The Billboard 200 shows "3121" jumped up to #79 this week from #117,

WTF???

I expected (obviously incorrectly) a Top 10 rebound for the CD after him being one of the most watched programs in history.

Didn't other Idol "guest stars'" appearance cause HUGE jumps in their album sales?

WTF??

Oh and at what a price...

sro100 said:

All of the Top 20 bumps you've seen from American Idol happened because the artists were "featured' guests on the show...Their music was featured throughout the show on various numbers(Barry Mannilow, Rod Stewart ect....) The AI gig was never going to push the album back to the top 10...What it did however, was made Prince water cooler material....It also gave Prince the platform to launch a new single ("Lolita'), which unfortunately he hasn't so far...The buzz is there...it's just up to the midget to capitalize on it....

murph said:

Prince is short but hes not a midget I think that is so ugly. I'm sorry but I think it is so rude when people call him that

pennylover said:

Yes, technically he's not a quite a midget but, let's face it, if he didn't wear those four inch heels his feet probably wouldn't reach the ground.

pennylover said:

"Murph" always calls Prince a midget. I think it's way to cover up a major insecurity issue "murph" has within himself.

SDNafka said:

Umm, you would have to be the size of a really small child, like under 4 feet for that. He's 5'2.

I'm not surprised.

His schtick is dated and that was sadly evident on American Idol.

Don't get me wrong, I"m a lunatic fan, but I can look at him realistically.

Since he's dated, nerdy, and desperate in his attempts to be cool (the comb? please), he should not be doing pop anymore, anywhere. He's not in sync with the pop atmosphere, which is always changing and trendy. He behind the trends.

His only chance for survival is rock. Aged rockers can forever make an impact. Steve Tyler will rock until the day he dies -- successfully.

Rock is so wide, raw, big, all encompassing, emotional and reflective ...plus you don't have to do lame dances and other James Brown stuff from the70s you can just play your guitar and look cool.

I hope he stops trying to be all 'down' and defect to the genre that's loved him, missed him, and where he's always been greatest: Rock!
[Edited 6/3/06 7:45am]

double post. oops..
[Edited 6/3/06 7:45am]

SynthiaRose said:

I DISAGREE with a lot of this but I would love to hear more ROCK

SynthiaRose said:

This is an interesting idea. I read recently about how classic rock albums are selling really well, and classic rock stations are gaining listeners...most interesting is the fact that teenagers (or younger!) are driving a lot of this. So apparently they don't mind that the artists who created the stuff are now over 25 years of age. Either way, I agree with Jay, I'd love to hear some more rock from him!

SynthiaRose said:

totally agree with you.

i was speaking with a friend of mine the other day about prince (surprise, imagine that!). we are both big fans -- actually we met at the rave new year's taping in 1999 -- but we both agreed that he's over in the pop world. he should stop trying to be "with it" and just make music. communicate through your work and let it touch whom it may.

in the past, hasn't it been his "pop" that hit?

sallysassalot said:

It amazes me how some people have amnesia. Was it not two years ago where Prince based his Musicology tour on the art of music or musicianship, without gimmicks or wild theatrics that you normally see in the pop world? Would you refer to the Musicology tour as Prince trying to be "with it" as you state?

I saw him in March 2006, here in Miami and believe me, he ain't trying to be "with it". The stage was very small and I wish these pop acts today can bring it the way he did that night. If he's over in the pop world as you state "GOOD". Prince has nothing to prove anymore.

wonder505 said:

prince's setlist for his musicology tour was, without a doubt, designed to be "with it." he pulled out a bunch of hits which the casual listener would enjoy hearing. he was out to please and there's nothing wrong with that.

this is not the point some of us were getting at, though. we were stating that his on stage antics and corny ways (ie, pulling the "comb" out, "brushing" his teeth, james brown moves, the corny call outs and all) are old news and a bit short of tired. the fact that you point out what he does right (the incredible musicianship and dedication to wonderful playing) only highlights that which we are saying he does "wrong."

sallysassalot said:

Whoa! Since when did Prince start brushing his teeth on stage? I'd pay to see dat!

