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PrintableMusicology doesn't break any new ground but it's far from DULL!
WDYWMTD?, IN MY OPINION, is one of the weaker songs on the CD... Which proves that this CD has something for everyone. LOTP even gets funky when he starts "shakin' like a leaf on a tree". Seriously, some of you just need to put the CD in, press "play", and feel the music. Stop analyzing every aspect of every song. We all know that Prince doesn't half-step when it comes to musicianship, shit, even Jughead has it's moments. Thanks for the laughs, arguments and overall enjoyment for the last umpteen years. It's time for me to retire from Prince.org and engage in the real world...lol. Above all, I appreciated the talent Prince. You were one of a kind. | |
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andyman91 said: Jestyr said: There's a bass progression in What Do U Want Me 2 Do? that is VERY similar to one in I Can't Help It from Michael Jackson's Off The Wall record, but to say that WDUWM2D sounds like OTW is a sweeping generalization. Additionally, I Can't Help It was written by Stevie Wonder, so, if anything, Prince was emulating a Stevie Wonder joint not a Michael Jackson one. And to complain about that fact is missing the point of this project to begin with. Musicology is ABOUT returning to Prince's musical roots, so every song has some element of a sentimental yearning for return to or of some past period. The original post didn't complain about it sounding like Mike, he said it was one of the best songs on the album, and that it sounded like MJ. "I can't help it" is on Off the Wall, right? People seem offended to have Prince compared to Michael Jackson. I'm not a fan, but Off the Wall is a well written, incredibly produced album. Any comparison to Off the Wall is like a comparison to Quincy Jones and, as you said, Stevie Wonder (in the case of that song) as much as Micheal Jackson. Not so bad, in my opinion. MJ can't compare to Prince as an individual artist, but he has surrounded himself with great talent. To say that Prince's guitar solo on some song reminds someone of Beat It would not be an insult to Prince. yes I can't help It is on Off The Wall. I think you can compare P and Mj in terms of singing/songwriting.coz they are just perfect. But you can't compare MJ to P interms of instrumentalism (mj is pretty good at guitar, piano and drums tho.) And you can't compare P to MJ at performin/dancing(prince is a nice mover and is cool on stage too) just giving credit where it is due | |
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Oh, fabulous. Another thread turns into Mike/Prince comparisons... This post not for the wimp contingent. All whiny wusses avert your eyes. | |
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Supernova said: Oh, fabulous. Another thread turns into Mike/Prince comparisons...
exacly. i didnt start it, did I?  | |
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EvilWhiteMale said: I see Matty is now proving the point I was making in my "Negativity on the org" thread.
Keep up the good work. But be careful, the fams may start putting you in their hate file.  And proving your point is very important to you... He started one thread...and made some quite strange observations about it...that frankly most of us simply don't agree with. keep up the good work?  Christian Zombie Vampires | |
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Supernova said: Oh, fabulous. Another thread turns into Mike/Prince comparisons...
They must really be comparable. Check this song out at:
http://www.soundclick.com...tmusic.htm | |
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andyman91 said: Jestyr said: There's a bass progression in What Do U Want Me 2 Do? that is VERY similar to one in I Can't Help It from Michael Jackson's Off The Wall record, but to say that WDUWM2D sounds like OTW is a sweeping generalization. Additionally, I Can't Help It was written by Stevie Wonder, so, if anything, Prince was emulating a Stevie Wonder joint not a Michael Jackson one. And to complain about that fact is missing the point of this project to begin with. Musicology is ABOUT returning to Prince's musical roots, so every song has some element of a sentimental yearning for return to or of some past period. The original post didn't complain about it sounding like Mike, he said it was one of the best songs on the album, and that it sounded like MJ. "I can't help it" is on Off the Wall, right? People seem offended to have Prince compared to Michael Jackson. I'm not a fan, but Off the Wall is a well written, incredibly produced album. Any comparison to Off the Wall is like a comparison to Quincy Jones and, as you said, Stevie Wonder (in the case of that song) as much as Micheal Jackson. Not so bad, in my opinion. MJ can't compare to Prince