Forgive my musings for a moment, but let me reflect on the way we as fans, and those who are not but comment on Prince's art, treat the man himself.

Perhaps more than any other artist, here I stand to be corrected, Prince is critisised for almost everything he does by his own "fan" base. Some of these critiques include the following:

- he has the wrong faith
- his music lacks melodies
- his expression of black consciousness is out of sync with the digital garden
- he releases to0 little, or too much music
- he is not public enough about his personal relationships
- he does not take his website or customers seriously enough

The list is endless, but sometimes it is as if all of the above lend to feelings of great superiority of certain Prince fans over the man they are supposed to be a fan of.

Could it be, though, that the anonymity of the Internet has given these individuals a sense of boldness, so that what they perceive as weaknesses or negativity on the part of Prince, is so much more important than his many achievements or strengths...ex: lets rather discuss songs we dislike, or things about Prince that we do not like, than what attracted us to the man in the first place

Sometimes it appears as if individuals are trying to bully Prince...>>> rather be a Jew than a JW; rather sing like this than like that, rather play your guitar like this, than like that, rather date women who look like this, than...y'all know

What tickles me slightly...is that I see Prince as a person who feels his music deeply; I can picture him listening to a cd/song a million times before it is officially released. Even if we don't get into certain tunes as much as others, each of them are like children to him...he's doing his best and being himself...

is it worth trying to bully Prince

*thanks for reading if you got this far

Prince! Nice to see you on the org.

Bullies need to be bullied back on occasion.

I am not Prince, and as an obedient observer of the org's rules, am not attemting to impersonate him either

Mars23 said:

is that not a purple rain perception of prince, though...whereas in rave 2000, his band members discuss his willingness to incorporate their ideas?

NelsonR said:

Of course you are Prince, you look like him.

NelsonR said:

No. Prince the bully is very much a part of his 2010 persona.

man, i miss the days when npgmc still existed

Mars23 said:

U have me wondering if that is your perception of him, generally, or if in 2009/10 he engaged in behaviour towards fans which would warrant such a label. then again, capitalism/individualism requires one to be aggressive, look out for no. 1...should prince be the exception?

NelsonR said:

no.

but given that example and specifically the cuthroat bleeding of the fans that LF.com was, it would be very difficult to also argue he is a soft target for bullies.

cborgman said:

1 way to view this is that prince's interest in his web presence is not as important to him as his live gigs...life is full of disappointments and maybe he has dissuaded many from joining his online sites; many will still join again and again, though...after knowing how prince is with websites.

but, does poor running of a website make prince a bully, and should it overshadow over 20 years of art?

NelsonR said:

Fans? Try the people he works with 1st. Then check in with the general consensus on his 2009 business ventures.

I would argue that my perception is vividly clear.

I have always been just like most fans. People made/make fun of me for being a fan and I defend Prince. I even defend his loonier decisions like his feud with youtube and dancing babies ect...Even the music that is not my favorite stuff, that was Prince's vibe at the time and I dig that even his worst would be a GREAT album for most of the hacks working today.

But I will never defend the blatant bullshit he pulls on fans year after year, weather it be through a stunted business sense or just outright malice, Prince is a habitual line stepper. For every fan that has had a good experience, there are 100 that feel screwed over. At some point you gotta look at the math,take off the blinders, and realize there is something there.

I don't like saying that, it pains me to be so fond of someone, yet so put off by his behavior. But I am also not blind to the truth.

NelsonR said:

poor running of a website doesn't make him a bully.

but charging people 8 times the retail amount to show them streaming videos they've already bought and sending some of them t-shirts is not the work of a martyr, either.

he isn't being bullied.

you can't pull stunts like that and gut the fans for money like that and simultaneously be the poor picked on artist when they turn on you for gutting them again and again over the years.

Mars23 said:

I just don't see it that way. I don't think Prince sits back and says: "hmmmm, how can I screw my supporters?" 3 cd's for the price of one resembles the opposite to me, as do 3 shows in 1 night. then again, how many ppl saw multiple shows at a reasonable price at the o2? malice, definitely disagree there.
[Edited 1/11/10 1:16am]

NelsonR said:

Like in, say, a true bully who doesn't care what his actions may cost others, as long as the bully is satisfied and all that?

