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PrintableUniversaluv said: DavidEye said: The irony is...Vanity left Prince a year later,and signed to Motown (the label that Rick was on).When Vanity was on 'Soul Train' in 1984,she mentioned that Rick was helping her out,giving her alot of great advice.Rick probably thought "She came back to me",lol. Great advice on where to get the good cocaine.  aaahaahahaa!! between rick and billy idol's "advice", no wonder she almost died. | |
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Gr8muta said: Well i guess when i started the post i should have been more clear to the purpose of this topic. I meant to just inforn the org fam that there was a little surprise on the Chappelle show extra's about our boy Prince. I have always known of the tension between the two but i thought it was "squashed"....until i saw this RECENT interview before he passed on. Has anyone else seen it? and what are your thoughts on James's bitterness?
what exactly did Rick say in this recent interview? | |
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Gr8muta said: Well i guess when i started the post i should have been more clear to the purpose of this topic. I meant to just inforn the org fam that there was a little surprise on the Chappelle show extra's about our boy Prince. I have always known of the tension between the two but i thought it was "squashed"....until i saw this RECENT interview before he passed on. Has anyone else seen it? and what are your thoughts on James's bitterness?
I think Rick was torn in some ways. He held on to a lot of anger when it comes to Prince. I haven't seen the Chappelle extra, but its not surprising. Around the same time, only months before he died, Rick said that Prince was holding the Funk down and he was glad and proud for that, and that others needed to do the same. He then went on to say that he was a fan of the Musicology record and never imagined himself saying that. I give him some credit for that because we all know it must have taken a lot to say that. | |
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DavidEye said:
Good point.Their feud was double-sided.Sure,Rick talked alot of shit about Prince,but Prince was no angel himself.When Rick's mother asked for his autograpgh,he ignored her.Then,in 1983,he showed up at a Rick James concert with his bodyguard (Chick) carrying him to his seat.This,of course,took attention away from the main attraction.Both of them behaved like children,and their feud was dumb and silly. That depends on how you look at it. I absolutely loved the fued and would have loved to have seen it continue on because it brought out both artists absolute strongest and best work during these years. I would love to have seen Rick come back with a strong kick ass album right after "Purple Rain", instead of "Glow". Prince would have thought twice about changing his style with his old arch enemy still being a threat. Prince's albums that followed after "Purple Rain" would have been eaten alive and spit out by Rick during the "Street Songs" era. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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Gr8muta said: Well i guess when i started the post i should have been more clear to the purpose of this topic. I meant to just inforn the org fam that there was a little surprise on the Chappelle show extra's about our boy Prince. I have always known of the tension between the two but i thought it was "squashed"....until i saw this RECENT interview before he passed on. Has anyone else seen it? and what are your thoughts on James's bitterness? I haven't seen it. Is the DVD out yet? I have got to see it.  Andy is a four letter word. | |
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dealodelandron said:
I think Rick was torn in some ways. He held on to a lot of anger when it comes to Prince. I haven't seen the Chappelle extra, but its not surprising. Around the same time, only months before he died, Rick said that Prince was holding the Funk down and he was glad and proud for that, and that others needed to do the same. He then went on to say that he was a fan of the Musicology record and never imagined himself saying that. I give him some credit for that because we all know it must have taken a lot to say that. I read the same interview with Rick about Prince and he had definately had a change of heart. I'm thinking maybe his comments on the Chapelle extra was strictly give people what they wanted and expected to hear in order to sell. "Nicey, Nicey" stuff doesn't sell too well. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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For those who missed it, this was one of the best threads I've seen on the Org in a long time:
http://www.prince.org/msg/7/139243 A few questions for the old skoolers who were around when this was happening: 1. Did Rick really have bitterness towards Prince or was it just 'fanning the flames'? I can't seem to tell from everyone's posts. Did he really feel that jealous towards Prince or was it just a media play-out? 2. If Rick really did feel like that, had he expressed it before asking him on the tour? Or did it start after Prince supported him? 3. I know this is hypothetical but... for those who really know their stuff when it comes to P/Rick - how much do you think that tour helped P's career? Was it a leg-up that Prince seriously needed or do you think he would've achieved success anyway? Or a bit of both? | |
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onenitealone said:
For those who missed it, this was one of the best threads I've seen on the Org in a long time: http://www.prince.org/msg/7/139243 That was a great thread. Someone cut and pasted the stories from Rick's web site that were written by his ex-pyrotechnics man, Pyro John. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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onenitealone said:
A few questions for the old skoolers who were around when this was happening: 1. Did Rick really have bitterness towards Prince or was it just 'fanning the flames'? I can't seem to tell from everyone's posts. Did he really feel that jealous towards Prince or was it just a media play-out? I think a little of both. He definately did not like Prince but I think publicly showing it, creates controversy, which sold records for both Rick and Prince. 2. If Rick really did feel like that, had he expressed it before asking him on the tour? Or did it start after Prince supported him?
