of club you frequent, I guess).

However, you seem to constantly deconstruct anything Prince does in a negative way, so I'm hardly surprised at your comments, nor do I expect you to take a broader view.

[Edited 7/16/10 12:47pm]

Mindflux, I see you're taking the gloves off.

Prince at one time had a genuine voice, now he's content miming the generic sounds of others or repeating himself. I'm sure there's a number of reasons for this, one being his faith, which turned the former rude boy in a homophobic pietist, the other being he's gotten lazy in the studio, and that goes beyond coming up with new sounds -- his lyrics are pure fluff. But I don't think Prince need create a new sonic pallette, at this point, I'd settle for decent compositions that sound earnest when coming out the speakers. There's got to be a circle of hell where that children's theme is on repeat. You know Tony M. is loving that cut; something finally topped the horror of Jughead.

Regarding Sting, like I said elsewhere, I'm not a fan and I don't think he was every anything other than a minor player at best. But I do respect his desire to grow as a performer and not try to recreate the Police sound. I can't say I've followed his career, so I've no real idea nor do I care what he's up to, it was just something someone mentioned in another thread.

I'm not suggesting Prince learn composition to write a classical piece, though that could be interesting. Maybe he could start playing actual jazz or more intricate pop-funk-rock. I don't know, Mindflux, I'm just tossing the idea out there. What do you think he should do? Make another Everyone Loves Me? If I had to wager what he'll do, I'd say in about 10 1/2 months we'll hear about Prince's new record that's going to be a return to form and at the end of the day, people will debate whether it's better than Planet Earth or vice versa.

Please just let me get this straight: you say that Prince, who recorded an acoustic guitar album ("The Truth"), a funk-jazz concept album ("TRC"), several mainly instrumental albums ("NEWS", "X-pectation", "C-Note") and a piano solo album ("ONA") has been repeating the same old recipe over and over again? Just because he decided to go fully retro back to the eraly 80s for the first time in 25 years now?

I like both Prince and Sting, but Sting was still chasing the latest trends with stuff like "Send your love" when Prince had already recorded "TRC". Sure, Sting recorded an album full of Dowland songs (I just assume you know who that was), and I really like that record, but many people in the classical music scene where pretty much laughing at him for this attempt.

Strange enough, most of the young German music scene (Silbermond, Tokio Hotel, Peter Fox etc.) went to Prince's Berlin concert. You think he should go and learn to read music? Fine, he can do that. But what will happen then? What is he supposed to do? You don't expect Prince to become a composer of art music such as Wolfgang Rihm or Helmut Lachenmann, do you? (Again, I just assume you konw these folks.)

When Arnold Schönberg played tennis with George Gershwin, Gershwin asked him to give him lectures on the twelve-tone system. Schönberg replied: "You already are a first-rate Gershwin, why do you want to become a second-rate Schönberg?" So, do you want Prince to become a third-rate "classical" composer doing cheesy John-Williams-kind-of-stuff? Or a guy desperately trying to get some respect from die-hard Jazz heads? (Friedrich Gulda already tried to get that and he failed, and boy, that guy was a gifted man! Again, I assume you know who Gulda was.)

Bottom line: Prince is good at what he is doing. You might not like his more recent efforts - fine. You think he doesn't have the energy and compassion in the studio anymore that he would need to record a masterpiece - o.k.! But I'll take "20Ten" any day of the week over his potential attempt to write an oratory (a la McCartney) or other desperate productions such as the 100,000th version of a popstar re-recording his shit with an orchestra.

EmancipationLover said:

Please just let me get this straight: you say that Prince, who recorded an acoustic guitar album ("The Truth"), a funk-jazz concept album ("TRC"), several mainly instrumental albums ("NEWS", "X-pectation", "C-Note") and a piano solo album ("ONA") has been repeating the same old recipe over and over again? Just because he decided to go fully retro back to the eraly 80s for the first time in 25 years now?

I can't get out of this box, help me, Emanicpation lover.

No, I never said that. I'm specifically referring to his post Musicology life, though I'm inclined to toss Rave into the equation. I rather like TRC and ONA Live. I think The Truth is pretty thin, to be honest. It's a nice departure and honest one, but hardly as good as some think. NEWS isn't my favorite, but I'll definitely give the guy credit for making an effort with that and putting it out. With all of that material, hit or miss as I find it, he wasn't chasing pop trends.

