violetcrush said:

benni said:

I guess that's where we differ, pink. I appreciate the song, period, and maybe even more so if it speaks to me about something I may be going through, or something I've experienced. That's what makes art so wonderful, when it speaks personally to the individual partaking of the art. I don't need to understand who was around when, or who he was sleeping with at the time, to appreciate the music. I guess I internalize the music and the lyrics and don't need to externalize it to appreciate it.

I think the interest/fascination with learning the subject of some of his love songs comes from how direct and specific the lyrics often were.

*

If you listen to "Violet The Organ Grinder" and watch the video....well, my goodness! He was mad, he was pointing at the camera, and he wanted that girl to know how pissed off he was that she left. Fascinating!! And then I start looking for clues in the lyrics, because they are usually there....

He did seem quite angry in the video for Violet. At the end of the videos for ANOTHERLOVE and Fury as well. Those songs and videos do seem as though they were aimed at someone specific.

violetcrush said:

petalthecat said:

benni said: I totally agree. P was known to have "stretched the truth" or contradicted himself in interviews, so I take whatever he has said about song writing with a pinch of salt. Songs could have been inspired by someone in particular, either a current relationship or maybe from years before if the song had been shelved and brought out and reworked. Songs could have been about nobody, just like a novelist invents a character and story. Songs could be about more than one person, both Carmen and Mayte lay claim to tmbgiw. They aren't being deceitful,it will be what P told them. For all the above reasons, it's best to just enjoy the song. Speculation is a waste of time, we will never know the truth!

Right - even though I believe Prince did write songs for or inspired by specific people throughout his life, the reality is he did not want the facts or details out there. He wanted the mystery. This discussion is exactly what he wanted and expected. I have no doubt that he at least occasionally surfed this site and read the comments/opinions about his songs, personal life, etc. Actually, we know he did, because they found prince.org under his search history on his PC.

I agree. I think that he did at times place enough clues in the lyrics though that the person who inspired the song would be aware that he was referring to them. I didn't know that they found the org in his search history. I remember there was speculation about him posting here anonymously several years back.

*

The funny thing about TMBGITW is that the main message of the song is the importance of inner beauty, not outer beauty....

"And if the stars ever fell one by one from the sky
I know Mars could not be, uh, to far behind
'Cause baby, this kind of beauty has got no reason to ever be shy
'Cause honey, this kind of beauty is the kind that comes from inside"

pinkcashmere23 said:

violetcrush said:

Right - even though I believe Prince did write songs for or inspired by specific people throughout his life, the reality is he did not want the facts or details out there. He wanted the mystery. This discussion is exactly what he wanted and expected. I have no doubt that he at least occasionally surfed this site and read the comments/opinions about his songs, personal life, etc. Actually, we know he did, because they found prince.org under his search history on his PC.

I agree. I think that he did at times place enough clues in the lyrics though that the person who inspired the song would be aware that he was referring to them. I didn't know that they found the org in his search history. I remember there was speculation about him posting here anonymously several years back.

*

The funny thing about TMBGITW is that the main message of the song is the importance of inner beauty, not outer beauty....

"And if the stars ever fell one by one from the sky
I know Mars could not be, uh, to far behind
'Cause baby, this kind of beauty has got no reason to ever be shy
'Cause honey, this kind of beauty is the kind that comes from inside"

Yes, the information was part of the investigation documents. Investigators were told that he would check this site after shows to look for any comments about the show. But, I'm sure he was reading other things too

violetcrush said:

pinkcashmere23 said:

violetcrush said:

I think the interest/fascination with learning the subject of some of his love songs comes from how direct and specific the lyrics often were.

*

If you listen to "Violet The Organ Grinder" and watch the video....well, my goodness! He was mad, he was pointing at the camera, and he wanted that girl to know how pissed off he was that she left. Fascinating!! And then I start looking for clues in the lyrics, because they are usually there....

He did seem quite angry in the video for Violet. At the end of the videos for ANOTHERLOVE and Fury as well. Those songs and videos do seem as though they were aimed at someone specific.

Oh, definitely for Violet and Fury. In the Fury video he sticks his tongue out at the camera

NotACleverName said:

violetcrush said:

Really??? Wow, that is surprising. Especially reading an interview with his Engineer Hans who stated he had to fight to get that song included on the Rave album. Prince thought it was too personal to release. I think it ties in with many of his "love lost" songs throughout the 90's, but of course, just my opinion. I digress.....

