Gohi said:

Oh, I see. But how did it move you "spiritually" then? Isn't "spiritually" referring to religion only? Do you believe that there is any kind of "higher power" and you just refuse to call it a "god"? (all of the "atheists" I know are of this kind - although "atheist" is the wrong term for them, since they accept in fact the existence of a deity, in greek we have a separate word for those without religion)
Or you believe that there's nothing beyond the visible world?

In either case you can interpret the song so as to suit your beliefs (as you have the right to do with any work of art) saying that God is for you a symbol for conscience perhaps, or ethics.

I hope what I wrote makes sense...

Me too, approximately 13 years... Maybe we've just moved onto to other music which is also moving Too much of anything is never good

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

I absolutely agree with you.
Prince was more spiritual back in the day and he always had an open mind, heart, and soul to let the spirit move him. To connect with his 'higher self' or to connect with God used to be his inspiration to write these beautiful songs you mentioned.
These songs were the main reason I became a Prince fan. I used to be so moved by his music and could relate to the lyrics in a very spiritual way.
These days Prince seems to be too focused on being religious instead of being spiritual. His religion dictates now how to act,or what to think or feel. Every man made religion somehow brainwashes people to the point where they don't use their own mind or imagination anymore.
They become so busy to follow the do's and don'ts of their religion, that there is no room left for inspiration. And that is sad, because there is something sacred about being inspired or in other words 'in spirit'
To be inspired means to be close to God.

porfyrivrohi said:

I believe that there is some sort of energy that is greater than us out there in the universe, something that caused us to exist... but I don't believe in a God that controls our lives. (I am annoyed when people relate every event in their lives to God and act like he is the reason for everything... 'God let me do this' or 'God didn't let me do this' etc.')

I have a lot more to learn about life (I am 19) so I won't act like I have an answer for all that stuff yet.

I jsut think the vibe and guitar work really emphasize what a broken, bleak world this planet can be. It's very powerful stuff. And even if I don't believe in God, I do I have a spiritual side.

GiGi319 said:

Gigi319, I agree when you state that "And even if I don't believe in God, I do have a spiritual side." Just because I believe in a "traditional" or "man-made religion" I don't think that it is my place to judge what is in other people's hearts. Just like I cannot empirically prove that there exists a God, especially the God of a particular religion, I can't also disprove that you or anyone else have a spiritual side. And in fact, I don't know if any religion, especially Christianity or Islam, teaches its followers to spend time trying to prove that others follow a false religion. In the text when Jesus states that he is the way, the truth, and the light, I interpret that as him wanting people to spend their time investigating his claims rather than worrying about the claims of others. So the Christian text seems to be claiming that if someone studied and practiced faith in what is being asserted in the text that the text would be proven, subjectively because faith cannot be proven empirically, and then I would be compelled to share my "good news" with others. Yet, my sharing would not be from the standpoint of denouncing other people but from the standpoint of sharing with others how following this religion has seemingly helped me. Unfortunately, people who seemingly spend more time denouncing others and making life hell for others become the poster children of the religion rather than the people who spend more time trying to ease the pains and burdens of others.

Accordingly, sometimes, in our frustrations with people whom we view or perceive as oppressive or judgmental, we fall into the trap of being as oppressive and as judgmental as the people whom we are trying stop from oppressing or judging us. And this may be the case when you assert that Prince has become less imaginative because of his religion. For instance, I don't think that Prince has become any less imaginative. (In fact, his sales--if we use that criterion to judge Prince's creative abilities--were slumping before his conversion to being a Jehovah's Witness. And many people, both rockers and soul people, were saying that Prince has loss touch with planet earth long before he converted to being a Jehovah's Witness.) Now, the fact that I feel that Prince is still just as imaginative is my very subjective opinion, but I know many people who believe in "traditional" or "man-made religions," and they are quite imaginative and creative. It is one thing not to agree with the subject or themes of someone's art, but just because we don't agree with or even care for the subjects does not mean that one is not imaginative. For instance, Oozy Osborn’s songs have very interesting and often imaginative lyrics and musical moments, and just because I don't agree with his subjects, assertions, or the activities that he seems to endorse in his music I can't say that his work is unimaginative. Just because Prince may not be open to various interpretations of life or spirituality does not necessarily mean that he lacks imagination. Rather than being open to various types of religions or interpretations of the spirituality, he or anyone else may choose to be creative in how they discuss the religion of their choice. So when he writes, "God is coming like a dog in heat; He's looking for soldiers with strong feet," that is a very creative and different way of describing the seconding coming of the Christian belief.

