Was listening to the Black album earlier which once every few months just reminds me why I was proud to be into his music when many friends weren't. Anyway I was thinking if he had released it back in 1988 what would have happened?

No Batman? Lovesexy released later, no Lovesexy tour , no name change? still at Warners? what do people think?

clarityman said:

It's obvious that the 'Black Album' spawned 'Lovesexy', but beyond that, who can say?

goosebumps said:

it is obvious yes, but would it have been released at all? cos we know that the two were pretty much recorded around the same time - just want to hear what fans that were around then think might have happened

clarityman said:[quote]Was listening to the Black album earlier which once every few months just reminds me why I was proud to be into his music when many friends weren't. Anyway I was thinking if he had released it back in 1988 what would have happened? /quote]

I think the fans would have been divided. The pop fans vs the musos. The Black Album came at a transitional time. It was definitely left field from any of the Revolution stuff and darker than Sign O' the Times. A precursor to the NPG. It was pure art, musicality and expressionism. Dead On It, 2 Nigs United for West Compton, Bob George. Warners would never accept it anyway. Too indulgent. All they wanted was Purple Rain II. But it's still my favorite Prince album.

clarityman said:

I think Tim Burton would have asked Prince to do the 'Batman' soundtrack in 89 and 'Graffiti Bridge' would have still been done. But I can remember at the time 'The Black Album' was to be released with no name, done by no artist, with the logo WX147 (In peach) down the spine.....

17dayz said:[quote]

clarityman said:

I said something like this to a friend earlier, it was art, and probably the rawest I can remember Prince ever being - it was brilliant - It only went to frustrate me further in the 90s when he sounded too over produced and a little contrived.

clarityman said:

Prince declined lts release for his own reasons, Warners were prepared to release it.

goosebumps said:

Weren't Acetates or very few records actually pressed b4 Prince pulled the plug?

People usually say this would have been a big hit if released at the time. No one really knows, but I think it could just as easily have bombed. For a start off, it was anti-general public not only with its mostly dark aggressive funk but also with its anti-promotional black packaging, it was like Prince challenging his audience to like it. There were no obvious singles either.

I think it could have been seen in the same light as Chaos & Disorder is seen, as an album that Prince put out without working too hard on perfecting it, after all several of the tracks were made just for a party for Shiela E! I think the Black album would have sabotaged his fan-base in the US as much as Lovesexy did, because in both cases it was Prince just going off on a tangent away from what people expected of him and confusing his casual fan base.

As it was, the 'black market' of bootlegging perfectly suited this 'black album' and even the tone of the album fitted a sort of underworld of music rather than the frilly pop that was around at the time. It did more for Prince's reputation this way than it ever could have if released officially at the time, so I reckon it was a good job it wasn't released then, even though its success was accidental.

This old chestnut again.... I'm sure there was a similar thread just a week or two back.

TBA was not going to be a 'canon' Prince album, it was gonna be like, say a Madhouse album, or NPS - It was Prince, but it was not released under his name, with the same level of promotion or acknowledged involvement, etc, etc.

So to all intents and purposes, had TBA been released as intended, there would've been no Lovesexy (the catalyst for said album's recording was TBA's cancellation - whoever said they were recorded at the same time is wrong - TBA was compiled from previously recorded material, and was not recorded as a whole project, COMPILED, just like C&D and The Vault - as opposed to the material Lovesexy, which was almost all recorded in a short space of time as a whole project).

Prince would've likely continued work on Graffiti Bridge in from '87 onwards, which would've been the follow-up to SOTT as intended.

It's likely that Tim Burton would still have contacted Prince to work on Batman, so there's a good chance that would've still happened - although had Prince been knee-deep in Graffiti Bridge at the time, he might not have had time to work on a whole album for Batman (with the inevitable follow-on of promotion and such) and may have just submitted the couple of songs originally requested.

After that, it's difficult to say with any certainty.

All I can tell you is that many guys in college (including frat guy types) asked me for copies of the Black Album and loved it (in 1988). "Bob George" was a sure clincher. Remember this was when Public Enemy and NWA were about to go mainstream in their appeal. They couldn't care less about Lovesexy, and they thought Batman sounded "gay".

