Spurned on by Ernest's recent topic on editing Tony M out of Prince songs, I've been busy putting together my own 'special edition' of Diamonds & pearls.

All Tony M's raps are gone and he's been reduced to the odd word here and there. Marvelous.

I couldn't do anything with the track Jughead, even I'd have wanted to, so I've replaced it with Horny Pony.

And it's just struck me now, why on earth did Prince think Jughead was a better album track than Horny Pony in the first place???

I'm loving the end result. Made a great version of Thunder with a mini instrumental breakdown nicked from the ballet version... Replaced Willing & Able with the D&P video version, stuck Violet the Organ Grinder on there as well, it flows really well.

But just wanted to know why the hell he though Jughead made the grade when better outtakes/bsides were just waiting to be included :s

Erik

This isn't commonly known, but Tony M gives really good head.

Prince was basically in love with him, until Mayte came along. So anything he touched, got put out.

NouveauDance said:

That makes sense. Mods, feel free to lock this thread, question answered.

Erik

I really really don't think he WAS thinkin'. He could have even put Player on board.


Jughead is SUCH SUCH a waste of space and waste of artistic integrity.

Prince was threatened by rap, so he thought he had better get on board because he realised it wasn't going anywhere. T.C Ellis and Tony M both got pay cheques because of this, and we got some really crap songs.

NouveauDance said:

sad really. Get rid of Tony though and Daddy Pop, Push & Live 4 Love are ok. The tragedy I've had is I can't get rid of him fully from Willing & Able without cutting Rosie. Might have a fiddle around, see if I can do a better job of that one.

Erik

Willing & Able, now there's evidence for sending Tony M. to the electric chair if I ever saw it. Rosie & The Steeles could've taken over his spot on that.

"Horny Pony" is great & far better than "Jughead"... 100% true.

I wish I could do that trick, erasing Tony M. from the D&P album.

Although I actually like Tony M's appearance in "Gett Off"...

thedance said:

Yeah kept him in Gett off and the odd word here and there, got rid of all his raps. It wasn't my idea, it was Ernest's, took me about 20 minutes in total and it's transformed the album.

Erik

erik319 said:

"Gett Off" replaced "Horny Pony". "Jughead" wasn't related to that switch. That's why it's shown as "Horny Pony" on the label.

I had the thought to edit "Jughead", but then thought...."Why bother?" I realized I had never ripped it to my computer anyway, so I never even think about it when the album plays. Perhaps "Violet" would be better in the place of "Jughead". I might give that a try. Wasn't it on an earlier configuration of the album?

There's this from Wikipedia:

One of the earliest songs that ended up on Diamonds and Pearls was "Live 4 Love", a track from 1989.[1] The bulk of the material would be composed in 1990, however. A few songs evolved during Prince's Nude Tour in 1990, notably "The Flow", and "Schoolyard". Prince decided to place an emphasis on rap with this album, handing the reins over to Nude Tour dancer, Tony M. An early version of the album from November 1990 [2] consisted of the following:

1. "Daddy Pop"
2. "Walk Don't Walk"
3. "Schoolyard"
4. "Strollin'"
5. "Willing and Able"
6. "Diamonds and Pearls"
7. "Insatiable"
8. "Money Don't Matter 2 Night"
9. "Horny Pony"
10. "Live 4 Love"
11. "Something Funky This House Comes"
12. "Call the Law"
13. "The Flow"

Most of these songs went through minor to major revisions before being released, and five of them didn't make the cut at all. However, "Call the Law" would be released as the B-side to "Money Don't Matter 2 Night", and later, on the New Power Generation album, Goldnigga, while "The Flow" would be revised for the album. A later version of the album, closer to the actual release date was identical to the official album, but still had "Horny Pony" in the place of "Gett Off", a newly written track which ended up replacing "Horny Pony" at the last minute. In fact, "Horny Pony" still exists on the track listing, written in red over "Gett Off", and is mentioned in the lyrics to "Push".

Tell us the track list you came up with.

Side note: I realized there's a small error on my edit of "My Name Is Prince". It's off a half beat. I need to change that.

NouveauDance said:

True. Prince thought something like "Jughead" was good because he was fully letting Tony M. shove "black down that nigga's throat" (or whatever the stupid ass quote was).

erik319 said:

I don't think I cut any Rosie out when I took Tony off "Willing & Able".

erik319 said:

Ummm, he didn't. He though Gett Off was a better song than Horny Pony...and I agree! Horny Pony sucks! But yeah, still better than Jughead.

thedance said:

well, I took about 90% of him off the album. Remove "Jughead" from your tracklist, and take the edits I did recently with "Push", "Daddy Pop", "Willing & Able", "Live 4 Love", and he's all but gone. He's still on "Gett Off". That one seems to work, and Prince is doing most of the 'rapping' anyway. In my edits, Tony is reduced to a one-word background singer at best. See edits here: http://prince.org/msg/7/327166

NouveauDance said:

Totally agree. I would have loved to seen some sort of gospel type chant or background arrangement in part of that song, and really build it up as the song goes on. I need to edit the D&P Video version, and insert that into the track listing as well.

ernestsewell said:

hmmm. I wanted to do a Special Edition so I used the livestudio version. Rosie's line 'let me take a bite.... That culminates with 'tonight' overlaps on that version with tony's 'well hello'. Only for a millisecond, but the fecker's still there. If there's no overlap on the studio version, I'll attempt a little splice.

Erik

erik319 said:

I just listened. I kept Rosie in. It's a big of a quick change, but you can hear Rosie says, "A hot chunk, piece of your loooove", then it goes right to Tony's last word "Yeahhhhh" at the end of his rap. "Tonight" is cut out for that reason, but in the context of the statement she's making, it doesn't take away from her plea for taking a bite to see if [you're] ripe.

rudedog said:

I love horny pony!!! Sorry I wasn't clear. I know Gett Off replaced Horny Pony. The CD case tells us that. What I meant was that it's an abomnation that Horny Pony was cut when Jughead was allowed to slip through. Put Horny Pony in Jughead's place and the album works much better.

And you get the added bonus of having 'new dance commercial take 1' instead of the 'take 2' of Jughead, which just sounds out of context.

Erik

ernestsewell said:

I decided not to mess with it too much, and only put on perfect quality stuff. Was originally gonna put Glamslam 91, schoolyard, something funky, etc... But it just felt like over egging the pudding.

So I made a nice new remix of Thunder that incorporates the breakdown and reprise from the Billboards ballet version. It's only a 20 second thing, but it gives it a nice 'calm before the storm' feel just before the climactic ending.

I added the other willing & able. Extended Gett Off. Horny Pony replaced Jughead and I slotted Violet the Organ Grinder after Push, just because i like it.

Like I said, nothing too out there, but along with the edited tracks, it just works really well.

Erik

ernestsewell said:

Ah right I get ya. I'm now wondeing if I can fudge together earlier bits of her solo to recreate the word 'tonght'. Haha,think I'm taking this too far now. I'm blaming you!

erik