Reel said:

Huggiebear said:

I agree with you. Apologies for that n word, but anthropologically big lips and large eyes and curly hair are associated with African descended humans, but as you say can occure in any group of human beings. But I look at it, that all hominiod fossils seem to come from Africa and we humans as descendants of Ardipithecus (See July 2010 National Geographic) are therefore all African people, and that therefore we are all the same. The white and Mongoloid races are later mutations that took place anytime from 2 million years ago when Homo Erectus left Africa up to the last movement of humans into New Zealand 1000 years ago charts the spread of humans. What I am saying is that we are all the same, black and white and we all have Negroid or African features as we are all descended from the first modern human, an African woman some 200,000 years ago. So therefore why do we care about the skin colour and cultural background of Prince's band members, all of the people who have played with him over the years, have one thing in common, they are human beings. And yes I have "Negroid features" too, I have fuller lips and rather thick hair (Explain that to my ex boyfriends busted clippers, hes always on at me about how my hair is too kinky for him" I say live with it.

And thats what I say to all the people hair, Prince's band members are mostly African American, who cares, live with it.

You need another barber.

Good point

Reel said:

LinnLM1 said:

Race has ALWAYS been a factor in Prince's bands. Don't kid yourself. The difference is that in the 80's Prince was actively trying to bring races together but in the last 20 years he has thrown that philosophy into the garbage can - along with the few good songs he may have written.

I don't know that the 80's Prince was intentionally trying to bring races together. I think that he was trying to prevent from being limited and typecast musically, and he wanted a broader audience. Bringing races together was a by-product of his music.

I think he enjoyed playing the music that he did in the 80's, I don't think it was a scam or anything, but i think his "true self" is a little less "rockish". I think he's somewhere in the middle of Funk and Rock (with a mellower deviation). That's my opinion.

All I know is that I hated that song Raspberry Beret. I coudn't figure out where he was going with Raspberry Beret or "The Bell of St. Mark" (if he wrote that for Sheila). I got lost with some of the cuts that were of that calibre.

All you have to do is listen to "Uptown" and "D.M.S.R." - those songs make it clear that at that point Prince was diggin on bringing people of all colors together.

The turning point was shortly after the release of PARADE. At the time PARADE came out, his original hardcore funk black audience was totally put off by it. And PARADE is not a dancable album compared to the actual dance stuff that was being released at the time (Madonna, Flyte Tyme Productions, etc...). Prince was told that he had almost totally lost his black audience and that black dance clubs no longer played his new music. Prince was hurt and he began to try to make amends with The Black Album and SoTT, Batman, Lovesexy etc.

Then when his days as a hitmaker were on the wane in the mid-90s he had a racist reaction 0 I suppose b/c his record company and his managers were white. He blamed rthem for all his woes and he got racial about it. Slave on the cheek was a good sign.

He's made it a point to be a "black artist" ever since.

Huggiebear said:

I agree with you. Apologies for that n word, but anthropologically big lips and large eyes and curly hair are associated with African descended humans, but as you say can occure in any group of human beings. But I look at it, that all hominiod fossils seem to come from Africa and we humans as descendants of Ardipithecus (See July 2010 National Geographic) are therefore all African people, and that therefore we are all the same. The white and Mongoloid races are later mutations that took place anytime from 2 million years ago when Homo Erectus left Africa up to the last movement of humans into New Zealand 1000 years ago charts the spread of humans. What I am saying is that we are all the same, black and white and we all have Negroid or African features as we are all descended from the first modern human, an African woman some 200,000 years ago. So therefore why do we care about the skin colour and cultural background of Prince's band members, all of the people who have played with him over the years, have one thing in common, they are human beings. And yes I have "Negroid features" too, I have fuller lips and rather thick hair (Explain that to my ex boyfriends busted clippers, hes always on at me about how my hair is too kinky for him" I say live with it.

And thats what I say to all the people hair, Prince's band members are mostly African American, who cares, live with it.

I know your post was in response to another orger, and although I was finished with this thread some days ago, I couldn't resist responding to your post. Looks like you've done your homework, and quite well I may add. Thanks for that. You are correct about the early humans (Africans) that travelled "across and out of Africa" and populated the rest of the globe. That woman you are referring to is who genetic scientists refer to as "Eve". It's a shame that many are not educated about this. All humans have the same early ancestors from the beginning of the first human. It was "travel/climate/geographic changes that separated humans from one another, as many from the earliest, human groups travelled across and out of Africa, due to climate and geographic changes (i.e, droughts, ice age, etc.) to reside elsewhere in the world where the soil was rich enough to plant crops and to have greater access to water.

