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Printable2elijah said: bellanoche said: I am sorry, but I cannot believe that people still think that Prince is "part black." Prince is black. He has two black parents. Prince's racial heritage is no different than millions of blacks in this country. It is similar to my own. Both of my parents are black. However, their parents have mixed parentage. I still consider myself and Prince black. His light skin and features do not change the fact that he is black. Vanessa Williams has light skin and eyes, but she is just like Prince with two black parents. Therefore, she is considered black like millions of us. Just because a white woman played his mother in PR and he danced around the race issue to crossover to white audiences in the 1980s, it does not change the fact that mama and daddy Nelson were black, which makes baby boy Nelson black as well. Also, there are many blacks who have never accused Prince of being too white. There are those out there who have done so in the past, especially in the 1980s during the PR/ATWIAD/Parade era when he seemed to be engratiating himself to whiter/mainstream audiences. However, many blacks see Prince as a black man who can rock just as hard as he can funk or croon a soulful ballad. [Edited 4/10/09 14:51pm] I hear you Bellanoche, and as usual, you are always on point. It is amazing in this day and age people are still delusioned about his heritage. You'd think they know something about the history of this country and the reasons so many Black Americans have fair to dark skin, and why many of our family members differ in complexions, sometimes siblings being anywhere from 2 to 3 shades darker than one another, such in the case of my family and so many others. It's not that difficult to figure out with a little common sense, and effort to do the research. But no matter what you, I or anyone state, many will still refuse to believe that, and pull that kumbaya sh*t about "we're all human". Hey, we know that, but tell that to the racists and ignorant or none of us would be having these discussions right? 
Yesterday on Tyra Banks show she had these two girls on, very fair skin. Most of the members in the audience thought they were white, they both said "No they are not" that they both have two black parents and are African-American. They said they are often mistaken for white, hispanic and everything else but African-American. The cycle will continue regarding P's heritage because either some feel more comfortable accepting him as "mixed" altogether instead of accepting that yes, he is a fair-complected black male. How many interviews has his own biological sister done, where the links were posted on this very site, where she stated she is Black, and when she talks about her family when they were kids, she referred to her and her brother as children of African-American parents? If they don't accept what his own biological sister stated about their heritage, then it doesn't surprise me that many refuse to accept it at all. Secondly, most Prince fans are aware that he has not featured many Black females or darker-skinned I should say, as the leading ladies in his videos, although he has in the past, but was he or is he the only Black musician that didn't? We can go back as far as the early 80s where many record execs even had rap artists/r&b artists doing the same thing. My only guess for that was to reel in the white fans/consumers, not because a black artist favors one type of woman over the other. Most of the time the decision of the women featured in the vids, are not left up to the artist. When you want to sell your product and be successful, the idea is to reach across all racial lines. Why cater to one demographic when that will not guarantee success financially? Even today, most rap artists/other artists feature individuals that reflect society. I'm not going to say racist attitudes are not apparent in that industry, when it comes to darker-skinned or other women of other ethnicities featured in many of these videos because unfortunately it does exist and the industry has a long way to go with that, because of the existing "plantation" mentality and "conditioning" of what the ideal female should look like, by an industry mainly run by males. These days in videos, you will usually see more hispanic type or women of mixed heritage, where you basically have to guess what race/ethnic background they are. I have a lot of respect for Prince as an artist, and although there has been comments about him not featuring many darker-skinned females in his vids, even if he does, just take a look at the nasty and hateful comments made about that darker-skinned female in the past? No one can say he did not try. Not to mention the horrible comments made about a beautiful, black female artist in the past, by many on this site, and other unofficial sites, when he promoted that artist not too long ago. You had some fans almost losing their minds because he was promoting a black female artist. It seems he just can't win with fans even if he tries. What else is new? 2elijah why do you write long winded replies....? Honey no one is reading them, they are too long...  | |
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pplrain said: 2elijah said: I hear you Bellanoche, and as usual, you are always on point. It is amazing in this day and age people are still delusioned about his heritage. You'd think they know something about the history of this country and the reasons so many Black Americans have fair to dark skin, and why many of our family members differ in complexions, sometimes siblings being anywhere from 2 to 3 shades darker than one another, such in the case of my family and so many others. It's not that difficult to figure out with a little common sense, and effort to do the research. But no matter what you, I or anyone state, many will still refuse to believe that, and pull that kumbaya sh*t about "we're all human". Hey, we know that, but tell that to the racists and ignorant or none of us would be having these discussions right?
Yesterday on Tyra Banks show she had these two girls on, very fair skin. Most of the members in the audience thought they were white, they both said "No they are not" that they both have two black parents and are African-American. They said they are often mistaken for white, hispanic and everything else but African-American. The cycle will continue regarding P's heritage because either some feel more comfortable accepting him as "mixed" altogether instead of accepting that yes, he is a fair-complected black male. How many interviews has his own biological sister done, where the links were posted on this very site, where she stated she is Black, and when she talks about her family when they were kids, she referred to her and her brother as children of African-American parents? If they don't accept what his own biological sister stated about their heritage, then it doesn't surprise me that many refuse to accept it at all. Secondly, most Prince fans are aware that he has not featured many Black females or darker-skinned I should say, as the leading ladies in his videos, although he has in the past, but was he or is he the only Black musician that didn't? We can go back as far as the early 80s where many record execs even had rap artists/r&b artists doing the same thing. My only guess for that was to reel in the white fans/consumers, not because a black artist favors one type of woman over the other. Most of the time the decision of the women featured in the vids, are not left up to the artist. When you want to sell your product and be successful, the idea is to reach across all racial lines. Why cater to one demographic when that will not guarantee success financially? Even today, most rap artists/other artists feature individuals that reflect society. I'm not going to say racist attitudes are not apparent in that industry, when it comes to darker-skinned or other women of other ethnicities featured in many of these videos because unfortunately it does exist and the industry has a long way to go with that, because of the existing "plantation" mentality and "conditioning" of what the ideal female should look like, by an industry mainly run by males. These days in videos, you will usually see more hispanic type or women of mixed heritage, where you basically have to guess what race/ethnic background they are. I have a lot of respect for Prince as an artist, and although there has been comments about him not featuring many darker-skinned females in his vids, even if he does, just take a look at the nasty and hateful comments made about that darker-skinned female in the past? No one can say he did not try. Not to mention the horrible comments made about a beautiful, black female artist in the past, by many on this site, and other unofficial sites, when he promoted that artist not too long ago. You had some fans almost losing their minds because he was promoting a black female artist. It seems he just can't win with fans even if he tries. What else is new? 2elijah why do you write long winded replies....? Honey no one is reading them, they are too long... Sweetie, that's your opinion. Was this reply to one of your posts? Did I hold a gun to your head or anyone else to force you to read it? It's called individual choice, and it's a public forum. You, especially do great favors for me, when you bypass my posts. Now...when you have something of value or intelligence to contribute, instead of your child-like comments, then notify me by orgnote, however, there's no guarantee I will respond. [Edited 4/10/09 16:43pm] | |