I say that because I know exactly where you are directing the conversation (you know this too, violet). There is a reason why I said "Fly has a protege" in another thread.

No, honestly, not trying to re-direct the conversation. The comment was meant to support the notion that he really did communicate through his songs, and he was quite direct in many of them. Not even going to go there with my thoughts on who, what, why or how....not in this forum!!

violetcrush said:

pinkcashmere23 said:

He did seem quite angry in the video for Violet. At the end of the videos for ANOTHERLOVE and Fury as well. Those songs and videos do seem as though they were aimed at someone specific.

Oh, definitely for Violet and Fury. In the Fury video he sticks his tongue out at the camera

That was the part of the video that I had in mind.

Ha hilarious!

-

Curious to see what the mods have in mind! Interested to see this section return to a robust discussion of the professional work of all the folks prince collaborated with over his long career -- I hope that people who have great insights into various eras' associates haven't all been driven off and will come back to share! I used to learn a lot from those diverse contributors.

poppys said:

benni said:

lol - that reminded me of my daughter when she was little:

Absolutely Adorable! Love the glint in her

I'm excited too, and love learning from others

disch said:

Ha hilarious!

-

Curious to see what the mods have in mind! Interested to see this section return to a robust discussion of the professional work of all the folks prince collaborated with over his long career -- I hope that people who have great insights into various eras' associates haven't all been driven off and will come back to share! I used to learn a lot from those diverse contributors.

poppys said:

Absolutely Adorable! Love the glint in her

PennyPurple said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Just wait until we present it

lol getting all stressed out lol

disch said:

Ha hilarious!

-

Curious to see what the mods have in mind! Interested to see this section return to a robust discussion of the professional work of all the folks prince collaborated with over his long career -- I hope that people who have great insights into various eras' associates haven't all been driven off and will come back to share! I used to learn a lot from those diverse contributors.

poppys said:

Absolutely Adorable! Love the glint in her

Presently, there are numerous active threads on former Prince collaborators and their "professional work." Various Orgers initiated the threads. Here are but a few that provide plenty of "insights" and updates. If none of these strike your interest, disch (and this applies to everyone), perhaps you could start a thread or two and help to provide some intellectual stimulation here on Prince.org. Just my .

1. Actress Damaris Lewis poses at photo call with cast of 'BlacKkKlansman' at the 71st Cannes Film Festival (FlyOnTheWall)
   
2. Andre Cymone interview in The Quietus (on Prince and 1969) (PriceAndTheRevolution)
   
3. Excellent Susan rogers interview (in depth) (Strawberrylova123)
   
4. Celebrate 30 years of Lovesexy at the PRINCE LOVESEXY SYMPOSIUM featuring CAT GLOVER, INGRID CHAVEZ & DR. FINK (Latin)
   
5. Article: THE REVOLUTION'S Matt ‘Dr.’ Fink deconstructs Prince’s pioneering use of synthesizers (Latin)
   
6. ST. PAUL posted nice recent photos of him with SHELBY J., LIV WARFIELD, MAYTE, SUSANNAH & the NPG HORNZ (Latin)
   
7. MonoNeon interview about working with Prince (lrn36)
8. 80s flashback: "Be Your Man" by Jesse Johnson's Revue (1985) (SoulAlive)
9. The Time "Cool" (1981) (SoulAlive)
10. Lenny Says He Has Songs In The Vault (ISaidLifeIsJustAGame)
    
    
    

[Edited 5/16/18 12:03pm]

luv4u said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Just wait until we present it

Ohhh yesssss

i'm female.

-

I don't there's anything particularly "deep" about interpreting lyrics in a very literal, very simplistic way -- I.e., they're a love note about and directed to one woman, and one woman only, and that woman is one of the girlfriends who's publicly known via gossip coverage -- or in focusing only on lyrics instead taking the time to develop an understanding of compositions as a whole.

violetcrush said:

pinkcashmere23 said:

I think we might be dealing with a "male vs. female" thought process here Not to stereotype, but females tend to gravitate toward the more emotional/deeper side of things.

*

However, I think it's hard to separate the lyrics from the instrumental piece of his music - they work together to create the specific "feel" or message he was trying to convey at that time. I do think it is obvious that on some of his more personal songs, such as Empty Room, the lyrics were an integral part of the song and very important to him. I think the fact that it took him years to pull that amazing song out of the Vault speaks to its significance.

