svengali said:

Yes. And as amazing it is to know all these things, doing them just because it sounds right to you at the moment is simply incredible.

paisley2002 said:

Wow your pretty smart. A musical genius.

Some of my favs:

G major - Little Red Corvette (catchy little number )

A major - 7 (at least that's how I play it )

A major - Kiss

C major - I Could Never Take The Place of Your Man

svengali said:

Hey! Me niether!

But, here's my take on the song:
http://www.soundclick.com...ndID=95911

It sucks, but that's the reason why Prince's songs work: noone else could ever pull it off!!!

BTW, it was done "just for fun" and i still cringe when i hear it, too.

Schöne Grüße

svengali said:

Nah, it isn't a conscious thought process to him. He just plays what he hears and that's it. He's a genius of the highest order.

Lilith said:

[/quote]

Yeah, when you feel the connection, a musical instrument is just another mouth you use in which to communicate, and it takes about as much thought to do it. The best musicians don't have to "concentrate" at all, just get in the zone.

Ice9sFine said:

I'm not denying he's a genius of the highest order, but I doubt he plays/composes 100% by ear. Sure, it's probably a big part of his musicianship, perhaps second to none (especially solos), but I'm sure he knows his theory inside out as well - even if he worked it out himself.

Reading/writing music and music theory are two different aspects. It is quite possible to not be able to read but still understand the theory. He mentioned in an interview last year how he was helping Beyonce learn scales/modes at the piano and you can hear him in rehearsal/sounchecks instructing the band members what keys to play etc. He's probably got his own terminology that he uses for scales/chords etc. I guess what I'm trying to say is that reading/writing is a visual tool, whereas the theory is an aural experience that anyone can work out without any formal teaching.
[Edited 8/29/05 17:26pm]

Prince maybe cant read music very well, but you can be sure he knows the scales and modes, he said many things in interview that points to that.

HE said once that ever guitar player should know the scales, sometimes he plays the same song in differente modes just to change the mood. Prince composed DO YOU LIE, that prooves he has a very good chord vocabulary.

I get your drift, but here's what I meant by my earlier statement:

I have no doubt that Prince knows his scales and modes very well. But I highly doubt that he PURPOSELY sets out to write a song in C# Dorian before even knowing what it sounds like. Prince's is a musical mind that germinates ideas straight from his ear and not from his brain. He will hear a phrase or a progression or a melody in his mind and will go from there. He most likely doesn't just say to himself, "I'm gonna write a song in F# Locrian 'cause I feel like it."

He isn't very good at reading music (I'm sure he reads it to an extent, however), and because of this he probably doesn't write music very much. If I had to make an educated guess, I would say that, during the Revolution years, Prince would arrange everything in his head and then get Lisa, Wendy or Dr. Fink to write it out for the band.

He probably hears chords before he even knows what the names of them are. A mind like Prince's can do that.

Ice9sFine said:

Prince is known to lie.
Prince can read music, don't believe the hype.

Reflecting about Prince music....I've noticed that he never used an harmonic minor scale....Am I wrong? Neither a melodic one.....

The percussions of SOTT r played with a Pentatonic Scale.....Does anybody know which others songs he played used the "Blue note"? (Except The Ride of course)....

Analizying the song "Anna Stesia", I've noticed that Prince plays it with piano using the right hand.....Listening 2 it I've noticing that the "bass key" is used 4 the arrangement of Bass and Guitar....Any thoughts about it?

Yes, i dont think Prince does this "I will write tghe melody in C mixolidian" i agree with you.

About the blue note prince uses a lot in guitar solo especially live.

OK.. this is a Prince Topic! A REAL Prince Topic!

I can see this is something Prince would post & like to read. Finally some detail on the board.

Too much detail and way over my head BUT I love it!!

Ice9sFine said:

U know what - you're right. I stand corrected on "4 The Tears". Now I'm trying 2 think of a song in c# minor and can't think of one... Anyone?

The modes are generally determined by the chords.

I doubt people who write music that's as pop as Prince's are starting out thinking "which mode will I use?" they start playing chords and singing along.

If you start playing d minor to G major (or G7), you're going to play the mode that corresponds to it which would be a dorian with a root of D. Those chords are really in the key of C, but the root is basically D.

If you're jamming on G7 or G9, you could play mixolydian (or a minor pentatonic, which can fit almost anywhere).

And either you can know this, or it will just sound right. Whether he knows the names of the scales, he obviously knows the most common modes considering how often he uses things like dorian melody.

paisley2002 said:

I'm not at an instrument, but I seem to remember Chaos & Disorder being in c#m? I could be way off.