Spinlight said:

he doesn't actually brush his teeth. he mimes it...kinda the same thing as with the cigarette bit and the comb bit.

Spinlight said:

OMG You haven't seen this? Be thankful

I can't believe people are conveniently avoiding the reality of his being out-of fashion, and so awkwardly so.

It's the elephant in the room that no one wants to discuss.

I have not met ONE non-Prince fan who thought his AI performance was cool. A young girl at the office called it ridiculous.

And this is why greater numbers aren't moved to buy the album.

SynthiaRose said:

Well Prince has been around for almost 30 years and that is just his style and that's what he likes to do. If you and sallysassalot find it awkward and out of style, out of fashion and out of touch, then don't watch him on TV anymore or no longer go to any of his concerts because that is how he performs. I believe Prince is at the point in his life where you either take him for what he does on stage or keep it moving in your own life. If you find the things he does ridiculous and corny and out of fashion-----why linger around----keep it moving.

murph said:

Agree. If he had a whole show dedicated it would have jumped higher. Shakira was an exception but her song is heavily played on radio and VH1 and Prince is not getting any radio play. A lot of people nowadays think Prince is weird ala MJ and don't understand him or his music. Of course most of them haven't heard anything from him since the early 90's. Face it, people in their teens and twenties even don't have a grasp on how popular he was in the 80's and how talented he actually is. They just know him from his weird outfits, interviews, etc.

sro100 said:

If he makes the album available on iTunes, it can easily sell more copies as there are thousands of iTunes users who buy mainly their albums there and don't have time to go to record stores or will not bother to go to record stores. Prince should release it on iTunes soon!! Really bad decision not to make it available there. Red Hot Chili Peppers' Stadium Arcadium is doing well there!!

wonder505 said:

hey, keep cool, kid. personally, while i do find his act a little corny at times, i enjoy it. i've been along for the ride since i was 6; i'm 29 now and still riding. i can deal with the corny factor because i can see past it. we're here talking about why prince's record didn't jump more on the sales chart after his AI performance, not why we do or don't like prince.

i can enjoy prince's music and live performances without climbing inside his asshole and calling it a home.

SynthiaRose said:

a lot of my friends who are not Prince fanatics thought it was a fun surprise and cool performance! I thought his moves were sharp. I suppose he could bust out more modern moves like he did for the When Doves Cry part of Musicology concerts (usher), but the his little sharp quick moves are cool for his look and suits.

But Prince just playing guitar is a huge turn off to many younger people, they associate that with 80's rock.

if he really, really wanted to surprise everyone today, he should do a song on the drumkit, Don Henley style, with a fro and no eyeliner.

SynthiaRose said:

100% correct.

SynthiaRose said:

interesting viewpoint

SynthiaRose said:

You speak more truth than most care to admit. Prince is desperate for people to pay attention to him. And every time he steps on stage it becomes more apparent.
And why are fans still pretending? I feel bad for Prince that he thinks this is "cool" Only when he takes a turn at a guitar solo, does he truly show he has that department covered. But everything else is a bad exercise in Dinner Theater soul r&B pop. And since the D& P it's progressively gotten worse EXCEPT when in 94/95 Prince decided to do a stripped down "Spontaneous" band with the new N.P.G.

But then after that era he went to back to Vegasville and now it's gotten so gaudy and lame. You know how people make fun of Cher and Madonna? Look at Prince it's the same thing except a brilliant musician is on stage desperate for the spotlight.I feel bad for the fans who cheer this on. It's become a max factor freak show and no one is buying it. You want to make fun of R Kelly or 50 cent? Look at the guy and what lengths goes for applause. They just want to hear him play Purple Rain and jet. And whenever you bring this up what do the sheep fans say? "HE MAKING MONEY" What the hell does that mean?