Also, and this is more of a subjective thing, "to be inspired" may mean "to be close to God" to some, but it may not mean that to others, especially if one embraces a notion of the universe that believes that both good and bad exist in the universe. If one embraces the notion of the existence of good and bad, with good and bad being defined by their subjective notions, then one may wonder if someone's inspiration for something is being motivated by the desire to "help" or the desire to "harm." So just becomes someone is inspired does not mean that they are inspired by constructive forces; they may be inspired by destructive forces. (And, again, constructive and destructive are also subjective terms.) Accordingly, then, an artist may be inclined to do what one can to try and ensure that the work that they produce is helping rather than harming, based on their subjective notions of helping and harming. But to say that "to be inspired" means "to be close to God" without allowing that others may feel differently may be doing the same thing to others that you don't want done to you, if, of course, I am not taking what you say out of context. Someone was inspired to create and drop the A-Bomb and kill millions of people. When they were creating and designing this weapon of mass destruction, were they being inspired by or close to God? And, as a believer in a "traditional" or "man-man religion" I must also be objective and totally forthcoming to add that in the Bible and Koran God seems to allow for warfare in defense of his followers. That being the case, I think (and I don't want to put words in your mouth) that you and I can agree that there have been many things that man has created that we (you and I) would wonder if that inspiration came from God or a source of good or from some other source? Thus, we would have to ask does all inspiration come from God or a good or positive place. And if there is enough that allows us to at least ask or ponder this question, can we look so negatively at those who take precautionary steps to try to ensure that their words, works, and behavior help people rather than harm them. I mean, have you never, at least once, started to say something, and then decided to say something else because you felt that the first statement would not be useful or helpful. If so, then that is no different than someone who considers how their actions will affect themselves or others and takes steps to modify or change their words and actions so that they can bring positivity rather than negativity. And that does not necessarily make them unimaginative. To be a thoughtful person does not always mean to be unimaginative. And, again, I will admit that there is a difference between being thoughtful and being judgmental. But being thoughtful or mindful about what we say, do, or create does not necessarily make us less creative.

One thing Supa mentions in his original post is the disconnect between Prince's behavior toward other people (fans, even, in many instances) and his claims in recent years to have begun walking in the Truth as he sees it.

I get what Tricky's saying about maturity having played a role in why Prince
speaks as if he no longer is searching. But I think Supa's point about Prince's yanking the baby video being proof of spiritual maturity is a really significant one.

The disconnect could be this: We were humored by Prince's "rude boy" schtick when it was accompanied by exhortations to accept all people; now that Prince has switched his preaching (because, I believe, Prince has preached to his listeners his entire career to fit a narrow dogma -- while being even ruder to his supporters -- it provides a stark context within which to view his "spiritual" songs and claims.

Gohi said:

I agree with the message of Colonized, but I also agree, the guitar work on Colonized Mind and most of Lotusflower is very spiritual. It's not like the yearning cry of The Ladder, or Sometimes It Snows, but still very enlightening.
My feeling is that Prince has finally found some kind of inner peace he was looking for and that's why we don't hear songs like Holy River anymore. He seemed to be searching for so long and may have found it - whether by being a Jehovah's Witness, or having Larry in his life, maybe both, but I think he has found it.

...Great posts by all of you, this has been a great thread SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Whatever, only one thing counts:



!!

Dave1992 said:

You tryin to start a brawl in here or what?!

I get the vibe, but I must say I was moved by War, some of Truth, Sistermotherloverwife (or whatever it was), Savior and even New World (gulp) + sorta Face Down and In This Bed I Scream. I Love U But I Don't Trust U Anymore got me somehwhere deep.
But I do agree that, though I LOVE some of the recent music (BS, Fury, some of TRC, some of LF), none of it grabs me in that transcendental way that some of the older stuff did - but then maybe we've ALL just grown up?? (that would be sad, tho...)

BTW - for those that blame everything on differing religious doctrine: I have always loved The Cross. I'm Jewish and don't identify with the imagery or the religious connotations, but the song just blew me away anyway. I think that it is not the fact that people don't identify with his religious associations that's the problem, it's the way he presents them and what he does with them...

NoVideo said:

ahhh good point!

Shorty said:

very very very good point...

nyse said:

Yep, forgot to mention that one...

OK, I like Reflection but it comes from an attrocious album and I am totally distracted by the blatant rip off of Chaka's Smokin Room. Besides, isn't this a love song/walk down memory lane and not a spiritual venture?

sevens together
Like time, indefinite
Trying 2 catch the glass
b4 it falls
Without a frown
Can U turn up the stereo?
Eye wanna play U this old song about love (is it about love?)
Can Eye do that?

Did we remember 2 water the plants today?
Eye 4got 2 look up at the moon because
Eye was 2 busy, said Eye was 2 busy
Eye was 2 busy
Looking at you babe

Still it's nice 2 know
That, uh when bodies wear out
We can get another
What does that 1 thing have 2 do with the other 1?
Eye don't know
Eye was just thinking about my mother

U know what
Turn the stereo back down
Ain't nothing worse than an old worn out love song
Tell me do you like my hair this way
Remember all the way back in the day
When we would compare who's afro was the roundest

Mirrored tiles above the bed
Fishing nets and posters all over the wall
Oh yes, sometimes
Sometimes Eye just wanna go sit out on the stool
And uh... play my guitar
Just watch all... all the cars go by...

Nice enough song, but this isn't even close to what I would consider spiritual fulfillment in a song.

^^^^
yeah your right..."reflection" is not overtly spiritual.
But you can tell he is coming from a spiritual place.

like novideo said
"I think Reflection is one of the most real songs he's ever done, and very moving."

musicology ain't that bad...but I can dig ur opinion

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

What about the ones I mentioned above? Nothing?

Prince has so many touching lyrics...but you know, sometimes Prince doesn't have to be spelling out a message for me to be moved. Something in Prince's voice moves me...I guess I just always hear a kind heart.

tricky99 said:

Growing up has nothing to do with musical hunger. I guess you have to be a musician to understand that (which I am). Limitations doesn't have to equal putting out mediocre music just for the hell of it, which it appears that he is doing. LEAVE THE PRO-TOOLS ALONE. He talks about "real music" by "real musicians".Hmmph.

1725topp said:

ladychel61 said:

Prince seem's 2 be at peace now....without God it's just the blind leading the blind