as an individual artist, but he has surrounded himself with great talent. To say that Prince's guitar solo on some song reminds someone of Beat It would not be an insult to Prince. I'd certainly say that when P came out, his music sounded similar to MJ. I can certainly see similaritys without a problem. He changed that with Dirty Mind and has never been anywhere close since. I think they were compared after that period, due to the fact that they were both male, black and making pop music...but their styles have never been even close. What do u want me to do...may sound similar to I can't help it...but he didn't have that song in mind when he made it. There is no influence there. And certainly comparing a song to Off the Wall as a whole...um  don't think so. Much more disco all over that thing. I'd say I can't help it is almost a stand out as it doesn't follow the "formula" that's exists on that disk.Christian Zombie Vampires | |
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1st of all MJ might play a few chords on piano kinda like what Madonna is doing now on guitar but MJ really does'nt play a damn thing. Where in the hell did that false info come from? U,ME,WE!....2FUNKY! | |
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superspaceboy said: andyman91 said: The original post didn't complain about it sounding like Mike, he said it was one of the best songs on the album, and that it sounded like MJ. "I can't help it" is on Off the Wall, right? People seem offended to have Prince compared to Michael Jackson. I'm not a fan, but Off the Wall is a well written, incredibly produced album. Any comparison to Off the Wall is like a comparison to Quincy Jones and, as you said, Stevie Wonder (in the case of that song) as much as Micheal Jackson. Not so bad, in my opinion. MJ can't compare to Prince as an individual artist, but he has surrounded himself with great talent. To say that Prince's guitar solo on some song reminds someone of Beat It would not be an insult to Prince. I'd certainly say that when P came out, his music sounded similar to MJ. I can certainly see similaritys without a problem. He changed that with Dirty Mind and has never been anywhere close since. I think they were compared after that period, due to the fact that they were both male, black and making pop music...but their styles have never been even close. What do u want me to do...may sound similar to I can't help it...but he didn't have that song in mind when he made it. There is no influence there. And certainly comparing a song to Off the Wall as a whole...um don't think so. Much more disco all over that thing. I'd say I can't help it is almost a stand out as it doesn't follow the "formula" that's exists on that disk.No, he definitely didn't copy the song, it's just reminiscent of it. Actually Alliyah has a song on her last record that sounds more like it than What Do U want.... I'm sure he really was looking back on his own material like Dorothy Parker, which he had been playing recently. Check this song out at:
http://www.soundclick.com...tmusic.htm | |
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ELBOOGY said: 1st of all MJ might play a few chords on piano kinda like what Madonna is doing now on guitar but MJ really does'nt play a damn thing. Where in the hell did that false info come from?
lol. he's good at it. in his biography, it says he took lessons since he was 11. and he is fine at guitar too. if you listen morphine, you'll se he is pretty fine. he does drums and percussion also in that song. and most of the instrumentations on invincible and some on history too are done by him. so please let's stop that my postar beats your thing pls | |
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LightOfArt said:[quote] ELBOOGY said: 1st of all MJ might play a few chords on piano kinda like what Madonna is doing now on guitar but MJ really does'nt play a damn thing. Where in the hell did that false info come from?
lol. he's good at it. in his biography, it says he took lessons since he was 11. and he is fine at guitar too. if you listen morphine, you'll se he is pretty fine. he does drums and percussion also in that song. and most of the instrumentations on invincible and some on history too are done by him. so please let's stop that my postar beats your thing pls[/quoteELBOOGY SAYS!!0(+> Enuff $$ can buy u a whole new identity! If MJ can play anything besides piano(from my musician sources) J-LO sings better than Patti Labelle! [This message was edited Fri Jul 9 15:04:12 2004 by ELBOOGY] U,ME,WE!....2FUNKY! | |
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ELBOOGY said:[quote] LightOfArt said: ELBOOGY said: 1st of all MJ might play a few chords on piano kinda like what Madonna is doing now on guitar but MJ really does'nt play a damn thing. Where in the hell did that false info come from?
