skywalker said:

Wynton said a lot of stuff in the eighties -- that rap didn't count as real music, for instance. I wouldn't hold him up as an authority. Just an opinionated person.

Much like I. So, don't take me as an expert either, just another opinionated person...

... who is familiar with Hendrix being a multi-instrumentalist, too: bass, drums, piano, etc. And, most people who've written about Hendrix's compositional prowess have well documented his genius in conceptualizing.

This is what I get for always returning to this type of thread ... every month, no less ... but it's funny that Hendrix's genius must constantly be subjugated to Prince's on this site.

Be that as it may, I have yet to see the tribute albums pumped out to Prince with the regularity that I see with Hendrix. And, I have yet to see schools of guitar players (or other instrumentalists) based on Prince's playing.

They're both giants.

Prince is still alive.

You really can't compare artists like point guards. Of course, P is influenced by Jimi but I believe that P's complexity is always undervalued. Name me someone that can do all that he does. He is comfortable in any style of music and his multiple instrumental voices serves as an extension to his brilliant musical mind. Prince music is a unique blend that is both instantly recognizeable and always changing. Listen to the diversity of his music. Jimi was basically a brilliant revolutionary blues guitarist.

Hendrix is dead and Prince is alive!

Something to consider:

Hendrix had the ability to do bar chords using his thumb for the bar. It created the ability for him to get all sorts of chord voicings and soloing opportunities that are quite hard to duplicate.

blackguitaristz said:

I think you'll find the title of his biggest film and album was Purple Rain.

IMO, there shouldn't be much of a debate as pertains to guitar playing; prince shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as jimi hendrix, or even santana for that matter. And thats not to knock prince's talent or potential. he simply doesn't have the body of guitar work that would IMO support any assertion that he possesses or has possessed a distinctive or influential guitar style.

IMO prince is a great guitar stylist, which is quite different than being a great player, IMO. segovia was an awesome and profoundly influential guitar player; wes montgomery, charlie christian, george benson, jimi hendrix, allan holdsworth, to name but a choice few, are other guitar standard bearers IMO. prince's playing reflects bits and influences of many of these players and the styles they popularized. however, he has not added anything of substance (and thats putting it kindly) to the body of knowledge of the instrument.

although I personally believe prince to be the best rhythm guitarist of his generation, his musical peak took place in an era where rhythm guitar was featured less and less in popular r&b. if one goes back to just before prince came on the scene in the late '70's you could hear INCREDIBLE r&b rhythm guitar playing on loads of the day's 'hits'. had prince come up in that environment, or perhaps in the '60s-early 70s alongside jimi, clapton, mclaughlin, dimeola et al, it seems to me he would have been considered a fine rock/r&b guitarist, certainly worthy of praise and 'guitar god' status...but I cannot imagine discerning fans comparing him favorable with the mindblowing cultural and social phenomenom that was jimi hendrix...they'd a been comparing prince to second tier players (all of them great and incredible and worthy or great praise IMO) such as jimmy page or perhaps al mckay or somesuch...

prince possesses such awesome talent; there's no telling how good an instrumentalist he could be were he to concentrate his energies on any one of his primary instruments. however being considered a great instrumentalist doesn't seem to be a primary motivation for prince so I'd say we'll probably never know how good he could be.

as pertains performing and songwriting, I just cannot wrap my mind around the idea that prince - - as charismatic and engaging and phenonmenal a performer as he is - - could ever on his best night reach peaks that jimi regularly hit everynight. please somebody dare make an argument that prince has EVER in any concert reached a peak like jimi does on 'who knows' or 'machine gun' or at woodstock, at the isle of wight and on and on....these are transcendent performances by a visitor from another consciousness standing head and shoulders above virtually everyone in an era where virtually every musician played every note like it might be their last...prince certainly is a throwback to that era in many respects, which is perhaps why he stands in such stark contrast against others in his own era. but jimi, man jimi had his s**t together, yo! ALL his s**t...

