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Printablemschirmer said: I agree fully.
The production sucks. In fact the record has the production quality of a kids record. The synths are not at all worthy of using the word "Synth" to explain the sound. I'm not sure what planet he's on, but clearly the man doesn't take any advice from anyone but himself. Prince hasn't had a professionally produced sounding record since Batman. The music sounds amature at best. "Fury" is being hailed as a throwback to classic Prince, but even Rollingstone says that it's close, but no cigar. The reality is that Prince's music is what it is today and it hasn't really been great since the late 80's. Most of his recordings have bee pretty forgettable. It's probably the most tragic thing I've experienced in my life as a music fan. Prince changed my life in the 80's and truly gave me the gift of really great art. His stuff is canned now. It's not art. Art is the cover of Around The World In a Day and the complex, abstract, and amazing writing that went along with it. Art is the photograpy on Sign O the Times and the music that had social, political and cultural value that his music doesn't have today. Purple Rain defined perfection of this art form. 1999's sound paved the way for a lot of the dance music you hear today. All The Critics Love You In New York was an early hint to house music. Today you have "3121". The cover artwork is cheesy at best. The back cover, fonts, and layout is second rate. The lyrics are bad and the style is forced. I don't think Prince will ever make an amazing record ever again. There has been one disappointment after the next. It's seriously tragic. He's good live, but that's if he actually plays his own songs and if he plays more than 20 seconds of a song. God! Please find Prince and give him back! Drama queen. | |
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calldapplwondery83 said: mschirmer said: I agree fully.
The production sucks. In fact the record has the production quality of a kids record. The synths are not at all worthy of using the word "Synth" to explain the sound. I'm not sure what planet he's on, but clearly the man doesn't take any advice from anyone but himself. Prince hasn't had a professionally produced sounding record since Batman. The music sounds amature at best. "Fury" is being hailed as a throwback to classic Prince, but even Rollingstone says that it's close, but no cigar. The reality is that Prince's music is what it is today and it hasn't really been great since the late 80's. Most of his recordings have bee pretty forgettable. It's probably the most tragic thing I've experienced in my life as a music fan. Prince changed my life in the 80's and truly gave me the gift of really great art. His stuff is canned now. It's not art. Art is the cover of Around The World In a Day and the complex, abstract, and amazing writing that went along with it. Art is the photograpy on Sign O the Times and the music that had social, political and cultural value that his music doesn't have today. Purple Rain defined perfection of this art form. 1999's sound paved the way for a lot of the dance music you hear today. All The Critics Love You In New York was an early hint to house music. Today you have "3121". The cover artwork is cheesy at best. The back cover, fonts, and layout is second rate. The lyrics are bad and the style is forced. I don't think Prince will ever make an amazing record ever again. There has been one disappointment after the next. It's seriously tragic. He's good live, but that's if he actually plays his own songs and if he plays more than 20 seconds of a song. God! Please find Prince and give him back! Drama queen. haha i was agreeing with you on a few points but you lost me in the end bit you must really miss your childhood days, 
we all change i guess would you write a diary entry and feel the same way about it 20 years later and after reading it over 500 times.. hell no haha You saw the apple
hanging on the tree, But missed the orchid in your gaze | |
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The artwork is awful and cheap looking.
I've listened to this album a few times now and I'm beginning to re-evaluate "New Power Soul"... | |
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jjam said: The artwork is awful and cheap looking.
I've listened to this album a few times now and I'm beginning to re-evaluate "New Power Soul"... what's the art got to do with the mixing of the music?  | |
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Okay, I'm going to break it down for you to just one very simple explanation: Modern hi-fi systems are quite different from each other these days - this wasn't necessarily the case 10-20 years ago as everybody was still attempting to produce a "neutral sound", but these days even the cheapest systems have "mega-bass", "ultra-bass", "hypno-bass" and whatnot. The fact that modern records have more low-end is accomplished by utilizing harmonic synthesizer programs that take up a bass sound and potentially divide it into subharmonies - hence the fuller, more effective sound in the low-end. The sizzling treble effect on many of the systems I've had the displeasure to listen to at friends' houses has been nothing else than an artificial distortion effect. The high-ends are augmented by using same kind of harmonic variants that are one type of extrafluous distortion as well. Everything adds up, potentially.