lol. he's good at it. in his biography, it says he took lessons since he was 11. and he is fine at guitar too. if you listen morphine, you'll se he is pretty fine. he does drums and percussion also in that song. and most of the instrumentations on invincible and some on history too are done by him. so please let's stop that my postar beats your thing pls[/quoteELBOOGY SAYS!!0(+> Enuff $$ can buy u a whole new identity! If MJ can play anything besides piano(from my musician sources) J-LO sings better than Patti Labelle! [This message was edited Fri Jul 9 15:04:12 2004 by ELBOOGY] ok keep closing your eyes to the facts | |
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QuakeXLE said: simply put
This is not his best...nor his worst. There are songs which I absolutely love..and those which I can do with out. I tire of peeps always comparing each album to its predeccessors so harshly. Enjoy it for what is is...and you will sleep a lot better knowing somebody really digs this music...even if you don't. Its still Prince and we are showing him support. He isnt perfect. And he cant please all the poeple all the time. So just be satisfied..you're not pleased...but dont look so shocked cause other peeps have different opinions and a lot are. I agree  If he were still making the same type of music from the 80's people would grow tired of it. Wasn't it MJ that was criticized for not having a "new" sound. No artist can please everyone all the time. The ones that are so harsh in their judgements should be judged with that same harshness.  U want me to swivel in your love seat, don't
u baby. | |
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MattyJam said: Nothing like defensive fanatics without an ounce of objectivity...
Musicology is a commerical record for commercial means. It was blatantly calculated for airplay. And it worked. "Goody" for Prince. But a classic? I'm sorry, Sign O The Times it will never be. Sloopydrew - In regard to Illusion, Coma... I guess most fans are a sucker for an instant pop hook. If I wanted that I'd buy a Britney album. Look.. I'm very happy for you that you have such confidence, but you should be realistic as well. I don't think Musicology is a "classic" either but I don't go around acting like I'm Mister Objectivity. Even critics who did not like Musicology as a whole praised different tracks than you did. People always cite the example of Johnny Cash as someone who stayed fresh very long, but they are also comparing apples to oranges. Prince is the ultimate generalist, someone who made his name by putting his own twist to various genres. That is clearly harder to achieve in a continuously startling way than expanding on a country sound. Expecting Prince to come out with another 1999 or SOTT is thinking The Beatles could still be putting out Rubber Souls and White Albums if they were still somehow together. That's how high the bar is for Prince, and I think any critic or fan worht his or her salt should take this under consideration when assessing Prince's recent output. It is an extremely tough spot to be in. The very fact there his creativity and inventiveness is still debated is a rather healthy sign for an artist of his longevity. Think about it... no one's expecting any other artist to wow them in so many styles. The very fact the expectation is still somehow there (despite all the denials) speaks volume. That's my take on this topic. Nothing more nothing less. [This message was edited Fri Jul 9 16:03:51 2004 by Aerogram] | |
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LightOfArt said: ELBOOGY said: lol. he's good at it. in his biography, it says he took lessons since he was 11. and he is fine at guitar too. if you listen morphine, you'll se he is pretty fine. he does drums and percussion also in that song. and most of the instrumentations on invincible and some on history too are done by him. so please let's stop that my postar beats your thing pls[/quoteELBOOGY SAYS!!0(+> Enuff $$ can buy u a whole new identity! If MJ can play anything besides piano(from my musician sources) J-LO sings better than Patti Labelle! [This message was edited Fri Jul 9 15:04:12 2004 by ELBOOGY] ok keep closing your eyes to the facts The fact is MJ does'nt play drums,guitar or any instrument! He doodles with piano and beatboxes! The so called facts in the book was Millie Vanillied,made up. I'm tellin u what Musicians who've done studio work with MJ namely Rod Temperton who written most of MJ's best songs on OTW and Thriller has stated 2me personally! R. Temperton played with a group from his hometown of Dayton OH. called Heatwave. He use 2 talk about workin with MJ all of the time and said that MJ was a genius at grasping the emotions of songs that he did'nt write and make them his own,but was amazed that MJ could'nt play any instruments,and this was back in 1986! R. Temperton wrote the ballad 'Always and Forever' 1 of the most played at weddings of all time! Y do u think that there r no film footage of MJ playing any damn thing. Even at award shows where he EGO trips on all of his accomplishments....u never see him play shit! It was made up, i'm sorry i had 2 tell ya like this but that's a fact! [This message was edited Fri Jul 9 16:40:34 2004 by ELBOOGY] U,ME,WE!....2FUNKY! | |