Lastly, songwriting prowess is certainly a subjective subject. Of course all of this debate is subjective, but perhaps none more so than songwriting. prince's songwriting style cannot be seen as anything more than derivative of the style's popular in his era. he is (actually he WAS cause he aint showed me he can write a great song in a long time) an adept pop songwriter. I think one could argue that jimi's songwriting style, particularly his lyric style was greatly derivative as well...however, I would argue that its difficult to compare the two b/c of the vast differences in their subject matter. actually, I think this is the only area where its even remotely fair to compare prince and jimi; in the arena where both were attempting to reach a broad audience through their songwriting, ie songs like 'fire' or 'crosstown traffic' for hendrix and more hits than could be mentioned for prince...prince certainly knows who to write a pop 'hit' when he wants to. but I triple dare him to write a song as lyrically complex or self reflective as 'axis bold as love' or 'belly button window' by jimi...

I thought I was just gonna add a bit to the dialogue and ended up writing a book - - sorry...I'm passionate about both of these great, great geniuses...but in the order of genuises, if there is one, I'd have to tip my hat to hendrix on pretty much all counts...prince can saang mo betta though, I'll grant him that!

IMO, there shouldn't be much of a debate as pertains to guitar playing; prince shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as jimi hendrix, or even santana for that matter. And thats not to knock prince's talent or potential. he simply doesn't have the body of guitar work that would IMO support any assertion that he possesses or has possessed a distinctive or influential guitar style.

IMO prince is a great guitar stylist, which is quite different than being a great player, IMO. segovia was an awesome and profoundly influential guitar player; wes montgomery, charlie christian, george benson, jimi hendrix, allan holdsworth, to name but a choice few, are other guitar standard bearers IMO. prince's playing reflects bits and influences of many of these players and the styles they popularized. however, he has not added anything of substance (and thats putting it kindly) to the body of knowledge of the instrument.

although I personally believe prince to be the best rhythm guitarist of his generation, his musical peak took place in an era where rhythm guitar was featured less and less in popular r&b. if one goes back to just before prince came on the scene in the late '70's you could hear INCREDIBLE r&b rhythm guitar playing on loads of the day's 'hits'. had prince come up in that environment, or perhaps in the '60s-early 70s alongside jimi, clapton, mclaughlin, dimeola et al, it seems to me he would have been considered a fine rock/r&b guitarist, certainly worthy of praise and 'guitar god' status...but I cannot imagine discerning fans comparing him favorable with the mindblowing cultural and social phenomenom that was jimi hendrix...they'd a been comparing prince to second tier players (all of them great and incredible and worthy or great praise IMO) such as jimmy page or perhaps al mckay or somesuch...

prince possesses such awesome talent; there's no telling how good an instrumentalist he could be were he to concentrate his energies on any one of his primary instruments. however being considered a great instrumentalist doesn't seem to be a primary motivation for prince so I'd say we'll probably never know how good he could be.

as pertains performing and songwriting, I just cannot wrap my mind around the idea that prince - - as charismatic and engaging and phenonmenal a performer as he is - - could ever on his best night reach peaks that jimi regularly hit everynight. please somebody dare make an argument that prince has EVER in any concert reached a peak like jimi does on 'who knows' or 'machine gun' or at woodstock, at the isle of wight and on and on....these are transcendent performances by a visitor from another consciousness standing head and shoulders above virtually everyone in an era where virtually every musician played every note like it might be their last...prince certainly is a throwback to that era in many respects, which is perhaps why he stands in such stark contrast against others in his own era. but jimi, man jimi had his s**t together, yo! ALL his s**t...