Now, some systems emphasize strongly different frequency ranges and also speaker placement in the room matters a great deal. This cannot be fought any other way during the mixing stage than compressing the hell out of the full mix - leaving as little dynamic variation as possible. Prince doesn't go for that, and he's right - he shouldn't. He wants to make music, not toothpaste. If the mix hasn't been very carefully reduced to today's mainstream popular music standards, some elements will stand out more in some other systems while others will not be as audible as they should. "3121" has its issues on the production side as well, but you should always take into account that the impact of your own playback system affects the sound in some cases more than you could ever think it would. | |
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funkii said: calldapplwondery83 said: Drama queen. haha i was agreeing with you on a few points but you lost me in the end bit you must really miss your childhood days,
we all change i guess would you write a diary entry and feel the same way about it 20 years later and after reading it over 500 times.. hell no haha I don't miss my childhood. I miss good Prince music. | |
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Novabreaker said: Okay, I'm going to break it down for you to just one very simple explanation: Modern hi-fi systems are quite different from each other these days - this wasn't necessarily the case 10-20 years ago as everybody was still attempting to produce a "neutral sound", but these days even the cheapest systems have "mega-bass", "ultra-bass", "hypno-bass" and whatnot. The fact that modern records have more low-end is accomplished by utilizing harmonic synthesizer programs that take up a bass sound and potentially divide it into subharmonies - hence the fuller, more effective sound in the low-end. The sizzling treble effect on many of the systems I've had the displeasure to listen to at friends' houses has been nothing else than an artificial distortion effect. The high-ends are augmented by using same kind of harmonic variants that are one type of extrafluous distortion as well. Everything adds up, potentially.
Now, some systems emphasize strongly different frequency ranges and also speaker placement in the room matters a great deal. This cannot be fought any other way during the mixing stage than compressing the hell out of the full mix - leaving as little dynamic variation as possible. Prince doesn't go for that, and he's right - he shouldn't. He wants to make music, not toothpaste. If the mix hasn't been very carefully reduced to today's mainstream popular music standards, some elements will stand out more in some other systems while others will not be as audible as they should. "3121" has its issues on the production side as well, but you should always take into account that the impact of your own playback system affects the sound in some cases more than you could ever think it would. I don't buy that. I've listened to great records on shitty sound systems before and they are still great records.Yes, good sound is key and it's a neccessary luxury for this Prince fan, but a good soundsystem isn't going to fix 3121. Sorry, It's flawed in ways no speaker is going to fix. | |
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mschirmer said: I don't buy that. I've listened to great records on shitty sound systems before and they are still great records.Yes, good sound is key and it's a neccessary luxury for this Prince fan, but a good soundsystem isn't going to fix 3121. Sorry, It's flawed in ways no speaker is going to fix. 100% true  | |
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My comment about the artwork was merely an addendum. But the artwork is as cheap as the mix sounds. If I didn't know any better, I'd swear that this had been mixed at home using a knackered pair of small monitor speakers. | |
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mschirmer said: Novabreaker said: Okay, I'm going to break it down for you to just one very simple explanation: Modern hi-fi systems are quite different from each other these days - this wasn't necessarily the case 10-20 years ago as everybody was still attempting to produce a "neutral sound", but these days even the cheapest systems have "mega-bass", "ultra-bass", "hypno-bass" and whatnot. The fact that modern records have more low-end is accomplished by utilizing harmonic synthesizer programs that take up a bass sound and potentially divide it into subharmonies - hence the fuller, more effective sound in the low-end. The sizzling treble effect on many of the systems I've had the displeasure to listen to at friends' houses has been nothing else than an artificial distortion effect. The high-ends are augmented by using same kind of harmonic variants that are one type of extrafluous distortion as well. Everything adds up, potentially.
