I only became a fan in the late 90s, so I wasn't around during the rampant bootleg trading of the 80s, but I have a simple question for you experts out there...

Who leaked this stuff originally? Given the staggering volume of unreleased Prince material out there I find it hard to believe that Prince didn't purposefully leak the majority of it himself back in the day. But if this is truly the case it opens up other questions, such as: 1. Why does he bitch about bootleggers all the time in interviews? 2. Why doesn't he do a proper commercial release of this material?

first came the legs

then came the boots

I always wonder - from where that massive set of unreleased material "The Work" came from?

MattyJam said:

Interesting question. I don't think anybody really knows the answer.

Luv the way the org has become a big forum for bootlegs!!!!!

eireboy34 said:

it just reminds me how much I miss Housequake

Prince won't stop until he's purged all that was or could be interesting from his artistry.

Sorry, OT and random personal opinion after a few beers. Haha, back to the topic...

I don't know...but my hunch is that a lot of it was just prince being a little more than careless...the studio stuff came from him directly and band members and studio staff...I've heard stories of how people got copies of things...such as a person installing a stereo in wendy or lisa's car and in the 'old stereo' was a tape that they were working on....I think that was around the mid 80's....Prince often gave tapes to girlfriends...and they'd eventually be copied by someone and distributed...the staff who purposely leaked stuff is a bit more sinister..but a lot of it was purely accidental on the band and Prince's part....that said I don't believe for a minute that Prince didn't make sure some of it got leaked on purpose - he knew/knows that the bootlegs would make/made him legendary....

the most interesting thing I find is that since he left Warners it became almost impossible to get 'new studio boots' - maybe Prince didn't care too much when he was on the WB payroll...now that he's gotta pay all the bills himself he actually cares about the value of his 'product' and doesn't want to give it away for free....or as WBs contested 'flood the market'

still, that said, I'm sure there's more unreleased stuff thats in very small circles....but because those circles know Prince directly and it can be traced back to them a lot easier...that could be why most new bootlegs are live shows now, taped by fans...not from soundboards....

that said, I wonder why Prince doesn't swamp us with stuff...he could be making money very easily from his vault material.....unless of course he does have plans for it all....one day.....or not...

erik319 said:

hah....that place was where i got all my bootlegs....rip HQ

jimino1 said:

Much of what you stated was pretty much backed up by Chronic Freeze during his org Q&A - I won't repost his words because he asked us not to. The part of your theory that I doubt is that Prince would put anything out there on purpose, given his public stance against his own work being bootlegged.

^true...I mean I don't know...but ain't it funny that while he was with WBs a lot got leaked...then since he's been on his own not much at all has surfaced..maybe cos PP has better security.....or maybe WBs had pretty average security..maybe a little of both...who knows...only those who get the 'first generation' tapes/cds I guess....

I still think Prince is missing out on a huge amount of easy $ by not releasing more....its not as though he has to press it all nowdays...downloads r a cheap option compared to making real cds...easy profit from work already done...he could still squirrel all the 'really good stuff' for projects later on if he liked, how would we know what else he has in the vault to compare LOL

MattyJam said:

Numerous different sources - carelessness, band members, girlfriends, employees,
record company employees, ex members of any of the above etc.


He didn't. Though in the early days it wasn't such a big deal and there wasn't
such a market for it.

Prince has never purposefully leaked material to bootleggers. Whenever, he
'leaks' material, he does it publicly - like giving tracks to radio stations
to play, or posting tracks on his websites etc.


He doesn't bitch about bootleggers all the time, he's mentioned it a few times
in interviews when it's come up, that's all. At the end of the day, it's his
material to release or not release as he sees fit.

I think part of the problem is the easy accessability of bootlegs these days.
In the past, unreleased tracks were very difficult to get hold of, and they
were only ever really shared amoungst the hardcore collectors, who already owned
everything he'd officially released (usually multiple times). They appeciated
the unreleased tracks for what they were... early working drawings for what
would eventually get officially released or tracks that didn't quite fit
conceptually with their respective albums or were replaced by better songs etc.