I always thought Prince was placed on that tour by his record company and didn't really want to do it. As far as Rick goes, I don't know if he really had an opinion about Prince until the tour. Once the tour started, Rick didn't like to be outdone. 3. I know this is hypothetical but... for those who really know their stuff when it comes to P/Rick - how much do you think that tour helped P's career? Was it a leg-up that Prince seriously needed or do you think he would've achieved success anyway? Or a bit of both? [/quote]
I think it definately gave it a great boost. Prince would eventually have become a moderate star but never the huge star he became without learning shock value from that tour. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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As always, thanks Vain. Now I need to get my hands on live DVDs showing that era! | |
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well all i have to say is that i love both rick and p all the same. because they both made right music in their time. but the only difference is that p is still living today and still going strong with his music. | |
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Hotlegs said: medina said: Thanx.I'll bring along a big ol' "Flashlight".  Give em' the keys Legs & let em' ride!!!!  | |
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vainandy
That depends on how you look at it. I absolutely loved the fued and would have loved to have seen it continue on because it brought out both artists absolute strongest and best work during these years. I would love to have seen Rick come back with a strong kick ass album right after "Purple Rain", instead of "Glow". Prince would have thought twice about changing his style with his old arch enemy still being a threat. Prince's albums that followed after "Purple Rain" would have been eaten alive and spit out by Rick during the "Street Songs" era.[/quote] Maybe in your world. An artist either continues to grow/evolve as Prince did or flames out like Rick (and many others). You can't keep making great music in the same vein. Besides, things work in cycles, so Prince can always come back to the funk whenever he's ready-- it'll just be different. It's probably good for Prince that Rick didn't come out with something hard after Purple Rain. If you don't follow your muse you're in for trouble. |
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I was barely a teenager when I first saw Rick and it was obvious to me that he was all messed up on booze and whatever. I lost some respect for him, he was missing his lines and slurring. I knew the lyrics by heart.
At the time, I loved Rick's albums as much as prince's. A big form of appreciation is to emulate. Prince has done the with most of the major funk players of the 70's. I hope rick has foud peace    | |
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vainandy said: murph said:
Ditto....Another thing that must be noted is that Rick resented (and rightly so) how Prince, the light skinned, rock playing, crossover negro received major play on MTV while the more hardcore R&B cat Rick James was barred from the station. There was a huge outcry at one point in '82 in which black artists complained nationally that they were being descriminated by MTV. So along comes Prince, a guy that was just opening up for Rick just two years earlier, getting major airplay with Little Red Corvette as well as the non threatening MJ...That's why he disliked Prince...It wasn't simple jealousy...But in recent years, Rick James has come to respect our boy P...He was even quoted as saying that Prince truely represented the FUNK....But by simply saying it's jealously is doing a disservice to Rick's legacy.... There's also word within the Rick James fan community, that MTV played Prince's videos simply because they learned that Rick James didn't like him and wanted to piss him off. Rick was a thorn in MTV's ass because he was demanding that they play his videos and openly calling them racists. It's something to think about because look how hard Michael Jackson had to fight to get his videos played in the beginning. I heard the exact same thing. I remember that. SynthiaRose said "I'm in love with blackguitaristz. Especially when he talks about Hendrix."
nammie "What BGZ says I believe. I have the biggest crush on him." http://ccoshea19.googlepa...ssanctuary http://ccoshea19.googlepages.com | |
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DavidEye said: blackguitaristz said: Don't know how many folks in Prince Music and More are really aware of Rick and P, because it goes far back. And it appears that many just started getting into P in the late 80's, at the very earliest. But for all of the o.g. P fans that were actually into P before "When Doves Cry", this fued was double sided. Sure, there is no doubt that Rick was jealous of P. Rick later admitted this. But, at the time when P was opening up for Rick, Rick was definately the bigger star. And even in 81 when P released Controversy, Rick was at the top with his huge hit album "Streetsongs". Rick's popularity put heat on Prince to get it up, so to speak. Overall, it was just competition more than anything. Rick had his world as P was building his own. Period. Sure, Rick was the first to openly talk about P in the press, but that was just fanning the flames. Rick knew P was on the rise, so,...They both admired and respected each other as artists, if not as people.
