I side with Prince when it comes to bootlegs etc. But I can't help thinking that the more difficult Prince makes it to get hold of his material, the more bootleg / pirate material will be bought and sold. I recently came across this quote:

"History has shown that one of the best deterrents to pirated product is providing legitimate product at appropriate prices. In the music industry, we have already seen that people will gladly pay fair prices for legally-produced product even when it can be easily reproduced and unlawful copies can be easily acquired."

-- excerpt from a holiday message by Walt Disney CEO, Michael Eisner, to a vast number of Disney employees, 2000


I agree 100%. So when I see Prince removing himself from the mainstream, and selling his work independently via a very poorly run, pretty unknown website, he is effect making it harder for people to get hold of his music.

I can't knock Prince for doing this, but if people find it hard to get his stuff, or don't know where to get it, they are likeley to buy unnofficial stuff, either knowingly or unknowingly.

Hope I'm wrong

I think that bootlegs are much harder to get than official stuff that was released through a website.

And I think that what the Disney article is about is exactly what Prince is doing right now. He´s giving live recordings to fans, unreleased songs etc etc. Bootleggers know how to statisfy fans and that is what Prince is trying to do right now. The whole ONA..Live, downloads from soundcheckes, Empty Room download is a "war" against bootleggers. But that is my humble opion...

If the artists were more fan friendly they would see that fans buy the music. Hit fan websites and see what they are talking about and see what is being traded, etc. Hate to bring up ole Dave again, b-u-t, when Dave Matthews tours, there is ually a live cd released. If fans saw the tour...they want to buy a cd of the tour!!! So simple. If an album gets held back and unreleased, it will eventually get to the fans via bootleg, sooo release it yourself, ie:DMB Busted Stuff, P's Black album.


Fan's would not want the Livesexy boot, if there was a soundboard Lovesexy cd...duh


Fan's would not want the Small Club boot, if there was an official '2nd show that night' cd. It is sooo simple.


Prince didn't release any of the soundchecks, so what do fans want...the soundchecks!! Because some fan played quitar, got up on stage, yelled and screamed or something.

Prince didn't release any aftershow, where most of his clever jams and ad libs come from, what do fans want most...aftershows. He talks to fans, jokes around, etc. Supply and demand. I LOVE the aftershows and Prince is at his VERY best.


In the end, People want what they can't have

I agree that many fans will (and have) looked in the direction of bootlegs to satisfy their enthusiasm for Prince's music.

However, if making available some tracks, hoping it will deter people from seeking out bootlegs, then I'm afraid Prince is sadly mistaken. Take the ONA live set that was released. U would think the bootleggers would shy away from supplying boots from this tour, wouldn't u? BUT NO! THe ONA tour has to be the most bootlegged tour in his entire career. There are at least 20 seperate concerts available on bootleg from this tour, not to mention countless aftershow and sound checks.

If Prince is serious about beating the bootleggers, he should follow in the footsteps of Pearl Jam (another great band) who made their entire 2000/1 tour available for their fans on simply packaged cds.

I really don't think Prince has fully grasped the economic potential of releasing more live sets and out takes. Being the 3rd most bootlegged artist out there has got to say something.

Unfortunately, from a personal point of view, I don't care what he says about his not being true if they buy bootlegs. I buy bootlegs and will continue to do so until either a) my apetite for his music dries up, or b) he comes to his senses and fully utilises the NPGMC by distributing live concerts, out takes, rehearsals, etc.

I'm sure all bootleg collectors would prefer their money goes into the pocket of the maker of the music, rather than the faceless bootleggers.

gambool said:

No you are not wrong. It is the truth.

boscho said:

I agree, but it is even worse.

Prince also forgets that when more people share his work for free more people will come to like it, check his offical stuff out... and actually buy it too.

But it is not only the economic potential, it is also the potential of building relationships with your fans. If you don't object in an agressive way like by suing fans for the simple linking to boots or the sharing of unauthorised material you will maintain these relationships.

If on the other hand you go mad whenever something unauthorised happens you do destroy these relationships.
Besides all that, what is so artistically ethical about oposing something that actually enables your fans to enjoy your work even more?


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[This message was edited Wed Jan 15 8:30:36 PST 2003 by Abrazo]

Jasper said:

I tend to disagree. Its easy to find bootlegged material on the market; you just have to know where to look. All of the Japan ONA shows are now on the bootleg market as are numerous European shows. Furthermore I have seen some ONA European and Japan shows also out on video (of course the quality varies from tape to tape). Also Ive seem all of the Celebration nights on both CD and VCD. im hoping that the Vegas Finale of the ONA tour is coming soon.

Jasper said:

Prince is not doing what the article says. ONA Live is a compiled live set commercially released to the genral public to hail Prince's carreer and him and the band as live musicians. ONA Live is also VERY expensive.

(most)Fans want at least the concerts they went too, and then some more. They do not need a dubbed and compiled live set perse.

(most yes...)Fans do not want to get ripped of by the club where they have to pay more for the box than in stores.

Fans are not interested in a "war" against bootleggers, because it will hurt their enjoyment just the same.

it is silly to wage a war against bootlegger. you will never win. Prince should do much more by himself instead of bitching against the ones who are prepared to give fans what they want. And he should encourage the sharing of his recordings, instead of suieng fans.


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Jasper said:

Well, everyone I know has seen Prince boots flying about, and can quite easily get their hands on them. However, ask them about Prince's website, and they will more often than not be unaware of its existance, nevermind know the URL.


Except for the fact that the illegal versions are often more accessible and more a fair price than the legal versions.


Yes, the Bootleggers are satisfying fans. An example would be the number of boots featuring NPGMC material, as to a number of these fans the club was not accessible, or they didn't even know about it.

There is always going to be bootlegs, and pleanty of people to buy them, but this can definetly be minimised by providing accessible products at fair prices.

I'd say its early days, and Prince will get there eventually. But its been 3 years of the NPGMC, preceded by 1-800, the shop in Camden, and the official Fanzine. Maybe Prince should stop changing his approach because it is not working, and stick with one until he makes it work.

Prince could release the cds from the concertss himself.
I attended 25 ONA concerts in 2002 plus I buy a lot of the merchandise, I feel if I recieve a bootleg that is offered, I'm not hurting Prince.

Some of the bootlegs are awesome.

lovebird said:

Yes, just like Pearl Jam have, albeit backed by Sony



U're damn right they are!

lovebird said:

this is exactly my point with bootleggers...the people buying them are the people who have shelled out the most for his official stuff.

i appreciate there are bootleggers sitting on a pile of cash, but i would guess most bootleg stuff changes hands for free these days with the trading system.

if prince released every show as an mp3 download and charged $10 a pop, along with some artwork, everyone would buy it from NPGMC to guarantee good quality sound...that way he doesn't even have to worry about costs of cd distribution etc.

letsgocrazy said:[quote]

lovebird said:

Don't go giving prince more bad ideas on how expensive he makes his offical stuff!


10$ for a cd. MAX

2.50 $ for an mp3. MAX

Otherwise it won't worjk and most people will get it for free.