However these days, that perspective has been lost. Almost everybody has these
tracks. Often without owning the official releases, and the lines between
official and unoffical material has become blurred. How many times have we seen
threads like "What album is Moonbeam Levels from?" THIS is why the issue of
bootlegging has become such an issue.

BorisFishpaw said:

Here, here Boris. There's too many times we've this kind of post someone saying "I've got thousands of unsorted files, which album is X song from?" - Tsk.

zaza said:

The Work is compiled from older sources like Boris listed above, the same as any other bootleg. It wasn't an entire collection that someone stumbled across and pressed to CD, it's compiled from a multitude of sources, older bootlegs etc.

jimino1 said:

Definately.

Fans are very naive if they don't think at least a portion of the bootlegs out there were purposefully leaked by the man himself. He knew that by having a wealth of bootlegs circulating that it would add to his reputation as a musical prodigy - even if 75% of it is utter shit.

The man isn't stupid. If he truly didn't want this music to be heard, why would he continue to be so careless, giving away tapes to girlfriends etc?

I'm sorry, I don't buy it.

jimino1 said:

I agree. I guess that was the idea behind Crystal Ball, but obviously he lost his sanity somewhere along the line with that project, including dross like Poom Poom and Tell Me How U Wanna Be Done over gems like All My Dreams and The Line.

MattyJam said:

People that have worked for Prince(and Prince himself) have said he NEVER released any of that shit himself. And if you trace bootlegs back, many are all explained as far as origin. Everthing from connecting with a Japanese soundboard guy years after a Lovesexy concert) to lifting a CD or cassette from a car or DJ at a club. Prince himself has walked into shops and had entire sections of bootleg cd's confiscated.

I, myself, was in contact with a bootlegger (they were overseas) and created and donated custom artwork/booklet designs for a release many many years ago. Prince was not involved.

i am pretty sure i have read that prince would hand out tapes of in progress work all the time at his shows and clubs .. there are interviews where he plays the interviewer a bunch of songs and only one of them ends up on the actual records ... he used to give them out all the time tho i dont think it was intended as a "leak" more just excitement and wanting the hardcore fans to hear what he is up to ... i am sure he used to do a quick mixdown to cassette back in the day throw it in his car and drive around ... so there were numerous mixes before cds came out on tapes that were work tapes ... i have no doubt that enough were laying around the studio that eventually the other people may have run off a quick copy ... i dont think he cared as much back then .. i know ive handed out thousands of rough mixes before i settled on the final track list and those people passed them around and so on ... eventually prince realized that people were making a lot of money on it and he got a little pissy but i dont think he cared to the extent that say metallica got all uptight cuz the song wasnt finished ... the whole npgmusic club was like his free demo site ... again i dont think he cares that much if people hear his experiments ... he likes them all ... i think it was just a business thing ... when u are on the upclimb it benefits you to have people trading bootlegs ... builds the excitement .. look at phish or grateful dead ... they built a whole career on tape traders craving the unique concert experience .. prince is that way too ... the record is a souvenier .. the bootlegs keep you wondering what will happen next because it is always different and new ... and the live show is where you earn your bread and butter ... the suppression of bootlegs was just a business quirk probably the result of his records selling a lot less ... he didnt even want the black album out there even tho he played songs from it live and it was more notorious as a bootleg ... its all part of the game ... so of course it came from him ... he is the reason we have it all mostly .. and there was never an end to his bootlegs he just released them himself with trippple albums and internet clubs .. thats the stuff you would have got from some dude in an obscure record shop ... now you get it from prince ... you know s + m groove or hypnoparadise is not that much worse than say "good man" or "snow man" or "it takes 3" ... they are all outtakes .. you are just getting the outtakes directly from prince now

TrevorAyer said:

Prince cares . . . don't be naive.