That said, I didn't even the read the rest, I'm out of gas with this stuff. 20Ten bombed, onto the next.

Wall said:

EmancipationLover said:

Please just let me get this straight: you say that Prince, who recorded an acoustic guitar album ("The Truth"), a funk-jazz concept album ("TRC"), several mainly instrumental albums ("NEWS", "X-pectation", "C-Note") and a piano solo album ("ONA") has been repeating the same old recipe over and over again? Just because he decided to go fully retro back to the eraly 80s for the first time in 25 years now?

I can't get out of this box, help me, Emanicpation lover.

No, I never said that. I'm specifically referring to his post Musicology life, though I'm inclined to toss Rave into the equation. I rather like TRC and ONA Live. I think The Truth is pretty thin, to be honest. It's a nice departure and honest one, but hardly as good as some think. NEWS isn't my favorite, but I'll definitely give the guy credit for making an effort with that and putting it out. With all of that material, hit or miss as I find it, he wasn't chasing pop trends.

That said, I didn't even the read the rest, I'm out of gas with this stuff. 20Ten bombed, onto the next.

Hi Wall,

but that is a completely different picture from the one you used to paint. I think you should see the guy's work in total and not only parts of it. In total, Prince has experimented a lot with music not being suitable for the mainstram pop business. O.k. he went back to pop from 2004 onwards, and it doesn't move you - fair enough. But that simply means that Prince has a different interest in music right now than you do, not that he is too lazy to try out something new.

hollywooddove said:

vainandy said:

Mindflux said:

So, a man of a given age is not allowed to make music that is current? What are they supposed to do, stay in a time-warp, or start making "genuine compositions" - whatever that means?!

Making music that sounds current is fine when current music sounds good. It's not fine when current music is shit hop.

Your prejudice against one genre of music only means something to you, but its banal and narrow-minded. Within any genre of music, 80% of it will be shit with 20% being truly innovative and worthwhile.

Furthermore, if your recent posts are to be believed, you haven't even heard the track, so how can you comment? You are assuming it is something based on other's opinions - nice one! I didn't think hip-hop when I heard it - sounds like a dirty, funky dance track to me, but I'm no expert on hip-hop (or compartmentalising music either!).

Mindflux said:

vainandy said:

Making music that sounds current is fine when current music sounds good. It's not fine when current music is shit hop.

Your prejudice against one genre of music only means something to you, but its banal and narrow-minded. Within any genre of music, 80% of it will be shit with 20% being truly innovative and worthwhile.

Furthermore, if your recent posts are to be believed, you haven't even heard the track, so how can you comment? You are assuming it is something based on other's opinions - nice one! I didn't think hip-hop when I heard it - sounds like a dirty, funky dance track to me, but I'm no expert on hip-hop (or compartmentalising music either!).

I heard it for the first time last night and the assumptions I made from the descriptions I read were absolutely correct. Not only was it shit hop but it was a damn disgrace of a song coming from someone like Prince.

As for it being a dance track, yeah it might work at a senior citizens' dance but it's way too slow for anybody that has any rhythm in their bones to dance to.

TheNewWatcher2 said:

mitunes11 long.

[Edited 7/16/10 13:15pm]

It's only your IMAGINATION.....thanx anyway!

Laydown kicks serious ass. Nuff said.

I know people of all ages who think this is the best cut on the CD.

need 2 do

*IT* boo

vainandy said:

Mindflux said:

Your prejudice against one genre of music only means something to you, but its banal and narrow-minded. Within any genre of music, 80% of it will be shit with 20% being truly innovative and worthwhile.

Furthermore, if your recent posts are to be believed, you haven't even heard the track, so how can you comment? You are assuming it is something based on other's opinions - nice one! I didn't think hip-hop when I heard it - sounds like a dirty, funky dance track to me, but I'm no expert on hip-hop (or compartmentalising music either!).

I heard it for the first time last night and the assumptions I made from the descriptions I read were absolutely correct. Not only was it shit hop but it was a damn disgrace of a song coming from someone like Prince.