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ELBOOGY said: LightOfArt said: ok keep closing your eyes to the facts The fact is MJ does'nt play drums,guitar or any instrument! He doodles with piano and beatboxes! The so called facts in the book was Millie Vanillied,made up. I'm tellin u what Musicians who've done studio work with MJ namely Rod Temperton who written most of MJ's best songs on OTW and Thriller has stated 2me personally! R. Temperton played with a group from his hometown of Dayton OH. called Heatwave. He use 2 talk about workin with MJ all of the time and said that MJ was a genius at grasping the emotions of songs that he did'nt write and make them his own,but was amazed that MJ could'nt play any instruments,and this was back in 1986! R. Temperton wrote the ballad 'Always and Forever' 1 of the most played at weddings of all time! Y do u think that there r no film footage of MJ playing any damn thing. Even at award shows where he EGO trips on all of his accomplishments....u never see him play shit! It was made up, i'm sorry i had 2 tell ya like this but that's a fact! [This message was edited Fri Jul 9 16:40:34 2004 by ELBOOGY] Thank you! Have you seen MJ so much as pick up a tambourine in any of videos, let alone a concert? Talk about Phantom Musician... | |
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Also, comparin WDUWM2D to music off Off the Wall is kinda lame. I understand the reminiscing to I Can't Help It, but it's basically apples and oranges. Only a defensive MJ fan would come to a P-site to compare his latest workings to MJ music of 20plus years ago. How about we compare MJ's and P's most recent activities--Prince's sold out concert tour, and MJ's last performance of the moonwalk on a limosene? I thought he had better promoters working for him..... | |
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ELBOOGY said: LightOfArt said: ok keep closing your eyes to the facts The fact is MJ does'nt play drums,guitar or any instrument! He doodles with piano and beatboxes! The so called facts in the book was Millie Vanillied,made up. I'm tellin u what Musicians who've done studio work with MJ namely Rod Temperton who written most of MJ's best songs on OTW and Thriller has stated 2me personally! R. Temperton played with a group from his hometown of Dayton OH. called Heatwave. He use 2 talk about workin with MJ all of the time and said that MJ was a genius at grasping the emotions of songs that he did'nt write and make them his own,but was amazed that MJ could'nt play any instruments,and this was back in 1986! R. Temperton wrote the ballad 'Always and Forever' 1 of the most played at weddings of all time! Y do u think that there r no film footage of MJ playing any damn thing. Even at award shows where he EGO trips on all of his accomplishments....u never see him play shit! It was made up, i'm sorry i had 2 tell ya like this but that's a fact! [This message was edited Fri Jul 9 16:40:34 2004 by ELBOOGY] as I said keep beliving that he can't play them, if it will make you happy. but there's a footage of him playing I'll be there on piano. Dangerous The Short Films. If he was takig credit just to satisfy his EGO, why he only takes credit for percussion drums, piano and guitar. coz he can only play them. Ok...I know how you feel most hardcore Prince fans are the same way .they love to underrate MJ. Believe me he plays the guitar. He and his brothers used to steal Joe's guitar. Anyway that conversation is getting so silly. I don't have to prove you anything. | |
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Whereas I do like the single Musicology, as with most Prince albums over the last few years (i.e. 10) it is going to have to grow on me. The back to basics with instruments is good, but there was never much of a stray into computers etc. The downside is that the hype generated by so called experts has pushed the album along as a "revival" when in essence it is just his next album. Over here in the UK all the magazine articles always come back to previous work, so what do jounalists know. These same journalists also rate Coldplay, so they have to be dellusional. Verdict : On the cusp | |
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superspaceboy said: EvilWhiteMale said: I see Matty is now proving the point I was making in my "Negativity on the org" thread.
Keep up the good work. But be careful, the fams may start putting you in their hate file. And proving your point is very important to you... He started one thread...and made some quite strange observations about it...that frankly most of us simply don't agree with. keep up the good work? Yes, it's a good thread. "You need people like me so you can point your fuckin' fingers and say, "That's the bad guy." "
Al Pacino- Scarface | |
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Musicology is like a wet rag. You can use it for a while, but then sooner or later the juice runs out. | |
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I'm sure MJ doesn't equate himself with Prince in being a musical whiz-kid. Just as I'm sure Prince realises that his vocal, dance and performance skills pale in comparison to Michael's.
