Anxiety said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: well I'm not advocating that you are responsible, just not sure of the sherriff and Prince's twisted logic is all given that hypothetical of twisted logic, you could also ask if the individual people who post could be held liable for placing that "harmful content" online in the first place. And what about the unscrupulous people who viewed said harmful content? | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Anxiety said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: well I'm not advocating that you are responsible, just not sure of the sherriff and Prince's twisted logic is all given that hypothetical of twisted logic, you could also ask if the individual people who post could be held liable for placing that "harmful content" online in the first place. That seems to be exactly their claim 2010: Healing the Wounds of the Past.... http://prince.org/msg/8/325740 | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Markland said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: well i truly agree with you I do think that underneath all this is Prince's desire to have the only site dedicated to himself. That way he can control what is said, what is posted and all that. But I will drop his ass forever than to be forced to give up my community so he can tell me what kinds of topics I can discuss and whether or not I can even quote any of his lyrics when talking about how the only thing I had in my lonely fucked up childhood was his music. And I'm with sexyb1 and gemini, I'm a fan for 28 years and I'd hardly say that's a quick turning on of prince There were a couple of quotes attributed to the MD of web sheriff along the lines of the artist not wanting his live performances represented by a load of grainy photos and if people wanted to see photos of the artist they could do so through his official website I've had quite a long look across the internet today and its almost scary the amount of publicity this issue has generated What is even more disturbing is the public outpouring of absolute contempt for prince by many of the posters Those supporting the actions of the people issuing these cease and desist notices are extremely thin on the ground If this affair was about a politician it would be nothing short of a public relations disaster The way its hit the media in such a negative way outside of the fanbase will almost certainly deter potential new fans from listening to subsequent material and taint the back catalogue its almost like he wanted to bring the whole thing crashing down. A happy face, A Thumpin Bass, For A Lovin' Race. PEACE. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Markland said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: well i truly agree with you I do think that underneath all this is Prince's desire to have the only site dedicated to himself. That way he can control what is said, what is posted and all that. But I will drop his ass forever than to be forced to give up my community so he can tell me what kinds of topics I can discuss and whether or not I can even quote any of his lyrics when talking about how the only thing I had in my lonely fucked up childhood was his music. And I'm with sexyb1 and gemini, I'm a fan for 28 years and I'd hardly say that's a quick turning on of prince There were a couple of quotes attributed to the MD of web sheriff along the lines of the artist not wanting his live performances represented by a load of grainy photos and if people wanted to see photos of the artist they could do so through his official website I've had quite a long look across the internet today and its almost scary the amount of publicity this issue has generated What is even more disturbing is the public outpouring of absolute contempt for prince by many of the posters Those supporting the actions of the people issuing these cease and desist notices are extremely thin on the ground If this affair was about a politician it would be nothing short of a public relations disaster The way its hit the media in such a negative way outside of the fanbase will almost certainly deter potential new fans from listening to subsequent material and taint the back catalogue double post org burp. [Edited 11/8/07 12:31pm] A happy face, A Thumpin Bass, For A Lovin' Race. PEACE. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
HQ's Aaron was on Dutch TV tonight, best watched show smack in the middle of primetime.
He did an excellent job making his case. Video will be online tomorrow. "this especially prepared potato is called pomme de terre" | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Anxiety said: babynoz said: Hey, I'm a little taken aback right now but that's about it. I'm hoping that the sabre rattling phase will give way to actual legal proceedings very soon because IMO, sufficient laws already exists and therefore, all that's left to be done is to have some precedent setting cases come to court complete with full discovery, evidence, depositions, etc, before an impartial jury. I don't favor a settlement because I think there are larger implications to these issues that need to be addressed in open court. Granted, it's easy for me to say being that I'm not the one having to scrape together the necessary resources. As I understand it other parties such as uptown have gone through similar legal proceedings and ended by reaching a settlement which is good for them but didn't do a lot with regards to setting any precedent which is why the issue has and will continue to resurface. So one of my questions is, are any of the principals involved with Princefansunited willing to prepare themselves for a protracted legal battle or is it a matter of calling each other's bluff and hoping the other side will blink first? If it's the latter that's all well and good but be aware that you'll more than likely be playing chicken on a recurring basis. Furthermore, It might be a good idea to step up the moderation due to some of the more inflammatory comments being made and an even better idea would be for individual members to treat freedom of speech as a precious commodity that should be used