Universaluv said:

There's your answer. It hurt Prince monetarily, but not artistically. The whole world was mimicking Prince when he changed his sound. If he had put out one more album of Minneapolis Sound hits, he would've been rolling in the dough. But the critics would've labeled him a one-trick pony. By changing up, Prince had actually guaranteed longevity in the industry. He's a legend now as opposed to a pop star.

I love Aerosmith. But they're basically making the same record over and over again. The Beatles and Prince have one thing in common: evolution! How many other artists can say that?

7salles said:

Your attention would have been held even if he did his formula thing or went higher. You didn't enter with parade and go "wow!" did you?

And I dont know anyones mind for fact but I really dont think people back then were going "I wonder how different Prince wil sound next year or what direction he will go in yay!" NMost were just waiting to hear it drop and not expecting the somber let down of ATWIAD and Parade...both quiet albums. Thats why SOTT was the shot of life for all fans and him included. And it was heralded as such.

SOTT was captioned in a quicky as "Prince retruns to his senses"

amo84 said:

So him following where his potential to take it even higher is not making music for himself either? Nobody has denied he shouldn't have pleased himself first. But if he continued on in his momentum does not equate pandering or denying artistic growth. Again I say if he continued he could have takin that "future shock funk" and did a lot of credible things with it as well. Just as he did with old soul.Thats what I am saying. Cool your jets. There is no telling what he could have become if he did it differently and not exactly by the book, but not exactly thrwoing the book away either. Its obvious when he did throw some pages of the book away, he lagged momentum and THE one wise.

Musicology tour numbers could have been forever (even though he claimssss he didn't want that lol)

vainandy said:

Thank you!





I must admit I hated PR. I remember the events leading to picking it up at Licorice Pizza and where we were having a listening session. And I hated it. It was a "what the fuck is this?" experience. Dont get me wrong, later I came to dig it much hard. But i can see where he dropped the ball on this one and if it wasn't for the movie I don't think it would be th e monster it was making all these fans. And some complain that "he did what his heart told him by not follwoing formula! he had to please himself!" are full of it because with Purple Rain he "changed his formula" AND sold out! He still was able to keep his artistic vision but any sane fan knows he done had watered down his ribald sexuality and PURPOSEFULLY made easy listening pop hits for mass consumption. he had to broaden his audience and he did it by going real pop with I Would Die 4 U, rock anthem with title track and C Blue, more silly pop with Take Me With U, and damn near vegas with baby Im A Star.

I mean come on...dude made Dirty Mind, Lets Pretend Were Married, All The Critics, Lady Cab driver and here this mutherfucker is later singing ..."take me with u"

please dont even try the "he went in different direction for diversity and for credibility" argument cause some dont realize he caught u with bullshittin himself and the audience.

Thank u goodnight





And he has twice made mention to the follow-up to 1999 and in 1985 how "easy it would be to have done that next" meaning he knows that he could have been more succesful doing that. He admitted it himself twice: in the 1985 Rolling Stone interview and teased us with that in the 1999 MTV Rave Kurt Loder interview. So even Prince knows he could have been more succesful forgoing that 180 bs.


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[Edited 11/19/05 9:18am]

"The change also almost buried him in the R&B world which he was on top of before the change. He went from being the baddest thing on R&B radio to the biggest joke on R&B radio. DJs in my area were having a field day playing snips of "Do U Lie" and asking callers to call in and answer the question "What the hell happened to him?"

I wouldnt doubt that this scenario happened but black folk will ALWYS support Prince if not simply for his ballads. Also, if indeed that happened, that is a sad statement on that dj. Some of us(black folks) can be SO narrow minded musically(among other things) and I think it is SAD that the dj wold do what you said he did SIMPLY cuz Prince was challenging folk musically. How DARE Prince (or any one else for that matter) ask us to think or be open minded

So PRINCE CHALLENGES HIMSELF BY CHANGING DIRECTIONS/CREATING NEW MUSIC and THEREFORE CALLENGES HIS FANS/ MUSIC WORLD. This is the STROKE of a TRUE MUSICIAN and NOT a SELL OUT ACTUALLY,Cause PRINCE KNOWS WHAT POP DITTY WILL SELL. He CAN PUT out BUBBLEGUM CRAP FOREVER with NO SUBSTANCE IF HE WANTED TO!

Zelaira said:

I think Prince did the right thing by revamping his sound after PURPLE RAIN. Who are we to make demands on his music? I'm sorry but I dont think that if Prince would have continued to do the "Controversy" album over and over ,his true genius would be realized. I dont think HE would be satisfied with that so he did the right thing. Who cares about record sales and #1's? Thats the problem with that industry right now

LoveAlive said:

Black people are open-minded. But that beginning of Do U Lie is corny laughable as hell. I remember a friend hearing it come on as we drove in my car and he began busting up in the ridiculousness beginning of it. Not the whole song which becomes jazzy smooth but that opening. Come on now. Just because some laugh at something, out of the norm by a long way, doesn't make them close-minded. Hell, he ended up going to Lovesexy tour with me and praising Prince.

And that is a legit what happened to him moment imo. But to be fair, they should have paired it with Anoptherlover to say "aint nothing happened to him..see?"

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[Edited 11/19/05 10:30am]

True! I ALWAYS LOVED the fact that he CREATED Different,Interesting New Music. Sometimes CONCEPTUAL. I was IN LOVE with ATWIAD and PARADE and I Think he is ALWAYS AHEAD of his TIME. KURT LODER SEEMs to ALWAYS LOVE PRINCE'S ALBUMS as he ALWAYS Gave GREAT REVIEWS in ROLLING STONE. HE VERY FORWARD MOVINg and VERY FRESH and VERY AWARE OF TRENDS and STYLES. Maybe SOME THOUGHT he was just SAY a DIRTY MIND type of ARTIST, but PRINCE JUST IS SO MUCH MORE. The SIGN O THE TIMES album is AMAZING.... Prince just I think as he says.....TRIES HARD TO NEVER GET BORED.....AND HE DOESN'T WANT US TO BE BORED by SAME OLE..SAME OLE..... He's Much TOO SMART to STAY STUCK. What a TALENT..

Black people are open-inded. But that beginning of Do U Lie is corny d laughable as hell. I remember a friend hearing it come on as we drove in my car and he began busting up in the ridiculousness beginning of it. Not the whole song which becomes jazzy smooth but that opening. Come on now. Just because some laugh at something, out of the norm by a long way, doesn't make them close-minded. Hell, he ended up going to Lovesexy topur wiht me and praising Prince.

Black people arent open minded to different forms of music. I would know cuz I had to endure the ridicule of being a Prince fan in the early 90's and a hard rock fan too so I KNO what I speak of

DiamondGirl said:

LoveAlive said:

Thats a bold/bullshit statement. Strereotyping.

LoveAlive said:

Well many "white black puerto rican" people would probably ridicule you as well for being a fan in the early 90's

But that "Black people arent open minded to different forms of music" has me on the floor. I know some of what u mean but lets not generalize to an entire culture and demonize them as well.

"black people arent open minded to different froms of music"---whoo boy!
[Edited 11/19/05 10:29am]

Ya Know that is TRUE. I KNOW FOR a FACT SOME OF PRINCE'S BIGGEST CRITICS Have been His Own PEOPLE. I would ALWAYS hear BLACK PEOPLE Laugh at Him, Call Him CRAZY OR GAY JUST BECAUSE HE WASN"T TYPICAL ROCK and ALL. He DIDN"T FIT IN..HE BROKE THE STEREOTYPES and MOLD... HE WAS DIFFERENT. I think FOR YEARS he has BEEN TRYING TO GAIN RESPECT In the COMMUNITY. I Think More WHITE FANS WERE just ACCEPTING his WHOLE VIBE. HIS WHOLE IMAGE..MAYBE That is WHI HE DIGS EUROPE and ALL. MORE ACCEPTING OF HIS LIFESTYLE

Zelaira said:

So? U mean they were kind of not feeling him not giving th eionly other lack dude in hias band anything to sday in Purple rain. You mean they were critical of him making th e only other black person in UTCM beasides him and tricky , be a overweight older black woman who was used as a nightmare? Oh you mean becasue sometimes it may have appeared he sold out to pander to a pop audience instaed of th e audience who syupported him and made him popular and have enough clout to be in the position to make Purple Rain project?

Oh




Wait. Let me get this striaght. You heard black people laugh at Prince because he wasn't a typical rock n roller? Okay. I guess they wanted him with leather studded outfits like Motley Crue. Oh

Zelaira said:"He DIDN"T FIT IN..HE BROKE THE STEREOTYPES and MOLD... HE WAS DIFFERENT. I think FOR YEARS he has BEEN TRYING TO GAIN RESPECT In the COMMUNITY. I Think More WHITE FANS WERE just ACCEPTING his WHOLE VIBE. HIS WHOLE IMAGE..MAYBE That is WHI HE DIGS EUROPE and ALL. MORE ACCEPTING OF HIS LIFESTYLE





It worked for him to have a wider white audience yes. This post of your is all kinds of wrong and proves some of what we said earlier about success.

I will caveat with saying that I do think the European audiences appreciate him more than the American audience both black AND white. However the miondset of his fans here seems somewhat unnerving.


(whats wrong with quote function?)
[Edited 11/19/05 10:48am]

DiamondGirl said:

Take off that Rudeboy pin for a minute and go listen to Delirious or I Feel 4 U (or pretty much the eintire For You album). P has always had a cheesy pop streak in him. That's not necessarily a bad thing.

This whole thread seems to be yet another one of those "If Prince had conducted his career like I think he should have he'd be so much better off" threads. I guess.


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[Edited 11/19/05 11:27am]

And let me state before I forget, that for every black person you heard laugh at you for liking rock or Prince, or that you heard laugh at Prince, there was a white person or whomever who said "turn that nigger shit off".

"I know of what I speak of" as well

Universaluv said:

Wrong. Evidently you have been reading selectively if you think that. Nobody siad anyting about "better off"

DiamondGirl said:

"better success" then. Is that better?

Universaluv said:

Well it's the title/subject of this thread so u tell me.

And nobody has made mention that he is not or has not done well with what he has already done

Is that better?

Um, guys, no one forces any of u to buy new Prince music. YOu discovered 20 yrs. ago that he doesn't sound the same as he used to.

DiamondGirl said:

I suppose, especially since I never said anyone thought he "has not done well" with what he has already done. That'd be putting words into my mouth.

"Better off, Better success" whatever, doesn't mean he has not done well, just some appear to think that Prince could have done "better" if only he had done more (insert personal opinion here).

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[Edited 11/19/05 12:49pm]

vainandy said:

So you're saying that all musical artists should care solely about make it easily listenable and attractive and popular as popular? That's why we have these jokes like Usher and 50 Cent.

doctamario said:

So you're saying he doesn't have the public in mind or doesn't care if they like or buy any of his output?

And stop with the hyperbole. Where did Vandy say anything about artists "solely" caring about popularity. There has been a lot of assinine assumptuions and putting words or thoughts into peoples mouths (posts) here. All as some defense or something.

I swear some of y'all are a trip.

LoveAlive said:

I want to know have you met 40 million plus black people in the usa and asked them about their taste of music or are you based your assumptions on people that you grew up with?

I remember that 1985 "Rolling Stone" interview. I found Prince making that statement at the time as "wanting to have his cake and eat it to". He wanted to go off in a far out direction but he wanted to let his fans know that he did have some more of his signature Minneapolis Sound so they would linger around for the next album and not leave him altogether. Then he teases them with a lead single like "Kiss" and disappoints them when they get the album.

Disappointed as I was with the album, I was still a huge Prince fan at that time and I had no problem with them making a joke out of it. I was laughing along with the rest of them. Prince set himself up for the jokes by releasing the song in the first place. Hell, I hoped it would catch on nationwide and maybe Prince would be so humiliated that he wouldn't do something like that again.

There we go with that making one album over and over again response. From "Dirty Mind" through "Purple Rain", each album, along with the protegees albums, had that sound but sounded completely different. Even the first two Prince albums had hints of it.

As far as the word "genius" goes, I think that word went to his head when the critics were praising the "Purple Rain" album. His music became weaker because he had to go off and try to live up to the word. If the music sounds good, I could care less if the artist is a genius or not. I love the "Apollonia 6" album and we all know those girls weren't geniuses.

I've never been one to care about record sales and number ones either. The majority of my favorite music is funk that never crossed over to the pop charts. That was the problem with music in the late 1980s also and that's why we don't have any funk anymore.

I think what you were probably meaning to say was that most teenagers are not open to different types of music, and that goes for any race. As a 38 year old, I love most of those late 1980s now but at the time of "Around The World In A Day", I was 17 and just graduated high school. I wanted to party and that record was definately not the party type records I had been accustomed to with Prince.

As far as you being rediculed for being a Prince fan in the early 1990s, that was, and still is, a different world altogether. White kids had gotten into hip hop and the record companies pushed it and ran everything else out of style. If you had been a Rick James, Cameo, or Lakeside fan, you would have been rediculed also. In the early 1980s, it was totally different. The majority of Prince's fans back then were black.

Talk! Very true!

You're comparing Prince changing his style in 1985 to mainstream artists of today. It was a completely different scene back then. Mainstream was still good and Prince fit very well into it in the early 1980s and could have still fit very well in the late 1980s.

Would I like for him to fit into today's mainstream? Hell to the naw!
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[Edited 11/19/05 16:16pm]

Thank you. A lot of the younger fans discovered Prince after he had already changed his style. Some of them came aboard and prefer the style change over the "old Prince" because those newer songs are the ones that attracted them to him in the first place. Prince had already gone off in that direction when they bought their first album.

It's totally different when you've been around from practically the beginning (1979) and lived through, gone out, and partied with these older albums. When the party is over, it's a big disappointment....even a bigger disappointment than the pop fans felt that enjoyed him from "Little Red Corvette" through "Purple Rain". Now, a lot of the younger fans are complaining about Prince not being nasty anymore. They are starting to feel a little disappoinment also. They might as well get used to it though. When Prince changes, he never goes back.
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[Edited 11/19/05 16:13pm]