Do you think there will be a positive change in terms of how music historians regard Prince's post 80's work? And is it justified?

Anji said:

Yes, a slight change. They will probably regard him as not falling off his perch until the mid-90s, I imagine The Gold Experience and Chaos & Disorder will get a fairer deal, and The Rainbow Children too.

Anji said:

Yes, in part. But, time doesn't make shit smell any sweeter.


» NouveauDance

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[Edited 9/12/04 12:34pm]

I'd imagine Come & The Truth will be considered unrealised gems too.

Anji said:

Those two are a foregone conclusion, but I also think The Gold Experience and The Rainbow Children will also be placed on that mantle in the weeks, months and years to come.

Who cares what illusionist revisionism whispers in the ears of the collective masses anyway? Opinions are lies opposed to personal truth. Parasitic writers whose ears are closed before they even press the play button. The review's always already written. Hearing but not listening is the norm. Pop life - the culture of the quick thrill.

Well anyway... I think most Prince albums are incredible works of art. That's all the justification I need. The man is obviously a genius. He was born knowing.
If a new young artist had released New Power Soul it'd be acclaimed as the 'Great Lost Prince Album' or 'The Album Prince Has Been Trying To Make For The Past Ten Years' by these contrary word fascists.
Prince was, is and no doubt always will be the most interesting artist working within popular music. The problem is we're all such spoiled children.

Number23 said:

Well put.

The content of the music isn't usually the first factor in the content of the review.

And this works both ways - Look at the reviews for Musicology.

NouveauDance said:

You got it. Let me kiss you in every nook and cranny.

Number23 said:

I'm no hermaphrodite, I only have one of those

NouveauDance said:

Mmmm..I guess 'cranny'. What's my prize?

Number23 said:

But before you get too comfortable . . . Don't simply differ to the critics being full of shit blah, blah blah. It's an interesting question and I'm glad someone asked one for once. The question is a much broader animal as it asks of what "historians" will think. Historians can be anybody, so for the moment scratch product-pushing critics off that list. What will Prince's post -80's work be like for you do you think? I wonder. Like some of you I'll revisit 'the truth' and 'gold experience.' I think packages like 'crystal ball' will only be better appreciated in terms of individual tracks. Looking back at albums from the sixties, seventies, the more cohesive an album the better it's remembered. His instrumental albums is what really stumps me. Who knows how the music community collective (whoever the hell that is-I made it up) will look back on rainbow children or others. How much interest does his madhouse projects get these days? Anyways, more insightful dialogue would be cool,

p.s. When people talk about Miles' Kind of Blue being great the question you ask is why? And then apply that principal to the original question.

Thanks VDubblin. You heard Number23? Now get to work you slacker.

Anji said:

Confusion!

Number23 said:

I.E. I agree with VDubblin that a part of your answer was a cop-out- the part referring to who gives a hoot about critics anyway. It still doesn't address how revisionists will alter their view of Prince's post 80's body of work, if at all. Of course, you still may just feel that it doesn't matter to you personally anyway. However, that isn't the point of the question.

I don't think there will be any change in hindsight with regards historians commentary on Prince's post 80's work. Simply because there was much more interesting and innovative music being made at the time. I think when trying to achieve an objective assesment of Prince's work and influence on popular music and culture the crux of it will be based on his work in the 1980s. A time when he was breaking new ground and creating new and innovative music. I think there may be a sligh reassesment on his 90s work, but I suspect that when discussing Prince's music as a collective, general opinion wouldn't differ so much as the reviews and opinions of today.

Here's a revisionist thought I recently read re: Emancipation:

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I love “Emancipation”. I think it’s one of his 10 best records. In the 80s you were lucky to get one great ballad per album, here alone you can find several of his greatest.

I was just trying to indicate that I would dedicate a great deal of the ink to acknowledging some of the truth behind the popular criticisms of this record: Drum tracks are mostly weak, too many slow love songs, synthetic production, safe, too much filler (“would have been a great single or double-disc set), uninspired cover songs, too pop-oriented/commercial (not enough rock or funk edge), etc.