judiciously. Remember, a judge or an impartial jury is not going to take your 20+ years as a frustrated fan into consideration...all they will see if and when evidence is presented is a screenshot of the forum where people are using inflammatory language that includes the words "gun", "bullet" and "die". Any impartial entity could easily conclude from such rantings that Prince's concerns are justified on that basis alone. I would urge anyone who claims to support this cause to consider that anything posted in these forums is potential evidence at this point. That includes the various postings in the M&M forum where everybody seems to be running around with their hair on fire with everything from suggestions of tarring and feathering on one side to the other extreme of people practically vowing to sacrifice their first born to their guitar playing savior! Many of the comments posted put the fansites at risk of being viewed by any impartial entity as a bunch of lunatics. My position remains the same...I believe the best remedy is a court of law where the parties can be compelled to put all of their cards on the table along with supporting arguments. Inasmuch as this remedy already exists, swindlers who pass themselves off as an internet policing organizations should not be empowered. I appreciate that people are concerned and I support their right to comment but I'd still like to see folks take a collective deep breath and try real hard to look beyond Prince or any single individual and consider the implications of a corporate/politically controlled internet. We have already seen what it has meant for other media such as radio, television and print outlets. Is the internet the final frontier? The FCC is already trying to rush through legislation that will expand the power of corporate media. I believe that it is corporate/political interests that will ultimately be served by so-called internet policing organizations and not the interests of artists or ordinary people. Just sayin'... Thanks for the very articulate and well thought-out post. The only comment I read that sticks in my craw a little is that of stepped-up moderation. To what extent do we step up what we will and won't allow to remain on a site like this? And I'm not just asking YOU this. I'm asking the other Org Mods this. I'm also asking MYSELF this. At some point, lines have to be drawn. What I may consider fair criticism, another mod may consider to be a threat or defamatory language. Or vice versa. And we all might agree on what standards the Org will uphold, but the site community may not end up agreeing with us. Or we'll have a situation of "if THIS comment can be snipped, then why aren't you snipping THAT comment?" Until all we're left with is a bunch of people posting stuff like: ...um.....hi? But on a personal level I do agree with your concern, and I tried to voice that in a post I wrote on this thread earlier today. We need to think about how we are viewed when we post in a public forum. We need to think about how the site is represented by us when we post. If not legally, then morally? Ethically? Asthetically? Spiritually? Hey, whatever it takes. There is a certain freedom which is implied on the Internet but that does not mean that we are exempt from policing ourselves. I'm thinking deeper than legal implications here. I'm talking about matters of conscience and personal standards. It sounds all hoity-toity for me to say that, and I'm sure I've unleashed my fair amount of snark on the Org over the years, but maybe if we can take something productive from all this, it's that we need to develop our own internal Web Sheriffs. Or something like that. [Edited 11/8/07 10:38am] Hey Anx, I suggest that at the very least comments that could be construed as threats of bodily harm can be snipped without much opposition. I purposely directed my comments more toward potential legalities because I understand that people's morality cannot be effectively moderated. The best you can do on that front is to continue to issue reminders. Since the mods can't be everywhere, you could also remind and encourage folks to use the report function to help direct your attention. Ultimately it's left up to you guys to decide what is merely offensive and what's potentially damaging. People have already agreed to abide by the moderator's decisions when they signed up. Good luck and take your vitamins sweetie...looks like it's gonna be a looong night. Prince, in you I found a kindred spirit...Rest In Paradise. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
2the9s said: Markland said: It seems this topic has found its way into meida in the Ukraine and Spain
Try googling Princefansunited and see what comes up Oh HELLS yeah! I just hope he doesn't send a cease and desist letter to Viktor Yushchenko for the "Orange Revolution"! HE WILL NOW | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
I have been a Prince fan for many years. I personally felt his talent and musicianship has elevated him above others to the status as a true artist. However, his most recent turn of events has put him as the front runner in the gossip column. I am appalled that he has placed himself in this elitist regime; this tantrum does nothing for the elevation and preservation of music. His status of a true artist is tarnished in my eyes simply because he would even consider busying himself with such nonsense as attacking his fan base- the people who have supported his career and contributed to making him the superstar he is today. I am disappointed for all the times that I have defended his position as a true artist .Now, I somehow feel like I have no claim as a fan what-so-ever. To me, it is like Prince saying to his fans, how dare you like my music that I make? How dare you look at the photos that are taken of me when I am out at public events and/or my concerts I have put on for my fans? How dare you even associate yourself with the very things that have been made available by me to you? Are these feelings a tad extreme; maybe. Still, this is absurd for a man of his age, his artistry, his wealth and supposedly of his "knowledge" to partake in such debauchery. Oh well.