[Edited 5/16/18 8:12am]

[Edited 5/16/18 12:16pm]

OldFriends4Sale said:

PennyPurple said:

lol getting all stressed out lol

.

disch said:

i'm female.

-

I don't there's anything particularly "deep" about interpreting lyrics in a very literal, very simplistic way -- I.e., they're a love note about and directed to one woman, and one woman only, and that woman is one of the girlfriends who's publicly known via gossip coverage -- or in focusing only on lyrics instead taking the time to develop an understanding of compositions as a whole.

violetcrush said:

I think we might be dealing with a "male vs. female" thought process here Not to stereotype, but females tend to gravitate toward the more emotional/deeper side of things.

*

However, I think it's hard to separate the lyrics from the instrumental piece of his music - they work together to create the specific "feel" or message he was trying to convey at that time. I do think it is obvious that on some of his more personal songs, such as Empty Room, the lyrics were an integral part of the song and very important to him. I think the fact that it took him years to pull that amazing song out of the Vault speaks to its significance.

[Edited 5/16/18 8:12am]

[Edited 5/16/18 12:16pm]

I agree. I wish he had recorded a newer version of Empty Room and released it on one of the later albums. I think the one with 3rd Eye Girl that he shared was great!

pinkcashmere23 said:

disch said:

i'm female.

-

I don't there's anything particularly "deep" about interpreting lyrics in a very literal, very simplistic way -- I.e., they're a love note about and directed to one woman, and one woman only, and that woman is one of the girlfriends who's publicly known via gossip coverage -- or in focusing only on lyrics instead taking the time to develop an understanding of compositions as a whole.

[Edited 5/16/18 12:16pm]

I agree. I wish he had recorded a newer version of Empty Room and released it on one of the later albums. I think the one with 3rd Eye Girl that he shared was great!

I love all of the versions of Empty Room, because it's such a FREAKIN' GREAT song I love the original because it was recorded in that moment, so the music and vocals speak to exactly how he was feeling at the time it was recorded. However, I also really love the live performance at the 2009 Montreux Jazz Festival - just amazing.

violetcrush said:

pinkcashmere23 said:

I agree. I wish he had recorded a newer version of Empty Room and released it on one of the later albums. I think the one with 3rd Eye Girl that he shared was great!

I love all of the versions of Empty Room, because it's such a FREAKIN' GREAT song I love the original because it was recorded in that moment, so the music and vocals speak to exactly how he was feeling at the time it was recorded. However, I also really love the live performance at the 2009 Montreux Jazz Festival - just amazing.

I do too. The performance at Montreux was fantastic! I also loved the one in Zürich in 2011.

disch said:

i'm female.

-

I don't there's anything particularly "deep" about interpreting lyrics in a very literal, very simplistic way -- I.e., they're a love note about and directed to one woman, and one woman only, and that woman is one of the girlfriends who's publicly known via gossip coverage -- or in focusing only on lyrics instead taking the time to develop an understanding of compositions as a whole.

violetcrush said:

I think we might be dealing with a "male vs. female" thought process here Not to stereotype, but females tend to gravitate toward the more emotional/deeper side of things.

*

However, I think it's hard to separate the lyrics from the instrumental piece of his music - they work together to create the specific "feel" or message he was trying to convey at that time. I do think it is obvious that on some of his more personal songs, such as Empty Room, the lyrics were an integral part of the song and very important to him. I think the fact that it took him years to pull that amazing song out of the Vault speaks to its significance.

[Edited 5/16/18 8:12am]

[Edited 5/16/18 12:16pm]

And, who made you the depth police, disch? Your level of condescension is staggering. So, you're saying that one needs to "[understand] compositions as a whole" in order to appreciate Prince's music? What does that even mean? Are you suggesting that only musicians and composers should attempt to interpret Prince's lyrics? Seriously???

There's a name for what you are attempting to do. It's called "shaming." SNIP - OF4$ see your orgnotes

I don't interpret the lyrics in a simplistic way. I said that I enjoy learning what was happening in his life during the writing and recording process of his songs and albums to have a better understanding of his mindset at the time. Some songs however were probably meant as simple love notes to a certain woman.

[Edited 5/17/18 6:40am]

FlyOnTheWall said:

disch said:

Ha hilarious!