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stanleylieber said: bellanoche said: I am sorry, but I cannot believe that people still think that Prince is "part black." Prince is black. He has two black parents. Prince's racial heritage is no different than millions of blacks in this country. It is similar to my own. Both of my parents are black. However, their parents have mixed parentage. I still consider myself and Prince black. His light skin and features do not change the fact that he is black. Vanessa Williams has light skin and eyes, but she is just like Prince with two black parents. Therefore, she is considered black like millions of us. Just because a white woman played his mother in PR and he danced around the race issue to crossover to white audiences in the 1980s, it does not change the fact that mama and daddy Nelson were black, which makes baby boy Nelson black as well. Also, there are many blacks who have never accused Prince of being too white. There are those out there who have done so in the past, especially in the 1980s during the PR/ATWIAD/Parade era when he seemed to be engratiating himself to whiter/mainstream audiences. However, many blacks see Prince as a black man who can rock just as hard as he can funk or croon a soulful ballad. [Edited 4/10/09 14:51pm] prince is the one who claimed to be part white early on in his career. you can call it stupid but he's the one who brought it to the table. i'm just talking about how some people have characterized him. obviously, these aren't absolutes. there was a black woman who joined the kkk but that doesn't mean the kkk is a black organization. and yes, prince has hired white musicians. i think the original post in this thread is silly, but i was trying to reply to it in a serious manner. i'm trying to engage the question of whether or not prince has demonstrated racist tendencies. i do think he has at times dipped into lashing out angrily at whites. my interpretation could be wrong but i think there is ample room for interpretation in some of his lyrics and some of the things he has said in public. his frustration is perfectly understandable, but also unfortunate. i don't think it makes him a bad person. everybody gets mad. i do however find that his later approach to race is much less inspiring to me than his earlier approach to race. he seems to have decided to blame racial groups for the treatment of other racial groups, and i think that always simply devolves into the same thing one is complaining about. namely, discrimination and generalizations that sacrifice the individual in favor of an abstract concept. to my mind a minority expressing racism isn't any less of a sin than a majority expressing racism. being the underdog doesn't guarantee someone is righteous any more than holding a position of authority guarantees that someone is unrighteous. obviously, not everyone perceives a shift in prince's racial politics as expressed through his lyrics and public statements. since we don't have inside information all we can do is argue about our interpretations. wow thats a mouthful stanley. from reading what you wrote essentially you consider Prince somewhat of a racist towards whites. you sound like you think he is sort of a hypocrite because he used to claim he was half white and now he has contradicted himself and insincerely switched into acting as a proud black. Now if he really is black he can consider himself as part of the minority and in his mind he feels he has the right to stand up for his race because it makes him feel righteous towards his fellow minority members. But it seems the question that remains in your mind is why did he claim he was half white in the first place? To Sir, with Love | |
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pplrain said: 2elijah said: I hear you Bellanoche, and as usual, you are always on point. It is amazing in this day and age people are still delusioned about his heritage. You'd think they know something about the history of this country and the reasons so many Black Americans have fair to dark skin, and why many of our family members differ in complexions, sometimes siblings being anywhere from 2 to 3 shades darker than one another, such in the case of my family and so many others. It's not that difficult to figure out with a little common sense, and effort to do the research. But no matter what you, I or anyone state, many will still refuse to believe that, and pull that kumbaya sh*t about "we're all human". Hey, we know that, but tell that to the racists and ignorant or none of us would be having these discussions right?
Yesterday on Tyra Banks show she had these two girls on, very fair skin. Most of the members in the audience thought they were white, they both said "No they are not" that they both have two black parents and are African-American. They said they are often mistaken for white, hispanic and everything else but African-American. The cycle will continue regarding P's heritage because either some feel more comfortable accepting him as "mixed" altogether instead of accepting that yes, he is a fair-complected black male. How many interviews has his own biological sister done, where the links were posted on this very site, where she stated she is Black, and when she talks about her family when they were kids, she referred to her and her brother as children of African-American parents? If they don't accept what his own biological sister stated about their heritage, then it doesn't surprise me that many refuse to accept it at all. Secondly, most Prince fans are aware that he has not featured many Black females or darker-skinned I should say, as the leading ladies in his videos, although he has in the past, but was he or is he the only Black musician that didn't? We can go back as far as the early 80s where many record execs even had rap artists/r&b artists doing the same thing. My only guess for that was to reel in the white fans/consumers, not because a black artist favors one type of woman over the other. Most of the time the decision of the women featured in the vids, are not left up to the artist. When you want to sell your product and be successful, the idea is to reach across all racial lines. Why cater to one demographic when that will not guarantee success financially? Even today, most rap artists/other artists feature individuals that reflect society. I'm not going to say racist attitudes are not apparent in that industry, when it comes to darker-skinned or other women of other ethnicities featured in many of these videos because unfortunately it does exist and the industry has a long way to go with that, because of the existing "plantation" mentality and "conditioning" of what the ideal female should look like, by an industry mainly run by males. These days in videos, you will usually see more hispanic type or women of mixed heritage, where you basically have to guess what race/ethnic background they are. I have a lot of respect for Prince as an artist, and although there has been comments about him not featuring many darker-skinned females in his vids, even if he does, just take a look at the nasty and hateful comments made about that darker-skinned female in the past? No one can say he did not try. Not to mention the horrible comments made about a beautiful, black female artist in the past, by many on this site, and other unofficial sites, when he promoted that artist not too long ago. You had some fans almost losing their minds because he was promoting a black female artist. It seems he just can't win with fans even if he tries. What else is new? 2elijah why do you write long winded replies....? Honey no one is reading them, they are too long... I read them. It is always refreshing to read 2elijah's posts because they reflect actual knowledge and critical thought. That can be rare around here at times. Also, if some people actually took time to read them, we would not be 30 years into Prince's career with people still referring to him as "mixed" or part "black." perfection is a fallacy of the imagination... | |