Based on that, I'd say Prince would have had a bit different legacy right now. One of much more respect due to "macho" creative muscle.

ufoclub said:

Yeah, but I'm sure people were asking for copies because it was a famous bootleg rather than for the quality of the music. The fact it was 'illegal' generated a buzz and interest it would not have had if released officially. Or to put it another way, if Lovesexy or Batman had been unreleased bootlegs, they'd have been given 'legendary' status too and been heavily sought after, pretty much like most unreleased Prince tracks that, in the light of day, ain't all that more special than his released stuff.

metalorange said:

The guys had no clue as to what was going on with the album, they didn't knowif it was official or not. They liked the vibe and theme and harshness and cussing. I remember when Batman came out, one of them asked if it was worth buying... if it was like the Black Album... I had to say no.

ufoclub said:

I can also tell you that no.. if Lovesexy or Batman had been bootlegs, I would not have enjoyed them as much as The Black ALbum. There is not a song on either as cohesive and creative as Le Grind or Bob George. The Black Album sequence of tracks is truly (whether accidental or not) a slab of strong flavor that has more of an identity and mysterious dark attraction then any other Prince Album in my opinion.

17dayz said:

It was all set for release, thousands of copies were pressed and a few copies had already been shipped when PRINCE himself pulled the plug a week before it was to be officially released. So Warner had already accepted it.

ufoclub said:

I agree, I played some of the tracks to people who had no clue if it were a bootleg or whatever, the reaction was universally one of excitement and double takes. I feel that fans of the Black Album tend to be those that were old enough to remeber his earliest stuff and who followed his development as an artist. Someone compared This album to Chaos and Disorder .... I can't even think why they would do that!

clarityman said:

Alls I know is - when I started reading your thread - my cat comes into the bedroom wanting a fuss - sniffing all over the computer.....weird

clarityman said:

The people I remember only knew of Purple Rain from 1985, and of course 1999 from '83

About Batman, Tim Burton originally cast 1999 and Baby,I'm a Star in the movie - these were obviously recorded well before TBA and LoveSexy, which after he asked Prince to record the soundtrack were replaced by Trust and Partyman. So my view is that Prince would have still been approached to do the Batman soundtrack.

The Question for me is if Prince would have accepted the soundtrack if TBA had been released... I suspect he would.

My own opinion is that TBA is a classic album that should have been released when it was originally intended to be. However, by pulling it P created a legend that way exceeded the actual quality of the record itself. If released, it probably would have bombed sales-wise, but created an underground following. By pulling it, it created a buzz without people even hearing it (for God sake, I didn't even like Prince at the time, but I was still hunting it down!).

If it had been released there would have been no promotion (how could there be - there was no artist credit!). Prince would have moved onto his next project, which I firmly believe would have been LoveSexy in some form or another. He would have toured with LoveSexy or something similar and Graffiti Bridge would have remained in the pipeline. TBA was just a bit of a release prior to a 'spiritual' period.

But what the hell to we know what was going on in his head anyway! I just enjoy the music...
[Edited 7/28/06 19:01pm]

the question should be what if camille was released?

the thing that messed prince up was his record company and his frustration at his us "fan base"
he was at the peak of his creativity.
if wb would have let him get away with releasing all of those albums, i dont think there would have been a batman, a grafitti bridge, sheeeeeit the entire 90's would have been different.
i dont think prince has been the same since he started second guessing himself.
this was due 2 his record company (declining sales), his audience (rap was a force in the black market), and himself.
so if tba was released originally, i dont know if it would have been successful
parade,sott,and lovesexy was not a financial success compared 2 purple rain.
artistic success? yes, the critics LOVED that album

It would have been like the Camille Album in the sense of an Easter egg hunt. Prince didn't want people to know it was him. He wanted the album to fly on its own merits which would have been cool. And another thing, the Black Album was slated for a Dec. 7th, 1987 release date which would have been two albums in the same year as SOTT was released in March of 1987. My Warners was throwing him a bone since they didn't let the original Crystal Ball fly. It would have been cool to see what style Prince would have had because it wouldn't have been as colorful as the Lovesexy era with the clothes etc.

revolution75 said:[quote]the question should be what if camille was released?

Yes indeed it is a good question and one worthy of it's own thread

clarityman said:[quote]

revolution75 said:

u got it...check the forums