As for it being a dance track, yeah it might work at a senior citizens' dance but it's way too slow for anybody that has any rhythm in their bones to dance to.

I was waiting for you to make a statement about that song. I was like when I first heard it, "Andy's not gonna like it."

I'm more open to the song but still think in terms of sequencing, it shouldn't have been a "bonus track", it should've been the opener lol

Timmy84 said:

vainandy said:

I heard it for the first time last night and the assumptions I made from the descriptions I read were absolutely correct. Not only was it shit hop but it was a damn disgrace of a song coming from someone like Prince.

As for it being a dance track, yeah it might work at a senior citizens' dance but it's way too slow for anybody that has any rhythm in their bones to dance to.

I was waiting for you to make a statement about that song. I was like when I first heard it, "Andy's not gonna like it."

I'm more open to the song but still think in terms of sequencing, it shouldn't have been a "bonus track", it should've been the opener lol

It would only have made a decent opener if the rest of the material that followed it was on a par - were it to be the opener for 20Ten, the rest of the album would have been more disappointing.

vainandy said:

Mindflux said:

Your prejudice against one genre of music only means something to you, but its banal and narrow-minded. Within any genre of music, 80% of it will be shit with 20% being truly innovative and worthwhile.

Furthermore, if your recent posts are to be believed, you haven't even heard the track, so how can you comment? You are assuming it is something based on other's opinions - nice one! I didn't think hip-hop when I heard it - sounds like a dirty, funky dance track to me, but I'm no expert on hip-hop (or compartmentalising music either!).

I heard it for the first time last night and the assumptions I made from the descriptions I read were absolutely correct. Not only was it shit hop but it was a damn disgrace of a song coming from someone like Prince.

As for it being a dance track, yeah it might work at a senior citizens' dance but it's way too slow for anybody that has any rhythm in their bones to dance to.

Nice timing Ahhh well, you likes what you likes.......

Likewise, I know plenty of people who can groove at a variety of tempos, but if you dance permanantly like you're on crystal meth. that's your look out (and anyone within 10 feet of you!)

Mindflux said:

Timmy84 said:

I was waiting for you to make a statement about that song. I was like when I first heard it, "Andy's not gonna like it."

I'm more open to the song but still think in terms of sequencing, it shouldn't have been a "bonus track", it should've been the opener lol

It would only have made a decent opener if the rest of the material that followed it was on a par - were it to be the opener for 20Ten, the rest of the album would have been more disappointing.

Well that's where "Cause & Effect" comes into play. It could've replaced you-know-what on it.

Hmmmm...Prince is feeling threatened by someone...

love the cheeky yoda ref, the groove is dutty cool

npggirl77 said:

b3xy said:

I want more from the Purple Yoda

Co-sign!!!!!!!!!

trueiopian said:

I'm really diggin' this one. The only song on the album I had to play again.

His rapping reminds me of M.I.A. a bit.

That's what I was thinking! Not full on M.I.A. but the attitude is there. This is my fav song on the album. It's on constant replay at the moment

Mindflux said:

Wall said:

What's up, herb4.

I said earlier 'I'm the purple Yoda, going door to door for Jehovah' is a fine enough line, and you're right, Prince has never been strong at writing lyrics. What separates a song like Laydown from Housequake (and I can't believe this needs to be pointed out for anyone, even here) is that in the latter, Prince created a 4 minute song that was the logical progression of James Brown, Sly Stone, P-Funk and the history of soul vol. 1. Existing within his own universe and at the height of his creative powers, Housequake comes from a very unique place, the mind of Prince. It sounds natural and new all in one shake. The lyrics and delivery aren't culled from the mindless drones buzzing about Prince in the 80's, because Prince was one of very few pop musicians in the history of the art form who had a vision all unto his own. He took all of the synthetic vapidness of the 80's and turned into genuine art.

Laydown meanwhile is a generic Club South Beach banger ripe with both lyrics and vocal delivery that sees a 53 year old Jehovah's Witness doing his best to sound like a man 30 years his junior. Prince is no longer moving in the rarefied air of James Brown and George Clinton, he's now chanting and grinding with the pop pap of today. He's a follower on a leash, trying to get a piece of the populous bone. There's no muse left to follow, apparently, so he's chasing the backsides of the trendy and trite. Could Laydown get the herds moving in club nouveau? Sure, why not? Is the music played in the clubs disposable and ultimately forgettable?