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bellanoche said: pplrain said: 2elijah why do you write long winded replies....? Honey no one is reading them, they are too long... I read them. It is always refreshing to read 2elijah's posts because they reflect actual knowledge and critical thought. That can be rare around here at times. Also, if some people actually took time to read them, we would not be 30 years into Prince's career with people still referring to him as "mixed" or part "black." Thank you bellanoche. Appreciate your comments as always. | |
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PEJ said: stanleylieber said: prince is the one who claimed to be part white early on in his career. you can call it stupid but he's the one who brought it to the table. i'm just talking about how some people have characterized him. obviously, these aren't absolutes. there was a black woman who joined the kkk but that doesn't mean the kkk is a black organization. and yes, prince has hired white musicians. i think the original post in this thread is silly, but i was trying to reply to it in a serious manner. i'm trying to engage the question of whether or not prince has demonstrated racist tendencies. i do think he has at times dipped into lashing out angrily at whites. my interpretation could be wrong but i think there is ample room for interpretation in some of his lyrics and some of the things he has said in public. his frustration is perfectly understandable, but also unfortunate. i don't think it makes him a bad person. everybody gets mad. i do however find that his later approach to race is much less inspiring to me than his earlier approach to race. he seems to have decided to blame racial groups for the treatment of other racial groups, and i think that always simply devolves into the same thing one is complaining about. namely, discrimination and generalizations that sacrifice the individual in favor of an abstract concept. to my mind a minority expressing racism isn't any less of a sin than a majority expressing racism. being the underdog doesn't guarantee someone is righteous any more than holding a position of authority guarantees that someone is unrighteous. obviously, not everyone perceives a shift in prince's racial politics as expressed through his lyrics and public statements. since we don't have inside information all we can do is argue about our interpretations. wow thats a mouthful stanley. from reading what you wrote essentially you consider Prince somewhat of a racist towards whites. you sound like you think he is sort of a hypocrite because he used to claim he was half white and now he has contradicted himself and insincerely switched into acting as a proud black. Now if he really is black he can consider himself as part of the minority and in his mind he feels he has the right to stand up for his race because it makes him feel righteous towards his fellow minority members. But it seems the question that remains in your mind is why did he claim he was half white in the first place? Could it be because early in his career he was more catergorized as a "rock" artist, and that was the type of music he put out, and more white fans, at that time, was attracted to his music? And due to society's misconception that most blacks listened to r&b, and wasn't listening to Prince's music, but in reality, Prince did have Black fans that bought his music. Also remember, Prince seemed to be the only black artist at that time, putting out rock-flavored music since Jimi passed? Also, what about how the filmmakers made the parent characters in "Purple Rain" an interracial couple, and many white and black fans actually thought his parents in real life were an interracial couple. I think that is where all the misconception came from. The film itself did reach across racial lines. My other question is, if an artist has lyrics expressing one of society's ills, such as "racial issues", is it wrong for him to do that or will that artist be seen as prejudice? racist? What about Curtis Mayfield? Gil Scott Heron? James Brown? and even Sly Stone? All of them at one time or another mentioned issues about the realities of racism in America. Just wondering and curious why fans would see something that is a fact in real life for an artist to mention it. [Edited 4/10/09 16:12pm] | |
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PEJ said: wow thats a mouthful stanley. from reading what you wrote essentially you consider Prince somewhat of a racist towards whites. you sound like you think he is sort of a hypocrite because he used to claim he was half white and now he has contradicted himself and insincerely switched into acting as a proud black. Now if he really is black he can consider himself as part of the minority and in his mind he feels he has the right to stand up for his race because it makes him feel righteous towards his fellow minority members. But it seems the question that remains in your mind is why did he claim he was half white in the first place? Well, it should be obvious to anyone who is perceptive about the world that we live in why Prince claimed he was half-white. It is the same reason why so many other non-white entertainers reach back and try to claim any trace of white ancestry that they can. They are trying to endear themselves to white audiences. They know that many whites are more comfortable with non-whites who are somehow more like them. Therefore, the marketing idea is to push black entertainers, for example, as not completely black. This has always been the case with black entertainers. Folks still think Dorothy Dandridge was mixed, but she was not. However, the idea (and facts support it) is that white audiences are more accepting of black entertainers who appear "less black." It is why we hear so much about the bi-racial heritage of people like Halle Berry and Alicia Keys. How many white entertainers feel the need to broadcast their ethnic backgrounds? We live in a majority white society. It is a society that still reflects the idea of white supremacy. For that reason, black and other non-white entertainers who want the money and opportunites that white audiences offer will lie about their racial make up to appeal to them. Someone on this thread said that if Prince looked like Al Green we would not have this discussion. I agree. Also, if Prince looked like Al Green he would not have had the career that he has had. He's not stupid. Why do you think Rick James hated on Prince so much? He took one look at Prince and knew that because of his lighter skin and features Prince would be able to crossover to white audiences in ways that Rick could not. Prince, especially the idea of a "mixed" Prince, was more palatable for white audiences. It was more acceptable for white girls to swoon over "mixed" Prince in the late 1970s into the 1980s. Whites in general would be able to relate to a "mixed" Prince because he was not that black. They could somehow feel connected to or partly responsible for his greatness. This is done for white audiences because they are more confused about race as it relates to black people or non-white people in general. This thread surely indicates that some white people are clueless when it comes to the varied racial heritage of non-whites. I mean someone referred to Sheila E. as white for goodness sakes.  Anyway, black folks knew that Prince was black no matter what he called himself to attract whites.
