DORA said:

How about we agree to disagree and move on? In this case it is about business practices whereas in yesterday's case it was about the proliferation of fallacious information about a public figure.

If you will agree to disagree with me, we can end this little dispute.

SkletonKee said:

Exactly. I have always defended Prince's right to believe as he wishes and to be JW or whatever he wants to be.

I respect everyone's PERSONAL views, but Prince's recent comments were made as a BUSINESS communication, as they came from his BUSINESS.

There is a difference between personal views and public comments from a business. I hope that everyone can understand that the issue is not with Prince's personal views but is rather with the public comments of his business.

I *was* offended by the joke, being an atheist. But it doesn't surprise me. It's very typical of the new Prince. Lift up your own beliefs at the expense of all others'.

in this matter i agree..


not the woody matter...


this could have been over if you had just answered me back with a note

i dont dislike "your ideas" just the bashing that follows the debate

I hope Prince takes regular showers.

DORA said:

In that case, I apologize for the bullshit yesterday. We will agree to disagree and I will say that I am sorry if I hurt your feelings or was an ass.

Well, I thought it was funny. I can see how it may have not been very smart of him in a business sense, however, he has never been very smart when it comes to that. I guess I see it as him making a little joke, since everyone comes at him for his beliefs... and it was true, athiests believe just that. I really don't see the harm.

AzureStar said:

The harm is in his flagrant disregard for the feelings of a fair percentage of his fans. The joke was very lame and wasn't funny the 9.5 billion times that I have heard it in the past and it is even less humorous when it comes as a business communication from an artist that I admire.

Would you think that it was okay for a major corporation to make comments such as the one that he made, or do you think that the board of directors would shit their collective trousers if they saw a comment such as the one that Prince made on the company's official website?

My issue with it is that Prince is clearly disrespecting many of his fans and he really does not care about their views. As Skeletonkee pointed out earlier, many of the athiestic/agnostic fans have been defenders of his religious choices but he would never defend our rights and has pointed that out on his website with his exclusionary comment.

So, there is harm in what he said in that he was purposely trying to be hurtful and exclusionary to a percentage of his audience. The same things were said about his blatantly religious questions in the NPGMC email that he sent out. He completely disregards the feelings of his non-christian fans.

I am sure that this is okay with him, as he has no use for anyone who does not agree with his views on god and religion.

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[This message was edited Sat Sep 21 7:51:12 PDT 2002 by IceNine]

I still think the joke was funny. If he would have made a comment about athiests that was not true, then I would think differently. But the "joke" was true.

I have never agreed with his business practices, and I am certain that no major company would allow that. But, we are talking about a musician here, one who is trying to run a small music club to those who still give a shit about him. Prince rarely shows good business sense, so to me, this isn't surprising that he would post this. And, I already said it probably wasn't very smart of him.

He has disrespected his fans a lot in the past. I didn't agree with the Christmas e-mail... some people may have found it funny. The other e-mail that you talked about...answer it or don't. It's all a matter of opinion I guess. To me, this was funny, as it didn't say anything that athiests don't already believe to be true. I guess it has to do with the fact that I really don't care what he believes or what he says on that site... if the music is good, great! Everything else is just talk and Prince being who he is at that moment. Add to that the fact that he changes his views on a regular basis and I take what he says with a grain of salt most of the time.

Why do you think that he has no use for fans who don't agree with him? Is he kicking non-christians out of the concerts?

Do NOT argue with me!

For the record: I think it would be smart of him to keep the music club and the e-mails strictly related to the business of the club and leave out the religion. That would be smart.


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[This message was edited Sat Sep 21 8:06:50 PDT 2002 by AzureStar]

I'm not offended. Not only is it funny, it is true. Prince can do no wrong.

AzureStar said:

He has a use for non-christians who follow deistic religions because he holds hopes that he can convert them to his way of thinking. He knows that he will not convert atheists/agnostics to his views, so he has no use for them...

He certainly tries to make atheists and agnostics feel uncomfortable at his shows though...

I will have to paraphrase, but he has said things about "if you don't care about Jesus, I don't have any use for you"... paraphrased, of course. I can't remember the exact phrase, but he has said things like that in concert. BUT, this is different than his official business communications from his NPGMC website.

I also remember hearing about him holding discussions at the celebration thing a couple of years ago and separating atheists/agnostics from christians, making them sit outside of his happy little circle of christians and then launching into a sermon about god.