Just my two cents, that is all they are worth about this matter. Alison | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Remember Remember the 5th of November A happy face, A Thumpin Bass, For A Lovin' Race. PEACE. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
unkemptpueblo said: Remember Remember the 5th of November
November 5th will go down as possibly the worst day in Prince's musical career. RIP, mom. I will forever miss and love you. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Dorthy86 said: I have been a Prince fan for many years. I personally felt his talent and musicianship has elevated him above others to the status as a true artist. However, his most recent turn of events has put him as the front runner in the gossip column. I am appalled that he has placed himself in this elitist regime; this tantrum does nothing for the elevation and preservation of music. His status of a true artist is tarnished in my eyes simply because he would even consider busying himself with such nonsense as attacking his fan base- the people who have supported his career and contributed to making him the superstar he is today. I am disappointed for all the times that I have defended his position as a true artist .Now, I somehow feel like I have no claim as a fan what-so-ever. To me, it is like Prince saying to his fans, how dare you like my music that I make? How dare you look at the photos that are taken of me when I am out at public events and/or my concerts I have put on for my fans? How dare you even associate yourself with the very things that have been made available by me to you? Are these feelings a tad extreme; maybe. Still, this is absurd for a man of his age, his artistry, his wealth and supposedly of his "knowledge" to partake in such debauchery. Oh well.
Just my two cents, that is all they are worth about this matter. Alison I kind of understand people feeling perplexed and frustrated. I was not on the org for a couple of days and actually heard about the latest installment of this saga on the local news of all places. Luckily that little heads up allowed me to brace myself when I got to work the next day. The one thing that kinda bums me out about this whole business is that each time one of these incidents occurs, it becomes more likely that this is the type of thing that will be remembered instead of exquisite offerings such as Beautiful Strange or Power Fantastic. In this tabloid society how many people will be inclined to investigate or even acknowlege the sheer beauty and artistry of Prince's body of work? The main things that stick in the memory of the general public is the symbol, the slave, the assless pants, etc. Prince, in you I found a kindred spirit...Rest In Paradise. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
I have just issued the press release on my website. Will show up later. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
2Jay said: I have just issued the press release on my website. Will show up later.
What press release? And whats the website address please | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
OMG! I only realised this was going on when i just read an article from yesterday (from free tabloid paper here in Melboure called MX) mentioning prince.org! Madness... No hablo espanol,no!
Pero hablo ingles..ssii muy muy bien... "Come into my world..." Missy Quote of da Month: "yeah, sure, that's cool...wait WHAT?! " | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
I just updated the news today, oh boy...
Check out the front page, top of the news section. Prince has posted a new song via Shelby's MySpace page. Seems like this is his "response" to the PFU complaints... | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Anxiety said: I just updated the news today, oh boy...
Check out the front page, top of the news section. Prince has posted a new song via Shelby's MySpace page. Seems like this is his "response" to the PFU complaints... He aint gonna let it ruin his day..... Screw Prince for real man. Am I making threats or just expressing my disgust? Prince is simply disgusting. He honestly couldn't issue a press release and talk to us? He has to put out a cryptic song instead? I'm so through with him. 2010: Healing the Wounds of the Past.... http://prince.org/msg/8/325740 | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: Anxiety said: I just updated the news today, oh boy...
Check out the front page, top of the news section. Prince has posted a new song via Shelby's MySpace page. Seems like this is his "response" to the PFU complaints... He aint gonna let it ruin his day..... Screw Prince for real man. Am I making threats or just expressing my disgust? Prince is simply disgusting. He honestly couldn't issue a press release and talk to us? He has to put out a cryptic song instead? I'm so through with him. But that shit is hot as hell... Honestly, if he promises to make a 2 CD album like this, should we think of volunterring having a lawsuit with his attorney bloodhound gang??? | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
EmancipationLover said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: He aint gonna let it ruin his day..... Screw Prince for real man. Am I making threats or just expressing my disgust? Prince is simply disgusting. He honestly couldn't issue a press release and talk to us? He has to put out a cryptic song instead? I'm so through with him. But that shit is hot as hell... Honestly, if he promises to make a 2 CD album like this, should we think of volunterring having a lawsuit with his attorney bloodhound gang??? I'm not immature to the point that I won't admit it's a killer song but I find absolutely no joy in it. Give it away for free, I don't want it. 2010: Healing the Wounds of the Past.... http://prince.org/msg/8/325740 | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
So let me get this straight, he puts out a song after all the crap of the last few days and everything is ok again?