[Edited 4/10/09 16:11pm] [Edited 4/10/09 16:13pm] perfection is a fallacy of the imagination... | |
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bellanoche said: PEJ said: wow thats a mouthful stanley. from reading what you wrote essentially you consider Prince somewhat of a racist towards whites. you sound like you think he is sort of a hypocrite because he used to claim he was half white and now he has contradicted himself and insincerely switched into acting as a proud black. Now if he really is black he can consider himself as part of the minority and in his mind he feels he has the right to stand up for his race because it makes him feel righteous towards his fellow minority members. But it seems the question that remains in your mind is why did he claim he was half white in the first place? Well, it should be obvious to anyone who is perceptive about the world that we live in why Prince claimed he was half-white. It is the same reason why so many other non-white entertainers reach back and try to claim any trace of white ancestry that they can. They are trying to endear themselves to white audiences. They know that many whites are more comfortable with non-whites who are somehow more like them. Therefore, the marketing idea is to push black entertainers, for example, as not completely black. This has always been the case with black entertainers. Folks still think Dorothy Dandridge was mixed, but she was not. However, the idea (and facts support it) is that white audiences are more accepting of black entertainers who appear "less black." It is why we hear so much about the bi-racial heritage of people like Halle Berry and Alicia Keys. How many white entertainers feel the need to broadcast their ethnic backgrounds? We live in a majority white society. It is a society that still reflects the idea of white supremacy. For that reason, black and other non-white entertainers who want the money and opportunites that white audiences offer will lie about their racial make up to appeal to them. Someone on this thread said that if Prince looked like Al Green we would not have this discussion. I agree. Also, if Prince looked like Al Green he would not have had the career that he has had. He's not stupid. Why do you think Rick James hated on Prince so much? He took one look at Prince and knew that because of his lighter skin and features Prince would be able to crossover to white audiences in ways that Rick could not. Prince, especially the idea of a "mixed" Prince, was more palatable for white audiences. It was more acceptable for white girls to swoon over "mixed" Prince in the late 1970s into the 1980s. Whites in general would be able to relate to a "mixed" Prince because he was not that black. They could somehow feel connected to or partly responsible for his greatness. This is done for white audiences because they are more confused about race as it relates to black people or non-white people in general. This thread surely indicates that some white people are clueless when it comes to the varied racial heritage of non-whites. I mean someone referred to Sheila E. as white for goodness sakes. Anyway, black folks knew that Prince was black no matter what he called himself to attract whites.
[Edited 4/10/09 16:11pm] [Edited 4/10/09 16:13pm] I agree with much of your statement, and your comments about Rick James' attitude towards Prince, although I appreciated both artists unique style of music. Both were a force in the industry. When Prince started gaining major popularity around Purple Rain, I also noticed that is when MJ seemed to feel threatened, that Prince was gaining popularity. It's almost as if MJ felt threatened because here was this "pretty boy" image coming out and basically taking his fame away from him. I remember the papers headlines were..."Who is the real King of Pop? So yes, unfortunately, like you said, many black artists go through what you mentioned above, and it is so unfortunate. People don't realize how "skin deep" it really is in the music/film industry. [Edited 4/10/09 16:41pm] | |
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only prince could be unconsious & be a racist at the same time..give him a break! | |
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lottielooloo1968 said: only prince could be unconsious & be a racist at the same time..give him a break!
 [Edited 4/10/09 16:24pm] perfection is a fallacy of the imagination... | |
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Thanks 2Elijah for your posts.
Prince can't seem to win with either whites or blacks. Most whites refuse to acknowledge he's black and some blacks are always accusing him of being anti-black. You can argue till you're blue in the face and it seems to do no good. When I was on one black message board, one poster said that Prince was anti-black because he refuses to date black women. What some people fail to realize is that one can be married to a black woman and still be anti-black. I have a cousin who is married to a black woman and he is constantly calling black people stupid and ignorant. He doesn't have anything to do with blacks or black culture as whole. Prince believes he is a musical prophet that has been chosen by Jehova to guide his fans to the "truth". | |
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candy2277 said: Thanks 2Elijah for your posts.
Prince can't seem to win with either whites or blacks. Most whites refuse to acknowledge he's black and some blacks are always accusing him of being anti-black. You can argue till you're blue in the face and it seems to do no good. When I was on one black message board, one poster said that Prince was anti-black because he refuses to date black women. What some people fail to realize is that one can be married to a black woman and still be anti-black. I have a cousin who is married to a black woman and he is constantly calling black people stupid and ignorant. He doesn't have anything to do with blacks or black culture as whole. Thanks Candy, I appreciate your comments and respect, and agree that it is almost like a "tug-of-war" for him with his fans. [Edited 4/10/09 16:44pm] | |
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GetWildHornyPony said:
worst thread Prince is not racist Wendy, Lisa, Sheila, Eric Leeds, Madonna, Kim Basinger, Tommy B. and more r white... He just didn't find the best white bassist... LOL are U serious? Sheila E. is not white Sheila is a mix of Creole(which is a mix itself:French/Black/Spanish) Black & Hispanic | |
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bellanoche said: stanleylieber said: in terms of race, prince has never been able to get a break from anyone. black people have always criticized him for being to white, and white people have always been uneasy with the fact that he's part black. (obviously, i'm making generalizations here.) it's got to be frustrating. I am sorry, but I cannot believe that people still think that Prince is "part black." Prince is black. He has two black parents. Prince's racial heritage is no different than millions of blacks in this country. It is similar to my own. Both of my parents are black. However, their parents have mixed parentage. I still consider myself and Prince black. His light skin and features do not change the fact that he is black. Vanessa Williams has light skin and eyes, but she is just like Prince with two black parents. Therefore, she is considered black like millions of us. Just because a white woman played his mother in PR and he danced around the race issue to crossover to white audiences in the 1980s, it does not change the fact that mama and daddy Nelson were black, which makes baby boy Nelson black as well. Also, there are many blacks who have never accused Prince of being too white. There are those out there who have done so in the past, especially in the 1980s during the PR/ATWIAD/Parade era when he seemed to be engratiating himself to whiter/mainstream audiences. However, many blacks see Prince as a black man who can rock just as hard as he can funk or croon a soulful ballad. [Edited 4/10/09 14:51pm] The person (again was not saying) Prince is biracial, they said mixed heritage, which he does obviously Your ideas are based on the One Drop Rule [One Drop of slave/negro blood makes you black even if the only last black ancestor was a great great great great great grandmother and all the rest are white] It's not saying who Prince identifies (and he has always been in the grey area about that) Like in that interview he had where the woman said something about him being a black artist and Prince said "Am I?" and stretched out his arm next to the (white lady interviewer) and she commented that he was lighter than she was Barack Obama is biracial yet he identifies as Black (that's a choice) but he is of mixed ancestry. That's all the original poster was saying about Prince. Prince is of mixed ancestry. | |
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bellanoche said: 2elijah said: Okay now I did not want to make this a P&R issue but you asked for it, and this is going to be a long one. First of all, you sound so ridiculous and you don't know what you are talking about. Whether you want to believe it or not, the majority of Black Americans, especially in the U.S. and the Caribbean are of mixed ancestry. Do not let the darker hue of Black Americans or those born outside of America fool you. I already gave facts on certain individuals who were tested and it was found they were of African/Caucasian or African/Native or all 3. Most Blacks from the Caribbean have all 3 ancestries, even some Asian ancestry. Of course, visually, you cannot just look at someone and assume "facts" about their ancestry only what you have been "conditioned" to think of them. When I state Black American that is anyone with a connection to ancestors of African ancestry. Doesn't mean "slave" equals "African". If you know anything about African history you will know that those Africans that were actually captured by the Europeans, had a family, culture, history, many languages, came from many ethnic groups, before they were taken off to the U.S at the time and the various islands throughout the Caribbean to work as slaves. First of all to even state that all black americans are not mixed, are you kidding me? You need to do some homework. Do not be fooled by the light or dark hue of any individual who has African ancestors, whether that descendant has light of dark skin. Unless you are 100% Black African, born on an African continent with no mixture from any other race, then you are African from an African ethnic group or if you immigrated here from Africa, with no mixture of another race, then you are African. When one refers to themselves as Black or African-American it's not the end of the world for crying out loud, but some here sure seem to think it is.
