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PrintableNice to see u back Toban. If it's magic, then why can't it be everlasting..... | |
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Toban said:
What was the point in someone creating this image? Who do they think it benefits? Denise’s life is interesting enough. Vanity is the one that always felt she needed a man to complete her, not Denise. . Denise does mention Michael Jackson a few times in her writings, stating “We crossed each other’s paths many times through the next few years. We’d end up attending the same charity event.” What happen that caused her to say this I'll get back to later. . Except for one occasion Denise mainly mentioned Michael, his “lovely” sister Janet and any other celebrity to provide clarity and gave additional context to the significance of the event, party or occasion. Actually, many times in her writings she’ll describe an extravagant event or a jaw-dropping occurrence without emotion and simply say it as a matter of fact, rarely providing the calendar date or the name of the event. Solely describing where she sat and the people around her that attended, as if she were relying upon brief notations she had made in a diary to help recall the event. . Tom Cruise for example. Denise briefly mentions him, but in a certain manner and she is deliberately cryptic in the telling. One earlier version she writes... “One night Tom Cruise came over and spent the night at my home…” . While in a later version she writes... “One evening Tom Cruise got together over at my home. I took a shining to him like most women. I figured he could cure this broken heart of mine. When he was in New York he called me up wanting to come for an audition for him, Scorsese and Paul Newman. I’ll never forget that day. I was too high for one thing and certainly not ready for any kind of audition. I flew to New York anyway.” . The meeting at her home in LA, she doesn’t state why they met, if it was the first time they met, nor does she state what occurred. Was that meeting solely about the subsequence audition in New York? Was she too high to interpret his initial and ultimate intent as being a movie project? She goes on to say, “Later I was told that Tom and Scorsese were considering me for a part, but not Paul. I was always looking for a man to fill this void in me.” That’s it. The story ends and the next page Nikki Six begins. Their are so many stories like this. Stories that bring up more or more questions. . My point is, each page has two chapters worth of information and intrigue. Which I soon discovered when I finally ask DeBorah about Tom Cruise, Nikki Six and that Livingroom Scene when Denise first got to Minneapolis. DeBorah doesn’t just fill in the blanks she brings every statement to life with vivid colors, textures and sound. She fills in explaining details creating layers upon layers of possibilities and motivating factors that helps determine true intent. . Denise writes about how Rod Stewart and Prince didn’t like each other, but probably never thought to mention the “Who’s the Best” Prince or Michael Jackson comparisons that has raged on for decades. Going to work for Berry Gordy, you’d think she’d have some thoughts on the matter. Not about who's the best, but how she'd argue in his defense. . The only interaction between her and Michael, that I’ve read thus far, was a phone call Steven Spielberg made to him, after a meeting she had with Spielberg when he called her to his office to read for a part in The Color Purple. I kinda felt sorry for Michael. Denise did not mention which part she was ask to read, writing: . “…he told me right up front that I was too pretty for the part. We got into a conversation about Michael Jackson as he was a friend of his. Spielberg said that Michael Jackson didn’t have nice things to say about Prince and I. “Call him up” I said. Spielberg did. He got a kick out of hearing Michael squirm from me confronting him over the phone. “I’ve got Vanity the actress in my office” said Spielberg over the intercom. “Oh really” Michael said. That’s when I jumped in speaking, “Michael, I hear you don’t like Prince or me for that matter, I also hear you think I’m too nasty.” In his squeaky little voice he replied, “I like you Vanity, I’ve got no problem with you or Prince.” “That’s not what I hear.” I said, I guess I made him nervous. We crossed each other’s path many times through the next few years…” . . Everything mentioned above is on less than 2 pages. . Denise's journey is interesting enough. Can someone fill me in on the leaving room scene in Minneapolis...please? | |
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PNV said:
Can someone fill me in on the leaving room scene in Minneapolis...please?
