I think many of you are missing the point, it was the combination of musicians and the time period that made the music so great, and dare I say magical...I would never give W&L all the credit, it was everbody from Dez (Pre Purple Rain) to Eric Leeds and everybody in between that made the 1985-1986 time period so great and interesting. Anybody who can play a note of music on any instrument can appreciate the growth from a musicians stand point from this time period. It wasn't just the released material that was so great it was the fact that for example, that no one knew that a white girl name Wendy could be so Funky during that time period and then turn around years later with Lisa and do the score to "Soul Food" and "Heros" to name a few. My point, it was the combination of musicians, versatility, and just plain O' perfect timing that made the Revolution great during that time period...and the NPG was and is cool, but as a whole, had NOTHING on the band and musicians that came before them...Ladies and Gentlman..."The Revolution"! Aaron6ix

you people think to narrow, you need to look at the larger picture. when i group or artist become wildly popular the record companies produce copies. that is why he came pout with the radically different Around the world in a Day. most everyone that hopped on the band wagon because of the pop fame of purple rain jumped off. the revolution was a good band but not his best. like miles davis, james brown and george clinton he knows how to surround himself with goods support, with a change in bands there is an evolution of music. wendy and lisa are not his only jazz influence his father was a jazz musician.

minneapolisFunq said:

that had nothing to do with it, and it was Prince's music direction

he just pulled things from various members in his circle, Susannah was probably just as big a part of the creativity
And it wasn't just them, Eric Leeds, Sheila E. the other band members and non band members:Mico Jonathan David Coleman David Z. Jill,
at that time he just had the perfect people even engineers Susan Rogers, Coke
and these people all 'believed' in Prince, they didn't use him as a stepping stone like many following band members did. Nor did any of them say he was never black enough and had intentions on 'shoving black down his throat' ie Tony M.

And remember most of what you hear on SOTT (if u like that album) came from the Revolution years/sessions
[Edited 2/11/10 15:36pm]

1.)Dude I know they are not completely the same band, but for the most part substituting Dez with Wendy they are the same band:Bobby Z Lisa Fink & Brown Mark

2.) not a contraditiction: Hip Hop for the most part wasn't a defined music style in the early 80's. I said they played everything but Hip Hop, which became more prominate in the latest of the 80's into the 90's.
A lot of hip hop was still borrowed heavily from other musicians. Yet Prince did used a generic rap in songs.
Again the music from his band and proteges was very definatively "Purple Music" and they played it live very well.

By 1986 the Revolution had expanded and often included: Susannah, Eric Leeds, Atlanta Bliss, Jerome, Wally, Greg, and Miko.

** Right, visusally it was different, but as far as studio and recording it was still the people who were on the Purple Reign which included Eric Leeds: Jerome Wally Greg even Miko were not a part of the studio recordings even after Parade

To me, that's a hugely different band than when it was just Dez, Lisa, Fink, Matt, Brown Mark.




I understand that the Revolution didn't play hiphop/rap because it wasn't a style Prince incorporated into his music at the time. However, the NPG did. So, we can only speculate when it comes to the Revolution and hip hop stylings.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Of course it had something to do with it.

people are influenced by those around them.

4xample

if not for Larry Graham there would be no rainbow children

** Right, visusally it was different, but as far as studio and recording it was still the people who were on the Purple Reign which included Eric Leeds: Jerome Wally Greg even Miko were not a part of the studio recordings even after Parade ]

OldFriends4Sale said:

This has nothing to do with technology as nearly all the ex Revolution members still release music from time to time and you can hear that they (especially Wendy And Lisa) have a different approach and simply aren't able to put as much energy into their music as, let's say, Mr Hayes, Sonny T or Michael B, although they seem to try very hard quite often (their latest "single" + video, for example).

The shows you mentioned are nearly untouchable because of their style and feeling, their happening just at the edge of the rising mountain of Prince and because the delivery was just absolutely sublime. Still, those shows were anything but loose - many songs sounded just the same as on the album, which makes me question The Revolution's ability to jam on-stage, too.