Everyone has a different forte. As much as many of the fanatical loons on this board like to believe that Prince is the best singer, the best dancer, the best performer, the best songwriter, the best... everything... he isn't. It's all subjective and a matter of taste... but I'd definately say that Prince's vocals aren't in a league with MJ's. When you hear MJ sing a song like They Don't Care About Us, he translates the emotion in his voice in a way Prince simply can't. You can feel his anger in the pit of your stomach - you can feel it physically - such is the extent of his vocal abilities. In regards to MJ playing instruments... you don't need to be Beethoven to write a four and a half minute pop song. Look at "The Cross" - one of Prince's finest tracks... made up of two (very simple) guitar chords. All you need is a basic understand of chord sequences really... [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 7:52:53 2004 by MattyJam] | |
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. [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 7:51:35 2004 by MattyJam] | |
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MattyJam said: I'm sure MJ doesn't equate himself with Prince in being a musical whiz-kid. Just as I'm sure Prince realises that his vocal, dance and performance skills pale in comparison to Michael's.
Everyone has a different forte. As much as many of the fanatical loons on this board like to believe that Prince is the best singer, the best dancer, the best performer, the best songwriter, the best... everything... he isn't. It's all subjective and a matter of taste... but I'd definately say that Prince's vocals aren't in a league with MJ's. When you hear MJ sing a song like They Don't Care About Us, he translates the emotion in his voice in a way Prince simply can't. You can feel his anger in the pit of your stomach - you can feel it physically - such is the extent of his vocal abilities. In regards to MJ playing instruments... you don't need to be Beethoven to write a four and a half minute pop song. Look at "The Cross" - one of Prince's finest tracks... made up of two (very simple) guitar chords. All you need is a basic understand of chord sequences really... [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 7:52:53 2004 by MattyJam] 
Everybody knows MJ isnt a GREAT instrumentalist. He is just ok at them. And I respect him that he isnt trying to prove such a thing. You know, "some" artists learn couple of chords and play them on stage to sell themselves as "instrumentalists" | |
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MattyJam said: Come on... anyone who seriously believes this album is any better than Rave or Emancipation is seriously deluded. And anyone who believes Musicology is a return to his eighties standards has been reading too many reviews from music critics who hail Diamonds & Pearls as a record all future Prince releases should aspire towards.
With the exception of the gorgeous On The Couch and the very MJ-reminiscent What Do U Want Me 2 Do, the album is very weak, especially considering it only has twelve tracks. The title is a re-hash of a record he made three years ago, which wasn't even that special itself. Illusion, Coma... is a straight out pop record disguised as a "funk" work-out, for those who actually know very little about the genre. Life O The Party is the weakest and most offensive offering I've heard since Jughead. Cinnamon Girl is yet another bland soft-rock stadium filler that would sound better off on a Bon Jovi album where it really belongs. Call My Name is nice, but when you compare it to something like U Make My Sunshine with Angie Stone, you realise how below par it is. And Reflection is trying to be Circle Of Amour and falling flat on it's face everytime. If Musicology had tanked the way Rave did, it would not get the appreciation many of the fans give it - I'm sure of that much. [This message was edited Thu Jul 8 9:28:24 2004 by MattyJam] Not better than Rave? Well that's your opinion but I strongly disagree. No I don't think it's better than Emancipation but I love Emancipation and I get the feeling that you don't. I honestly think that Musicology is a very consistent album. And I like the fact that it only has 12 tracks. I find that sometimes Prince includes too many songs on his cd's. I agree with you that it is not as great as many of his eighties albums. I think Musicology is lacking two or three killer singles which is what the eighties albums had. But it is still a very good album. Probably the best that we can expect from him. | |
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ELBOOGY said: FunkMistress said:  As do I. Nothing about this song reminds me of "Off The Wall," an album I know quite well.