This has been confirmed by many genetic scientists. You can research Spencer Wells and Stephen Oppenheimer. Physical and facial features, hair textures, skin color changed as the early humans (Africans) travelled across the continent of Africa in small groups, and outside of it. and settled in areas around the globe for short/long periods of time, depending on the climate. Climate and geographic changes, had a lot to do with how different humans began to look in physical appearance as they travelled throughout Africa and outside of it. But that's a whole 'nother topic for another thread, but as far as the topic of Prince's current band members are concerned, I honestly don't see what their skin tones have to do with their music knowledge/skills, as musiciians/artists . Again, thanks for the info you gave in your post.

[Edited 7/13/10 22:11pm]

2elijah said:

I know your post was in response to another orger, and although I was finished with this thread some days ago, I couldn't resist responding to your post. Looks like you've done your homework, and quite well I may add. Thanks for that. You are correct about the early humans (Africans) that travelled "across and out of Africa" and populated the rest of the globe. That woman you are referring to is who genetic scientists refer to as "Eve". It's a shame that many are not educated about this. All humans have the same early ancestors from the beginning of the first human. It was "travel/climate/geographic changes that separated humans from one another, as many from the earliest, human groups travelled across and out of Africa, due to climate and geographic changes (i.e, droughts, ice age, etc.) to reside elsewhere in the world where the soil was rich enough to plant crops and to have greater access to water.

This has been confirmed by many genetic scientists. You can research Spencer Wells and Stephen Oppenheimer. Physical and facial features, hair textures, skin color changed as the early humans (Africans) travelled across the continent of Africa in small groups, and outside of it. and settled in areas around the globe for short/long periods of time, depending on the climate. Climate and geographic changes, had a lot to do with how different humans began to look in physical appearance as they travelled throughout Africa and outside of it. But that's a whole 'nother topic for another thread, but as far as the topic of Prince's current band members are concerned, I honestly don't see what their skin tones have to do with their music knowledge/skills, as musiciians/artists . Again, thanks for the info you gave in your post.

[Edited 7/13/10 22:11pm]

Yes I agree with that too, asI read somewhere, that a lot of African American people now are far paler relatively than African peoples still in Sub Saharan Africa, this means a gradual lightening of their skin colour, especially seen as a result of a move into much colder climates. Theres probably a good chance a lot of African Americans in Minnesota will apppear a lot paler overall than say an African American from Mississippi and then much lighter still than say an African from Sierra Leone or Kenya. One has to remember Minnesota has an extreme winter climate and this would affect the amount or and intensity of sunlight that produces melanin (A skin colouring chemical) and hence people like Prince and Andre would be more common than ones as dark as say Bill Cosby or the late Manute Bol (Who was actually Sudanese). Of course there will always be some exceptions to this rule, hence people like Wesley Snipes and Eddie Murphy are very dark skinned and could be passed for a tropical African, but these people are exceptional rather than common in Latitudes north of 40 degrees. At least the Delta region has a warmer and more moist climate like tropical Africa, but the north does not.

Huggiebear said:

2elijah said:

I know your post was in response to another orger, and although I was finished with this thread some days ago, I couldn't resist responding to your post. Looks like you've done your homework, and quite well I may add. Thanks for that. You are correct about the early humans (Africans) that travelled "across and out of Africa" and populated the rest of the globe. That woman you are referring to is who genetic scientists refer to as "Eve". It's a shame that many are not educated about this. All humans have the same early ancestors from the beginning of the first human. It was "travel/climate/geographic changes that separated humans from one another, as many from the earliest, human groups travelled across and out of Africa, due to climate and geographic changes (i.e, droughts, ice age, etc.) to reside elsewhere in the world where the soil was rich enough to plant crops and to have greater access to water.

This has been confirmed by many genetic scientists. You can research Spencer Wells and Stephen Oppenheimer. Physical and facial features, hair textures, skin color changed as the early humans (Africans) travelled across the continent of Africa in small groups, and outside of it. and settled in areas around the globe for short/long periods of time, depending on the climate. Climate and geographic changes, had a lot to do with how different humans began to look in physical appearance as they travelled throughout Africa and outside of it. But that's a whole 'nother topic for another thread, but as far as the topic of Prince's current band members are concerned, I honestly don't see what their skin tones have to do with their music knowledge/skills, as musiciians/artists . Again, thanks for the info you gave in your post.