U know what - you're right. I stand corrected on "4 The Tears". Now I'm trying 2 think of a song in c# minor and can't think of one... Anyone?[/quote]



First of all, I thank ya all 4 this topic.....Its time I began 2 remember what I've studied at the conservatory last year.....Its always nice remembering music theory....

I don't know about the other keys in C#minor.....but Im SURE Anna Stesia is in C minor....If u have music sheets its possible 2 understand which keys is the song....4 example, "Anna Stesia", stops with a chord of 2 Cs.....A way 2 understand the Key is looking at the final note...but its not always exact...
Another way 2 discover it is looking at the first b or # starting from the bottom...and than going under a 4th grade.....

U talked about Dorian and Mixiolidian modes....R u sure that Prince aint using 4 example Lidian, etc.....

Whats about 2 - 5 - 1 grades of 3 chords? R there in Prince songs? If u shall help me...i will b thankful.....

Another question.....

Which keys r played in NEWS album?.....I've perceived a G major in "East"...am I wrong?

It's just great to read a threat you don't really understand!

about the fact that Prince doesn't writes down his music...in the beginning of the movie Braffiti Bridge, doesn't Robin holds some music sheets, like Dance with power, God is alive or The Grand Progression? so...info or intox?

I can't recall prince using minor harmonic or melodic. And that clean acoustic licks in the middle of musicology? Under a italian voice? ]
Just from the top of my head, i am not sure.

Wow , so many words in this thread I've never heard in my life , I feel so small now , I have heard of Mixolydian though , 5th dimensional guy , fights Superman yeah , say his name backards and he disappears , am I right , tell me I'm right ?

nayroo2002 said:

Don't be so hard on yourself. I think it sounds pretty decent. It sounds way more than what I could do because i've always wanted to play guitar but never actually got started.

Also Moonshine don't feel bad, because I don't understand this thread either but still its pretty interesting.

So many posts...so cool to feel that Prince's music is loved in the same way I love it by so many!

Yeah, I think the harp phrase in the segue into "The Marrying Kind" in Musicology is in harmonic minor. I also think that parts of the keyboard solo in the extended version of "When Doves Cry," although being heavily chromatic at times, tend to have a harmonic minor kind of flavor.

Melodic minor is not used very much per se in pop music, due to the fact that pure scales are rarely played. It is very difficult to compose a pop tune in melodic minor as compared to classical music, where scale figuration make the melodic minor tonality readily apparent (a la Mozart).

If I remember correctly, the middle section of "Computer Blue" is in C# minor, but I may be wrong. You know, the section that kinda sounds like it comes from Hall and Oates song? It's actually my most favorite section in the song.

Um, let's see...As for modal writing, I can think of the following:
Ionian: (same as major)
Dorian: "Power Fantastic" et al.
Phrygian: parts of "Loose!" et al.
Lydian: parts of "What Do U Want Me 2 Do?", "Reflection" et al.
Mixolydian: "7" et al.
Aeolian: (same as natural minor)
Locrian: can't think of any examples (very rare mode due to flat fifth)

Oh, and, if by blue note you are talking about the alternating major/minor third, Prince uses it all the time, especially in solos. It's one of those things you have to feel. As a part of the compostion, though, where the blue note forms an integral part of the chord progression, here are a few examples:

"Family Name:" the verse starts as a pretty simple A minor to D7 chord progression, but then when it goes from the D7 to F#m7 (which contains a C# in it), and then it does this Bm7 to E7, the tonality kind of shifts to A Major for a little bit (this, by the way Lilith, is an example of a ii-V-I chord progression in a way, but as usual, Prince never does a simple ii-V-I. He always adds to it or changes it in only a way he can).

"Controversy:" verse is in F#m, but chorus section is D#m to C#7 to B(contains A#, making it sound like F# Major).

"The Marrying Kind:" Instead of simple Em - G - Am - B7, Prince does Em - G#m - Am - B7, again implying a juxtaposed major/minor tonality.

There are many, MANY more examples of this, so these are only a few. Again, remember that, to Prince, he probably does not set out with the intent of composing a song with a vague tonality like the above. They simply germinate from that incredible ear of his.

I've also thought of another example of the so-called "singing a song in one key and playing the music in another" technique I mentioned earlier:
"Irresistible Bitch"

Oh, I could go on for days about Prince's music! I'll post more as I discover it. Admittedly, my Prince collection is still very small, because I am still young and a poor college student, but I do want to increase it very quickly and very soon.