Someone made a brilliant post elsewhere about how Sting is now working on genuine composition and while I'm not a big supporter of Sting's music, it seems a logical progression for a 50 year old who is continuing to explore and learn his craft. Elvis Costello has made similar progressions in his career. If they were like Prince, in a stage of Jehovah Bangin' arrested development, they'd be out there embarrassing themselves, trying to write a Nu-Metal song or some other heinous form of popular music, just to prove 'they can do it.'

Prince needs to think about his future. The man can't even read or write music. I know he'll never do it, but he should take a year off not to study some bronze age cult, but music theory. What's he going to do in ten years? Keep putting out this crap? He's regressing into a modern day Little Richard, his face caked with makeup and his sounds dull with trend.

Utter rubbish! So, a man of a given age is not allowed to make music that is current? What are they supposed to do, stay in a time-warp, or start making "genuine compositions" - whatever that means?! Are none of Prince's myriad songs "genuine compositions"?!! The ability to read or write music is clearly not a requirement for composing good music. You mention this as though it is some sort of hinderance, whilst also lauding his 80s efforts and calling it "genuine art". Well, he couldn't read music back then either - didn't stop him making some of the greatest music we've heard!

Sting is not doing anything innovative (unless you call making an album with instruments that are centuries old "innovative" lol) and most of his recent output has been quite boring. He's still a talented musician nonetheless. And, whilst nothing Prince has done recently has matched the innovation of his 80s output, I still find enjoyment in his music, whether he is reaching back to his early sound or doing something more contemporary. All artists take influence from other music and Prince has been one of those who have taken many influences and weaved them in to his music. What, exactly, is wrong with him making a tune in a certain style? You talk of the "rarified air" of certain artists, yet their music changed and "followed" over time too. And, so what if its a club track, designed to make people dance, what's wrong with that? (and all "club music" is not disposable - depends on the kind of club you frequent, I guess).

However, you seem to constantly deconstruct anything Prince does in a negative way, so I'm hardly surprised at your comments, nor do I expect you to take a broader view.

[Edited 7/16/10 12:47pm]

Wow, I see truth in what these words. I absolutely love this song and I have not ever been a hip hop fan but I don't really think of this as a rap song. It is so extremely funky that I could listen to it over and over. I love the new music and can't wait until I own it. There are some here that have no feeling of enjoyment when listening to Prince like he supposed to make you shake in your boots everytime he releases a new cd. It is music and by my favorite musician so I love it when I love it and like it when I merely like it. Sometimes he creates something that doesn't fully grab me but I don't get on here and call it anything because who am I trying to hurt. Certainly, not the musician that I greatly admire and certainly not any of his fans. If you don't like something that is your right but some of you have a feeling that your opinion is the only one that matters and you have a wall up will not even try to enjoy the music or the movement that it causes in you. Sad but true. Once again I love this song more with each listen.

Mindflux said:

vainandy said:

I heard it for the first time last night and the assumptions I made from the descriptions I read were absolutely correct. Not only was it shit hop but it was a damn disgrace of a song coming from someone like Prince.

As for it being a dance track, yeah it might work at a senior citizens' dance but it's way too slow for anybody that has any rhythm in their bones to dance to.

Nice timing Ahhh well, you likes what you likes.......

Likewise, I know plenty of people who can groove at a variety of tempos, but if you dance permanantly like you're on crystal meth. that's your look out (and anyone within 10 feet of you!)

Lol. My old behind was grooving to it but if it is not your cup of tea then so be it. But I disagree about it being a disgrace of song coming from Prince. I think coming from him that it is a shock because I didn't expect this from him. I love the way the different lines came together and the background vocals fit perfectly. I love the whole song and will continue to groove to this one. More please.

purplecam said:

Another song I was ready to hate this but I actually love this song. I love the groove and i find myself dancing to this song. Its HOT!

I agree. I was thinkin' "oh no, here we go..." but then, I started movin' & groovin' & that's when it hit me---this song is in the same vein as "face down" except it's much, much better. I love it!