God Forbid someone point out how cliche his stage moves and props are. Let's not do that and just parrot what prince says about "musicology" and "how today's music has no soul" Instead let's praise him for his generic photo shop over airbrushed shots and boldly declare, "Oh, he looks soooo YOUNG" and "3121 is a masterpiece" and "What a stupendous performance on AI" and after that let's add convulsing happy emoticons to express our joy for such a feat.

Alot of Prince fans have lost so much objectivity. Prince's fan camp isnt going to come take you away and torture you if you have a different take on it.
But yet soooo many have to grandstand it's just sad. Did I miss the part where the fans complimented his crease in his pants? Because if I did link me to that thread.


Did anyone really fall for these "bought and paid for" reviews before the 3121 lp dropped? Because if you did let me get your home phone number because I am going to cold call you and lift you of all your life savings in exchange for a grand state lottery that you just won. Congratulations! I can't believe you won.

A-maz-ing

You speak more truth than most care to admit. Prince is desperate for people to pay attention to him.

If this statement was true then he would be out there over promoting his CDs which he has not done, so I don't understand this statement.

And every time he steps on stage it becomes more apparent.
And why are fans still pretending?

This statement is absurd. Without a doubt Prince gives the most electrying performances on stage. Yes, some shows were bad, but the majority has been good. How he arranges his music, play different melodies, instruments, make the guitar cry, I'm talking about the art of musicianship, what your talking about is silly/petty stuff that nobody cares about.

I feel bad for Prince that he thinks this is "cool"

I think its pathetic that you would "feel bad" how another person feel about themself. If Prince thinks he is cool then that is his business, not yours. What do you care? If it makes Prince happy, regardless of what people think then who cares? I think I'm cool, and I'm sure there are people who think that I'm not. Why the hell should I give a f*ck what other people think.

Only when he takes a turn at a guitar solo, does he truly show he has that department covered. But everything else is a bad exercise in Dinner Theater soul r&B pop. And since the D& P it's progressively gotten worse EXCEPT when in 94/95 Prince decided to do a stripped down "Spontaneous" band with the new N.P.G.

That is your opinion and I respect that, but after seeing how live here in Miami back in March I still believe he is a great performer. Some don't and that's okay.

But then after that era he went to back to Vegasville and now it's gotten so gaudy and lame. You know how people make fun of Cher and Madonna?

If you are a fan of someone's music, you are not going to care who wants to make fun of them or not. How lame would it be, if I were to turn away from Prince's music, not because I don't like it anymore, but because someone made fun of him. How immature is that?

Look at Prince it's the same thing except a brilliant musician is on stage desperate for the spotlight.

Prince does not over promote himself like most artist do today so and I don't understand where you are getting this "desperate" stuff from, and if he is on stage, the spotlight is going to be on him, so what?

I feel bad for the fans who cheer this on. It's become a max factor freak show and no one is buying it.

Why would you feel bad for the fans or a group of people who support a "brilliant musician". Hasn't it always been about the music? Prince's music and live shows have entertained and inspired millions all over the world, for the past 30 years and you feel bad for us? For those who don't like Prince anymore moved on to other artists (I suggest you do the same), and those who still like him stuck around, with varying opinions. Simple as that.

Shouldn't you feel bad for those who focus on the garbage they play on the radio and the Britney Spears type stuff, and never had the opportunity to experience Prince's music, or any other artists who are great musicians?

You want to make fun of R Kelly or 50 cent? Look at the guy and what lengths goes for applause. They just want to hear him play Purple Rain and jet. And whenever you bring this up what do the sheep fans say? "HE MAKING MONEY" What the hell does that mean?

Your talking out of your ass with gibberish. Based on the fans I have met and responses I have read on the Internet, their experience has gone far beyond Purple Rain, so I don't know where you are getting your information from.

God Forbid someone point out how cliche his stage moves and props are. Let's not do that and just parrot what prince says about "musicology" and "how today's music has no soul" Instead let's praise him for his generic photo shop over airbrushed shots and boldly declare, "Oh, he looks soooo YOUNG" and "3121 is a masterpiece" and "What a stupendous performance on AI" and after that let's add convulsing happy emoticons to express our joy for such a feat.