It is readily apparent that he has absolutely no respect for those of us who do not believe in god.

Aerogram said:

lol...silly.

^ ^
PRINCE
[This message was edited Sat Sep 21 8:27:47 PDT 2002 by Aerogram]

Aerogram said:

You know what, Aerogram? Prince is always right and I have decided that his views are right and that I should follow along with what he thinks...

I am off to get a lobotomy now so that I will not think so much anymore.

...
[This message was edited Sat Sep 21 8:26:49 PDT 2002 by IceNine]

IceNine said:

Don't most christians do this? Attempt to bring one to think as they do? Each religion believing their religion is the "right" one? I don't agree with that at all - I never have. He takes things to the extreme... he always has.

I guess I should explain more why I think this is funny... I was an athiest for 14 years and I have heard this joke more than once. It is funny becuase it is true. It is like the one saying it is attempting to make a point, attempting to trigger something when saying it, being smug about it with an attempt to be hurtful... when all they are doing is confirming what an athiest believes. To me, that is funny.

If this is all about his business sense, or lack of...I agree with you on that. I can agree and still think the joke was funny.


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[This message was edited Sat Sep 21 8:35:35 PDT 2002 by AzureStar]

IceNine said:

All I said was that it was funny and true... The only place we're going is the stomach of a gazillions carnion eating bugs. Personally, I'm having myself toasted to a nice crispy ash.

Aerogram said:

So you will be all dressed up with a place to go!!

SkletonKee said:

I am not making stuff up to fit my own views..and i had no idea that the Christians and Catholic folks on here crap on the Jehovah Witness...i am not on the org 24/7 to know what's going on and I hardly know anyone here on a personal level..but the times that I was on the org i've seen a lot of disrespect, nasty and cruel posts on religion.

IceNine said:

I think that most of his fans and lovers of his music don't see Prince functioning as a corporation...let's face it, we clearly see that Prince don't care about losing his fanbase. I think Prince feel free to say or do anything he pleases, even if he do lose fans. In fact, I think he's gaining fans. I don't think he is trying to weed out atheists or non-believing fans, I think he's just letting us know what he believes in and what he stands for.

PEOPLE...its music...his personal views are just that...personal... I don't care what he believes...as long as it hurts no one...and isn't illegal... (he could boink a duck for all i care...just don't make a vidio)

DISCLAIMER: all those .org members involved in PETA DO NOT ORG NOTE me... they are your personal views... I am not interested in your views or those of your duck...
Nor am I being literal

O4ITSME said:

damn... I was just getting ready to click "send".




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[This message was edited Sat Sep 21 20:26:29 PDT 2002 by AzureStar]

AzureStar said:

Hello Azure... or umm Quack Quack

O4ITSME said:

Hi!




not sure why I had to edit...
[This message was edited Sat Sep 21 20:32:29 PDT 2002 by AzureStar]

IceNine said:

---
We know Prince is not smarter that that (LOL) He is not a business man he is a musician. The music club started as after he pissed of Warner Brothers. I sure he never planned to run a music club or anything type of business. He appears to have spent most of his life pissing people off. I think he gets a little bit of a kick out it.

SkletonKee said:

Melody said:

laurarichardson said:

You know what... you are right. He doesn't care and he is not a businessman... I really wish that he could be both or that he would hire someone to help him because he is really a mess.

IceNine said:

I agree with the two of you!!!

IceNine said:

Well it would be good for him to hire someone to run the business but,that may cost a lot money. I think he may be scraping by and with the economy going into the toilet bowl he may not have a choice but,to run it himself.

Any way no record label will sign him without bringing in outside producers and I do not want to see that happen. Therefore, the music club is a evil we must live with.

oh brother

aw35077 said:

I am not making stuff up to fit my own views..and i had no idea that the Christians and Catholic folks on here crap on the Jehovah Witness...i am not on the org 24/7 to know what's going on and I hardly know anyone here on a personal level..but the times that I was on the org i've seen a lot of disrespect, nasty and cruel posts on religion.[/quote]


yup..those nasty, cruel and disrespectul comments were mostly from the christian and catholic followers...go figure.

you would think that their teachings of God will help them understand how to be tolerable...is that a word?

at anyrate...this debate is boring me now..can't we get back to making fun of President Bush?