I remember reading somewhere, way back when, about Prince making reference to the song The Ladder. He was asked about a project he was working on, some sort of movie or something like that. That movie would be Under the Cherry Moon. His reply to confirmation on the movie project was "look to the ladder". Again, this is what I read and it always stuck out in my mind. I remember Prince being extremely cryptic with everything he said back then.

So I listened to the ladder and have concluded that it's words are a rough draft to the storyline of Under The Cherry Moon. What do you guys think?

1nonly said:

RepoMan said:

easy man,easy

Interesting idea.

I think it's a case of Prince thinking about this kind of stuff around that time, probably fuelled by his increasing fame after the success of 1999, and of course after Purple Rain.

There's parts of UTCM that are just Prince preaching his ideas, as if it were a song, like the part where Christopher is explaining to Tricky about love as they walk through the town square.

I think Prince doing a lot of soul-searching, and he put that into his art, as he still does.

I don't think The Ladder has any direct relation to the UTCM other than that, but it's an interesting topic nonetheless
[Edited 11/8/05 15:04pm]

RepoMan said:

Hey, be nice. I was only repeating what I had read years ago. Maybe in 1985? I was like, 12 then or something. The notion of the song being somewhat similar to Under the Cherry Moon is not too far off.I know the song is preachy, but it is possible if taken to mean how Love is all important. don't dismiss the idea so much. Pretty much the way NuveauDance summed it up. But I gotta admit, it did read weird when I declared that I concluded that Ladder is a rough draft for Under the Cherry Moon. See, I can laugh at myself

Actually, from what I read in interviews afterwards, "Condition of the Heart" was a rough outline of what Prince wanted to accomplish script-wise with the movie that eventually became Under the Cherry Moon. Paul Peterson and Susannah were originally slated to play the lead roles.

Jestyr said:

yea thats what i heard too.however this has got me to thinking and the ladder - if taken as a metaphor could be seen a bit outlinish to the movie

Once upon a time in the land of Sinaplenty

christopher tracy lived what could be considered a sinful lifestyle

There lived a king who didn't deserve 2 be

and by the way them women swooned over him in the movie it can be taken that he was the best gigilo around

He never once said thank U, never please

dude was a bit of an arrogant asshole

Now this king he had a subject named Electra
Who loved him with a passion, uncontested
4 him each day she had a smile
But it didn't matter

elektra is the female counterpart to tricky. tricky - like elektra, loved christopher

The king was looking 4 the ladder

But chris was looking for love

Everybody's looking 4 the ladder
Everybody wants salvation of the soul
The steps U take are no easy road
But the reward is great
4 those who want 2 go

everybody wants love, everyone wants to know that everythings gonna be alright that they dont have to worry and that at the end of the day all the hard work will be worth it cuz u got a sweet someone to come home to


A feeling of self-worth (everybody's looking)
will caress U (for the answers)
The size of the whole wide world will decrease (how the story started)
(and how it will end)
The love of God's creation will undress U
And time spent alone my friend, will cease

chris (i think) had low selfesteem, cuz he knew that women only wanted him for his sexy, not for his thoughts or what he could contribute to a relationship.
chris wanted a REAL love, a love so great that the whole world wouldnt matter to him (it would decrease) all that would matter is his love.
he wanted the love of God's creation (mary sharon) to undress him, to love him and make him feel like he's worth something. "and time spent alone will cease" -

Interesting, moonwalkbjrain...thanks for that.

Last month he announced an indefinite retirement from live performance. "I'm going to look for the ladder," he told one of his managers. When the manager asked Prince what he meant, the inscrutable idol said only, "Sometimes it snows in April." (1985)

I see "The Ladder" as meaning spiritual ascension.
Sorry for being ungrateful to those around him, the king began to climb.
Does it make sense? Maybe so, maybe not. Sometimes it snows in April too.

To me it's SPIRITUAL.... EVERYBODY LOOKING FOR THE LADDER....SALVATION,PEACE FREEDOM.... CLEANSING It's ACCEPTING CHRIST... Such a BEAUTIFUL SONG,BUt then again ATWIAD is a MASTERPIECE.....

I think, to sum it up, this song is about reaching God.
And through reaching God we reach the goodness, light and peaceful life that we are all seeking.

This is only an idea of course.....

Snap said:

yes exactly... looking for love... looking for gods love in a sinful world, in the rehersal footage at wembly where he is performing it and he appears to be crying....
but we better be careful as one can be accused of being a nut who worships him like a god simply for seein a deeper meaning in his songs....

Exactly Melt..Prince is So SPIRITUAL. Alot of his FANS AREN'T OR DON't HEAR This in his SONGS. They don't GET HIm....They Don't Want to THINK.....

Zelaira said:

thanks Zel... you are one of the special ones your are one of the rainbow children

Thanks Melt...That ALBUM along with ATWIAD and LOVESEXY and GRAFFITI BRIDGE are Really Telling when it comes to SPIRITUALITY and PRINCE. I think ALOT of his FANS who AREN"T RELIGIOUS only are INTO HIS top 40 hits . He's Very POLITICAl also. The RAINBOW CHIlDREN is Prince's BESTEST BESTEST ALBUM... I am going to play it today when it gets later. I think Maybe REALLY RELIGIOUS PEOPLE may NOT DIG PRINCE or they Don't like his Fans Worshipping him Cause of his SEX/RELIGION thing. Denise feels ALL THAT IS SIN.... But PRINCE is JUST LIVING his LIFe and he is RELIGIOUS and Preaching and Trying To TEACH His FANS. I Think he is DOING THE RIGHT THING.... I LOVE PRINCE!