Its funny because it seems that YOU ARE THE ONE focusing on the cliche stage moves and photoshop stuff. All most fans care about is THE MUSIC!!!!!


Alot of Prince fans have lost so much objectivity. Prince's fan camp isnt going to come take you away and torture you if you have a different take on it.
But yet soooo many have to grandstand it's just sad. Did I miss the part where the fans complimented his crease in his pants? Because if I did link me to that thread.

Hey, guess what, I think his dance moves are corny too but unlike you I don't believe Prince is doomed because of it and other than the NPGMC, you're going to find differing views on this website as well as HQ.

Did anyone really fall for these "bought and paid for" reviews before the 3121 lp dropped? Because if you did let me get your home phone number because I am going to cold call you and lift you of all your life savings in exchange for a grand state lottery that you just won. Congratulations! I can't believe you won.

A-maz-ing[/quote]

The majority of the responses, both good AND bad, has been from people who have listened to the CD themselves. If you have evidence that fans stated that they liked it or hated because of what a critic said then I will like for you to prove that. Other than that you're just talking out of your ass...again.
[Edited 6/7/06 16:30pm]
[Edited 6/7/06 16:32pm]

You speak more truth than most care to admit. Prince is desperate for people to pay attention to him.

"If this statement was true then he would be out there over promoting his CDs which he has not done, so I don't understand this statement."

It's perspective,wonder. Let's not play that game. Look at the over glossed photos and the flash ad's and the self congratulatory "My new single it's another EVENT" It's desperation,plain and simple. Why is he not promoting everywhere? He went on A.I. for attention for a sub par performance.



And every time he steps on stage it becomes more apparent.
And why are fans still pretending?

"This statement is absurd. Without a doubt Prince gives the most electrying performances on stage. Yes, some shows were bad, but the majority has been good. How he arranges his music, play different melodies, instruments, make the guitar cry, I'm talking about the art of musicianship, what your talking about is silly/petty stuff that nobody cares about."

You are missing the point,Wonder. It's this pandering for applause and if you can't see it then just watch his actions on stage . You can see it in his damne eyes. It screams, "please applaud" It reminds me of Cher or Celine Dion. Except it's Celine Dion with a telecaster. Seriously, don't look at this as a personal attack. Look at as a opinionated observation. This is the Judy Garland Syndrome and Prince suffers from it. Hence why he went on A.I. He is addicted to hearing applause even if it's staged.



"I think its pathetic that you would "feel bad" how another person feel about themself. If Prince thinks he is cool then that is his business, not yours. What do you care? If it makes Prince happy, regardless of what people think then who cares? I think I'm cool, and I'm sure there are people who think that I'm not. Why the hell should I give a f*ck what other people think."

You are getting overt- emotional Wonder. Anyone is allowed to critique and that's what Im doing after SynthiaRose has added in her 2 cents. Your voice is no less valid than mine. No Matter what kind of tone you answer to me. I still think it's bad theater.


"If you are a fan of someone's music, you are not going to care who wants to make fun of them or not. How lame would it be, if I were to turn away from Prince's music, not because I don't like it anymore, but because someone made fun of him. How immature is that?"

Im not saying to turn away from his music. I am stating that most fans for example on "Amazon" lose all objectivity and applaud everything he does.
It's almost like they think they will be eternally hexed if they say, "You know this album really isn't anything to give 4 stars to." Instead what happens? People slam amazon with over pandering reviews of 5 stars and applaud every little sickening thing. It's almost like you are reading zombified thoughts.


"Prince does not over promote himself like most artist do today so and I don't understand where you are getting this "desperate" stuff from, and if he is on stage, the spotlight is going to be on him, so what?"

Desperate as in "What can I do to get the media to pay attention to me"
Desperate like that. He's like a mini Paris Hilton now. "I have to be seen and people have to talk about me even if there really isnt a event" His legacy is in tact. "So what'? It's a view on why I think Prince behaves like this. And that's all it is.





