muleFunk said:

forgive me .. but... your screen name is interesting lol ..

Commercially, Prince hasn't had the same success as earlier years because;

a) In a lot of cases, he's chosen not to.
b) The record industry has changed and records simply don't sell as much as they used to.
c) He's got 'legend' status, not 'contemporary pop star' status these days, so his music, when promoted to the masses will still sell, but only to those who appreciate both him and music in general rather than the processed pop market.
d) He's distributed a lot of his more recent music in different ways than the usual recognised methods and it's when those recognised methods ain't used that the crappo record industry decides to tell us all that the music hasn't been a 'success'.

But in terms of artistry, Prince has been amazingly successful over the past 15 years. He can still do all the genres he's always been good at and do them brilliantly, and he can still sell records when he chooses to. His live shows continue to piss on the opposition and he can choose to create something completely non-commercial one year and then follow it up with a made-for-the-masses opus the next and vice versa. Are there any other music artists out there who have that luxury both because of their art and their reputation? He still has the power to be controversial lyrically (The Rainbow Children) and has managed to surprise us musically too (The Rainbow Children again).

Over the past four years, Prince has proved to me what he has clearly known for ages: that commercial success really doesn't matter. Musicology, 3121 and Planet Earth served their purpose and as a fan, I'm no more or less appreciative of the music just because those albums were offered to the masses through either a major label or given away to thousands of people. So long as the music is there for me to pick up either in my local wrecka stow or online, I don't care who else gets to listen or whether or not other people like it. But I'll happily stand my ground and defend it to death on the Org if I feel the urge .

As a fan, all I want for the future is for Prince to bombard me with new music for as long as he is able and even when he isn't, I hope we get albums crafted from the vault.

muleFunk said:

Your facts on the Vice President deal are a little "gray". He was given the Vice President position in Reprise records, a subsidiary of Warner Bros. The difference would be like him being VP of Chevrolet - NOT VP of GM.

I still hold firm that he should've delivered top-notch music and fulfilled his contract. The name change and "slave" stuff was adolescent and ultimately harmed his legacy. He should've taken the high ground and he would've come out on top.

Also, I'm sick of hearing that Prince "makes music for himself". As soon as he puts a price tag on it, it's for us -- and as such should be of a certain quality.

I think he lost track of that in the 90s and put out whatever the hell HE wanted; not realizing that we're the ones buying (or not buying) his music.

Diminished quality of his work, coupled with his eccentric & questionable behavior & a public with an increasing interest in more accessible, normal & exciting music is why he's no longer as big a commercial success.

As for artistic success, he no longer challenges himself or the listener. He hasn't in years. The only challenge he now poses to audiences is to see if you can listen to an entire album without wishing he'd return to form.

Se7en said:

Gold was not "top notch" ?

I agree with you in what you are saying.

I just don't think that WB was dealing from the top of the deck as well.

Prince and his career have always gone thru periods of ups and downs and I've been a fan throughout all of them, trust me, he ain't done yet.

Se7en said:

it's so easy 2 say that when ur not in the game and looking in. but even if ur in the game and ur willing 2 sell ur soul and legacy just 2 b "popular and play by the rules" then that's all good. but i applaud what prince did during the 90's and u can call it career suicide but look who got all the acolades later. sometimes u have u take on the storm in order 2 come out on the otherside.

Se7en said:

and it all boils down 2 a personal choice or taste of music then. a track or a album u may deem not "quality" another will jam 2 it 4 days and days

jb86 said:

The whole mess with that mother posting a youtube video of her baby dancing to his music.

Anxiety said:

its hard to maintain superstar level of popularity for 70's,80's,90's 20's..that's 4 decades of music. each decade has its own style and prince still is holding his own at his age level plus he was nominated and won grammy's not too long ago. so he may not be selling millions due to new acts that are hot, but he still the man of all decades

Prince has done great the last 15 years, and he has come on top relatively speaking, but honestly, it has been because of his tremendous talent as a live musician and performer with one of the best back catalogs in contemporary music.
[Edited 9/3/08 22:47pm]

notaprintztype said:

During those first 10 years or so Prince was viewed controversial, rebel, anti-establishment, he had a fresh sound that made a lot of those 70's acts outdated. It was also a competitive atmosphere with Michael Jackson, Madonna..It seemed since 90's came around his sound had became outdated and not bold. A great performer, but as a songwriter are Prince's days long behind him???

Isn't it true that for the last twenty years the media and record companies have really pushed Rap and synthetic music to the masses?

If this is true, then artists like Prince and other musicians have been forced to be creative in their promotional options. Which would lend some support to your statement only in that his music is not heard as much on traditional promotional outlets.

It doesn't mean however that his true popularity has taken a dive, most likely his base is just more focused.

It seems to me that Prince is gaining in popularity because people recognize his talent and music in contrast to the non-music they're forced to hear.

Many people are "re-discovering" Prince with his Planet Earth and 2131 CDs.

Twinkly1 said:

He needs to re discover himself thru his music. Otherwise he just turns into a golden oldies tour show.

Anxiety said:

It has been.

"Well.. I'm number one, AT THE BANK!!!!" - prince rogers nelson

Se7en said:

I'm sorry, but you're wrong.

If you personally gave Prince a million dollars and said: "OK, here's some money, I want you to make a record, and I specifically want to it sound like this" - only then would he actually be making the music for you.

But when Prince spends his own money, makes the record, and puts it out, we can only choose whether to buy it or not. We have no right to dictate how it should sound - neither has Prince any right to complain if noone's buying it.

Anxiety said:

my sentiments xactly ...