Snap said:

Youknow, that may have been what I read many years ago. That may be it exactly. And Jestyre, I too remember Condition of the Heart being an outline for the movie as well. Wasn't that period so trippy, and wasn't Prince just soo cryptic back then. I dug it myself and I thought it was sooo cool that he was like that. Memories, man, memories, listening to ATWIAD and playing with my Atari 2600 because I was too poor to get a Nintendo.

Zelaira said:

What absolute rot. I'm not Chrisitian, and I don't believe in Jesus as the son of God, but it's clear as day that the albums you listed have large percentages of spiritual and Christian themes to their lyrics, and I think most other non-religious fans would agree.

Snap said:[quote]Last month he announced an indefinite retirement from live performance. "I'm going to look for the ladder," he told one of his managers. When the manager asked Prince what he meant, the inscrutable idol said only, "Sometimes it snows in April." (1985)

Funny that you mentioned this. I remember when ATWIAD came out, I bought the album and me and a friend studied the album cover for clues about his "retirement". There is a ladder in the album cover picture and we counted the rungs on the ladder (I think there were 16 or 18). We concluded that that was the number of months that he would be retired. What can I tell ya, we were KIDS!

Zelaira said:

well yea it means that too - first and formost, but 1nonly was talkin about in relation 2 utcm

CandaceS said:

ur welcome

Well, Noveau I Don't think AOT of FANS WHO AREn'T REALLY SPIRITUAl get his RAINBOW CHILDREN and I THINK ALOT HATE HIM Cause he is a JEHOVAH and THEy DOn'T UNDERSTANd JEHOVAH WITNESSES thinking it's some WEIRd CULT. When it Really has COOL PEOPLE INVOLVED. People get SCAREd OF THEM and I Only See them as RELIGIOUS People NOT a CULT. Did you UNDERSTANd what I SAID in the ABOVE Message.
[Edited 11/9/05 13:38pm]

Zelaira said:

They are some wierd cult

Zelaira said:

I bet there's a bucket-load of religious fans who don't "get it" either - Christians are the most close-minded, backward-thinking warped people you will ever meet. They put their faith in a book, that uses an elaborate astrological allegory, the sole purpose of which is social-engineering through fear.

And What is your RELIGION? We are told DO NOT FEAR..That is THE DEVIL TALKING.... The Jehovah's are COOL, But I Cannot Give up HOLIDAYS.

NouveauDance said:

something we kinda agree on... religion is not GOD its mans interpretation of God and mans way of using God to control people for thier own personal gain thats true... (they who heareth the word and understand it not, then commeth the wicked one to steal away that which would be sewn in the heart).. BUT that dont mean God dont exist... and yes most christians are controlled by narrow mindednes as is most religions.. ignorance is easier to control... but people do have the right to believe what they choose to believe and God is real no matter how one interperates him or it... its just a shame that people like yourself only seem to have negative things to say and always seem to want to rubbish anything you dont or wont understand

NouveauDance said:

also did you know there is a hidden mathematical code in the original hebrew text of the bible which fortells every major event in world history over the past 3000 yrs !! a little more than just an astrological allegory !! original ancient hebrew also represents numbers as well as letters. the code was discovered around 1995 by a jewish mathematical scientist Dr Eliyahu Rips
[Edited 11/9/05 17:04pm]

Since I am NOT JEWISH..I HAVE NEVER READ OLD TESTAMENT..CATHOLIC ONLY reads New Testament. Old TestamenT IS Jewish teaching..MoseS AND all.I TEND TO BE MORE INTO Protestant TEACHING.
[Edited 11/9/05 17:24pm]

Moonwalkbjrain said:

Exactly, and this thread has gone waaay out there. But, reading back on this thread, I think I may have been thinking about COndition of the Heart as opposed to The Ladder, that previous quote about prince saying he was looking for the ladder and referencing Condition of the Heart is so familiar.

meltwithyou said:

oh and the code itself actually predicted that the code would be found in that year by a man named Rips...
i kid you not..

NouveauDance said:

at this conversation...

meltwithyou said:

Isn't it a little easy to predict what has already happened??

I saw a documentary on these supposed "Code breakers" turns out you can make a code out of anything - Example - I don't remember the supposed broken code but they took a page out of Moby Dick and invented a code which then spelt someones name - Someone like John F Kennedy etc ..... Religion is a form of control, to tell people how to live your lives in order to gain entrance to "Heaven" - I am not religous, but I am spiritual, I believe that once you pass on, there is another level. Whether this is Heaven or not does not matter - It is everlasting life. I do not for one second believe that because I was brought up in a "Christian" family that I will have a better chance of afterlife than a Jew or Catholic etc.

Faith is something that you belive in and not what you are told, Dictation is believing in what you are told and not what you believe.

Apologies if I offended anybody, it was not my intentions.

Jehovahs witnesses are not a wierd cult, nor are buddhists, muslims or any other religion - they are people whom share a different following !!
[Edited 11/10/05 2:10am]
[Edited 11/10/05 2:10am]