Rock is so wide, raw, big, all encompassing, emotional and reflective ...plus you don't have to do lame dances and other James Brown stuff from the70s you can just play your guitar and look cool.

SynthiaRose said:

Like he did on SNL. That's an interesting point you bring up.

You speak more truth than most care to admit. Prince is desperate for people to pay attention to him.

"If this statement was true then he would be out there over promoting his CDs which he has not done, so I don't understand this statement."

It's perspective,wonder. Let's not play that game. Look at the over glossed photos and the flash ad's and the self congratulatory "My new single it's another EVENT" It's desperation,plain and simple. Why is he not promoting everywhere? He went on A.I. for attention for a sub par performance.



And every time he steps on stage it becomes more apparent.
And why are fans still pretending?

"This statement is absurd. Without a doubt Prince gives the most electrying performances on stage. Yes, some shows were bad, but the majority has been good. How he arranges his music, play different melodies, instruments, make the guitar cry, I'm talking about the art of musicianship, what your talking about is silly/petty stuff that nobody cares about."

You are missing the point,Wonder. It's this pandering for applause and if you can't see it then just watch his actions on stage . You can see it in his damne eyes. It screams, "please applaud" It reminds me of Cher or Celine Dion. Except it's Celine Dion with a telecaster. Seriously, don't look at this as a personal attack. Look at as a opinionated observation. This is the Judy Garland Syndrome and Prince suffers from it. Hence why he went on A.I. He is addicted to hearing applause even if it's staged.



"I think its pathetic that you would "feel bad" how another person feel about themself. If Prince thinks he is cool then that is his business, not yours. What do you care? If it makes Prince happy, regardless of what people think then who cares? I think I'm cool, and I'm sure there are people who think that I'm not. Why the hell should I give a f*ck what other people think."

You are getting overt- emotional Wonder. Anyone is allowed to critique and that's what Im doing after SynthiaRose has added in her 2 cents. Your voice is no less valid than mine. No Matter what kind of tone you answer to me. I still think it's bad theater.


"If you are a fan of someone's music, you are not going to care who wants to make fun of them or not. How lame would it be, if I were to turn away from Prince's music, not because I don't like it anymore, but because someone made fun of him. How immature is that?"

Im not saying to turn away from his music. I am stating that most fans for example on "Amazon" lose all objectivity and applaud everything he does.
It's almost like they think they will be eternally hexed if they say, "You know this album really isn't anything to give 4 stars to." Instead what happens? People slam amazon with over pandering reviews of 5 stars and applaud every little sickening thing. It's almost like you are reading zombified thoughts.


"Prince does not over promote himself like most artist do today so and I don't understand where you are getting this "desperate" stuff from, and if he is on stage, the spotlight is going to be on him, so what?"

Desperate as in "What can I do to get the media to pay attention to me"
Desperate like that. He's like a mini Paris Hilton now. "I have to be seen and people have to talk about me even if there really isnt a event" His legacy is in tact. "So what'? It's a view on why I think Prince behaves like this. And that's all it is.





I feel bad for the fans who cheer this on. It's become a max factor freak show and no one is buying it.

"Why would you feel bad for the fans or a group of people who support a "brilliant musician". Hasn't it always been about the music? Prince's music and live shows have entertained and inspired millions all over the world, for the past 30 years and you feel bad for us? For those who don't like Prince anymore moved on to other artists (I suggest you do the same), and those who still like him stuck around, with varying opinions. Simple as that."

YOu are taking things WAY too literally. I was being sarcastic in some sense. You suggest I move on to other artists? I don't think you like strong dissenting views. It's a obvious emotional flaw you have. Who said I don't like Prince? Again, I am just reacting to what Synthia said and what I agree with. This immature statement "if you don't like it then leave" That's what is funny to me. Most Prince fans who disagree, why do they always go to that?

"Shouldn't you feel bad for those who focus on the garbage they play on the radio and the Britney Spears type stuff, and never had the opportunity to experience Prince's music, or any other artists who are great musicians?"

And there it is,folks. "GARBAGE ON THE RADIO" Another obvious stock statement from a disgruntled fan. Again, do not take things so literally. It's just a reactionary commentary to what Synthia said.



"Your talking out of your ass with gibberish. Based on the fans I have met and responses I have read on the Internet, their experience has gone far beyond Purple Rain, so I don't know where you are getting your information from."

Once again I was not being literal. Im sure there are true fans who aren't there just to be seen. Again, I get into what I really think about is at the heart of why I am not buying it.


"Its funny because it seems that YOU ARE THE ONE focusing on the cliche stage moves and photoshop stuff. All most fans care about is THE MUSIC!!!!!"

I am just observing the reaction of everything this artist does. And the fans reactions, it's really over compensating to a degree I have never seen before. It's fascinating in some sense. The psychological effect Prince has on his fans I think would be a whole other area of an interesting topic.



"Hey, guess what, I think his dance moves are corny too but unlike you I don't believe Prince is doomed because of it and other than the NPGMC, you're going to find differing views on this website as well as HQ."