Good point.Their feud was double-sided.Sure,Rick talked alot of shit about Prince,but Prince was no angel himself.When Rick's mother asked for his autograpgh,he ignored her.Then,in 1983,he showed up at a Rick James concert with his bodyguard (Chick) carrying him to his seat.This,of course,took attention away from the main attraction.Both of them behaved like children,and their feud was dumb and silly. Exactly! SynthiaRose said "I'm in love with blackguitaristz. Especially when he talks about Hendrix."
nammie "What BGZ says I believe. I have the biggest crush on him." http://ccoshea19.googlepa...ssanctuary http://ccoshea19.googlepages.com | |
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As far as to what Rick James said on the interview about Prince:
He was calling prince a "pretender", "a fishnet, high heel wearing something something" and variuos other names. It was actually funny watching James do the prince fingers around the eyes and lips with sound effects. He also said he would have tripped prince up and had his way (in reference to the Ball game) with him. Rick seemed kind of bitter when the discussion somehow ended up on prince. Again the Interview was NOT solely about P but rather about James's dealings with Charlie Murphy in reference to the BasketBall skit. For those that want to know it is on Disk 3 Of the new Season 2 DVD of Chappelle Show Under "Rick James extended interview" i believe. | |
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cranshaw62 said: Prince stole Vanity away which is well, top shelf p***y.(No disrespect to the ladies.)
Rick was really probably bitter about that especially since it was public. E, W and F and George Clinton were doing spin-off groups/outside production first. (Brides, Emotions, Pockets, etc.) IMHO I think Prince got a lot of ideas from Earth Wind And Fire while they were both managed by Cavallo and Co. The Senheiser mics, Fender Jazz Bass. Mesa Boogie amps, The Paisley Park label/studio. Maurice had all this going in 1979 with the ARC label and The Complex.(Feel free to correct the names. I don't feel like looking them up) You can see that in the Earh Wind And Fire In Concert 1982 HBO DVD. Back to Rick. He didn't win. Prince knew that sex sells and he used that to capture people's imagination but he had the music and the work ethic to back it up. And every year like clockwork he "did the work." He may have had problems like everyone but he didn't disappear like Sly or go the Elvis route. At he still looks great and is capable of giving the world good music. Rick after knowing he had health problems went and did all that drug stuff and he lost his life. Rick didn't give himself the chance to come back and show people. "Despite what I've been though here is my talent and my music." To the average person who doesn't know Rick's career three things will come to mind: "He was in jail, wasn't he?" "Can't touch this." "I'm Rick James, Bitch!" I'm sure he wanted a better legacy than that. [Edited 5/25/05 23:46pm] I agree with you on several points. Prince DID have the work ethics. That is why he has had some many nationwide tours under his belt, so many albums, 3 movies. And credits to for songs for so many different artists, different genre. That man lived on music and p***y. 
Also Rick took the fruits of his early labor and squander it instead of reinvesting his money and talent back in to his business, the music. It is too bad about Rick's legacy. I know, remember and love Rick James but you are right... most people know about his jail time, MC's sampling his song and Dave Chappelle show parodying him. Too bad.  "Remember, one man's filler is another man's killer" -- Haystack | |
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funkpill said: Hotlegs said: Give em' the keys Legs & let em' ride!!!! | |
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whodknee said:
Maybe in your world. An artist either continues to grow/evolve as Prince did or flames out like Rick (and many others). You can't keep making great music in the same vein. Besides, things work in cycles, so Prince can always come back to the funk whenever he's ready-- it'll just be different. It's probably good for Prince that Rick didn't come out with something hard after Purple Rain. If you don't follow your muse you're in for trouble. Well the worst thing an artist can do is to switch up at the top of their game. When their sales start to decline, then it's time for a change. As far as Prince "growing and evolving", if he had waited just five more years when rap and hip hop started taking over music in general and then put out the "artsy/fartsy" stuff, I would have welcomed it with open arms. As far as artists flaming out, with the exception of making a splash every blue moon, Prince pretty much flamed out himself also before the 1990s even arrived. The thing that keeps an artist alive is their hardcore fans that continue buying every single album they release. Prince is just lucky enough to have a much larger hardcore fan base than the average artist does. It would have been great if both Rick and Prince had put out an absolute great album after "Purple Rain" because, as a consumer, I want music that is desirable to my ears and, like the general public, could care less about Prince "growing" and "evolving". The music that came after "Purple Rain" is good but would I sacrifice Prince's growth for some more hardcore jams.....hell yeah. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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vainandy said: whodknee said:
Maybe in your world. An artist either continues to grow/evolve as Prince did or flames out like Rick (and many others). You can't keep making great music in the same vein. Besides, things work in cycles, so Prince can always come back to the funk whenever he's ready-- it'll just be different. It's probably good for Prince that Rick didn't come out with something hard after Purple Rain. If you don't follow your muse you're in for trouble. Well the worst thing an artist can do is to switch up at the top of their game. When their sales start to decline, then it's time for a change. As far as Prince "growing and evolving", if he had waited just five more years when rap and hip hop started taking over music in general and then put out the "artsy/fartsy" stuff, I would have welcomed it with open arms. As far as artists flaming out, with the exception of making a splash every blue moon, Prince pretty much flamed out himself also before the 1990s even arrived. The thing that keeps an artist alive is their hardcore fans that continue buying every single album they release. Prince is just lucky enough to have a much larger hardcore fan base than the average artist does. It would have been great if both Rick and Prince had put out an absolute great album after "Purple Rain" because, as a consumer, I want music that is desirable to my ears and, like the general public, could care less about Prince "growing" and "evolving". The music that came after "Purple Rain" is good but would I sacrifice Prince's growth for some more hardcore jams.....hell yeah.  True[Edited 5/26/05 16:42pm] | |
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vainandy said: murph said:
Ditto....Another thing that must be noted is that Rick resented (and rightly so) how Prince, the light skinned, rock playing, crossover negro received major play on MTV while the more hardcore R&B cat Rick James was barred from the station. There was a huge outcry at one point in '82 in which black artists complained nationally that they were being descriminated by MTV. So along comes Prince, a guy that was just opening up for Rick just two years earlier, getting major airplay with Little Red Corvette as well as the non threatening MJ...That's why he disliked Prince...It wasn't simple jealousy...But in recent years, Rick James has come to respect our boy P...He was even quoted as saying that Prince truely represented the FUNK....But by simply saying it's jealously is doing a disservice to Rick's legacy.... There's also word within the Rick James fan community, that MTV played Prince's videos simply because they learned that Rick James didn't like him and wanted to piss him off. Rick was a thorn in MTV's ass because he was demanding that they play his videos and openly calling them racists. It's something to think about because look how hard Michael Jackson had to fight to get his videos played in the beginning. CBS Records (Sony Music Entertainment) were threatening to pull out all of their white rock videos (including Ozzy) if MTV didn't play Michael Jackson's Billie Jean on their network. Yes indeed, Michael had it far worse trying to get a video on MTV than Prince, Lionel Richie, Tina Turner, or RUN-DMC ever did!!! | |
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TonyVanDam said: vainandy said: There's also word within the Rick James fan community, that MTV played Prince's videos simply because they learned that Rick James didn't like him and wanted to piss him off. Rick was a thorn in MTV's ass because he was demanding that they play his videos and openly calling them racists. It's something to think about because look how hard Michael Jackson had to fight to get his videos played in the beginning. CBS Records (Sony Music Entertainment) were threatening to pull out all of their white rock videos (including Ozzy) if MTV didn't play Michael Jackson's Billie Jean on their network. Yes indeed, Michael had it far worse trying to get a video on MTV than Prince, Lionel Richie, Tina Turner, or RUN-DMC ever did!!! It's a good thing MTV came to their senses just in time.They would have looked like fools if they had rejected the "Billie Jean" and "Beat It" videos. | |
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blackguitaristz said: vainandy said: There's also word within the Rick James fan community, that MTV played Prince's videos simply because they learned that Rick James didn't like him and wanted to piss him off. Rick was a thorn in MTV's ass because he was demanding that they play his videos and openly calling them racists. It's something to think about because look how hard Michael Jackson had to fight to get his videos played in the beginning. I heard the exact same thing. I remember that. I never understood why MTV refused to show Rick James' "SuperFreak" video.That song has an undeniable pop/New Wave sound to it,and it would have fit perfectly on their playlist.One could argue that some of his other songs are "pop-sounding" enough to have made their playlist. | |
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blackguitaristz said: DavidEye said: Good point.Their feud was double-sided.Sure,Rick talked alot of shit about Prince,but Prince was no angel himself.When Rick's mother asked for his autograpgh,he ignored her.Then,in 1983,he showed up at a Rick James concert with his bodyguard (Chick) carrying him to his seat.This,of course,took attention away from the main attraction.Both of them behaved like children,and their feud was dumb and silly. Exactly! Their feud was based on stupid nonsense.When Prince toured with James in 1980,Rick's people assumed that Prince and his entourage were acting "stuck up".It was just a silly misunderstanding.Instead of sitting down and talking about it,they both behaved like children.Rick went to the press and bashed Prince in interviews.Meanwhile,Prince showed up at a Rick James concert and stole the crowd's attention away from Rick.It's a feud that didn't really have to happen. | |
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Anyone else see the Interview? | |
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Handclapsfingasnapz said: we're well aware of the fact. thank you for repeatin it.