If you are a "descendant: of any of the groups of Africans that were taken to the U.S. or the Caribbean, 9 out 10, you are of mixed ancestry, moreso because of the rapings, mixed relationships that took place during slavery between the and generations later. Unless you can prove to me that the African women that were captured and forced into slavery, only had children by another African male, generation after generation to date with no mixture from any other race. Unless you can prove to me that all the mixed babies at that time did not come from African women who were either raped, had a relation with a European or Native, because the various complexions of Black Americans I see walking around this nation would prove you wrong. Of course one cannot tell by looking at individuals what their exact ancestry consists of, because society has been conditioned to believe that only those with dark skin is of Black African ancestry and not mixed or that an individual with "light" skin are the only ones that can be of mixed ancestry. Take your blinders off. You give the example of Wesley Snipes standing next to Prince and if one not notice the difference in complexion, and not be able to tell if Prince has mixed ancestry? Why wouldn't you question Wesley's ancestry? Is it because of the dark hue of his skin? It would be very ignorant of you to suggest or assume that because of the dark hue of Wesley's skin that he couldn't possibly be of "mixed" ancestry. Whether he is or not doesn't mean he's denying he is Black or ashamed of it. Show and prove to me any Black American, who is 100% Black African ancestry in this country? Unless that individual was born in Africa with no mixture whatsoever from another race, then that individual you identify as "Black" is not 100% African. Even if that 100% Black African immigrated to the U.S. and did not mix with another race, then that individual is still 100% Black African, regardless of what African ethnic group/tribe he is from. I already gave an example in another post, regarding this same situation with Don Cheadle being of a darker complexion. But it wouldn't even cross your mind that Don is of mixed ancestry would it, because most have been "conditioned" by society to think that anyone with dark skin identified as African/Black American in appearance, couldn't possibly be of mixed ancestry now could they? 
Yet with Prince you automatically mention his light skin and "assumed". he is of mixed ancestry without hesitation compared to your Wesley Snipes example. As I mentioned in my other post, Don Cheadle had his DNA tested and it the results announced publically that Don Cheadle is 19% Caucasian or of European descent, (Don's % percentage corrected thanks to orger cdcgold) but you would not assume that would you? Of course you wouldn't. I'll give you another example. Professor Henry Louis Gates, is 50% caucasian or of European descent. Tom Joynor, who is basically Prince's complexion, who had his DNA tested, and is much lighter in skin color than Prof. Gates, is only somewhere in the range of 30% Caucasian or of European descent. If you took Prof Gates and stood him next to Tom Joyner, and the question was asked who has more "Caucasian/European ancestry Tom or Prof. Gates? I guarantee you that the majority asked would pick Tom Joynor because of the "fair" complexion of his skin, but yet they would get the answer wrong, because Prof. Gates who is darker complected, (brown-skinned) has more Caucasian/European ancestry than Tom. So now should Prof. Gates and Tom Joyner not refer no longer refer to themselves as Black or African-American because of these findings? I doubt if they would at this stage. So please know what you're talking about before you post your nonsense to me. Fact is, the majority of Black Americans in this country are of mixed ancestry. Doesn't mean they are denying their African-ancestry. Most Black Americans I know, don't seem to have any problem referring to themselves as "Black Americans", as it is individual choice, and it usually seems it's non-blacks or some blacks that have a problem with the terms "Black" or "African" as an identifier of oneself, but that's not my problem. I certainly have no problem or shame, identifying as Black or African-American despite my family history. Why should I? Embracing all that one is sets your soul free.
So before you come after me with your bullsh*t, know what the hell you're talking about. [Edited 4/10/09 8:28am]   Teach the babies!lol listen 2 the One Droppist spreading their propaganda | |
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OldFriends4Sale said: bellanoche said: Teach the babies!lol listen 2 the One Droppist spreading their propaganda You are so clueless. No one is spreading any one drop BS rule, as you would love to believe, but you seem to be stuck on that "plantation" mentality instead of accepting the fact that the majority of Black/African-Americans in this country, whether they are light or dark-skinned have mixed blood. It is not denying they are black. You apparently only want to believe that those with "light" skin have mixed ancestry. Keep believing what you believe, if that's what makes your ego feel comfortable, secure and more "accepting" of those who define themselves as Black or African-American. I can only laugh at your ignorance. [Edited 4/10/09 17:09pm] | |
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Here you are talking about who is mixed and not and turning around and saying all Africans are pure basically. Do you know how many Europeans and Middle Easterns live/pass thru and socialize with the various African countries and people?