Hi PNV, I'll fill you in. After going through a lot of trouble to get Denise to move to Minneapolis, telling her he loved her and that he wanted to make her a star, blocking her from his concert and giving her an ultimatum to move to Minneapolis or they were through- On arrival in Minneapolis, Denise walked into his living room to find Susan and Brenda. Brenda immediately told her that Susan belonged to Prince. When she confronted Prince about it, he didn't deny it, but asked her if she wanted to be a star or not. She decided to stay and also decided that she would fight back in a way that would make him burn with the likes of jealousy he'd never expierenced. We are still waiting for the conclusion... [Edited 6/8/17 15:58pm] | |
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Toban said:
Denise writes that an agent name Nick Masters escorted her the AMAs. . . Also that night, after Jamie Shoop delivered his initial indecent proposal and return to Prince, and apparently as Prince was about to reach her or had just reach her, Denise writes “Michael Jackson sauntered passed us and I stopped to say hello followed by a quick goodbye with Prince nudging me at my side to head for the door. He ask if he could try on my coat...
Thank you for answering my Question Toban. That confirms again, along with what she said in "Blame It On Vanity" that she didn't show up "On the arms of Rick James" to the AMA like "The Rise of Prince" states... But instead she'd met both Rick and Prince there on the same night. Lol. It does look like Michael Jackson tried to deter Prince from speaking to her.  [Edited 6/8/17 15:00pm] | |
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Another myth started by Mr. Hahn. I am so glad that book was revisited. It shows how many things he wrote that were wrong about Vanity. | |
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Again I ask, did no one copy and paste that other thread where questions like this were asked, answered or addressed? I’m getting married on Saturday (in 2 days), I refuse to take this computer out of the country, and I definitely won’t be calling DeBorah for clarity, so it is unlikely that I’ll be doing much posting until July. . It is not my intent to belabor this point (which has also been a point of frustration) about the removal of that one particular thread where a majority of Denise’s life, high-lights and low-lights between 1978 through to 1985, were discussed. It was enlightening. I felt that I was discovering and began understanding more about Denise and Vanity than I was providing in my sharing. It felt like a journey of discovery about their beginnings (events which led to their meeting) that no one had yet travel, it also felt like group therapy, it felt like healing. . At the time that thread began I was depressed and had continued to refuse to acknowledge my grief. As result it is possible I may have spoken on matters and posted images I might now otherwise think twice about posting. This I do not regret. Denise was a blessing in my life and the lives of many others, it is encouraging that others are wanting to know more about her. Which is why I became frustrated. That question about the Livingroom Scene is another example of the discontinuity and confusion that has been created and that will continue as result of the removal of that thread. . Responding to this question will lead exponentially to a series of number of other questions. Some of those questions may seems off topic, but ultimately they all are related to the dynamics that created the media and meteoric Vanity/Prince life long bond, which either of them could completely erase or escape. . The “Him” mentioned in “The Beautiful Ones” was the topic of query that initiated the “Morris and Vanity” thread. The question seemed (at least to me) to be asking if Morris and Vanity were at one point romantically involved. I just happened to see the untouched thread, read it, found the question a bit ridiculous, and just happened to be the first to respond. I responded based in part on what I was told 24 years ago, what I knew about Denise’s artwork and paintings, but mainly I responded due to something I had recently read in one edition of Denise’s unpublished autobiographies. . Since I am uncertain as to why that thread was removed, i.e. if it were due to something I had posted, if it was due to the result of the subsequent comments, or if it were due to a completely unrelated subject matter, agenda or offense. That being the case I strongly suggest that all interested in what I had posted in that thread to prepare to start making a record of this thread; just in case. . Hopefully the moderators will provide some warning and or just hide or remove a select individual post they find questionable. . . Shall we begin…? I shall evenually get to that "Livingroom Scene" via the scenic route. . . My first response in that thread regarding “Him” in “The Beautiful Ones” was: . . NO!!! Not him. The way I read it is... . There was a previous relationship that Prince knew about. There was a portrait of a man that she had painted and traveled with that Prince accused and questioned her about, believing it to be of this person. And actually he was right, it was. This was her way to keep him guessing, and it was a reminder that she did have a life, a career (movie offers), other interest that she could return to, and that he was the one that approached and pursued her. The way one of the stories go is that Prince went ballistic when this British, New Wave, Glam Pop music artist dared to show up calling on Denise to take her out after one their concerts.
I wondered if Prince was mocking his flamboyant way of dress in the movie
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Congrats on the marriage!
