In which songs Prince uses Auto Tune and what do you think about it?
I think Prince should not use it.
I hear auto tune in :
Incense and Candles and most of Mplsound album

Well,i really dig that song and album so evidently I must not mind it. The Lotus set was for everybody. Mplsound was more modern and appealed more to todays young audience (thats prob why i love it). Lotus was made with real instruments and was for guitar lovers.

thebanishedone said:

Why shouldn't he use it?

Should he not use reverb either? Or delay? Or phase? Or flanger?.....

Do you see what I'm getting at here?

dance4me3121 said:

Except that Boom also uses Auto-tune - so bang goes the supposed "real instruments" argument

Mindflux said:

excuse me,u need to check urself

dance4me3121 said:

In what way?

And, what do you mean by "real instruments"? Why is autotune not a "real instrument" (which is what is implied by your original statement).

Listen, I agree that Lotus has a more band-orientated sound, but virtually all the same instruments, studio-wizadry and effects that Prince employs on MPLSound are present on Lotus. This "real instruments" argument is just nonsense. An instrument in the studio is ANY implement, effect or sound-generating device that help you produce music.

Too many people are confusing Autotune being used in it's original and designed purpose (correcting inaccurate pitch, particularly for vocalists who aren't particularly good) and Autotune being used by more creative artists, beyond what it was intended for, as an actual instrument to produce innovative sounds and music. There is a MASSIVE difference between somebody using it to cheat and an artist using it to extend their musical palette.
[Edited 4/28/10 18:22pm]

I think he used it like any other tool of the trade 2 get the sound he was looking 4. I don't think we'll get 2 a point where his vocals rest entirely on it, so I have no problem with him using it in a track or 2.

I don't mind autotune as long as it's being used as an effect and not to hide poor singing ability. In that regard, it's no different to any other effects you might use - chorus, reverb, flange etc. We all know that Prince is a moster vocalist and has nothing to hide from, so in my opinion it's clearly a creative choice when he does use it. It works really well on songs like "Boom" and "(There'll Never B) Another Like Me" - gives him that 'futuristic' sound.

My only small gripe with autotune (well, not really a gripe, but something that artists should keep in mind before using it) is that autotune effectively limits the amount of 'notes' one can use. Often the most interesting notes are the 'in between' notes - bends and whatnot. It's not written in stone that there are only 12 notes. You could, in theory, divide the octave up into as many notes as you please. Autotune is simply limiting you to the standard 12 that our Westernised ears are acustomed to.

But, as with any artform, limitation can also be an interesting creative starting point, so... like I said... as long as it's being used 'creatively', then I'm OK with it (and the examples I hear Prince using it are mostly that).

Edit... yeah, what Mindflux said
[Edited 4/28/10 23:31pm]

toejam said:

And the church said, "Amen!!" This morning I was listening to Timberland and Katy Perry and I was sick. Autotune is now apart of what is happening now, but I don't mind a real singer using it...its the mediocre crew that upsets me....
[Edited 4/28/10 23:32pm]

thebanishedone said:

That's not Auto-Tune! I wish people would figure it out. Auto-Tune tunes the voice that hits a wrong note. It's what bitches like Britney & other c-list talent "singers" use to sound great on record, and lip sync in a concert.

The shit that T-Pain, Kid Rock, and Cher use is not an Auto-Tune. It's either a vocoder, or what Roger/Zapp used - which is a Talk Box. Even Bon Jovi used the device in "Livin' On A Prayer".

ernestsewell said:

As mentioned in another thread before, it is clearly autotune that he is using. Autotune was originally intended to tune out of tune notes but more and more it is being used as effect much like in this song. I'm a recording studio owner and use the effect frequently. It is definitely 120% autotune. T-Pain, Kid Rock, and Cher all use that autotune effect (like on Do You Believe in Love). No doubt about it.

ernest, I've explained this before.

The T-Pain/Cher effect IS autotune. It's what happens when you put the Autotune on overdrive, basically setting it to be as sensitive and to retune the note as quickly as possible.

Trust me - I have autotune and I use it on my own tracks. I even cloned the exact settings that T-Pain uses and it's bang-on.

'Incense & Candles' however is a combination of both autotune and a vocoder.

NONE of these modern artists are using a talkbox like Roger did, with three notable exceptions I can think of - DJ Quik (who was taught to use the talkbox by Roger himself), Teddy Riley, and Prince's horn player Mike Phillips who is a great talkboxer himself. That's it.

Most modern artists are using autotune which requires the least skill of the three.

Here's 'Billie Jean' ran through autotune


[Edited 4/29/10 7:43am]

ernestsewell said:

Uh, Ernest you are so extremely wrong man. Wrong wrong wrong.

is it any diffrent than what he did in 1999 or Erotic City or Bob George or Partyman? He can sing will pretty high and pretty low but not that high or low.

Jakeasaurus said:

Get a new line. You're boring.

ernestsewell said:

errr.. stop being wrong then?

Jakeasaurus said:

You're boring.

ernestsewell said:

even if it is auto tune, it is just a tool to create an effect, something that he would have done in post (to use a movie phrase) to alter the sound of the voice. He has used studio techniques to alter his voice since his first album. And mad adjustments to tape speed and tone and pitch in the mixing process.

To use auto-tune is not any diffrent, just makes it easier.

ernestsewell said:

This response is boring. Back to autotune.

Militant said:

Eventually these noobs are gonna get this through their thick heads

ernestsewell said:

Not even close.....

ernestsewell said:

What's boring is that all this was explained, at length, to you in a recent thread and here you are chiming in with the same old WRONG shit - its time YOU changed the record

Mindflux said:

I see what you're saying since its an effect and everything else you mentioned is an effect, so why not? If you can sing well without the use of auto tune, then why bother? Reverb, delays and flanger only enhance a person's voice. Try putting a flanger on Rosanne Barr while she's singing, that won't make her sound better, though Auto Tune will. Point is, if you can't sing...you have no business using Auto Tune.

rudedog said:

I would say it is those that can not sing that need auto tune. I do not see any major problems, if you like how it sounds and you enjoy it then who cares.

I get that is it 'cheating' but I am not sure it is any more cheating than any other trickery used in the studio over the last 40 years.

rudedog said:

Nope - you're still missing the point. Prince is using it differently to how it is supposed to be used. He is not using it to correct his pitch, he is using it to produce the almost robotic, rapid, stepped pitch change that you hear. That isn't what autotune was designed for, but some artists are using it at its most extreme setting to achieve a vocal effect and NOT to hide mistakes or a lack of vocal talent.

If you can sing, then you won't use autotune to correct your voice. If you are a producer, you may use autotune to create an effect - that is the difference.

Again, autotune was not designed as an "effect" (like flangers etc), it was designed as a pitch-correction system. Some are using it as an effect, just like flanger etc

OnlyNDaUsa said:

See above.

And, it is only "cheating" if it is used as intended - to change pitch that the vocalist could not hit. As an effect, its a different matter. That's not cheating, same as a lot of production techniques are not cheating either.

Militant said:

Yeah, that is spot on. I have Auto-Tune on my DAW as well, but I only use it for pitch correction. Funny enough, there is a large thread at a music production forum I sometimes hang out @ (Gear Slutz)... it is about all of the cliches that will seem dated in next few years. Autotune is mentioned time and again. Some choice quotes:







If P pulled this out of his purple hiney 10+ years ago, he would have been @ the forefront. Now? It is a tired cliche. He can do it if he want's to (who the hell am I to tell him otherwise?), but gawd, it ain't helpin' him look anything other than old.

BlackbeltJones said:

Sure, I agree to an extent. Its not an effect I use either. But, its all about how it is used. Some tracks I like what I hear, .some are torture!

Mindflux said:

Yeah, that's the trick isn't it? There is nothing wrong with the effect by itself, but lazy producers tend to abuse it or shoe-horn it in where it doesn't belong. But when it works, it works. Dirty Vegas' "Days go by" is a great use of the effect actually (and I think it may be driven through a Vocoder to really come across as synthetic). It just fits that track like a glove and you can't imagine hearing it any other way. But for every track like that, there are dozens where its use is just sloppy and/or unnecessary.

Electronic music producers are likely more wary of its use than most because that trick came from the underground scene eons ago... I can remember hearing it pop up in underground electro trax in the late 90s (it may not have been Auto-tune, but it was certainly hyped pitch correction via outboard gear and/or vocoder tricks). R&B adopted it much later and took it further in its use, which is fun.

That said, I stopped hearing the innovation in hyped pitch correction years ago... but then again I don't listen to much current R&B, so I may be missing out on something interesting (i.e. my opinion should come with a grain of salt).

[Edit: Me No Spell Good]
[Edited 4/30/10 12:53pm]

I don't mind it, myself, as the effect only seems cheesy at the moment because Cher used it. My friends might make fun of it. But taken out of context of the times, it's just an effect like any other.

As was pointed out earlier, it's not to cover his bad singing or pitch problems, it's to augment the sound, which is certainly acceptable to me.
[Edited 4/30/10 13:00pm]