All in all, quality-wise and technically, I doubt that The Revolution were really over-the-top as much as people tend to think. The thing is, Prince knew how to use them correctly. For what they did on-stage and in the studio they were the perfect musicians. For the stuff that the mid 90s NPG could do they weren't and that's exactly why they never did it.
Lisa is a crazy, creative keyboarder, who comes up with weird chord changes all the time, but she is not as quick as a Tommy Barbarella, or even Fink or Neto, for that matter. Wendy is funky and comes up with some funky licks, but she is not quick nor very clean.

I'm not saying that they were bad because of that. They were even more interesting, because that is what defined their sound and style back then.

But when it is about a band, consisting of professional individuals, nothing can touch the NPG.

I am not trying to be coy, or mess with you. Explain this point to me again.

You

originally said:

the band from Controvery - Parade did the same

My original point is that is that the band Prince had during Controversy is hardly the same band he had during Parade.


Are we limiting the conversation to just in studio? Because (correct me if I am wrong) the band didn't have a lot of input in the studio with Controversy and 1999.
[Edited 2/12/10 9:55am]

skywalker said:

Outside of the dancers, what was so different about the band?

Eric Leeds was on the PR tour, Atlanta Bliss & Mico
Can't really count the 3 male dancers
the only change to the band for the most part was the added horn sections and Prince not playing guitar as much.

Controversy Tour: Fink Bobby Lisa Dez Brown Prince
1999 Tour: Fink Bobby Lisa Dez Brown Prince (Jill on vocals)
Purple Rain tour: Fink Bobby Lisa Wendy Brown Prince (Eric Leeds horn)
ATWIAD performance: Paris show, A Love Bizarre with Sheila
Fink Bobby Lisa Wendy Brown Prince (Eric Leeds)
Parade tour: Fink Bobby Lisa Wendy Brown Prince (Eric Leeds horn, Susannah vocals, Atlanta trumpet, Mico guitar) was Jill a regular?
Dream Factory recordings did not consist of Mico 3 Dancers

OldFriends4Sale said:

There are 7 new musicians that you have listed that were added from Controversy to Parade. 7 new people. I agree that much of the core group is the same, but when you more than double the size of the band (especially adding a horn section) it ain't the same band.

It's like saying the NPG of 1991 is the same as the 1995 lineup. It's not the same band.

Ur blowing that up, where did U get 7?

Controversy Tour: Fink Bobby Lisa Dez Brown Prince
1999 Tour: Fink Bobby Lisa Dez Brown Prince (Jill on vocals)
Purple Rain tour: Fink Bobby Lisa Wendy Brown Prince (Eric Leeds horn)
ATWIAD performance: Paris show, A Love Bizarre with Sheila
Fink Bobby Lisa Wendy Brown Prince (Eric Leeds)
Parade tour: Fink Bobby Lisa Wendy Brown Prince (Eric Leeds horn, Susannah vocals, Atlanta trumpet, Mico guitar) was Jill a regular?

U cannot add the 3 dancers, visually they were part of certain aspects but they didn't change the music at all.

and even Susannah doing vocals you can't say changed the band
the core group is the same and everyone else at times contributed, Mico and the horns were not on every piece live or studio

I swear by the Revolution and totally feel he went downhill fast with their departure. But in concert, his sound definitely improved afterwards.

This is no disrespect to the Revolution...the big difference was the drumming. Once Prince did away with the electronic drums in concert, the sound was mind blowing. It would have been interesting to here Bobby play real drums rather than the electros, especially on the Parade tour.

Sheila and Michael B brought a deepness to the live sound and while I am well aware that they are far superior drummers then Bobby, I honestly feel those electronic drums were the biggest difference.

Bobby Z drumming on Parade tour is GREAT
just check the jazz ending of Controversy brilliant drummer.