And people think he is weird??? | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Markland said: So let me get this straight, he puts out a song after all the crap of the last few days and everything is ok again?
And people think he is weird??? That's how pathetic his fams are. They cower in the corner like frightened rabbits because they actually voiced an opinion any opinion on Prince and they forget anything even happened as soon as he strings together some musical notes. 2010: Healing the Wounds of the Past.... http://prince.org/msg/8/325740 | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: Markland said: So let me get this straight, he puts out a song after all the crap of the last few days and everything is ok again?
And people think he is weird??? That's how pathetic his fams are. They cower in the corner like frightened rabbits because they actually voiced an opinion any opinion on Prince and they forget anything even happened as soon as he strings together some musical notes. I was really looking forward to a statement from him EXPLAINING to us what the hel* is going on. I'm sorry I have no time to read through mounds and mounds of peoples OPINIONS. I want to know why he went out of his "busy" way to wound the people that have carried him through his career. I thought we were told that he would be giving a response Wednesday and I waited up for it..and it NEVER came. And Im NOT going to go to Shelbys website and try and figure out..or put my twist on what he is trying to say. I have no time for parables or cryptic messages. I as a fan who has spend money on him..want answers from HIM. Not a web sherriff or record company but from Prince himself. We atleast deserve that. And its not much...is it?? And no pun intended at you ANX thanks for the headsup on Shelbys. U want to know the secreat of love and happiness? Love GOD with all your heart, mind soul and strength. And love your neighboor as yourself. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
The man is almost 50 can't he cut the cryptic shit and actually release a statement like a person?
In the 80's it was kinda cool and refreshing, now its just tired, old and amateurish. The Most Important Thing In Life Is Sincerity....Once You Can Fake That, You Can Fake Anything. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Fuck him and his recent shitty albums.
If it wasn't for his live performances he would be completely irrelevant beyond a rock footnote. What a jackass!!! Time to move on to artists who embrace their fans and the fan related net activity. Wilco anyone? "What a lovely fat beat with a zompige baslijn" | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: Markland said: So let me get this straight, he puts out a song after all the crap of the last few days and everything is ok again?
And people think he is weird??? That's how pathetic his fams are. They cower in the corner like frightened rabbits because they actually voiced an opinion any opinion on Prince and they forget anything even happened as soon as he strings together some musical notes. Aaron from HQ was on TV tonight. He talked a little bit about what they are threatening him with, and this is funny in light of recent remarks by the Web Sheriff playing the whole thing down, but get this ... they are telling Aaron he will go to jail for 3 years + pay a 300.000 euro fine. "this especially prepared potato is called pomme de terre" | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
m3taverse said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: That's how pathetic his fams are. They cower in the corner like frightened rabbits because they actually voiced an opinion any opinion on Prince and they forget anything even happened as soon as he strings together some musical notes. Aaron from HQ was on TV tonight. He talked a little bit about what they are threatening him with, and this is funny in light of recent remarks by the Web Sheriff playing the whole thing down, but get this ... they are telling Aaron he will go to jail for 3 years + pay a 300.000 euro fine. By "they" you mean Websheriff? I wonder if Ben and the founder of Princefams are getting comparable threats of jail time & fines. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
m3taverse said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: That's how pathetic his fams are. They cower in the corner like frightened rabbits because they actually voiced an opinion any opinion on Prince and they forget anything even happened as soon as he strings together some musical notes. Aaron from HQ was on TV tonight. He talked a little bit about what they are threatening him with, and this is funny in light of recent remarks by the Web Sheriff playing the whole thing down, but get this ... they are telling Aaron he will go to jail for 3 years + pay a 300.000 euro fine. I think its safe to assume that all three website owners are getting exactly the same treatment/threats I read you said earlier the interview was on Dutch tv, was it in English or is it in Dutch and is it available on the net? As for web sheriff, if you google them you come up with everything from successes to complete cock ups posted One critic described them as "a joke" and several websites call for regulation of companies like theirs Their public statements and emails they have sent to websites are contradictory which says it all frankly As I said earlier, for prince it looks like a total public relations disaster | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
m3taverse said: The NPGMC files had Digital Rights Protection crap on them, which is why you couldn't use them on a Mac. The digital licenses to play these files were kept on a server, and with every upgrade of Windows Media Player or Windows, we had to re-update those licenses from the npgmc server to be able to continue playing the files. When NPGMC stopped, so did the licensing server, and that meant those files could no longer work after an upgrade of some sort.
