Universaluv said:

really good points, but i can't tell ya how much a good remasters series has brought me into the fold with other artists. bowie's 'sound+vision' series by ryko was HUGELY influential in making me a bowie fan. the recent eurythmics remasters have helped me appreciate their music in a whole new way. remasters revitalize an artist's back catalog and bring in a whole new audience for the stuff that artist is doing in the here and now. i already know that the 'for you' album exists...it should be repackaged for a whole new wave of folks who didn't even know he made music before 1982. i'm sure the results won't be HUGE, but i bet it would sell more than N.E.W.S.

So, you know, okay...we fans get our panties all tied in a knot over all the unreleased stuff he has in The Vault and we want to see all his old albums remastered and reissued with pretty packaging and bonus tracks and the works, and whenever he is approached with this, or whenever people bellyache about it at NPGMC, the response is always the same kind of thing:

"Prince B-leaves in MOOving 4ward - Y dwell on D past???"

And, well, okay. Okay, Prince. I'm with ya there. The guy's an artist and a prolific one at that, and even if I'm not 100% as on track with what he's doing these days as I used to be, I'd rather he keep following his muse. Fine. Great. Love it.

But WAIT A NOSE-PICKIN' MINUTE!!!!

Dude's been paying homage to James Brown and Carlos Santana and Sly & the Family Stone and all the stuff from his past since when...at least since the Emancipation album??? (and of course, there have been nods all through his career...I'm talking about literal homages here...cover versions...working with veteran soul musicians...stuff like that...not just dancing like JB and shouting "goodgod!" )

Tell me the Musicology tour wasn't one big wish fulfillment fantasy come true for Prince, in that he finally got to have his James Brown soul revue with himself as the Godfather of Soul (which of course the Purple Rain tour could arguably have been as well). And the entire tour and album concept was about looking back!

And, well, okay, Prince. That's cool too. But just as the glory days of James and Sly and classic R&B are the things that matter to Prince as a music fan, there are MANY of us who look to Prince's classic music as what matters to US as music fans.

Sooo....that brings us back to wanting to see that classic Prince material being brushed off and remastered, and wanting all the Vault treasures brought into the world of legitimacy. If he wants us to move forward as people who follow him, shouldn't he be setting an example instead of constantly referring to his own retro fixations?

Anyway. It's no huge thing. God bless him and all. Just a little mental bugbear.
[Edited 1/24/06 7:16am]

Anx said:

Well, i think the answer is evident...Prince is no different from any other aging music artist...When you have been on the cutting edge and so in-your-face throughout much of your career, what's the most logical next step? You go back to your roots; you go back to what made you want to record music in the first place...For Prince, this is his way of doing something entirely different: By being normal.As much as us fans don't like to admit it, Prince is human, y'all...It's the same thing as Bruce Springsteen making a folk album...We all look back at the past sooner or later...It happens people...
[Edited 1/24/06 20:19pm]

So, you know, okay...we fans get our panties all tied in a knot over all the unreleased stuff he has in The Vault and we want to see all his old albums remastered and reissued with pretty packaging and bonus tracks and the works, and whenever he is approached with this, or whenever people bellyache about it at NPGMC, the response is always the same kind of thing:

"Prince B-leaves in MOOving 4ward - Y dwell on D past???"

It's a tricky subject, because many Prince fans seem to not want to look back with Prince, but keep looking back AT Prince, wishing he'd _____ like he used to. The fact is, Prince IS moving forward in his own way, and that has bothered some people since 1985.

The problem any artist with a past has is the expectations their past creates. If people could stop comparing each album to the highest concept of Prince in their minds, they might like what he does.

andyman91 said:

yeah, but as a james brown fan, isn't he doing the same thing he's wanting his own fans not to do to him?

andyman91 said:

yeah, but as a james brown fan, isn't he doing the same thing he's wanting his own fans not to do to him?

Posthumous said:

I see what you're saying & agree to a large extent. I just think an artist like Prince can be viewed many ways. I don't think Prince has ever really abandoned his own past. He's played the hits at every show I've been to. But you're right, he doesn't really address the past in interviews or new recordings (or new releases of old recordings).

So at the show, he plays his hits and encourages us to explore the past. But on record, he wants to move forward. His way of moving forward just happens to include looking back to his influences. But he's always looked back, it was just harder to see back then. Jack U Off, Housequake, Delerious, Girl of My Dreams, even Tambourine all look back to past styles.

Beatles influence is blatantly all over ATWIAD

Universaluv said:

did you expect it? and did it get beat to death over the years?

I'm wondering if there's not some good ol' days syndrome going on here about Prince and his influences. Go back and read some reviews of the classic albums and all you read is Hendrix this, Santana that, James Brown here, Parliament there. Thing is Prince's spin on all of that was new at the time. Now Prince's spin on all of that is familiar.

I'm wondering if there's not some good ol' days syndrome going on here about Prince and his influences. Go back and read some reviews of the classic albums and all you read is Hendrix this, Santana that, James Brown here, Parliament there. Thing is Prince's spin on all of that was new at the time. Now Prince's spin on all of that is familiar.