[Edited 7/13/10 22:11pm]

Yes I agree with that too, asI read somewhere, that a lot of African American people now are far paler relatively than African peoples still in Sub Saharan Africa, this means a gradual lightening of their skin colour, especially seen as a result of a move into much colder climates. Theres probably a good chance a lot of African Americans in Minnesota will apppear a lot paler overall than say an African American from Mississippi and then much lighter still than say an African from Sierra Leone or Kenya. One has to remember Minnesota has an extreme winter climate and this would affect the amount or and intensity of sunlight that produces melanin (A skin colouring chemical) and hence people like Prince and Andre would be more common than ones as dark as say Bill Cosby or the late Manute Bol (Who was actually Sudanese). Of course there will always be some exceptions to this rule, hence people like Wesley Snipes and Eddie Murphy are very dark skinned and could be passed for a tropical African, but these people are exceptional rather than common in Latitudes north of 40 degrees. At least the Delta region has a warmer and more moist climate like tropical Africa, but the north does not.

I was going to say, as well this applies for all tropical peoples outside the tropics. Maori are the lighest skinned of all the Polynesians, mainly as New Zealand is the only part of Polynesia wholly within a temperate zone. For example winter temps in all the Pacific Islands even Hawaii, French Polynesia, Easter Island and the southern cooks in the 20s of latitudes are in the 70sx, here in Auckland at 37 south its been lows of 35 with highs of 50 all week, is it any wonder us Maoris are so pale. Even in the summer average temperatures only just reach 70.

Huggiebear said:

2elijah said:

I know your post was in response to another orger, and although I was finished with this thread some days ago, I couldn't resist responding to your post. Looks like you've done your homework, and quite well I may add. Thanks for that. You are correct about the early humans (Africans) that travelled "across and out of Africa" and populated the rest of the globe. That woman you are referring to is who genetic scientists refer to as "Eve". It's a shame that many are not educated about this. All humans have the same early ancestors from the beginning of the first human. It was "travel/climate/geographic changes that separated humans from one another, as many from the earliest, human groups travelled across and out of Africa, due to climate and geographic changes (i.e, droughts, ice age, etc.) to reside elsewhere in the world where the soil was rich enough to plant crops and to have greater access to water.

This has been confirmed by many genetic scientists. You can research Spencer Wells and Stephen Oppenheimer. Physical and facial features, hair textures, skin color changed as the early humans (Africans) travelled across the continent of Africa in small groups, and outside of it. and settled in areas around the globe for short/long periods of time, depending on the climate. Climate and geographic changes, had a lot to do with how different humans began to look in physical appearance as they travelled throughout Africa and outside of it. But that's a whole 'nother topic for another thread, but as far as the topic of Prince's current band members are concerned, I honestly don't see what their skin tones have to do with their music knowledge/skills, as musiciians/artists . Again, thanks for the info you gave in your post.

[Edited 7/13/10 22:11pm]

Yes I agree with that too, asI read somewhere, that a lot of African American people now are far paler relatively than African peoples still in Sub Saharan Africa, this means a gradual lightening of their skin colour, especially seen as a result of a move into much colder climates. Theres probably a good chance a lot of African Americans in Minnesota will apppear a lot paler overall than say an African American from Mississippi and then much lighter still than say an African from Sierra Leone or Kenya. One has to remember Minnesota has an extreme winter climate and this would affect the amount or and intensity of sunlight that produces melanin (A skin colouring chemical) and hence people like Prince and Andre would be more common than ones as dark as say Bill Cosby or the late Manute Bol (Who was actually Sudanese). Of course there will always be some exceptions to this rule, hence people like Wesley Snipes and Eddie Murphy are very dark skinned and could be passed for a tropical African, but these people are exceptional rather than common in Latitudes north of 40 degrees. At least the Delta region has a warmer and more moist climate like tropical Africa, but the north does not.

Good information. But we still have to acknowledge that people like Prince & Andre & Morris have their complexion not because 'their african ancestors came over in the boat in all shades(I'm not saying your saying that)' but because of historic and recent 'race mixing'. I'm not defining Prince or any of them racially. I'm just saying that differences in facial features, skin tones, eye colors and hair textures between people who look like Prince, Andre, Morris, Sheila vs Jellybean, Jerome, Jessie, Shelby is genetic mixture from 2 or more ethnic groups. Even if the 2nd group has some in their family past -it's not visual. If Prince lived in Georgia he could/would still be fair skinned. My family is from S. Carolina and my parents were just as light there as they are when they moved north. They can get a tan, but it goes away in the Fall-Winter months. My mom stays about even because she isn't out in the sun like my dad. Same with me.

Even "white" people tan.

I guess that's can be connected to your information about people in those tropic places that are still fair complexioned vs others who are darker.

Er, did anybody mention that The Revolution was one of Prince's least diverse bands? Once Dez was gone, the band was Bobby, Fink, Lisa, Mark, Wendy. That's 4 white folks and 1 black person, not a particularly diverse group.