Lastly, songwriting prowess is certainly a subjective subject. Of course all of this debate is subjective, but perhaps none more so than songwriting. prince's songwriting style cannot be seen as anything more than derivative of the style's popular in his era. he is (actually he WAS cause he aint showed me he can write a great song in a long time) an adept pop songwriter. I think one could argue that jimi's songwriting style, particularly his lyric style was greatly derivative as well...however, I would argue that its difficult to compare the two b/c of the vast differences in their subject matter. actually, I think this is the only area where its even remotely fair to compare prince and jimi; in the arena where both were attempting to reach a broad audience through their songwriting, ie songs like 'fire' or 'crosstown traffic' for hendrix and more hits than could be mentioned for prince...prince certainly knows who to write a pop 'hit' when he wants to. but I triple dare him to write a song as lyrically complex or self reflective as 'axis bold as love' or 'belly button window' by jimi...

I thought I was just gonna add a bit to the dialogue and ended up writing a book - - sorry...I'm passionate about both of these great, great geniuses...but in the order of genuises, if there is one, I'd have to tip my hat to hendrix on pretty much all counts...prince can saang mo betta though, I'll grant him that!

IMO, there shouldn't be much of a debate as pertains to guitar playing; prince shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as jimi hendrix, or even santana for that matter. And thats not to knock prince's talent or potential. he simply doesn't have the body of guitar work that would IMO support any assertion that he possesses or has possessed a distinctive or influential guitar style.

IMO prince is a great guitar stylist, which is quite different than being a great player, IMO. segovia was an awesome and profoundly influential guitar player; wes montgomery, charlie christian, george benson, jimi hendrix, allan holdsworth, to name but a choice few, are other guitar standard bearers IMO. prince's playing reflects bits and influences of many of these players and the styles they popularized. however, he has not added anything of substance (and thats putting it kindly) to the body of knowledge of the instrument.

although I personally believe prince to be the best rhythm guitarist of his generation, his musical peak took place in an era where rhythm guitar was featured less and less in popular r&b. if one goes back to just before prince came on the scene in the late '70's you could hear INCREDIBLE r&b rhythm guitar playing on loads of the day's 'hits'. had prince come up in that environment, or perhaps in the '60s-early 70s alongside jimi, clapton, mclaughlin, dimeola et al, it seems to me he would have been considered a fine rock/r&b guitarist, certainly worthy of praise and 'guitar god' status...but I cannot imagine discerning fans comparing him favorable with the mindblowing cultural and social phenomenom that was jimi hendrix...they'd a been comparing prince to second tier players (all of them great and incredible and worthy or great praise IMO) such as jimmy page or perhaps al mckay or somesuch...

prince possesses such awesome talent; there's no telling how good an instrumentalist he could be were he to concentrate his energies on any one of his primary instruments. however being considered a great instrumentalist doesn't seem to be a primary motivation for prince so I'd say we'll probably never know how good he could be.

as pertains performing and songwriting, I just cannot wrap my mind around the idea that prince - - as charismatic and engaging and phenonmenal a performer as he is - - could ever on his best night reach peaks that jimi regularly hit everynight. please somebody dare make an argument that prince has EVER in any concert reached a peak like jimi does on 'who knows' or 'machine gun' or at woodstock, at the isle of wight and on and on....these are transcendent performances by a visitor from another consciousness standing head and shoulders above virtually everyone in an era where virtually every musician played every note like it might be their last...prince certainly is a throwback to that era in many respects, which is perhaps why he stands in such stark contrast against others in his own era. but jimi, man jimi had his s**t together, yo! ALL his s**t...

Lastly, songwriting prowess is certainly a subjective subject. Of course all of this debate is subjective, but perhaps none more so than songwriting. prince's songwriting style cannot be seen as anything more than derivative of the style's popular in his era. he is (actually he WAS cause he aint showed me he can write a great song in a long time) an adept pop songwriter. I think one could argue that jimi's songwriting style, particularly his lyric style was greatly derivative as well...however, I would argue that its difficult to compare the two b/c of the vast differences in their subject matter. actually, I think this is the only area where its even remotely fair to compare prince and jimi; in the arena where both were attempting to reach a broad audience through their songwriting, ie songs like 'fire' or 'crosstown traffic' for hendrix and more hits than could be mentioned for prince...prince certainly knows who to write a pop 'hit' when he wants to. but I triple dare him to write a song as lyrically complex or self reflective as 'axis bold as love' or 'belly button window' by jimi...