Timmy84 said:

vainandy said:

I heard it for the first time last night and the assumptions I made from the descriptions I read were absolutely correct. Not only was it shit hop but it was a damn disgrace of a song coming from someone like Prince.

As for it being a dance track, yeah it might work at a senior citizens' dance but it's way too slow for anybody that has any rhythm in their bones to dance to.

I was waiting for you to make a statement about that song. I was like when I first heard it, "Andy's not gonna like it."

I'm more open to the song but still think in terms of sequencing, it shouldn't have been a "bonus track", it should've been the opener lol

Oh hell naw! He did right but putting way hidden 77 tracks later so maybe somebody wouldn't find it because it's sure a damn shit hop disgrace. Actually, most of the rest of the album was pretty decent, especially "Lavaux" and "Walk In Sand", but if he had opened the album with some shit hop mess like "Laydown", I probably wouldn't have even finished listening to the rest of the album and threw it in the trash because it's bad enough that the track is even on the album in the first place.

Mindflux said:

vainandy said:

I heard it for the first time last night and the assumptions I made from the descriptions I read were absolutely correct. Not only was it shit hop but it was a damn disgrace of a song coming from someone like Prince.

As for it being a dance track, yeah it might work at a senior citizens' dance but it's way too slow for anybody that has any rhythm in their bones to dance to.

Nice timing Ahhh well, you likes what you likes.......

Likewise, I know plenty of people who can groove at a variety of tempos, but if you dance permanantly like you're on crystal meth. that's your look out (and anyone within 10 feet of you!)

Oh no, I'm not into trance or acid music. That shit is actually too fast. I don't do drugged up pogo stick jumping tempos just like I don't do head bobbing nursing home tempos. I got plenty of rhythm, I do ass shakin' tempos.

Mindflux said:

vainandy said:

I heard it for the first time last night and the assumptions I made from the descriptions I read were absolutely correct. Not only was it shit hop but it was a damn disgrace of a song coming from someone like Prince.

As for it being a dance track, yeah it might work at a senior citizens' dance but it's way too slow for anybody that has any rhythm in their bones to dance to.

Nice timing Ahhh well, you likes what you likes.......

Likewise, I know plenty of people who can groove at a variety of tempos, but if you dance permanantly like you're on crystal meth. that's your look out (and anyone within 10 feet of you!)

omg Mindflux! I totally luv your posts

I think Laydown is a great track. It's funky. It's fun. It would fit on the Newpower Soul or Exodus CD and be one of the better tracks.

When I listen to it, I don't think "Prince shouldn't be making this kind of music." I think... "this is funky!" A simple track, sure, but then again when someone records dozens, if not 100+ songs per year, you can't take one or two songs and make an assumption about whether or not they're following trends or have "lost it". With his last few albums, Prince has proved he hasn't lost anything. MPLSoUND, Lotus, 20Ten, all albums with hugely varied and interesting music.

Hi, guys. I am not an English native speaker. Could you please help me to understand these lines: ...U need a six string and let that sucker ring the holy funking roll...What does it mean in your own words. Thanks.

[Edited 7/23/10 3:56am]

safiya said:

If this track didn't seem like a rip off of some kind of lil Wayne vibe and was new and original I'd love it. But as it is, I think it brings the integrity of the album down, because it seems like a copycat type of song miming a younger crowd's hiphop/rock fusion vibe.

But I bet he could make it very exciting live in concert.

fambam93 said:

safiya said:

Hi, guys. I am not an English native speaker. Could you please help me to understand these lines: ...U need a six string and let that sucker ring the holy funking roll...What does it mean in your own words. Thanks.

[Edited 7/23/10 3:56am]

He's talking about using a guitar in the music and how being funky gets the listeners dancing when he says the whole funking roll gotta get the people up.

I just realized that he says holy funk n' roll..like rock and roll, but with funk instead of rock..that makes a little more sense.

Did anyone else think their CD was duff?!?

I even sent mine back, having bought it of eBay. The seller kindly reposted first class fo' free.

I love it. As soon as I heard the rap I was like "O WORD?" This is what's hot in the streets now P? It was on repeat for a minute cause I thin it's way too short.

Usually I cringe when people who don't normally rap ATTEMPT to rap, but I think he kinda kicks ass in this song...

Let's do it now, come on boo!