And I really do believe that for his 20+ years legacy of brilliant music, doesn't excuse his bad behaviour. As even Prince himself seem to think: You've got to seperate the artist from his art. One doesn't excuse the other..

cborgman said:

some people go to McDonald's coz they like the fries, others dig the Big Macs; some choose not to go at all. for seasoned fans, who have seen Prince's inconsistency in dealing w/ his websites over years now, why keep going back. rather check out his shows, re-visit your mp3's or own personal dvd collection.

then again, should Prince's miss-handling of his website spill over into the analysis of his music, etc? some people take one issue and mix it up w/ the next, forgetting that not too long ago, Prince was the funkiest person to them.

It's almost like a marriage where people lose site over an argument, then everything else gets mixed in...

Cravens said:

please see the post which follows yours

I didn't say everything was bad or done out of malice, but just as you can list a few things, I could list a bunch of the bad. Just take off the blinders and look at the whole picture.

Right now, there is 3 months left of the founding member's subscriptions on lotusflow3r.com. There is no-one running the site. The phones are off, the e-mails go unread and unanswered. People that need login assistance are up the creek and bunches still didn't even get the damn shirt.

That is simply a pure and powerful "FU" to those fans that arguably support him the most. The day one signups are being ignored.

Mars23 said:

i admit i am not a member of the current site, and yes...i would be highly pissed if that was the service i received as many of y'all do. what i am
suggesting is this...perhaps we need to treat our relationship w/ prince as
a sort of marriage (it will never be perfect). if you cannot stand your hubby's complaining, or your wife's lasagne tastes terrible...you avoid them; so it is w/ Prince y'all (perhaps forget joining his websites)...but, like couples, try not mix things up.

p.s. hopefully Prince will learn that their are people who are really interested in enjoying his websites, and that in this day of age, they are a serious mode of communication...but perhaps the dude will never care and we've all been bitten before and should be shy by now.

NelsonR said:

I see your point, but I think I'm fairly good at just listening to the music and discussing it, without mixing the personal/media life of Prince into it.

To be honest, if I couldn't oppress my knowledge of Prince and his persona, I couldn't listen to his music at all.

But naturally, things mix up. You have to take into account, that Prince himself have been mostly about .. Prince himself .. in the media ever since, hm, Gold Experience, and thereby almost forcing you to focus on the personality and conduct of the man, rather than listening to some tunes. (And most of his lyrics seems to be about he media-Prince)

NelsonR said:[quote]

cborgman said:

to quote kevin smith... don't talk to me like i'm apollonia.




well, to use your marriage anology, there is such a thing as a battered spouse who continues to defend the abusive spouse, making all kinds of excuses for his abuse.

but to be less dramatic: even you, in a really non-commital way, are admitting that the way he treates his fans is very poor.

and as far as making it about his music... his last several albums have been pretty tepid. there are some gems, but there is an assload of filler. regardless of whether he burned people with his insane business choices doesn't really factor into the music being largely meh.

and he has every right to put out meh and to get every penny he can squeeze the fans for from it.

but he also then opens himself up to the comments he gets from the people he bleeds. he isn't being bullied.
[Edited 1/11/10 1:30am]

Cravens said:

totally in agreement here

NelsonR said:

Take 100 couples with troubled marriages as that seems to be the analogy of the morning.

Now have 50 couples take your advice of "not mixing it up" and the other 50 engage in honest conversation. Which 50 do you think will have more success in the marriage?

not to mention the sheer aggression exhibited in recording songs like "no more candy for you" and that PFU one.

at best, it's passive-aggressive to record songs attacking your fans then claiming being bullied.

cborgman said:[quote]

NelsonR said:

interesting use of words and expression.

to be honest, i think he f'd up w/ his websites; we agree there, but i don't think that the website issue should be linked to all the other aspects of the man.

i also happen to be one of those who has really enjoyed the last few releases, with Musicology being the exception

*off topic, but i dig 'a million days' and the title track

Shit, the pic posted in the OP is from housequake.

Why not ask them if Prince is a bully or just a misunderstood lil puppy just trying to get us to feel his music.

cborgman said:

i think that's him being human though...reacting to negativity which he perceives to be coming from "fans"

Mars23 said:

people try and work things out, even it's difficult; the thing is that after the divorce many of us are still here, kindof like a divorce recovery forum

Mars23 said:

NelsonR said:

I think our dear Mr. Nelson could benefit from a reality check and a good therapist. He's getting nothing from fans than what he gives.