Universaluv said:

ok, let me bounce this sucker back into my true intention:

we can dissect every single prince song on this thread until nothing is left but some pocket lint and a handful of moist glitter, but that's not necessarily the point i was originally working at.

what i was saying at the beginning of this thread was, i think it's a little bothersome when we get messages from prince's camp to the tune of "let's not live in the past, let's move forward" when it comes to remasters or vault releases, though all we've heard from him since his big (not-a) "comeback" have been shouts to the glories of HIS past. "reflection". "old skool joints". so on.

it seems like his whole musical vocabulary is very safely nestled in classic R&B anymore, which is fine - i mean, the guy's paid his dues, let him do whatever the hell he wants - but i don't think fans should have to feel like material from HIS past should be a no-no to want because it's "looking back". if he can look back, so can we. prince is to most of us as james and sly are to him. that's what i'm getting at.

Also I don't think all of TRC or Musicology is "safely nestled in classic R&B"

Universaluv said:

ok, let me bounce this sucker back into my true intention:

we can dissect every single prince song on this thread until nothing is left but some pocket lint and a handful of moist glitter, but that's not necessarily the point i was originally working at.

what i was saying at the beginning of this thread was, i think it's a little bothersome when we get messages from prince's camp to the tune of "let's not live in the past, let's move forward" when it comes to remasters or vault releases, though all we've heard from him since his big (not-a) "comeback" have been shouts to the glories of HIS past. "reflection". "old skool joints". so on.

it seems like his whole musical vocabulary is very safely nestled in classic R&B anymore, which is fine - i mean, the guy's paid his dues, let him do whatever the hell he wants - but i don't think fans should have to feel like material from HIS past should be a no-no to want because it's "looking back". if he can look back, so can we. prince is to most of us as james and sly are to him. that's what i'm getting at.

andyman91 said:

musicology? i liked it, but it was empty calories because it was so derivative from beginning to end. i can listen to it all the way through, but nothing on there is anything i'd consider a favorite by a long stretch.

Posthumous said:

Sure, but "classic R&B?" only a couple songs, really.

2. I also agree that Prince has as of late heralded the "old school" as the paragon of musicology (how music should be done). However, Prince needs to realize that HIS fans would rather have Prince's old school (1982ish) than James's, Sly's, or anyone else's old school. I like me some 70's funk, but Prince, if you are going to go old school, go 1982 not 197whatever. Do your own sound boy.[/b]
[Edited 1/25/06 13:11pm]

Posthumous said:

Ah grasshopper, I see. The hypocrisy of it all is so disturbing. Well, yeah he is inconsistent.

So let's imagine that Prince decides to take us up on the whole remastering/reissuing, releasing from the vault thing. He could stand back and let others do the heavy lifting, but that would be out of character. More likely he'd want to be heavily involved in the process.

I figure with his personality about a week into working on the new and improved For You, the Prince we think we know says to himself "Screw this, there are about 20 new songs I'd rather be working right now". Remember that whole "I'm gonna re-record my entire catalog" business? We got a new crappy version of 1999 and he was back to making new music.

Now I'm not saying it shouldn't happen, or it won't ever happen. It should, and I beleive eventually it will. But as long as he's got record companies and fans interested in his new stuff, I think his primary focus will be on making new music. Even if it's new music that's reminiscent of his old stuff.



obligatoryedit
[Edited 1/25/06 13:11pm]

skywalker said:

In 1985 he went back to 196whatever and a good portion of the fanbase (i.e. not vainandy) loves him for it.

Universaluv said:

Yeah, but it wasn't EXACTLY 196whatever. It was Prince's spin on it. One could argue that "Musicology" is much more STRAIGHT UP James than "ATWIAD" was straight up The Beatles. I mean, ATWIAD was Prince using the MPLS sound to revisit the Paisley 60's. However, jams like "The Work Pt 1" could literally BE James Brown joint.

Universaluv said:

Yeah, but it wasn't EXACTLY 196whatever. It was Prince's spin on it. One could argue that "Musicology" is much more STRAIGHT UP James than "ATWIAD" was straight up The Beatles. I mean, ATWIAD was Prince using the MPLS sound to revisit the Paisley 60's. However, jams like "The Work Pt 1" could literally BE James Brown joint.

ok, well, that IS certainly a valid scenario. but let's look at some stuff that's going on now, just for kicks.

prince has all but removed himself from the art direction of his albums. i'm sure he has a vague concept and some broad standards, but it's not his thing anymore - he leaves it to other people. same with the club. how involved do you think he is with the way things are marketed at NPGMC? the downloads, the way news is handled, the promotional campaigns? i'm sure he gets last look, but these days, it's more about him trusting people who he thinks are capable, and if he sees money at the end of the day, then they must be doing their jobs. period.

so with a remaster/reissue series, i'm sure he'd be way more hands-on than with, say, a new album cover or a new download release - certainly so, hopefully so - but i think he has gotten to a point where he's willing to give up more decision-making power than he has in the past, as long as the bottom line remains positive for him.

just my speculation based on what little i've observed.

Yeah well, ATWIAD and Paisley Park would easily fit in the Beatles catalog.