According to your logic Sade is pure African right (she was born and raise in her fathers home country) and left later. Dark complexions have nothing to do with and I said nothing of the fact that dark skin equalled unmixed, I could go down the list of (biracial) people who are dark skinned, My grandfather is darkskinned and he is biracial(1/2Native American 1/2African-American) he has a good mix of genetics from both sides, with long wavy hair, passed onto his children Your offended at my words, because the One Drop Rule(go read about the history)and you support it, has been taken as a fact by most black-americans and I bet if someone (you identify) as black says they are not, U would get upset and try to straighten them out. the racist idea that you base your post is just as baseless as the idea of 4 races: WHITE, BLACK, RED, YELLOW, or NEGROID, CAUCASOID, MONGOLOID it's all racist and this idea is what the ODR is based on as well, it came about strongly after the emancipation of slaves in American, written into the laws, and pressed into the social ideas of American citizens black and white. Black Americans are more prone now to be the champions of the One Drop Rule. It's black americans(leaders) who oppose the creation of a multiracial box for those who identify that way(which could be 1/2Asian 1/2Navajo) ooooohhh I didn't know the people of various African countries had unique culture, religion, societal values etc etc oooooh I didn't know that? lol many from 1979-1983 I was a part of a Pan African Cultural Awareness group... don't even get me started. You probably think they all see themselves as Black too don't you?(more American racialized thinking) Let me tell U something young wippersnapper... American isn't the defining end of all things in the world In South Africa there are the Whites, the Afrikaners, the Coloured and the Blacks In earlier American history there were Whites, Negroes, Mulattoes, Natives(which were hoped to be wiped out) If you know anything about Caribbean and Latin American social cultures concerning mixed race and race, that there is no blanketed Black race (she may have blue eyes and blond hair but she is black) Latin America had over 30 mixed race labels for people of mixed heritage. They were not affected by the U.S. way of thinking elijah said: OldFriends4Sale said: Just because hundreds of 'people who are black identified or you identify as black' look like Prince doesn't mean they are not mixed. Mixed heritage means just that, that his ancestral line consists of different ethnic groups. The person isn't sayin Prince is biracial(of 2 different ethnic/racial lines) Prince's mother almost looks white herself, so you can't cross that out as just black or just like other black americans. I don't think if prince & wesley snipes were standing together that we can just say 'they are the same' there are 'black identified' people who could pass for white, native american or asian (ever seen Kimora Lee Simons?) What this is about is the One Drop Rule (1 drop of negro/black/slave blood makes you black) it's a very racist idea made 2 keep white in line as well as swell the number of slavery chatel. Many places in the Slave states had it that a person that was 1/50% (negro/white) was still negro Mixed people are mixed people and all black-americans aren't mixed (visually or ancestrially) Both of my grandfathers (paternal & maternal) are biracial and not only where they lived were they marked mulatto but their children(my parents). Okay now I did not want to make this a P&R issue but you asked for it, and this is going to be a long one. First of all, you sound so ridiculous and you don't know what you are talking about. Whether you want to believe it or not, the majority of Black Americans, especially in the U.S. and the Caribbean are of mixed ancestry. Do not let the darker hue of Black Americans or those born outside of America fool you. I already gave facts on certain individuals who were tested and it was found they were of African/Caucasian or African/Native or all 3. Most Blacks from the Caribbean have all 3 ancestries, even some Asian ancestry. Of course, visually, you cannot just look at someone and assume "facts" about their ancestry only what you have been "conditioned" to think of them. When I state Black American that is anyone with a connection to ancestors of African ancestry. Doesn't mean "slave" equals "African". If you know anything about African history you will know that those Africans that were actually captured by the Europeans, had a family, culture, history, many languages, came from many ethnic groups, before they were taken off to the U.S at the time and the various islands throughout the Caribbean to work as slaves. First of all to even state that all black americans are not mixed, are you kidding me? You need to do some homework. Do not be fooled by the light or dark hue of any individual who has African ancestors, whether that descendant has light of dark skin. Unless you are 100% Black African, born on an African continent with no mixture from any other race, then you are African from an African ethnic group or if you immigrated here from Africa, with no mixture of another race, then you are African. When one refers to themselves as Black or African-American it's not the end of the world for crying out loud, but some here sure seem to think it is.
If you are a "descendant: of any of the groups of Africans that were taken to the U.S. or the Caribbean, 9 out 10, you are of mixed ancestry, moreso because of the rapings, mixed relationships that took place during slavery between the and generations later. Unless you can prove to me that the African women that were captured and forced into slavery, only had children by another African male, generation after generation to date with no mixture from any other race. Unless you can prove to me that all the mixed babies at that time did not come from African women who were either raped, had a relation with a European or Native, because the various complexions of Black Americans I see walking around this nation would prove you wrong. Of course one cannot tell by looking at individuals what their exact ancestry consists of, because society has been conditioned to believe that only those with dark skin is of Black African ancestry and not mixed or that an individual with "light" skin are the only ones that can be of mixed ancestry. Take your blinders off. You give the example of Wesley Snipes standing next to Prince and if one not notice the difference in complexion, and not be able to tell if Prince has mixed ancestry? Why wouldn't you question Wesley's ancestry? Is it because of the dark hue of his skin? It would be very ignorant of you to suggest or assume that because of the dark hue of Wesley's skin that he couldn't possibly be of "mixed" ancestry. Whether he is or not doesn't mean he's denying he is Black or ashamed of it. Show and prove to me any Black American, who is 100% Black African ancestry in this country? Unless that individual was born in Africa with no mixture whatsoever from another race, then that individual you identify as "Black" is not 100% African. Even if that 100% Black African immigrated to the U.S. and did not mix with another race, then that individual is still 100% Black African, regardless of what African ethnic group/tribe he is from. I already gave an example in another post, regarding this same situation with Don Cheadle being of a darker complexion. But it wouldn't even cross your mind that Don is of mixed ancestry would it, because most have been "conditioned" by society to think that anyone with dark skin identified as African/Black American in appearance, couldn't possibly be of mixed ancestry now could they?
Yet with Prince you automatically mention his light skin and "assumed". he is of mixed ancestry without hesitation compared to your Wesley Snipes example. As I mentioned in my other post, Don Cheadle had his DNA tested and it the results announced publically that Don Cheadle is 19% Caucasian or of European descent, (Don's % percentage corrected thanks to orger cdcgold) but you would not assume that would you? Of course you wouldn't. I'll give you another example. Professor Henry Louis Gates, is 50% caucasian or of European descent. Tom Joynor, who is basically Prince's complexion, who had his DNA tested, and is much lighter in skin color than Prof. Gates, is only somewhere in the range of 30% Caucasian or of European descent. If you took Prof Gates and stood him next to Tom Joyner, and the question was asked who has more "Caucasian/European ancestry Tom or Prof. Gates? I guarantee you that the majority asked would pick Tom Joynor because of the "fair" complexion of his skin, but yet they would get the answer wrong, because Prof. Gates who is darker complected, (brown-skinned) has more Caucasian/European ancestry than Tom. So now should Prof. Gates and Tom Joyner not refer no longer refer to themselves as Black or African-American because of these findings? I doubt if they would at this stage. So please know what you're talking about before you post your nonsense to me. Fact is, the majority of Black Americans in this country are of mixed ancestry. Doesn't mean they are denying their African-ancestry. Most Black Americans I know, don't seem to have any problem referring to themselves as "Black Americans", as it is individual choice, and it usually seems it's non-blacks or some blacks that have a problem with the terms "Black" or "African" as an identifier of oneself, but that's not my problem. I certainly have no problem or shame, identifying as Black or African-American despite my family history. Why should I? Embracing all that one is sets your soul free.