I thought I was just gonna add a bit to the dialogue and ended up writing a book - - sorry...I'm passionate about both of these great, great geniuses...but in the order of genuises, if there is one, I'd have to tip my hat to hendrix on pretty much all counts...prince can saang mo betta though, I'll grant him that!

jilljones said:

Nicely said and on point. Hmmm,.I wonder why Skywalker hasn't disected this post?

blackguitaristz said:

Yeah, because Jimi had trademark on the term "purple" right? Whatever...Listen I am not saying that Prince, especially in the Purple Rain era, was not influenced heavily by Jimi. He was .However, anyone who listens to the sound of Prince's guitar can hear it is more often played like Santana than Hendrix.

skywalker said:

I'm a lead guitarist myself. Trust me, I KNOW Carlos is an influence on P. Hendrix and Carlos are two of my all time fave guitarists and both have influenced me as a lead guitarist greatly. Prince himself has influenced me as a lead guitarist. But to say that P sounds more like Carlos than Jimi is wrong. P's whole sensibilty and sound is linked more to Hendrix than anybody when he plays lead guitar. And it always has been. To this very day. Sure, he'll employ the use of minor penatonic scales and phrase it in the vein of Carlos. On a few select songs, i.e. "In A Spanish Villa" and "God" the instrumental version, for example. But even on those, which are heavy Santana inspired, he STILL employs Hendrix's showmanship in his playing. The choice of effects P ususally uses are close in sound to that of Hendrix. Like I said, his sensibilty, his phrasing, etc., is that of Hendrix. He often blends Hendrix and Carlos together, in his leads. Which many guitarists, including myself, has done. Ernie Isley, Eddie Hazel, Brian May, David Gilmour, all have blended elements of Hendrix combined with Carlos in their playing. But when it comes to Prince, his calling card as far as when he's on lead guitar in a rock based song is and always has been and I suspect always will be Jimi. It's who Prince himself has chosen to echo. It's delibrate and no mistake. He wants people to think of Hendrix when he's playing. So much of what he does and has done when he's playing lead guitar is more Hendrix than anyone. And no place does this show more than when seeing P live. It's nothing about P's playing that echoes Carlos live. P embellishes certain runs from scales that Santana and many other guitarists often uses. But what P tops it off with, his vibrato, his bends, are all from the school of Hendrix. And I don't care what P may be wearing at the time. It could be a 3 piece suit.

blackguitaristz said:

Your post is knowledgeable and I agree with your point. Jimi not only influenced P but he changed the entire concept of guitar playing in contemporary Rock/Blues. But I would like to hear your thoughts on the overall influence of their respective catalogs, musical influence and musical growth. There are several important virtuosos on guitar over the last 70 years (Les Paul, Robert Johnson, etc.) but there is more to making great compositions than being a master of an instrument. Did Jimi ever have an album comparable in breadth, complexity, diversity and impact as PR, SOTT, Parade. His masterful studio skills and the ability to conceptualize a song inside and out are amazing. I once read a quote from a session musician who stated that P single handidly changed the production methods of contemporary music. Look at Prince as a live performer and make comparisons. Has there ever been an artist with the kind of discipline and work ethic as P? At Prince's peak, I would put him alone in the studio with any artist over the last 100 years.

jdcxc said:

Thank u. Jimi's first album, "Are You Experienced?" still to this day is....scary. Meaning that nothing, and I mean NOTHING sounded remotley close to it. But yet at the same time, people could identify with it. Hendrix's gift was just that. His playing was so huge that it not only inspired countless of people to want to learn how to play but it inspired known guitarists who were already considered greats; i.e. Clapton, Beck, Page. Hendrix's best work represented a freedom. And that's so important. Because without freedom, what do u have? Hendrix embodied freedom, musically and visually. And this inspired musicians and non musicians alike. I think for this very reason, is why Hendrix is soooo loved by so many differnt poeple. It touches people. Kids today, of all races, in this generation filled with serious turmoil, are wearing Hendrix t-shirts. They identify themselvs with what Hendrix represented. P is someone who is a STONE genius. Period. What's chilling is the fact that I don't think we will ever hear P's best shit. P is definately one of the best musical artists of all time. His grasp of music is GOD given. One of the best vocalists ever. And one of the best live performers to ever live. It's nothing, musically, P can't do. He's a living legend and will go down as one of the best that ever lived. And that's the stone truth.

Drugs

blackguitaristz said:

Your post is knowledgeable and I agree with your point. Jimi not only influenced P but he changed the entire concept of guitar playing in contemporary Rock/Blues. But I would like to hear your thoughts on the overall influence of their respective catalogs, musical influence and musical growth. There are several important virtuosos on guitar over the last 70 years (Les Paul, Robert Johnson, etc.) but there is more to making great compositions than being a master of an instrument. Did Jimi ever have an album comparable in breadth, complexity, diversity and impact as PR, SOTT, Parade. His masterful studio skills and the ability to conceptualize a song inside and out are amazing. I once read a quote from a session musician who stated that P single handidly changed the production methods of contemporary music. Look at Prince as a live performer and make comparisons. Has there ever been an artist with the kind of discipline and work ethic as P? At Prince's peak, I would put him alone in the studio with any artist over the last 100 years.

Ifsixwuz9 said:

A girl that's defending my boy, Jimi Hendrix?! With an org name Ifsizwaz9 to boot?!....I think I love u. May This Be Love?

blackguitaristz said:

You do realize you just quoted a Partridge Family song along side a Hendrix song right? Tell me that wasn't on purpose.

blackguitaristz said:

Your post is knowledgeable and I agree with your point. Jimi not only influenced P but he changed the entire concept of guitar playing in contemporary Rock/Blues. But I would like to hear your thoughts on the overall influence of their respective catalogs, musical influence and musical growth. There are several important virtuosos on guitar over the last 70 years (Les Paul, Robert Johnson, etc.) but there is more to making great compositions than being a master of an instrument. Did Jimi ever have an album comparable in breadth, complexity, diversity and impact as PR, SOTT, Parade. His masterful studio skills and the ability to conceptualize a song inside and out are amazing. I once read a quote from a session musician who stated that P single handidly changed the production methods of contemporary music. Look at Prince as a live performer and make comparisons. Has there ever been an artist with the kind of discipline and work ethic as P? At Prince's peak, I would put him alone in the studio with any artist over the last 100 years.

jdcxc said:

You're kidding right? I'd compare Are You Experienced to Purple Rain, Axis Bold as Love to Parade, and Electric Ladyland to SOTT and no matter what side of the fence you sit, it's a valid comparison. Ultimately it's subjective but don't think for one minute that Jimi's albums have less impact than Prince's. I mean most people outside of the org haven't even heard Parade and SOTT.

True Prince has become a masterful musician in his own right, but he was running in Jimi's shadow for a long time-- most never get out of it. Don't think for one minute that he's overcome the man though. He ain't there yet.

[Edited 3/22/07 9:31am]

You're kidding right? I'd compare Are You Experienced to Purple Rain, Axis Bold as Love to Parade, and Electric Ladyland to SOTT and no matter what side of the fence you sit, it's a valid comparison. Ultimately it's subjective but don't think for one minute that Jimi's albums have less impact than Prince's. I mean most people outside of the org haven't even heard Parade and SOTT.

True Prince has become a masterful musician in his own right, but he was running in Jimi's shadow for a long time-- most never get out of it. Don't think for one minute that he's overcome the man though. He ain't there yet.

Damn, this is a long ass thread.

I would comment but I don't know enough about Jimi to make a comparison. The Audience needs to come in here and set all you motherfuckers straight.