If we're looking for Prince's most racially diverse bands, I think the Lovesexy band in 1988 and the NPG band that performed in 2003 were probably his most diverse. Lovesexy had a decent balance of white and black plus a Latina. The 2003 group that performed in Hawaii and elsewhere had black, white, Latina, and Asian identified folks in the band.

Now, that's just looking at race, which seems to have been the focus of the original post. If we're talking about gender, sexual orientation, musical tastes, nationality, instruments, age, and other forms of diversity, that's a bigger discussion. It would be difficult to come up with a most diverse band given all those factors.

I apologize to be bringing this thread back to the top. I was away from my computer for awhile, but I wanted to make a comment related to the initial post.

Huggiebear said:

2elijah said:

I know your post was in response to another orger, and although I was finished with this thread some days ago, I couldn't resist responding to your post. Looks like you've done your homework, and quite well I may add. Thanks for that. You are correct about the early humans (Africans) that travelled "across and out of Africa" and populated the rest of the globe. That woman you are referring to is who genetic scientists refer to as "Eve". It's a shame that many are not educated about this. All humans have the same early ancestors from the beginning of the first human. It was "travel/climate/geographic changes that separated humans from one another, as many from the earliest, human groups travelled across and out of Africa, due to climate and geographic changes (i.e, droughts, ice age, etc.) to reside elsewhere in the world where the soil was rich enough to plant crops and to have greater access to water.

This has been confirmed by many genetic scientists. You can research Spencer Wells and Stephen Oppenheimer. Physical and facial features, hair textures, skin color changed as the early humans (Africans) travelled across the continent of Africa in small groups, and outside of it. and settled in areas around the globe for short/long periods of time, depending on the climate. Climate and geographic changes, had a lot to do with how different humans began to look in physical appearance as they travelled throughout Africa and outside of it. But that's a whole 'nother topic for another thread, but as far as the topic of Prince's current band members are concerned, I honestly don't see what their skin tones have to do with their music knowledge/skills, as musiciians/artists . Again, thanks for the info you gave in your post.

[Edited 7/13/10 22:11pm]

Yes I agree with that too, asI read somewhere, that a lot of African American people now are far paler relatively than African peoples still in Sub Saharan Africa, this means a gradual lightening of their skin colour, especially seen as a result of a move into much colder climates. Theres probably a good chance a lot of African Americans in Minnesota will apppear a lot paler overall than say an African American from Mississippi and then much lighter still than say an African from Sierra Leone or Kenya. One has to remember Minnesota has an extreme winter climate and this would affect the amount or and intensity of sunlight that produces melanin (A skin colouring chemical) and hence people like Prince and Andre would be more common than ones as dark as say Bill Cosby or the late Manute Bol (Who was actually Sudanese). Of course there will always be some exceptions to this rule, hence people like Wesley Snipes and Eddie Murphy are very dark skinned and could be passed for a tropical African, but these people are exceptional rather than common in Latitudes north of 40 degrees. At least the Delta region has a warmer and more moist climate like tropical Africa, but the north does not.

Thanks for responding Huggie, as I was actually finished with this thread, but felt I owe you a response, and after that, I'm done with this thread. Anyway, in my previous post, I was referring to the first humans, moreso than today, when I mentioned early humans travelling across the globe and populating the earth, and their skin tones/physical/facial features/eye and hair color changing, due to climatic and geographical changes, as they moved crossed the globe, and populated it, hundreds of thousands plus years ago.

Obviously, as those same, various groups of early humans, travelled and populated the globe, in their travels, and faced climatic/geographic changes, while at the same time, their physical/facial features/eye color/hair textures changed along the way, depending on what part of the earth they migrated to and how long they stayed in specific areas. During that time, continuing hundreds of thousands of years that followed, those ancient, early humans were responsible for passing their DNA to future generations throughout the world, as well as those generations that followed, to present day, as people continue to intermingle with one another and produce off spring from various groups.

Also, just to note, you cannot just look at Bill Costy or Don Cheadle, because of their "darker" shades, and assume they are 100% of sub-saharan ancestry, because it is a fact that Don Cheadle is 19% European, and 81% sub-saharan African <--(from and African ethnic group), based on DNA testing he had done, by Professor Henry Gates. It is obvious Don, identifies and chooses to be defined as a Black American, because that is the culture he apparently was raised in, and personally embraces. Although Don is more than his skin color, it will be society that will judge him by his skin color first, before the accept/embrace the "individual" that he is in spirit and personality.

[Edited 7/19/10 22:28pm]