Like paisleypark4 said, Musicology might be tame compared with other Prince releases, I don't find it the least bit dull. It's a sweet, enjoyable record, with some truly ass-kicking moments. Five years later, I barely listen to Rave, but Musicology grows on me more and more. I have a feeling it will become a classic of sorts in its own time. I agree FunkMistress. It's tamed but enjoyable! And MJ wish he had some shit that sounded like that! If MJ would not take himself so seriously, his stuff might sound like that again, someday!! "Love is like peeing in your pants, everyone sees it but only you feel its warmth" |
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I know the 80s stuff is classic, but to be honest I rarely listen to that stuff anymore. I more apt to listen to the downloads thru NPGMC or the 90s stuff on up til now. I think if the old albums are remastered I would go listen to them again. Yeah course I know SignOAroundthePurple1999 are classic! I like the new album cause it was not too watered down with religion mumbo jumbo and not too jazzy but jazzy just enough. It rates up with Emancipation, Rave and TGE..well maybe not TGE! Its no New Power Soul or collection of old songs thrown together like CBall, Its about time that guy did some house cleaning and released Crystal Ball 2?! Spanning the beginning til now! | |
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ChadtheRTF said: The Rainbow Children was a masterpiece. Seriously, it was like a more mature version of Lovesexy.
 I agree 100%! That's exactly how I summed it up in some review I wrote back when he first released the tracks at the music club. I think Prince reached a new artistic peak with The Rainbow Children, and I hope he'll climb it again (even though I DO enjoy both Musicology and The Chocolate Invasion)!
Luv & Peace, Alex Clubbin' in Mpls/A Night w. Prince | |
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LightOfArt said: ELBOOGY said: The fact is MJ does'nt play drums,guitar or any instrument! He doodles with piano and beatboxes! The so called facts in the book was Millie Vanillied,made up. I'm tellin u what Musicians who've done studio work with MJ namely Rod Temperton who written most of MJ's best songs on OTW and Thriller has stated 2me personally! R. Temperton played with a group from his hometown of Dayton OH. called Heatwave. He use 2 talk about workin with MJ all of the time and said that MJ was a genius at grasping the emotions of songs that he did'nt write and make them his own,but was amazed that MJ could'nt play any instruments,and this was back in 1986! R. Temperton wrote the ballad 'Always and Forever' 1 of the most played at weddings of all time! Y do u think that there r no film footage of MJ playing any damn thing. Even at award shows where he EGO trips on all of his accomplishments....u never see him play shit! It was made up, i'm sorry i had 2 tell ya like this but that's a fact! [This message was edited Fri Jul 9 16:40:34 2004 by ELBOOGY] as I said keep beliving that he can't play them, if it will make you happy. but there's a footage of him playing I'll be there on piano. Dangerous The Short Films. If he was takig credit just to satisfy his EGO, why he only takes credit for percussion drums, piano and guitar. coz he can only play them. Ok...I know how you feel most hardcore Prince fans are the same way .they love to underrate MJ. Believe me he plays the guitar. He and his brothers used to steal Joe's guitar. Anyway that conversation is getting so silly. I don't have to prove you anything. [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 13:37:57 2004 by ELBOOGY] [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 13:40:17 2004 by ELBOOGY] [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 13:41:10 2004 by ELBOOGY] U,ME,WE!....2FUNKY! | |
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ELBOOGY said: LightOfArt said: as I said keep beliving that he can't play them, if it will make you happy. but there's a footage of him playing I'll be there on piano. Dangerous The Short Films. If he was takig credit just to satisfy his EGO, why he only takes credit for percussion drums, piano and guitar. coz he can only play them. Ok...I know how you feel most hardcore Prince fans are the same way .they love to underrate MJ. Believe me he plays the guitar. He and his brothers used to steal Joe's guitar. Anyway that conversation is getting so silly. I don't have to prove you anything. [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 13:37:57 2004 by ELBOOGY] [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 13:40:17 2004 by ELBOOGY] [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 13:41:10 2004 by ELBOOGY] u got no proof to NONE of the things u said as you got NO proof that he has credited him playing them. If you don't belive the liner notes than I have every right to say Prince doesnt write his songs. But let's not fool our selves. Coz MJ play them and P writes those songs. And Moonwalk aint got nothing to do with Jeffrey. There was a dance move called "Back Slide",MJ took it and perfected it and made it more like an illusion and thats how moonwalk was created. But BackSlide aint got nothing to do with Shalamar. Check out Off The Wall album credits. He is credited for playin Percussions. It was way before he developed an ego. And if you got Off The Wall Special Edition you can hear the home demos of Don't Stop and Workin' Day And night being played by MICHAEL and Randy.(1978) Man just accept it. you're embarassing yourself  [This message was edited Sat Jul 10 14:03:22 2004 by LightOfArt] | |
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