-

Curious to see what the mods have in mind! Interested to see this section return to a robust discussion of the professional work of all the folks prince collaborated with over his long career -- I hope that people who have great insights into various eras' associates haven't all been driven off and will come back to share! I used to learn a lot from those diverse contributors.

Presently, there are numerous active threads on former Prince collaborators and their "professional work." Various Orgers initiated the threads. Here are but a few that provide plenty of "insights" and updates. If none of these strike your interest, disch (and this applies to everyone), perhaps you could start a thread or two and help to provide some intellectual stimulation here on Prince.org. Just my .

1. Actress Damaris Lewis poses at photo call with cast of 'BlacKkKlansman' at the 71st Cannes Film Festival (FlyOnTheWall)
2. Andre Cymone interview in The Quietus (on Prince and 1969) (PriceAndTheRevolution)
3. Excellent Susan rogers interview (in depth) (Strawberrylova123)
4. Celebrate 30 years of Lovesexy at the PRINCE LOVESEXY SYMPOSIUM featuring CAT GLOVER, INGRID CHAVEZ & DR. FINK (Latin)
5. Article: THE REVOLUTION'S Matt ‘Dr.’ Fink deconstructs Prince’s pioneering use of synthesizers (Latin)
6. ST. PAUL posted nice recent photos of him with SHELBY J., LIV WARFIELD, MAYTE, SUSANNAH & the NPG HORNZ (Latin)
7. MonoNeon interview about working with Prince (lrn36)
8. 80s flashback: "Be Your Man" by Jesse Johnson's Revue (1985) (SoulAlive)
9. The Time "Cool" (1981) (SoulAlive)
10. Lenny Says He Has Songs In The Vault (ISaidLifeIsJustAGame)
    
    
    

[Edited 5/16/18 12:03pm]

Correction: The Damaris thread now seems to be gone.

[Edited 5/18/18 13:55pm]

*** MODERATORS NOTE ***
Click on you MY ORG section which shows you all the threads you post in
It is not gone, just move to the appropriate section

THANK YOU! I understand for some it is fun and interesting to talk about all the women in his life whether it is just friendship or relationship/romance, but at times it gets outta hand because it turns into just pure gossip and speculation and then silly little arguments tend to break out that just are not necessary. Some people really get obsessed about it!! Stuff like "who did he love the most", "his soulmate was .....", "he really wrote that song about such and such", etc. Ughhhh, enough already!! It is a little weird too considering how private for the most part he was about all of that. Heck sometimes this part of the forum should have been renamed "Prince's ex and assumed Lovers". There is no need for one person to have 10 separate threads about them. It is fine when discussing work related things but I feel all the romance stuff has run its course.

[Edited 5/18/18 14:15pm]

Missmusicluver72 said:

THANK YOU! I understand for some it is fun and interesting to talk about all the women in his life whether it is just friendship or relationship/romance, but at times it gets outta hand because it turns into just pure gossip and speculation and then silly little arguments tend to break out that just are not necessary. Some people really get obsessed about it!! Stuff like "who did he love the most", "his soulmate was .....", "he really wrote that song about such and such", etc. Ughhhh, enough already!! It is a little weird too considering how private for the most part he was about all of that. Heck sometimes this part of the forum should have been renamed "Prince's ex and assumed Lovers". There is no need for one person to have 10 separate threads about them. It is fine when discussing work related things but I feel all the romance stuff has run its course.

[Edited 5/18/18 14:15pm]

Personally, I find threads like the "Prince Death Investigation Discussion" nauseating and depressing. I'm also not interested in discussing the "Estate" ad nauseum. Instead of such morbid fare, I prefer Prince discussions about love and happiness, even if people sometimes express differences of opinion.

[Edited 5/18/18 14:48pm]

Missmusicluver72 said:

THANK YOU! I understand for some it is fun and interesting to talk about all the women in his life whether it is just friendship or relationship/romance, but at times it gets outta hand because it turns into just pure gossip and speculation and then silly little arguments tend to break out that just are not necessary. Some people really get obsessed about it!! Stuff like "who did he love the most", "his soulmate was .....", "he really wrote that song about such and such", etc. Ughhhh, enough already!! It is a little weird too considering how private for the most part he was about all of that. Heck sometimes this part of the forum should have been renamed "Prince's ex and assumed Lovers". There is no need for one person to have 10 separate threads about them. It is fine when discussing work related things but I feel all the romance stuff has run its course.