  u & me, we got mad chemisty | |
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Hotlegs said: Gr8muta said: Not sure if it's anything new but if you check out the new Chappelle show season 2 the extra's feature Rick James's side of the Charlie Murphy skit.
Rick James apparently disliked Prince a great deal. The interview shed a new light on James's view on the "pretender" to his throne. James was an awesome cat and all but we all know Prince was able to evolve into the genius/megastar he remains today. It was just interesting to see how James totally shunned prince. ....I still like Rick and all but damn, he was cold on P ! Well, it all boils down to this, Rick basically felt like he didn't have to be a fan of shit if he didn't want to. Simply, due to the fact that he's been in the buisiness longer than Prince. Plus, Rick gave Prince's career a boast by letting him having an opening spot on tour when he was just starting out and struggling. Furthermore, Rick felt that Prince stole alot of his ideas and used them to his advantage and don't give him credit (which some of P's protogees say he is known to do alot) . it all comes down to PURE JEALOUSY on Rick's part (rip). Rick didn't give Prince a career boast. Prince was an opening act, and if fans were hip to his funk, then it was Prince and the crowd. Why give Rick so much credit,,,it's not like he was a mentor to Prince... [Edited 5/25/05 21:27pm] u & me, we got mad chemisty | |
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prodigalfan said: murph said: Ditto....Another thing that must be noted is that Rick resented (and rightly so) how Prince, the light skinned, rock playing, crossover negro received major play on MTV while the more hardcore R&B cat Rick James was barred from the station. There was a huge outcry at one point in '82 in which black artists complained nationally that they were being descriminated by MTV. So along comes Prince, a guy that was just opening up for Rick just two years earlier, getting major airplay with Little Red Corvette as well as the non threatening MJ...That's why he disliked Prince...It wasn't simple jealousy...But in recent years, Rick James has come to respect our boy P...He was even quoted as saying that Prince truely represented the FUNK....But by simply saying it's jealously is doing a disservice to Rick's legacy....
[Edited 5/25/05 18:48pm] YES! I remember this! MTV was the new thing,and I remember watching Rosanna I don't know how many times, just waiting for an black act get some airplay. Then first MJ who might as well been white and Prince who started out saying that he was only 1/2 black and yes did play rock and crossed over to white audiences. I imagine that did piss RJ off. So.....???Rick was pissed, big deal...he was JEALOUS u & me, we got mad chemisty | |
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dealodelandron said: cranshaw62 said: Prince stole Vanity away which is well, top shelf p***y.(No disrespect to the ladies.)
This part here is the part that I think just really adds insult to injury as far as Rick was concerned. Anyone that thinks someone as fine as Vanity didn't play a major factor in Rick's hate for Prince is probably using as much coke as Rick did. Its not like Rick would not have done the same, but Prince straight stole her away from Rick and used the whole idea of the Mary Jane girls to put Vanity in the spotlight. Let's not forget P & Vanity had the cover of Rolling Stone. I'm sure Rick wasn't feelin that. So with Prince getting all kinds of recognition while Rick was getting shunned by a lot of folks within the industry, stealing Vanity, and Prince using a lot of Rick's ideas successfully, the hate was deeply rooted. Not that he wasn't justified in some way, but Rick never seemed to understand that his mouth got him into a lot of trouble. He was always calling folks out citing what he felt were major character flaws, but never really admitted any of his own. He destroyed himself. How does one still someone from someone? Vanity was noone's property...I never heard Prince tying her up and dragging her from Rick.... u & me, we got mad chemisty | |
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