Now, some systems emphasize strongly different frequency ranges and also speaker placement in the room matters a great deal. This cannot be fought any other way during the mixing stage than compressing the hell out of the full mix - leaving as little dynamic variation as possible. Prince doesn't go for that, and he's right - he shouldn't. He wants to make music, not toothpaste. If the mix hasn't been very carefully reduced to today's mainstream popular music standards, some elements will stand out more in some other systems while others will not be as audible as they should. "3121" has its issues on the production side as well, but you should always take into account that the impact of your own playback system affects the sound in some cases more than you could ever think it would. I don't buy that. I've listened to great records on shitty sound systems before and they are still great records.Yes, good sound is key and it's a neccessary luxury for this Prince fan, but a good soundsystem isn't going to fix 3121. Sorry, It's flawed in ways no speaker is going to fix. You both may be right. I got some new sony speakers in my car, and I can barely listen to anything on them without adjusting the eq. Everything has extreme high end, even with 10k turned down -4db. Makes no sense. They weren't that cheap either. Perhaps that's why Black Sweat hurts my ears. Then I go home and everything sounds great on my 20 year old speakers. My Legacy
http://prince.org/msg/8/192731 | |
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Novabreaker said: Okay, I'm going to break it down for you to just one very simple explanation: Modern hi-fi systems are quite different from each other these days - this wasn't necessarily the case 10-20 years ago as everybody was still attempting to produce a "neutral sound", but these days even the cheapest systems have "mega-bass", "ultra-bass", "hypno-bass" and whatnot. The fact that modern records have more low-end is accomplished by utilizing harmonic synthesizer programs that take up a bass sound and potentially divide it into subharmonies - hence the fuller, more effective sound in the low-end. The sizzling treble effect on many of the systems I've had the displeasure to listen to at friends' houses has been nothing else than an artificial distortion effect. The high-ends are augmented by using same kind of harmonic variants that are one type of extrafluous distortion as well. Everything adds up, potentially.
Now, some systems emphasize strongly different frequency ranges and also speaker placement in the room matters a great deal. This cannot be fought any other way during the mixing stage than compressing the hell out of the full mix - leaving as little dynamic variation as possible. Prince doesn't go for that, and he's right - he shouldn't. He wants to make music, not toothpaste. If the mix hasn't been very carefully reduced to today's mainstream popular music standards, some elements will stand out more in some other systems while others will not be as audible as they should. "3121" has its issues on the production side as well, but you should always take into account that the impact of your own playback system affects the sound in some cases more than you could ever think it would. I listen on a denon receiver that is flat (no eq adjustment) and on an NHT speaker system with a subwoofer that has its own amp and is turned only to a natural level. okay but really I listen more in my 2004 HOnda accord which has an incredible sounding factory system.... it also sounds very natural. My art book: http://www.lulu.com/spotl...ecomicskid
VIDEO WORK: http://sharadkantpatel.com MUSIC: https://soundcloud.com/ufoclub1977 | |
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mschirmer said: I don't buy that. I've listened to great records on shitty sound systems before and they are still great records. You don't seem to understand what I am saying. There is no foolproof way to mix any record these days (according to current production standards) so that it would sound even mix-wise identical on different soundsystems. | |
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I agree with Novabreaker's comments. Just try to listen to Outkast on a high fidelity system. It just sounds compressed and barely audible. Prince doesn't tweak the sound this way and it's mostly a good thing (except when radio broadcasted).
Regarding the production value, I disagree pretty much with a lot of what has been written here: his pre-1988 production is quite mediocre (just listen to Parade or SOT on a great sound system, it's very weak). The sound got better from Batman.IMHO, TRC & NEWS sound absolutly flawless on a great hifi system! ONA piano is also very good, with a stripped-down production. Musicology sounds as if it was rushed: the sound is not consistent with good contribution (such as the organic sound on Dear Mr Man). 3121 sounds actually sounds much better to me. | |
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