But for me, the bottom line is that there are more good and great songs to be found here than a majority of groups or solo artists will produce in an entire career. I think if someone can get over the disappointment of this album not being anything akin to the astonishingly adventurous “Crystal Ball” and the “Album he was born to make”, they just might find a great deal to love here, especially if they are open to ballads and more conventional song writing, arrangements and production.

Anji said:

See, I need to listen to 'emancipation' again just to get another feel. At the time and this is primarily what makes this kind of forshadowing so difficult, I had other expectations, just like the quote above. But given enough time away from it and it may sound much different to me tomorrow. But that's just one opinion. Thirty years from now I think historians will pay special attention to it for it's ambition. They'll come for the ambition and stay for the replayability.

Personally out of all the albums post-80's I think the one that will be revisted and really commented on will be Exodus. It's incredibly cohesive and has a great sense of humor which I think most music lacks these days. (though you had 'midnight vultures' and some of the outkast stuff come out since then) But I think what makes this album special is it was so under everybody's radar. Even fans of Prince don't really know what to make of it. That's my whole thing, the humor. Prince has got great humor but rarely communicates it effectively. Anyways, the album's funky. It's working on so many levels and combined with the fact that it didn't ever get railroaded in the mainstream media. Even critics that like to bash his stuff didn't notice it. He kinda slipped it in there. I think it'll be one of those retro party records that'll grow in cult status. but anyways, i'm babbling.

I also don't think his rap fusion stuff will impress people, even light years from now. That's something I miss about wendy & lisa in the mix. It's like he could express his blackness in weird & beautiful ways without having to adopt both the production and rap aspects of modern black culture. The more he identifies himself with that genre the more he seems to not be his own voice anymore. I did like New Power Soul and think that might be another that critics, historians, you, we will give it's due.

So there you have it. Too much time on my hands,

Anji said:

I think there will be. Prolly 15 - 30 years from now. The Gold Experience will be praised as the TRUE follow-up to Purple Rain. And, NO critic will dare deny the genius that was The Rainbow Children.

I think, eventually, the albums Prince will be remembered for are Purple Rain and The Rainbow Children. A lot of people love that album (TRC), but just don't know it yet. Their children will definitely understand.

The critics initially hated it when Brian Wilson made the Beach Boys "weird." Now they praise those albums. I think the same will happen for The Rainbow Children. Prince reached an artistic peak that I sometimes doubt he will ever reach again.

Luv & Peace,
Alex
Clubbin' in Mpls/A Night w. Prince

Number23 said:

My crook

VDubblin said:

Interesting response, VDubblin. Yes, I do believe Emancipation will be considered in a more favourable light by historians (I'd imagine there'll be less wrestling with expectations).

Whilst I really do enjoy Exodus, I'd be very surprised if this side project gets any more coverage in the years to come. My overwhelming impression is that it's certainly been given the thumbs up as a fan favourite.

VDubblin said:

Interesting. Here's another revisionist perspective I recently came across...

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RE: Newpower Soul

The thing about Prince is that it is maddeningly difficult to dismiss any of his projects. I thought and still do that “Newpower Soul” was the best of the 3 NPG records. But this one had Prince’s mug on the cover and that completely changed expectations.

If he had hidden himself behind an alter ego like with most side projects, I believe this record would be viewed in entirely different way. Not that it would be highly respected by any stretch of the imagination, just that it wouldn’t have become this oft-discussed work that has almost become the synonym for Prince failure.

sloopydrew4u said:

Yes, I can magine positive reviews of The Gold Experience, and much more so for The Rainbow Children. However, I doubt TRC will be what he's remembered for (even if I feel it's one of the few he should be).

with THE CREATIVE SOURCE gone...all pre-xisting material with have it's worth by dgrees, but 2 whom, really, then?

2 come from the vault, only 2 return 2 a vault...poetic justice? or sheer irony?

Just as reviews changed over time for Stevie Wonder's Journey Through The Secret Life of Plants and Marvin Gaye's Here, My Dear, I believe the same could easily happen for several of P's 90's albums and TRC.