So before you come after me with your bullsh*t, know what the hell you're talking about. [Edited 4/10/09 8:28am] [Edited 4/10/09 17:19pm] | |
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PEJ said: stanleylieber said: prince is the one who claimed to be part white early on in his career. you can call it stupid but he's the one who brought it to the table. i'm just talking about how some people have characterized him. obviously, these aren't absolutes. there was a black woman who joined the kkk but that doesn't mean the kkk is a black organization. and yes, prince has hired white musicians. i think the original post in this thread is silly, but i was trying to reply to it in a serious manner. i'm trying to engage the question of whether or not prince has demonstrated racist tendencies. i do think he has at times dipped into lashing out angrily at whites. my interpretation could be wrong but i think there is ample room for interpretation in some of his lyrics and some of the things he has said in public. his frustration is perfectly understandable, but also unfortunate. i don't think it makes him a bad person. everybody gets mad. i do however find that his later approach to race is much less inspiring to me than his earlier approach to race. he seems to have decided to blame racial groups for the treatment of other racial groups, and i think that always simply devolves into the same thing one is complaining about. namely, discrimination and generalizations that sacrifice the individual in favor of an abstract concept. to my mind a minority expressing racism isn't any less of a sin than a majority expressing racism. being the underdog doesn't guarantee someone is righteous any more than holding a position of authority guarantees that someone is unrighteous. obviously, not everyone perceives a shift in prince's racial politics as expressed through his lyrics and public statements. since we don't have inside information all we can do is argue about our interpretations. wow thats a mouthful stanley. from reading what you wrote essentially you consider Prince somewhat of a racist towards whites. you sound like you think he is sort of a hypocrite because he used to claim he was half white and now he has contradicted himself and insincerely switched into acting as a proud black. Now if he really is black he can consider himself as part of the minority and in his mind he feels he has the right to stand up for his race because it makes him feel righteous towards his fellow minority members. But it seems the question that remains in your mind is why did he claim he was half white in the first place? i think prince was very inspiring during the days when he purposely obfuscated his own racial background and declared that racial identity was irrelevant because we're all just people. i think he did a lot (whether by design or by circumstance of his times and his position as a celebrity) to alleviate anti-black racism in american culture. though not necessarily through skill or intention (though i think he's highly skilled and certainly had good intentions). his videos were some of the first by black artists to be played on mtv and to be taken seriously as 'music' without a qualifier such as 'black music.' prince was one of those people who, standing on the shoulders of those who came before him, started to break through the color barrier in pop music. i think prince correctly perceives racism in the music industry, and to a certain extent in american culture. i'm sure during the course of his career he has probably had some truly horrible things said to his face by white and black music executives. in pragmatic terms prince filled the slot of 'black singer' in the music business landscape even as he worked to shift that slot into something less defined by and limited by race. prince and music executives alike are intelligent enough to recognize this fact and to manipulate their respective positions accordingly. in his later years, owing to the changing climate of american culture, prince seems to have decided to use race to his advantage rather than continuing to allow it to be something he had to work against. previously, and especially in the years before he gained worldwide fame, this was much less possible. america (or at least its popular culture) has changed a little since 1978. the white house is black, etc. i do find it disappointing that prince discovered the need to project a strong racial identity only when critics like nelson george started to question his essential 'blackness.' my perception is that prince crumbled to peer pressure in the worst possible way. i think he saw that hip-hop and the 'street' sensibility in general were gaining commercial acceptance and that he couldn't make those things go away simply by mocking them (which he tried, at first). his response was to pretend he had always been down with those things and to integrate them into his own work. unfortunately, prince's mounting frustrations with his record label, and perhaps with the record business in general, reached a crescendo at the same time as his desperation for the black community to perceive him as 'keeping it real.' the natural next step for him was to link the business/creativity binary with the white/black binary. it put him in the strange position of having to make unambiguous statements where previously he had purposely created ambiguities as part and parcel of his art. in prince's mind, he had to become 'black' and project strong identification with the black experience in america in order to convincingly mount his crusade against racism in the music industry. the reason i have a problem with all of this is that i think the identity prince has tried to forge in order to war with the music business has largely let the air out of the complex personae and resonant body of work he assembled prior to his adoption of the downtrodden black victim of white business rapaciousness. i do also detect an element of his grasping for commercial viability by adopting black radicalism almost as a concession to his waning popularity. (only in the crazy spaceman future we inhabit here in 2009 could a person hope to improve their commercial standing by aping the surface elements of black radicalism; but as i say, american popular culture has gone through some changes since 1978). it seems to me that prince has sold out his vision of a post- racial future in order to shore up support from those still living in a (today) very racist world. i'm not mad at him for previously claiming to be part white, but i am disappointed that he has sacrificed his art in exchange for identification in a racial construct he once rejected as a racist cage. ironically, i believe the so-called immature and selfish prince of 'dirty mind,' 'controversy,' '1999' and 'purple rain' did more to alleviate racism in america than the would-be revolutionary prince of the 1990s and onward. in the 1980s, prince made a real contribution towards breaking through the propaganda that teaches racism to young children. today, he prefers to identify as an angry black man who wants white people to 'take responsibility' for racism that occurred before they were born. some people will say that today prince is more practical, that he wants to work with what we have here today, in the real world, rather than keeping his head in the clouds and theorizing about what it might be like if everybody got along. i'm just saying that i think he did more ultimate good as a visionary and a poet than as a community organizer or business role model. it is a judgment call though and i am naturally willing to concede that there is room for debate on both sides of the argument. it's time for a new direction / it's time for jazz to die | |
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2elijah said: OldFriends4Sale said: lol listen 2 the One Droppist spreading their propaganda You are so clueless. No one is spreading any one drop BS rule, as you would love to believe, but you seem to be stuck on that "plantation" mentality instead of accepting the fact that the majority of Black/African-Americans in this country, whether they are light or dark-skinned have mixed blood. It is not denying they are black. You apparently only want to believe that those with "light" skin have mixed ancestry. Keep believing what you believe, if that's what makes your ego feel comfortable, secure and more "accepting" of those who define themselves as Black or African-American. I can only laugh at your ignorance.
[Edited 4/10/09 17:09pm] lol I have many dark skinned family members who are mixed (my brotha) I have cousins aunts and uncles who are dark that look like white people with dark skin or Native americans, so your little personal attack there is baseless, and there are many biracial people (celebrities I could call out) who are biracial and dark skinned. Find something else to try to base my ignorance on. One Drop Ruler lol now that I'm done with you, I'm getting back to Prince discussions, you'll most likely keep it going. [Edited 4/10/09 17:24pm] | |
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oh, i said i was white earlier but my grandfather looked like a cigar store indian. apparently my mother's ancestors came to america in 1735 but my father's ancestors were here a long time before that.  it's time for a new direction / it's time for jazz to die | |
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is it too late for everyone to take off their clothes and read the bible while listening to thumping music it's time for a new direction / it's time for jazz to die | |
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stanleylieber said: apparently my mother's ancestors came to america in 1735
evidently as irish slaves, btw. it's time for a new direction / it's time for jazz to die | |
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http://www.newyorker.com/...-scen.html
the NEW YORKER November 17, 2008 Behind the Scenes: Glamorous Life We were having a larger conversation about his belief system and his politics. He told me he didn’t have a horse in the November election and that he didn’t believe in getting involved with these kind of earthly contests. I had asked him if the fact that Obama was black didn’t compel him to get involved. He said, “Why?” And I said, Well, because you’re black. And he said “Am I?” and held up his wrist next to my ruddy one. Indeed his skin was lighter, and he cracked up. | |
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OldFriends4Sale said: Here you are talking about who is mixed and not and turning around and saying all Africans are pure basically. Do you know how many Europeans and Middle Easterns live/pass thru and socialize with the various African countries and people?
According to your logic Sade is pure African right (she was born and raise in her fathers home country) and left later. Dark complexions have nothing to do with and I said nothing of the fact that dark skin equalled unmixed, I could go down the list of (biracial) people who are dark skinned, My grandfather is darkskinned and he is biracial(1/2Native American 1/2African-American) he has a good mix of genetics from both sides, with long wavy hair, passed onto his children Your offended at my words, because the One Drop Rule(go read about the history)and you support it, has been taken as a fact by most black-americans and I bet if someone (you identify) as black says they are not, U would get upset and try to straighten them out. the racist idea that you base your post is just as baseless as the idea of 4 races: WHITE, BLACK, RED, YELLOW, or NEGROID, CAUCASOID, MONGOLOID it's all racist and this idea is what the ODR is based on as well, it came about strongly after the emancipation of slaves in American, written into the laws, and pressed into the social ideas of American citizens black and white. Black Americans are more prone now to be the champions of the One Drop Rule. It's black americans(leaders) who oppose the creation of a multiracial box for those who identify that way(which could be 1/2Asian 1/2Navajo) ooooohhh I didn't know the people of various African countries had culture, religion, societal values etc etc oooooh I didn't know that? You probably think they all see themselves as Black too don't you?(more American racialized thinking) Let me tell U something young wippersnapper... American isn't the defining end of all things in the world In South Africa there are the Whites, the Afrikaners, the Coloured and the Blacks In earlier American history there were Whites, Negroes, Mulattoes, Natives(which were hoped to be wiped out) If you know anything about Caribbean and Latin American social cultures concerning mixed race and race, that there is no blanketed Black race (she may have blue eyes and blond hair but she is black) Latin America had over 30 mixed race labels for people of mixed heritage. They were not affected by the U.S. way of thinking lol now that I'm done with you, I'm getting back to Prince discussions, you'll most likely keep it going. If you read my post clearly, I stated Black Africans with no mixture from other races are identified as "full-blooded" Africans, although most know that "African" is just a nationality and does not define the actual ethnic group/tribe that individual is from. Many Black Americans born in the U.S. who are descendants of Black Africans, are more than likely of "mixed" blood, whether they light or dark-skinned, that due to many African/Black American ancestors that may have been slaves, during the American slavery and post-slavery eras, and whose ancestors were possibly victims of "rape" by their "white slavemasters/plantation owners. There is nothing in your post that I can respect or that you can teach me. First of all, who told you America was the defining factor concerning race??? [/quote]
Secondly, "Clueless"...Do I know anything about the Caribbean?? My family is from the Caribbean, both great-grandparents, grandparents, and my parents, on maternal/paternal sides, so if you read my earlier posts you would have known that. 5 out of my nine 9 siblings, including me, were the first generation in my family born outside of a Caribbean island. You have nothing to teach me in that department. My maternal grandmother was Arawak and her son was my grandfather, who was born in Cuba, but later moved to the U.S.VI, who happens to be my mother's father, so what are you teaching me? Absolutely nothing, and with all that mixture I still define myself as "Black/African-American proudly, and embrace my Caribbean culture under which my Grandmother/parrents raised me.
The main portion of my family on both sides, (paternal/maternal) were born in the British Virgin Islands (Tortola) and migrated to the U.S. Virgin Islands, and I have African ancestors that were born there as well. You have nothing to teach me, and yes, I'm glad we have nothing else to discuss regarding this subject, but thanks for assuming I'm a young "wippersnapper", says a lot about you. [Edited 4/10/09 17:47pm] | |
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OldFriends4Sale said: 2elijah said: You are so clueless. No one is spreading any one drop BS rule, as you would love to believe, but you seem to be stuck on that "plantation" mentality instead of accepting the fact that the majority of Black/African-Americans in this country, whether they are light or dark-skinned have mixed blood. It is not denying they are black. You apparently only want to believe that those with "light" skin have mixed ancestry. Keep believing what you believe, if that's what makes your ego feel comfortable, secure and more "accepting" of those who define themselves as Black or African-American. I can only laugh at your ignorance.
[Edited 4/10/09 17:09pm] lol I have many dark skinned family members who are mixed (my brotha) I have cousins aunts and uncles who are dark that look like white people with dark skin or Native americans, so your little personal attack there is baseless, and there are many biracial people (celebrities I could call out) who are biracial and dark skinned. Find something else to try to base my ignorance on. One Drop Ruler lol now that I'm done with you, I'm getting back to Prince discussions, you'll most likely keep it going. [Edited 4/10/09 17:24pm] Personal attack? Please stop your nonsense. You are hilarious. So because I disagree with you it is a persona attack? Then maybe you shouldn't take part in these discussions if you get that sensitive. And why the need to disrespectfully post a picture of Prince's mother to prove your point? You're ridiculous. You have nothing of interest that you think you can teach me. [Edited 4/10/09 17:48pm] | |
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Gone majorly off track and going downhill
 
Ohh purple joy oh purple bliss oh purple rapture! REAL MUSIC by REAL MUSICIANS - Prince "I kind of wish there was a reason for Prince to make the site crash more" ~~ Ben |
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