I mentioned this as an example of why we as consumers need flexible and workable fair use legislation and policies in place. Giving a central figure control over how we use music that we have already payed for, in the way that we did with those NPGMC files, basically delivers us to the whims of whomever is in control of the system. And already from experience we know that this is a very bad idea, and something to be wary of. The type of control Prince is after is not something that we should sheepishly give to him, he has proven that he cannot be trusted with such power. Not one of my files had DRP on them, the Audio Shows, the music, all of it. Now once the site upgraded, I burned CDs and then reimported them and the "protection" was gone. There's always a better mousetrap, too bad nobody has clued in the little man. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Markland said: m3taverse said: Aaron from HQ was on TV tonight. He talked a little bit about what they are threatening him with, and this is funny in light of recent remarks by the Web Sheriff playing the whole thing down, but get this ... they are telling Aaron he will go to jail for 3 years + pay a 300.000 euro fine. I think its safe to assume that all three website owners are getting exactly the same treatment/threats I read you said earlier the interview was on Dutch tv, was it in English or is it in Dutch and is it available on the net? As for web sheriff, if you google them you come up with everything from successes to complete cock ups posted One critic described them as "a joke" and several websites call for regulation of companies like theirs Their public statements and emails they have sent to websites are contradictory which says it all frankly As I said earlier, for prince it looks like a total public relations disaster It was in Dutch, and will be available on the net tomorrow. No doubt someone at HQ will provide a transcript in English. Aaron shows a big pile of paper, and when asked to mention some of the finer points he says they're threathening him with 3 years of jail and a 300.000 euro fine *minimum*. It is unclear if this is the Sheriff doing the talking, as the Sheriff coordinated "attacks" on HQ from different geographical regions through different lawfirms. "this especially prepared potato is called pomme de terre" | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
m3taverse said: Markland said: I think its safe to assume that all three website owners are getting exactly the same treatment/threats I read you said earlier the interview was on Dutch tv, was it in English or is it in Dutch and is it available on the net? As for web sheriff, if you google them you come up with everything from successes to complete cock ups posted One critic described them as "a joke" and several websites call for regulation of companies like theirs Their public statements and emails they have sent to websites are contradictory which says it all frankly As I said earlier, for prince it looks like a total public relations disaster It was in Dutch, and will be available on the net tomorrow. No doubt someone at HQ will provide a transcript in English. Aaron shows a big pile of paper, and when asked to mention some of the finer points he says they're threathening him with 3 years of jail and a 300.000 euro fine *minimum*. It is unclear if this is the Sheriff doing the talking, as the Sheriff coordinated "attacks" on HQ from different geographical regions through different lawfirms. Thanks for the info I would imagine their tactics are to threaten law suits in multiple countries, its basic intimidation tactics Try and make it look so overwhelming that you cannot possibly defend agains it and cave in I wouldnt mind betting, as in other cases in the USA apaprently, that they have failed to comply totally with the legislation regarding the cease and desist notices The more paperwork you generate the more mistakes you are likely to make The more information that comes out, the more it has all the appearances of a strategy to force everyone to use the 3121.com website and to destroy any other public platforms of debate Where photographs are concerned it certainly appears that is what web sheriff have stated is the position This is about free speech, but more importantly its about peoples rights Demanding that images are taken down that don't belong to you is a clear abrogation of peoples rights And the tactics that appear to be being used are threatening and intimidatory This is thought and speech policing at its worst | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Markland said: m3taverse said: Aaron from HQ was on TV tonight. He talked a little bit about what they are threatening him with, and this is funny in light of recent remarks by the Web Sheriff playing the whole thing down, but get this ... they are telling Aaron he will go to jail for 3 years + pay a 300.000 euro fine. I think its safe to assume that all three website owners are getting exactly the same treatment/threats I read you said earlier the interview was on Dutch tv, was it in English or is it in Dutch and is it available on the net? As for web sheriff, if you google them you come up with everything from successes to complete cock ups posted One critic described them as "a joke" and several websites call for regulation of companies like theirs Their public statements and emails they have sent to websites are contradictory which says it all frankly As I said earlier, for prince it looks like a total public relations disaster Fuck! I really, really, really want someone to sue the shit out of Websheriff when this is over. I don't care whether it's Prince suing him for being an incompetent idiot or Aaron, Ben, & Endre countersuing him for harassment and false accusations; I just want someone to put him in his place. He obviously is not good at the detail-oriented aspects of his job (e.g. understanding what the law does & does not allow) and he is just bilking celebrities out of money by feeding on their issues. I detest Websheriff! | |
- E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |