hi all , this is my first post so be kind!!!!!
when u now go and see a lot of current artists in concert u can purchase that nights concert on a flashdrive to take home at the end of the night ( minus the encore which can be downloaded at home with a special code)taken from the soundboard so quality is pretty sharp. how many of us have multiple bootleg concerts in not so great quality. he is missing out on a huge revenue stream that other artists have embraced.he gets the money that would usually go to the bootleggers and we get the goods.considering he thinks of himself as ahead of the game i am suprised this has not been implemented for a while
discuss.....

Prince doesn't want to release music that hasn't been polished in the studio.

There could be nights where his voice isn't the greatest.

The band could be not as tight as they should be.

There are plenty of reasons why Prince wouldn't want to allow taping at his shows.

There are tons of other artists who don't allow recording of their shows, but Prince is the only one who gets shit for it.

Ah... but wasn't he the one who said "free music"? Didn't he give away, albeit 'polished' (euphemistic term for 'not quite so good'... alright most of Musicology was alright), CDs at his concerts?

I'm with both of you... but Prince is such a barrel of hypocrisy and contradiction it makes me scream to think of all the wonderful music he could be earning money to pay these court bills with, if only he would allow us to pay a buck or two to listen to them.

Indeed, Prince is such a control person, I do not see him handing out unpolished versions of his concert.

His preference, it seems, is to release video's of performances instead of releasing audio registrations.

The only live album (the One Nite Alone box) certainly was doctored in after-production. I think Prince sees himself mainly as a live artist; I think a lot of his ego is built on being considered a genius live performer and he will not easily give those controls out of hand.

Paris9748430 said:

Those are all egocentric reasons based on a ridiculous drive for control and perfection and an immense insecurity about his own talent.

Who cares if his voice wasn't that great, when he sang and tens of thousand of people heard it already, right?

Anyway, if he doesn't do it, the bootleggers will continue to do it, like they already released his entire outtake catalogue several times.

So the only one missing out is him.

HamsterHuey said:

If all his "official" live stuff is "doctered" in the studio afterwards, he isn't such a great live performer at all. At least not according to himself. Or he wouldn't feel the need to "polish" any mistakes or imperfections.

"Improving" your live performance in the studio is just being a faker.

I think the issue here is that it's Prince's music to chose when and how he wants to release it.

I've heard tons of his bootlegs and honestly only a fraction of it would not get skewered by critics and listeners alike. Not because it is crap, but because much of it is sketches and ideas for songs rather than songs themselves. I think Prince has every right to not want to release this to the public. And if he's too busy to go back and tinker with stuff he now considers old, then that's fine with me too.


However, I know there's tons of stuff in the vault that is 'ready-to-go' which he is holding on to, and this perplexes me as to why he's opting to do that considering the goldmine he's sitting on.

If he released 3 albums a year from his vaults, I'm assuming that he could probably coast for the rest of his life and never have to step foot in a studio.
But I digress.


My take on all of this is that he shouldn't release anything that he doesn't want released--that's his right. However, his morbid focus on gagging fansites and youtube and the like for stuff that he's already released and has proclaimed over and over again that he's 'putting to bed' rather than figuring out a way to release new, quality music that he KNOWS a substantial number of peopel (FAMS) will buy, perplexes me. Prince has a guaranteed audience who will forever subscribe to his music (even those are are fed up with him), simply because from time to time, he releases something brilliant. I think he should focus on that .



That being said, I would for him to open the floodgates on many of the boots I've heard (Crystal Clear, remastered 'Rebirth of the Flesh' )

One of the reasons why he 'doctors' releases may be because, as he freely admits himself, as he's playing the songs he hears a different and, to him, better version and he gets frustrated...you only have to listen to Crystal Ball, there's so much post-production on there it's almost a 'covers' album.

Tremolina said:

So, the song Purple Rain as released is fake. As is It's Gonna Be A Beautiful Night.

Doctored doesn't ALWAYS mean 'bad'. I was trying to convey that he just does not like to leave the control over his music to someone else, which he would have to do, if he came up with the same scheme as decribed above.

HamsterHuey said:

"Being a faker" refered to Prince, not the song. The songs are real, HE is just being a faker when he can't keep them as they were originally played live.



I didn't say doctoring is "always bad" either. By qualifying it as faking I am trying to convey that it isn't original anymore when you doctor a live performace in the studio and that Prince always doing this, is only proof of Prince's ridicuolus insecurity.

Tremolina said:

For what it's worth, doctoring live performances is a time honored tradition and Prince has good company. Take one of the biggest selling "live" ablums of all time... Kiss "Alive!". About the only thing "live" about that album that anyone can confirm was the audiance noise... nearly everything else was re-recorded and/or overdubbed.



Even the cleverly titled Guns n' roses EP "Lies" has a fake "live" side. I am really just scratching the surface of course.

I am not saying it justifies it one way or the other, but polishing up "live" performances is just part of the game. I would wager Prince does less polishing than most, however. I have heard enough undoctored boots to know the man puts on a great live show. In fact, the mistakes give those performances a life and charm of their own...
[Edited 3/4/10 9:27am]

if he still had a fanbase of 1 million worldwide he would release
shows starting tomorrow.

but it's probably just not worth it to him since he's only gonna
ship, what, 50.000 max. after cost deduction and manufacturing etc
there'll be enough money left to pay a month's rent on his new
home (wasn't beverly park 250,000 dollars a month?).

i'm still convinced that if his website had a million members he'd
release an album's wort of material each month. the numbers now do
not get him enough $ and not enough exposure. so he doesn't.

bummer for us

Paris9748430 said:

Precisely - simple, accurate, intelligent analysis. SO refreshing here.

Perhaps he feels that live performances are better heard in the moment.

what makes you think he wants to stop the bootlegs?

HamsterHuey said:

not fake. just not "live."

HamsterHuey said:

I've heard the rehearsals and live performance for the Purple Rain album and it's really close, but an album release is different

the live concert feel doesn't really need that. As a fan I'm loving it, the fans are going to tear it down like that.
And like others have said it's getting out anyway,
Even if you don't release all shows, release some

1 day he will pass away soon or later and someone will make money off of it

i am pretty sure its cuz all his good live shows are probably owned by warner brothers .. some kind of we own all recordings while ur under contract thing .. ya know thats why he changed his name and all so he could release the whitest funk records ever ... so post wb his live show kinda sucked ... long on hip hop swear words and religious lite jazz that makes easy listening sound like satan metal in comparison ... short on great tunes and real improvisation beyond .. its yer turn to solo dude i paid to play notes real fast.

so thats why .. no real money in it. bands that make money off of that kind of stuff change up their shows more every nite .. they have a fan base based upon mind blowing live shows not a hit single or a career that ended 20 years ago. prince fans .. well most prince fans go to his concert because prince made great live music a long time ago ... and back then this idea would have worked for him but really i bought that book with the live disk for 35 bucks and did not need to hear shelby j or half the lamo tunes on that disk .. and it was 35 bucks and a massive book filled with pics of the hotel maid. dude is just off his cracker for sure. so there u go ... if prince ever starts writing and playing good music again it may be worth the idea but for now its just really really really bad new songs mixed with really really bad covers "whole lotta love anyone?" mixed with mediocre versions of songs he used to blow the roof off with back when he really was on fire live.

sure compared to american idol prince still has it live but his live show is just the last waning ounce of talent that is slipping away and likely only still there because he is drawing from his rich back catalog. its like a breath of relief these days when he DOESNT butcher an old tune ... ha the only thing he still hangs onto from his past is that stupid o e o from oz and that stupid lets go from crazy ..

he could, but right now it's his pension fund. The more crap like c&e he releases the less he is going to sell , in turn his golden egg i.e. his live rep will see ticket sales declining and eventually it will come full circle. Thsi means that he will always come back to his hard core fans with some tat who he can rely on to buy any old rubbish [including me!]. Do not expect any miracles until he totally manages to fuck up his legacy, which on current form shouldn't be too long!!!.

TrevorAyer said:

how do you explain Crystal Ball and the (very few) older tracks that have trickled since?

Welcome to the Org. Filipaul.

not in a position to explain but simply a guess is that he was able to do something with with the 'few' outtakes that have been officially released because wb passed on them or likely the crystal ball set was released with some kind of wb negotiations involved after all dark and p control were both on wb come and gold .. wb records ... so they must of given an ok or been compensated or something ..

Paris9748430 said:

I agree! Was watching the opening night of the Musicology show and this totally aligns with the second point you made (re: the band).

Paris9748430 said:

Yeah but that adds an aura of fakeness to Prince's music. Since he's such a great live artist, he's really losing big time positive exposure and not satisfying his many fans request for copies of his live shows sold through legitimate means. Release a full live concert, sign the disc, and limit them to a few thousand and you have an instant collectors item and highly reviewed disc.