[Edited 5/18/18 14:15pm]

There was a thread that someone dedicated to the album Superconductor but it was removed. The thread about U Will B has also mainly been discussion about the song.

I got to this thread because I tried to participate in one of the Judith Hill threads (I like her as an artist) and experienced the new Fly and her alters blotting out the sun. No interest whatsoever in her running every "discussion".

[Edited 5/18/18 15:25pm]

poppys said:

I got to this thread because I tried to participate in one of the Judith Hill threads (I like her as an artist) and experienced the new Fly and her alters blotting out the sun. No interest whatsoever in her running every "discussion".

[Edited 5/18/18 15:25pm]

Do you mean there is a link to this thread on the JH thread to which you are referring???

FlyOnTheWall said:

FlyOnTheWall said:

Presently, there are numerous active threads on former Prince collaborators and their "professional work." Various Orgers initiated the threads. Here are but a few that provide plenty of "insights" and updates. If none of these strike your interest, disch (and this applies to everyone), perhaps you could start a thread or two and help to provide some intellectual stimulation here on Prince.org. Just my .

1. Actress Damaris Lewis poses at photo call with cast of 'BlacKkKlansman' at the 71st Cannes Film Festival (FlyOnTheWall)
2. Andre Cymone interview in The Quietus (on Prince and 1969) (PriceAndTheRevolution)
3. Excellent Susan rogers interview (in depth) (Strawberrylova123)
4. Celebrate 30 years of Lovesexy at the PRINCE LOVESEXY SYMPOSIUM featuring CAT GLOVER, INGRID CHAVEZ & DR. FINK (Latin)
5. Article: THE REVOLUTION'S Matt ‘Dr.’ Fink deconstructs Prince’s pioneering use of synthesizers (Latin)
6. ST. PAUL posted nice recent photos of him with SHELBY J., LIV WARFIELD, MAYTE, SUSANNAH & the NPG HORNZ (Latin)
7. MonoNeon interview about working with Prince (lrn36)
8. 80s flashback: "Be Your Man" by Jesse Johnson's Revue (1985) (SoulAlive)
9. The Time "Cool" (1981) (SoulAlive)
10. Lenny Says He Has Songs In The Vault (ISaidLifeIsJustAGame)
    
    
    

[Edited 5/16/18 12:03pm]

Correction: The Damaris thread now seems to be gone.

[Edited 5/18/18 13:55pm]

I see that. I didn't notice any problem with it.

It was moved to General Discussion (thanks Google Search Box):

http://prince.org/msg/100/454592

pinkcashmere23 said:

FlyOnTheWall said:

Correction: The Damaris thread now seems to be gone.

[Edited 5/18/18 13:55pm]

I see that. I didn't notice any problem with it.

disch said:

It was moved to General Discussion (thanks Google Search Box):

http://prince.org/msg/100/454592

pinkcashmere23 said:

I see that. I didn't notice any problem with it.

It wasn't there earlier. I searched several times today. BTW, Damaris toured with Prince and the NPG. In fact, she was a member of the NPG. She's certainly a Prince Associate. Do you know why a thread about her "professional work" would be moved from the Associated Artists & People forum?

Dunno. I wasn't really following that thread. I just popped into this thread, saw the comment about it, typed "Damaris Lewis" into the Google Search box and that thread was close to the first one that came up.

FlyOnTheWall said:

disch said:

It was moved to General Discussion (thanks Google Search Box):

http://prince.org/msg/100/454592

It wasn't there earlier. I searched several times today. BTW, Damaris toured with Prince and the NPG. In fact, she was a member of the NPG. She's certainly a Prince Associate. Do you know why a thread about her "professional work" would be moved from the Associated Artists & People forum?

disch said:

Dunno. I wasn't really following that thread. I just popped into this thread, saw the comment about it, typed "Damaris Lewis" into the Google Search box and that thread was close to the first one that came up.

FlyOnTheWall said:

It wasn't there earlier. I searched several times today. BTW, Damaris toured with Prince and the NPG. In fact, she was a member of the NPG. She's certainly a Prince Associate. Do you know why a thread about her "professional work" would be moved from the Associated Artists & People forum?

I just thought you might be willing to put on your "moderator cap," as you've been doing so much lately, and hazard a guess as to why Prince's beloved Damaris Lewis is not good enough for the Associates Forum. BTW, as I said, I did a search several times today, using the full thread name, and nothing popped up. Nothing.