Wow you are getting emotional over nothing. I don't believe Prince is doomed. I think I will start buying his records again someday. But I havent bought a record since 2001. The fans interest me more than the artist themselves. Is that a crime? I don't think so at all.
I like your honesty of something you dislike about Prince. That shows to me you aren't glazed over about everything he does. I don't think anyone is immune to being transfixed by a particular artist or a particular thing.




A-maz-ing

Why are "older" artists like Bruce Springsteen, Neil Young and Elvis Costello allowed to go wherever their creativity pulls them without consideration for commercial sales while Prince gets raked over the coals when he doesn't outsell teeny boppers? Some artists are given tons of creative freedom while other artists are judged by cash registers. When Prince ventures into jazz, acoustic piano/guitar and thematic concept music there is nothing but criticism for him to stay in his place. Prince's brilliant musical brain could go everywhere if commercial considerations were out of the equation.

jdcxc said:

I think maybe Prince put those commercial expectations on himself. He's always been more of a pop star than Bruce, Elvis, & Neil. Those guys (particularly Bruce) became popular, but they were never the pop packages that Prince was/is. If he wasn't trying so hard to be pop, nobody would care if he wasn't.

NDRU said:

I disagree. It's a matter of popular music marketing. More money has been spent on marketing Bruce Springsteen than any American artist. Millions were dumped into his first few albums to capitalize on his forminable live and underground power. Born in the USA was the pinnacle of this push and it paid off. The difference is that Springsteen is allowed to do side projects with the support of the elitist rock press (Rolling Stone) and Prince gets bashed if he is not the "song and dance man" they want him to be. Black artists are forced to do revue shows, Vegas and other demeaning venues to pay the bills. There is a whole cottage industry that supports the "artistry" of the above mentioned artists. The problem is that P is such a complex artist who befuddles the simple straightforward world of dumbed down 21st century music.

jdcxc said:

I'm not sure where this comes from. Prince can play any music anywhere he wants. The reason Bruce & Neil Young have kept much the same fanbase and same position in the pop world is that they don't take the same chances with their music, then try to play catch up with a mainstream pop record.

Elvis Costello is more comparable to Prince in that he's a star who takes chances, and consequently doesn't consistently sell records.
[Edited 6/27/06 10:39am]

Has this week's chart position been posted anywhere yet? I noticed Mary J. Blige, Ne-Yo and Chris Brown got bumps on the album chart this wek, I assume due to the BET Awards. Was curious how the show affected 3121 even though it's not in the top 100.

Bruce Springsteen's last three albums have been:

1. 9/11 tribute album w/E Street Band, and absolutely NOTHING written to be a single;
2. Solo acoustic "Devils and Dust"; again NO single material whatsoever; and
3. Pete Seeger tribute album; NO material that isn't at least 50 years old, plus there's banjoes on it.

The Boss hasn't made a mainstream rock record in 14 years.

vashti1999 said:

http://www.prince.org/msg/7/194429

RodeoSchro said:

Correct.

I'm not surprised.

His schtick is dated and that was sadly evident on American Idol.

Don't get me wrong, I"m a lunatic fan, but I can look at him realistically.

Since he's dated, nerdy, and desperate in his attempts to be cool (the comb? please), he should not be doing pop anymore, anywhere. He's not in sync with the pop atmosphere, which is always changing and trendy. He behind the trends.

His only chance for survival is rock. Aged rockers can forever make an impact. Steve Tyler will rock until the day he dies -- successfully.

Rock is so wide, raw, big, all encompassing, emotional and reflective ...plus you don't have to do lame dances and other James Brown stuff from the70s you can just play your guitar and look cool.

I hope he stops trying to be all 'down' and defect to the genre that's loved him, missed him, and where he's always been greatest: Rock!
[Edited 6/3/06 7:45am]

SynthiaRose said:

You speak more truth than most care to admit. Prince is desperate for people to pay attention to him. And every time he steps on stage it becomes more apparent.
And why are fans still pretending? I feel bad for Prince that he thinks this is "cool" Only when he takes a turn at a guitar solo, does he truly show he has that department covered. But everything else is a bad exercise in Dinner Theater soul r&B pop. And since the D& P it's progressively gotten worse EXCEPT when in 94/95 Prince decided to do a stripped down "Spontaneous" band with the new N.P.G.

But then after that era he went to back to Vegasville and now it's gotten so gaudy and lame. You know how people make fun of Cher and Madonna? Look at Prince it's the same thing except a brilliant musician is on stage desperate for the spotlight.I feel bad for the fans who cheer this on. It's become a max factor freak show and no one is buying it. You want to make fun of R Kelly or 50 cent? Look at the guy and what lengths goes for applause. They just want to hear him play Purple Rain and jet. And whenever you bring this up what do the sheep fans say? "HE MAKING MONEY" What the hell does that mean?

God Forbid someone point out how cliche his stage moves and props are. Let's not do that and just parrot what prince says about "musicology" and "how today's music has no soul" Instead let's praise him for his generic photo shop over airbrushed shots and boldly declare, "Oh, he looks soooo YOUNG" and "3121 is a masterpiece" and "What a stupendous performance on AI" and after that let's add convulsing happy emoticons to express our joy for such a feat.