It is nice to know that posting here helped out with your mourning. It is what brought me to the org too. The info you shared helped in understanding Denise as more than just a packaged pop star, sidekick to Prince. Hope I am not disrespectful by mentioning mentioning [Edited 6/8/17 17:28pm] | |
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Toban said:
Again I ask, did no one copy and paste that other thread where questions like this were asked, answered or addressed? I’m getting married on Saturday (in 2 days), I refuse to take this computer out of the country, and I definitely won’t be calling DeBorah for clarity, so it is unlikely that I’ll be doing much posting until July. . It is not my intent to belabor this point (which has also been a point of frustration) about the removal of that one particular thread where a majority of Denise’s life, high-lights and low-lights between 1978 through to 1985, were discussed. It was enlightening. I felt that I was discovering and began understanding more about Denise and Vanity than I was providing in my sharing. It felt like a journey of discovery about their beginnings (events which led to their meeting) that no one had yet travel, it also felt like group therapy, it felt like healing. . At the time that thread began I was depressed and had continued to refuse to acknowledge my grief. As result it is possible I may have spoken on matters and posted images I might now otherwise think twice about posting. This I do not regret. Denise was a blessing in my life and the lives of many others, it is encouraging that others are wanting to know more about her. Which is why I became frustrated. That question about the Livingroom Scene is another example of the discontinuity and confusion that has been created and that will continue as result of the removal of that thread. . Responding to this question will lead exponentially to a series of number of other questions. Some of those questions may seems off topic, but ultimately they all are related to the dynamics that created the media and meteoric Vanity/Prince life long bond, which either of them could completely erase or escape. . The “Him” mentioned in “The Beautiful Ones” was the topic of query that initiated the “Morris and Vanity” thread. The question seemed (at least to me) to be asking if Morris and Vanity were at one point romantically involved. I just happened to see the untouched thread, read it, found the question a bit ridiculous, and just happened to be the first to respond. I responded based in part on what I was told 24 years ago, what I knew about Denise’s artwork and paintings, but mainly I responded due to something I had recently read in one edition of Denise’s unpublished autobiographies. . Since I am uncertain as to why that thread was removed, i.e. if it were due to something I had posted, if it was due to the result of the subsequent comments, or if it were due to a completely unrelated subject matter, agenda or offense. That being the case I strongly suggest that all interested in what I had posted in that thread to prepare to start making a record of this thread; just in case. . Hopefully the moderators will provide some warning and or just hide or remove a select individual post they find questionable. . . Shall we begin…? I shall evenually get to that "Livingroom Scene" via the scenic route. . . My first response in that thread regarding “Him” in “The Beautiful Ones” was: . . NO!!! Not him. The way I read it is... . There was a previous relationship that Prince knew about. There was a portrait of a man that she had painted and traveled with that Prince accused and questioned her about, believing it to be of this person. And actually he was right, it was. This was her way to keep him guessing, and it was a reminder that she did have a life, a career (movie offers), other interest that she could return to, and that he was the one that approached and pursued her. The way one of the stories go is that Prince went ballistic when this British, New Wave, Glam Pop music artist dared to show up calling on Denise to take her out after one their concerts.
I wondered if Prince was mocking his flamboyant way of dress in the movie
I didn't copy and paste, but I do have screenshots... 
The thread was enlightening. It definitely took us on a journey. We were finally getting to hear Denise's story from her perspective. We saw her in a different light, growing into herself and having her own independence and drive before meeting Prince. God bless on your upcoming marriage. [Edited 6/8/17 18:21pm] | |
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Congratulations on your upcoming marriage. Your sharing of Denise's writings and taking us back to Denise's beginnings prior to Prince, her accomplishments gave a new understanding of her, her ambitions, and fearless determination. Sharing about the time they met, her arrival in MPLS, and what led to the beginning of an explosive relationship was intriguing. All of these discussions have been part of a healing journey for those of us who have been discussing. I'm glad that it helped you in some way. My wonderment about Prince and Denise's connection, began for me just after Prince's death. Their dying so close to one another and all the things Prince said in his concerts, made me rethink their connection throughout the years. It does seem like a connection that could not be erased nor escaped. | |
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Luvgirl So true we were able to see Denise in her own sphere as an artist, with an inner drive. She modeled had a boyfriend/ photographer. Her ambition was there on her own. I wonder how and why she stepped into the uncertainty of Minneapolis back then. She had so much going on in her own right. | |
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