Love2tha9s said:

Thanks, Love2tha9s! I really appreciate the comments!!!

Paisley2002, This get's my vote for ".Org Thread Of The Year"!!!

Ice9sFine, I'm really curious to know what the fat-ass chord is at the very beginning of "Endorphinmachine." It sounds sonically gigantic
Please break it down??? Your explainations are priceless

Schöne Grüße

Hi Im gonna 2 answer u step by step.....

So many posts...so cool to feel that Prince's music is loved in the same way I love it by so many!

*** Personally I LOVE VERY MUCH PRINCE MUSIC....Yesterday night I was talking with a friend....Prince music aint complicated but is wonderful bcuz Prince put all himself in music.....Prince music is REAL MUSIC..coming from heart and soul.....


Yeah, I think the harp phrase in the segue into "The Marrying Kind" in Musicology is in harmonic minor. I also think that parts of the keyboard solo in the extended version of "When Doves Cry," although being heavily chromatic at times, tend to have a harmonic minor kind of flavor.

*** I will listen 2 these songs again.....About Prince using harmonic minor scales I have some doubts....I didnt hear the distance of 1 1/2 tune who gives an "arab" taste, flavour 2 music.....I will listen 2 "the marrying kind paying more attention".....


Melodic minor is not used very much per se in pop music, due to the fact that pure scales are rarely played. It is very difficult to compose a pop tune in melodic minor as compared to classical music, where scale figuration make the melodic minor tonality readily apparent (a la Mozart).


*** In my opinion...I HATE MELODIC MINOR SCALES .....I find they sound out of tune...but I must study them and i will do it.....
My piano teacher uses these scales 4 improvisation....


Um, let's see...As for modal writing, I can think of the following:

Ionian: (same as major)

*** Major??? My teacher told that Modes r used only 4 minor keys.....

Dorian: "Power Fantastic" et al.

*** Its the most used Mode.....Especially in Blues music....."The Ride", "Make ur mama happy".....


Oh, and, if by blue note you are talking about the alternating major/minor third, Prince uses it all the time, especially in solos. It's one of those things you have to feel. As a part of the compostion, though, where the blue note forms an integral part of the chord progression, here are a few examples:

"Family Name:" the verse starts as a pretty simple A minor to D7 chord progression, but then when it goes from the D7 to F#m7 (which contains a C# in it), and then it does this Bm7 to E7, the tonality kind of shifts to A Major for a little bit (this, by the way Lilith, is an example of a ii-V-I chord progression in a way, but as usual, Prince never does a simple ii-V-I. He always adds to it or changes it in only a way he can).

*** The blue note could sound not meaningful but its what it gives "taste" 2 a piece....
Thanx 4 the tip about II-V-I.....
Prince aint the only one not using these grade "exactly"....Lot of jazz players use them in a "relative" way....


There are many, MANY more examples of this, so these are only a few. Again, remember that, to Prince, he probably does not set out with the intent of composing a song with a vague tonality like the above. They simply germinate from that incredible ear of his.

*** Im SURE of it.....Theory is important but not ALL.....Prince is a genius....
Would u like 2 know a thing? My piano teacher teaches me theory but he makes me play by ear....A musician without ear aint a real player.....


Oh, I could go on for days about Prince's music! I'll post more as I discover it. Admittedly, my Prince collection is still very small, because I am still young and a poor college student, but I do want to increase it very quickly and very soon.[/quote]

*** Im waiting.....Thanx 4 all ur info.....Im sure that I will have lot 2 discuss with my teacher when I start lessons....
[Edited 8/31/05 1:52am]

Ice9sFine, I'm really curious to know what the fat-ass chord is at the very beginning of "Endorphinmachine." It sounds sonically gigantic
Please break it down??? Your explainations are priceless

***** May I try 2 guess by ear?

Its starts by A -...then progressing....Prince slides the left hand 2 the handle of guitar.....

Not sure about what I wrote....just tried

Music has keys?

nayroo2002 said:[quote]

Love2tha9s said:

Thanks. I'm so glad people got into this thread the way they did. I certainly didn't expect it. Much appreciated and much love, for the interest and obviously Prince's music.

I've been trying 2 play Prince songs on my keyboard 4 over 20 years, and I've always done it by ear. I do have some sheet music of his songs, but it takes me 2 long 2 figure out what the notes are. I took some music theory classes in college, but that was a long time ago, so I'm no professional by any means. I just love his music.

And not 2 sound arrogant, but I think Prince himself would truly appreciate a thread like this if he were on the ORG.