I feel bad for the fans who cheer this on. It's become a max factor freak show and no one is buying it.

"Why would you feel bad for the fans or a group of people who support a "brilliant musician". Hasn't it always been about the music? Prince's music and live shows have entertained and inspired millions all over the world, for the past 30 years and you feel bad for us? For those who don't like Prince anymore moved on to other artists (I suggest you do the same), and those who still like him stuck around, with varying opinions. Simple as that."

YOu are taking things WAY too literally. I was being sarcastic in some sense. You suggest I move on to other artists? I don't think you like strong dissenting views. It's a obvious emotional flaw you have. Who said I don't like Prince? Again, I am just reacting to what Synthia said and what I agree with. This immature statement "if you don't like it then leave" That's what is funny to me. Most Prince fans who disagree, why do they always go to that?

"Shouldn't you feel bad for those who focus on the garbage they play on the radio and the Britney Spears type stuff, and never had the opportunity to experience Prince's music, or any other artists who are great musicians?"

And there it is,folks. "GARBAGE ON THE RADIO" Another obvious stock statement from a disgruntled fan. Again, do not take things so literally. It's just a reactionary commentary to what Synthia said.



"Your talking out of your ass with gibberish. Based on the fans I have met and responses I have read on the Internet, their experience has gone far beyond Purple Rain, so I don't know where you are getting your information from."

Once again I was not being literal. Im sure there are true fans who aren't there just to be seen. Again, I get into what I really think about is at the heart of why I am not buying it.


"Its funny because it seems that YOU ARE THE ONE focusing on the cliche stage moves and photoshop stuff. All most fans care about is THE MUSIC!!!!!"

I am just observing the reaction of everything this artist does. And the fans reactions, it's really over compensating to a degree I have never seen before. It's fascinating in some sense. The psychological effect Prince has on his fans I think would be a whole other area of an interesting topic.



"Hey, guess what, I think his dance moves are corny too but unlike you I don't believe Prince is doomed because of it and other than the NPGMC, you're going to find differing views on this website as well as HQ."

Wow you are getting emotional over nothing. I don't believe Prince is doomed. I think I will start buying his records again someday. But I havent bought a record since 2001. The fans interest me more than the artist themselves. Is that a crime? I don't think so at all.
I like your honesty of something you dislike about Prince. That shows to me you aren't glazed over about everything he does. I don't think anyone is immune to being transfixed by a particular artist or a particular thing.




A-maz-ing[/quote]

"The majority of the responses, both good AND bad, has been from people who have listened to the CD themselves. If you have evidence that fans stated that they liked it or hated because of what a critic said then I will like for you to prove that. Other than that you're just talking out of your ass...again."


I am just talking out of my ass? Your opinion just like my response in this post. You responsed to me in depth on every point I made. Over a response I made to a particular poster. That's what I thought when I wrote it. Do I really feel that way? I was being sarcastic and partly I was pointing out the hilarity of just being the over the top about everything an artist does. And quite frankly, I don't think that benefits a artist. But that's a whole different discussion for a different time.

There's no reason to get emotional if you are. WHat SynthiaRose resonated alot in my feelings why I haven't been spinning Prince's recent material. And you have given me a idea to post about why I think that may be.


There is no right or wrong answer when it comes to your individual perspective. It's at that moment that you feel that way. Who is to say how tommorrow you will feel? I have no idea.

I really have to chuckle when I hear "If you don't like it leave"
That is "New Power" priceless. What's not to like?

Thanks for the response anyways.

Trickology said:

If sounding like a bitter fan, be it that you're a fan at all, is being objective, then I won't have any of that. Being a fan is being able to look at the good and the bad and accepting it all, otherwise I wouldn't be a fan in the first place. He's got you like it's cool cause you're here. I mean WTF. Public forum or not, I'm just wondering.
[Edited 6/8/06 7:10am]