I think prince is completely motivated by money, and hit singles dont make money anymore. so he just doesnt try to write hits anymore, he just does what he feels like when he wakes up in the morning. So he's out of practice. When it's time to release an album and the promoters tell him to produce a hit, he makes rubbish like guitar, black sweat and musicology because he just doesnt know what it takes to make a hit and he wouldnt care as it doesnt bring him much money anymore. He is playing the good old songs that everyone wants to hear in his concerts and that's what he seems to like.

mydrawers said:

"That's what Mr. Nelson said"
[Edited 9/4/08 10:53am]

vinx98 said:

not everybody wants 2 hear that tired old song

vinx98 said:

I love it when people say stuff like that. Do you know what it takes to make a hit? Does anyone in here know what it takes to make a hit and if so, where's your hit song at? I sure hope it's not that shit that's on Z100 here in NYC or KIIS-FM in L.A. Besides, most of what's a "hit" is shit. Prince has made some great songs in the last 15 years but it was either never released (shame on Prince in many of those cases) or the songs that were released that were worth a damn weren't promoted properly. I think it's that simple really.

purplecam said:

so are you saying in the first 10 years of his career when PRINCE (not me) knew how to make hits, that those were shit too? just because he doesnt produce the hits now, that suddenly the charts are shit? yeah, there is a lot of shit hop out there, but there is also a lot of really great music too, melodic, catchy and commercial. Prince has definately made a few songs like this, but I would be amazed if he ever made songs of the quality of when doves cry, raspberry beret and Kiss ever again, I just dont think he has the motivation anymore.

Se7en said:

I could be totally wrong about this but I think that when Warners gave Prince a "vice president" position,they weren't really serious about it.It was probably a meaningless title.Perhaps it was just a way to sweeten the deal and get him to remain with the company? In the short time that he held that title,what exactly did he do? What were his duties? Did he advise Warners on other artists who were signed to Reprise? Did he help pick singles and come up with promotional ideas and strategies? Considering all the problems he was having with his own Paisley Park label and artists,it seems odd that Warners would give him vice presidential duties at Reprise.

I agree with your second point....he really should have delivered some top-notch albums in the 90s,fulfilled the contract and then moved on.His career slowed down in the 90s and that's largely because of his war with Warners.The sad thing is,he came up with some truly amazing songs in the 90s but because of the constant feuding,most of it wasn't promoted very well (under normal circumstances,an album like 'The Gold Experience' would have been a top-selling smash).I also think that,if he hadn't behaved the way he did (dissing Warners in interviews and writing "slave" on his face),today he would be in a stronger position to gain complete control of his master recordings.They might have been willing to work out some sort of deal.He burned alot of bridges.
[Edited 9/5/08 5:35am]

peter430044 said:

What kind of success in the last 15 years are you talking about?
If you are talking about successful album sales, then they haven't been as successful as the 80's, but remember that they haven't been that bad either. Conventional methods of calculating record sales have been abandoned by Prince primarily during this period. Most of his album sales come via the net or are included with concert tickets.
As far as popularity goes, he is now just as popular as he was in his prime and making a hell of a lot more money than he ever did.
If you are referring to him reaching a new audience, then as you stated, musical tastes have changed to processed sounds so most of his newer material won't appeal to the younger generation. Until the producers of their processed sound point out to them that Prince just happens to be a huge influence to them.
He has marketed his albums poorly ever since he became a recording artist. I think he concentrates on making music and believes that the music will market itself. The songs you mentioned could have been released, I agree wholeheartedly with The 1 U wanna C, but what about Adore, Play In The Sunshine, Lovesexy, Willing And Able, Live For Love and Dark etc? He let many songs just sit in limbo which could have blown up a lot of his albums.
Overall he is one of the few artists of his era who has managed to stay successful despite of the ebbs in years of charting music.
[Edited 9/5/08 9:02am]

mELdOURADOsELVAGEM said:

3 grammys sir

vinx98 said:

it's lines like these that make me go

i guess it's that "quality" tag that people like u use that gets me...what u may deem quality might b shit 2 someone else and vice versa. i will admit that that when doves cry had a very important impact on me becoming a fan but songs like the last december brings me 2 a higher plane than when doves cry, raspberry beret or the countless "hits" u want 2 throw out there so don't talk about quality, cause it's still there in his music

SoulAlive said:

the record company is the pimp..the artist is the ho ..the fans r the tricks ..- ice cube

so u think that if prince didn't take a stand in fighting and proclaiming how the business rapes an artist from almost all of their creations in public letting all unsigned or signed artists in2 fighting back 4 their right he would have been better off?

bottom line, he's been having problems with them 4 years way b4 it was public knowledge

So, is he suppose to be like top 40 all the damn time or something? I mean, come on people. He has been doing this for soooo sooooo long. Successful is a relative term, esp. in regards to him--now.

I agree with those of you who acknowledge that "success" is a relative term. There are so many different criteria for one's definition of success that this kind of question is bound to elicit varied responses.

In my opinion Prince has been extremely successful in the later part of his career because he is doing his own thing. The freedom to do what you want, when you want, and how you want is the greatest success to me. I marvel at his talent, creativity, intelligence and business savvy when I look at all the things he's accomplished over the past 15 years. My list of some of Prince's most successful feats of the past 15 years include:

Freeing himself from WB
The NPGMC
The Celebrations
The Musicology tour with the ticket/album tie-in, that was genius
3121 Vegas
21 Nights in London
Planet Earth release with the Daily Mail deal
The one-off album distribution deals with major labels
Releasing experimental albums like N.E.W.S. and TRC
The 7.7.07 concerts last year with the perfume release

Now Prince doesn't have to get "permission" to do anything he wants. That is success, at least to me it is. Add to that the fact that he doesn't have to give the majority of profits from his album sales to anyone and that he doesn't have to pay a manager 20 percent off the top and he's financially more successful now than ever.