Alot of Prince fans have lost so much objectivity. Prince's fan camp isnt going to come take you away and torture you if you have a different take on it.
But yet soooo many have to grandstand it's just sad. Did I miss the part where the fans complimented his crease in his pants? Because if I did link me to that thread.


Did anyone really fall for these "bought and paid for" reviews before the 3121 lp dropped? Because if you did let me get your home phone number because I am going to cold call you and lift you of all your life savings in exchange for a grand state lottery that you just won. Congratulations! I can't believe you won.

A-maz-ing

Why are "older" artists like Bruce Springsteen, Neil Young and Elvis Costello allowed to go wherever their creativity pulls them without consideration for commercial sales while Prince gets raked over the coals when he doesn't outsell teeny boppers? Some artists are given tons of creative freedom while other artists are judged by cash registers. When Prince ventures into jazz, acoustic piano/guitar and thematic concept music there is nothing but criticism for him to stay in his place. Prince's brilliant musical brain could go everywhere if commercial considerations were out of the equation.

SynthiaRose said:

Thank god there's an orger who can see this. I stopped buying P albums years ago, so AI was the 1st time I heard Lolita and it sounded as dated and lame as everything else I've heard from him since NPS. The funny thing is; his old songs (SOTT, WDC, Alphabet Street), today sound as fresh and cool as ever. On AI though, he just seemed like a curious artifact from another time. And those "you're so fine" lyrics were cringe worthy. After 48 years on earth is that all he can think to say?
You're right that the only time Prince is still a cool motherfucker on stage any more (apart from when he's talking) is when he's rocking it with the guitar. And bear in mind I'm a funk and soul fan saying that. I've never listened to rock music. Also, Prince just isn't the dancer he was 15 years ago. The moves now seem half assed and corny. The only hope I can see for making himself seem relevant again would be to focus more on the musicianship and, specifically, the guitar. Some good songs would help too.

SynthiaRose said:

Thank god there's an orger who can see this. I stopped buying P albums years ago, so AI was the 1st time I heard Lolita and it sounded as dated and lame as everything else I've heard from him since NPS. The funny thing is; his old songs (SOTT, WDC, Alphabet Street), today sound as fresh and cool as ever. On AI though, he just seemed like a curious artifact from another time. And those "you're so fine" lyrics were cringe worthy. After 48 years on earth is that all he can think to say?
You're right that the only time Prince is still a cool motherfucker on stage any more (apart from when he's talking) is when he's rocking it with the guitar. And bear in mind I'm a funk and soul fan saying that. I've never listened to rock music. Also, Prince just isn't the dancer he was 15 years ago. The moves now seem half assed and corny. The only hope I can see for making himself seem relevant again would be to focus more on the musicianship and, specifically, the guitar. Some good songs would help too.

whoknows said:

The only problem I have with the above comments is the word 'realistically'. It doesn't seem the right choice of words for the crap that follows.

jdcxc said:

That's just it. Prince doesn't go where his creativity leads him. He's been going round in circles now for well over a decade. Because mainstream music has gone nowhere so neither has he. Read an interview with any of the three artists you mentioned, then read one with Prince. They will talk about their artistic journeys, their new inspirations, etc. Prince will bitch about Soundscan and emphasise what a great profit he makes on every release. When he talks about inspiration he'll still talk about the same people he was listening to 30 years ago; Sly, James, etc. etc. And let me assure you, there's no way on earth you'll find Neil Young hanging out with The Black Eyed Peas, Beyonce and Alicia Fucking Keys.

jdcxc said:

That's just it. Prince doesn't go where his creativity leads him. He's been going round in circles now for well over a decade. Because mainstream music has gone nowhere so neither has he. Read an interview with any of the three artists you mentioned, then read one with Prince. They will talk about their artistic journeys, their new inspirations, etc. Prince will bitch about Soundscan and emphasise what a great profit he makes on every release. When he talks about inspiration he'll still talk about the same people he was listening to 30 years ago; Sly, James, etc. etc. And let me assure you, there's no way on earth you'll find Neil Young hanging out with The Black Eyed Peas, Beyonce and Alicia Fucking Keys.

whoknows said:

Where does all this musical elitism come from? You complain about P going backwards for inspiration but where do Neil Young (Lets reform one of my old groups), Bruce (Pete Seeger anyone?) and the rest of the baby boomer recyclers advance any new musical territory? They have been stealing from Black music idioms for years. Did you know that Rick James taught Neil Young to play the electric guitar? Neil Young could not hang in a band with John Blackwell, Stevie Wonder, Eric Leeds, Miles Davis, Chaka Khan and Sheila E. He's been doing the same two structurally simple songs for years.

Bruce was heralded for fighting his record companies and was not able to record for a couple of years. Neil Young has fought against MTV, commercialism and artists rights. They are idolized for their social and political views. Prince's revolutionary stand against the corporate music industry is derided by you? To question his musical integrity (no commercials, ubiquious movie moments, and defining himself on his on terms) I believe is factually incorrect.