Since no one else will chime in...I will!

No! He became a bona fide star with the 1999 LP. "Little Red Corvette" was indeed a hit on it's own. Garnering him commercial success.

"Purple Rain" the movie and LP made him a Superstar!

It's true the movie helped make him a superstar, but you couldn't call him indie even before Purple Rain. He had a huge contract with Warner Brothers right from the start.

What difference does it make? With Prince's talent it was just a matter of time. He's proven himself over and over again since the Purple rain days. Gett out of the past, he has!

Yeah, that's pretty much the story I got. I'm sure he was better known in the colored community earlier on his career since he supposedly was like a newer/younger Stevie Wonder... critics noticed him during Dirty Mind... [this is what I gathered from hearsay, not sure how much is true]

DreamyPopRoyalty said:

Dreamy.....sorry to call you out here, and i can't speak for where you're from.....but over here in the UK, you don't use the word "colored". It's fairly offensive.

If you mean black, you say black. Black Community would have been the right thing to say.

I see your point, and it's probably something that's occured to most of us at one time or another, as a neat explanation as to why Prince hasn't performed commercially and culturally to the same level as some of us peers from the 80s.

Only, Prince didn't stumble on commercial success, he agressively sought it. From selecting a multi-racial/gender band, to planning and executing a music/movie tie-in that would become somewhat of a template for future movie/music tie-ins. He actively sought out a wider, mainstream audience.

I think a lot of things he wanted to do, couldn't have been done without the commercial pulling power of that mainstream audience.

A better explanation for why Prince might not have achieved the same level of recognition or acceptance, as some of his peers, is just down to his own choices. From his androgynous appearance, non-conformist attitude to the music business even from very early on - such as his insistence on producing his own stuff, locking himself away in Minneapolis away from the glitterati, and his attitude towards the promotional activities of releasing mass-market commercial music. Prince has systematically shyed away from promotional duties, and not put the same long-term effort into promoting one singlular release like say, Michael or Janet Jackson did at the time. These choices definately had a tangible impact on the level of commercial success.

From this point of view, Prince does have more of an 'indie' attitude, but he wanted that level of mega-stardom. Basically, he wanted his cake and to eat it too.


.
[Edited 9/20/07 5:06am]

No. Prince didn't stumble upon commercial success with a well timed movie debut. His "success" was deliberate and planned. As far as "indie star" I don't even know what those are.

Did indie stars play American Bandstand? I thought that was more a commerical thing.

Militant said:

I would think that the spelling implies her location - not sure if its PC "over there" or not (and I can't imagine it is) but, as you rightly say, certainly not here in the UK.

Do you (or anyone) have a view on Prince's use of "people of colour" in Family Name (TRC), or is that offset by his use of "higher still"s, like "from the Tribe of"? Because, if we are saying that describing people as being "coloured" is offensive, then surely this would apply to "people of colour"? (Don't hate me cos I'm exploring )

I see your point, and it's probably something that's occured to most of us at one time or another, as a neat explanation as to why Prince hasn't performed commercially and culturally to the same level as some of us peers from the 80s.

Only, Prince didn't stumble on commercial success, he agressively sought it. From selecting a multi-racial/gender band, to planning and executing a music/movie tie-in that would become somewhat of a template for future movie/music tie-ins. He actively sought out a wider, mainstream audience.

I think a lot of things he wanted to do, couldn't have been done without the commercial pulling power of that mainstream audience.

A better explanation for why Prince might not have achieved the same level of recognition or acceptance, as some of his peers, is just down to his own choices. From his androgynous appearance, non-conformist attitude to the music business even from very early on - such as his insistence on producing his own stuff, locking himself away in Minneapolis away from the glitterati, and his attitude towards the promotional activities of releasing mass-market commercial music. Prince has systematically shyed away from promotional duties, and not put the same long-term effort into promoting one singlular release like say, Michael or Janet Jackson did at the time. These choices definately had a tangible impact on the level of commercial success.

From this point of view, Prince does have more of an 'indie' attitude, but he wanted that level of mega-stardom. Basically, he wanted his cake and to eat it too.


.
[Edited 9/20/07 5:06am]

No. Prince didn't stumble upon commercial success with a well timed movie debut. His "success" was deliberate and planned. As far as "indie star" I don't even know what those are.

adorable2 said:

Hi adorable I miss u

Well, IMO it goes something like this:

1978 - 1980: Prince testing ground, not sure which direction he is heading

1981 - 1984: Prince, reacting on the praise Dirty Mind did get, purposely and deliberatly tries to 'conquer the world' with his mix of funk, rock, dance and pop. Releasing the Purple Rain-movie to promote this musical mix, his lyrics that struggle with both the carnal and the devine, being 'the icing on the cake'.

1985 - 1988: In 1984 Prince became the superstar he wanted to be, what could he do to top this? Well, not repeating himselve. He tries to focus on his creativity and expand his musical horizons. Not caring too much about the 'sales'.

1989 - 1995: Prince sounds like on the one hand he stills wants to follow his muse, but on the other hand he likes to be 'popular' also. Incorporating rap, modern R&B and house in his music to remain relevant, but it doesnt always pay off.

1996 - 2003: Prince reacts in an exaggerated way on his troubles with WB. Him 'freeing' himself from the slavemasters, sees to come from deeper, psychological problems. The second halve of the nineties he sounds like he is having problems with himself, and he thinks at the turning of the millenium to have found 'solutions' in the learnings of the JW.

2004 - 2007: Prince is deliberately trying to get 'mainstream appeal' again, streamlining his act and his music, trying not to come over as a 'freak' too much. Wether he does it for the money or the fame, isnt quite sure.

He wasn't an Indie, even from Day One. He had a WB contract.

1999 (the album) was a huge success long before Purple Rain. The album Purple Rain would've been a huge success too, even without a movie.

BUT - he hit the jackpot with the movie, the album, and the tour all at once. One year before or after might've ruined the equation.

1984 was the perfect year for that kind of breakout success. Not just for Prince either; 1984 was just simply a kickass year for music, period.

You tell me Marvin Gaye, Jimi and JB weren't indie. For some reason the term "independent" has been co-oped to mean white, offbeat, noisy and dressed in a certain way.