It seems that Prince without a huge studio and access to all instruments made music some would call "genius." After a friend showing me some aftershow or something to the effect of "Darling Nikki", it occured to me that its a masterpiece..., almost even in a classical-operatic sense. In plain english, its effing beautiful and quite lyrical instrumentally and vocally. "Darling Nikki" and others from his days of limited instruments shows his genious.

Did the over-abundance of instrumental access side track his genious? I mean, classical works that way, but small jazz ensembles, blues, and rock doesn't work well with too many instruments. Just like how goofy it is when Elton John or Guns n Roses utilizes a full scale symphony to back them up.

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[Edited 9/24/05 14:10pm]

It can be silly, but it still is beautifull. I dont think it's good to limit yourself when it comes to music. I dotn understand why some people are so put off with orchestras and horns, It's too much RAMONES and SEX PISTOLS in their mind? so they only want raw grooves?

I can dig some power trio like in The Undertaker, but i love some complex arrangments too, it's all good.

Rockability said:

It seems like you're not really saying that more instruments sidetracked Prince's genius, but rather that you personally prefer more stripped-down music and have a distaste for more complex or "overblown" popular music. I say, listen to "Pink Cashmere" and re-think. If you still feel the same way, well, then just pop in "Dirty Mind" and have a ball.

I prefer Prince's more atmospheric, full of instruments, power sound over his
more minimalistic efforts, but thats just a personal preference.
Though, I love The Truth and that was pretty basic

FunkMistress said:

ooh I forgot about "Pink Cashmere". I have to go listen to that now.

MMMMMHHHHHMMMMM

Pink cashmere is like the BEST.....SOOOOO BEAUTIFUL!

It is one of the songs that made me the crazed fan I am today!

I happened to like when GNR had an orchestra behind them BTW! I get chilzzzzz!

FunkMistress said:

"Pink Cashmere" would qualify as drums, bass, guitar and synth. But, still, it is a good example as Prince utilizes the synth to "realize" an orchestra. He could easily hire an orchestra and it would sound similar.

What I am saying is that Darling Nikki sounds more like a rock quintet. You have the drums starting out in military fashion, then synth with a definitive classical-era appeal (but not overblown), an electric bass which frequents into fast paced scales, and the electric guitar. Combined, it really underscores how Prince USED to compose. He shifted things up as soon as he went solo. Maybe he felt The Revolution was too limited in that they couldn't play what he really wanted to.

I think Prince should get back with them as that style is what he does best rock/soul and record jazz/classical or whatever as side projects. I would buy both.
[Edited 9/24/05 3:08am]

Rockability said:

I'm pretty damn sure there is an orchestra on "Pink Cashmere", though. At least the string section of it.

I hate it when people can't spell the word genius.

The funny thing is, some people think Prince is a "genius" because of his dry, stripped-down arrangements ("Kiss", "SOTT" etc) - while others say it's because of his fat, multi-layered productions ("My name is Prince", "Eye No" etc)...

I guess that shows he can be a master of both.

I say he is a genius because he seemingly can master both stripped down and multi-layered musical formats across multiple fronts (rock, pop, soul, and funk with elements from everything from gospel to country). In addition, he shows a strong grap of taking exising arrangements that are not his and adding some spice by inserting his translation and style while preserving the work of the credited artist.

'Pink Cashmere' is accompanied by strings (Claire Fisher); however, I do agree with the post that states his complex use of the synth to accompany and enhance the strings - (PC is a wonderful song - I like most of the songs that experimented with strings during the period especially the underrated 'The Family' album).

Learning so much here -- thanks.

RepoMan said:

Me too.

RealMusician said:

Whoever says Prince is a genius because of fat, multilayered productions should scratch their head and wonder where Prince has been for the last 15 years. Those who think his genius in composing is dry and stripped down music would wonder where he has been too.

Typical for a rockabilly fan.

I like both approaches and both have their place at my dinner table . Personally I think that's often the mark of truly great artist; to be able to use both "stripped down" or multi-layered approaches effectively. That's part of the reason why Sign O'The Times is so great because it contains both extremes.

jacktheimprovident said:

Same here. My point is that Prince hasn't done any gifted stripped down music in so much time. S.S.T.-style, while stripped down, is not the "genius" Prince composed with during his Controversy, 1999, Purple Rain and Around the World albums. The stuff he done simplistically as Starfish and Coffee is really good, but doesn't compare to Darling Nikki, Little Red Corvette, etc.

Almost makes me wonder if Prince just revised music that was given him at the time, cause he sure can't do it himself anymore.
[Edited 9/25/05 3:33am]

Rockability said:

I think it's somewhat unreasonable for fans to expect prince to keep making ingenius music year after year. Every artist, hell every human being has a prime. I once heard an interesting theory, that great, ground-breaking artists can only actually make consistently great, ground-breaking music for 7 years (give or take), and it fits a lot of them pretty well.

The Beatles' entire recording career 1963-1969
The Rolling Stones' run from Aftermath to Exile on Main Street 1966-1972
Stevie Wonder's run from Where I'm Coming From to Songs in the key of life 1970-1976
Prince's run from Dirty Mind to Sign O' The Times 1980-1987
James Brown's most important recordings from live at the apollo to sex machine 1963-1970
The Who's Career from the beginning to Quadrophenia 1965-1973
Led Zeppelin from the beginning to Physical Graffiti-1969-1975

Yeah, people got to realize that Prince is not the same Prince. we gotta be happy cause he still is giving us good albums, cause he is still better than most of artists out there. He is not half as inventive, but he is a better musican now, and we can appreciate a genius in the top of his musical chops. He is a much better singer nowadays than before, a much better guitar players, ah better drumer from what i heard on glass cutter. he is incredible as a musican.

7salles said:

I really like the way you put that

jacktheimprovident said:

jacktheimprovident said:

Wow! Very nice trivia facts. I never knew that was the case, although I am going to work hard to find a good example of an artist that kept it going past 7 years.

For now, I will add that Prince can do better. He isn't dead, he's in good health and he isn't popular to the point of how Elvis Presley was (wait thats one example past 7 years maybe) to the point of total isolation bogging down artistic expression.

I would agree that for all those cases that stardom is what shuts the artistic valve off. Being regular and "normal" is what drives the artist to become "strange."

Novabreaker said:

- Yeah. According to the booklet, it was Clare Fischer and his Orchestra...sounded great, by the way. Clare knows how to interact with Prince very well.