AnotherLoverToo said:

When you make a thread about it.

I'd have ta kill ya if I tell ya..

Christopher said:

omggg, you are so gonna get it now! I'm gonna send you Tevin Campbell sex dreams!

AnotherLoverToo said:

i heard tevin was tied up at your house

Christopher said:

That's what I'm sayin'! I'm sending him to you now, gonna pack his freaky nekkid ass in a crate and ship him to Cali! Xtina is on tour wit Justin, but she'll be joining Tevin shortly...

AnotherLoverToo said:

oh my...can apollonia come to? we got a party then:pimp2:

Christopher said:

I don't know, her self-esteem isn't too good--she jumped into what she thought was Lake Minnetonka nekkid just because Prince told her she had to purify herself to make it in the biz.

AnotherLoverToo said:

poor her

Well, my narcissistic ass is taking itself to bed now!

AaronMaximus said:

My favorite topic!

Self-esteem has two dimensions:

1) The experience of feeling competent to live and deal with reality

2) The general feeling of being worthy of happiness.

Neither of these have anything to do with Narcissism. I think our culture took a wrong turn because of it's obsession with people's emotions, and the resulting disregard of reality. Anything that FEELS good, and to hell with any objective standards of good and evil. But reality is immutable--we win some, we lose some, we have flaws, we fail, we feel bad sometimes, etc.

Consider: Knowing that I have flaws, would I be more competent to cope with reality if I were familiar with those flaws or if I were in denial of them?

Denial = Narcissim.

You can't just "feel good about yourself" and expect the reality to snap into place. You must actually LIVE well in reality, do the right things, ACCEPT failure, pick your ass up off the ground when you fail, be HONEST, have INTEGRITY, and have a PURPOSE in life. Then you will know that you are more than your circumstances. When this is reality, your feelings will snap into place, not vice versa.

Narcissism is the desire for the unearned, the tail wagging the dog...ugh...etc...

Don't get me started...
I'm frightened for a lot of children today because they are not going to know how to deal with real life, but it will not catch up with them until they are adults! Then it will be too late! Some certain children I know get EVERYTHING they want--I'm not just talking toys, I'm talking the parents especially the mothers, alter their lives and are on antidepressants so that their children's feelings will not get hurt by being told no or that they lost at something, try again later! I only shudder to think of the hell that these parents will go through as teenagers, as well as the possible irreversible trouble these children could get into--car accidents, jail, death.

teller said:

Wow. I'm not sure it's possible to give a better definition of self-esteem or narcissism than that. How interesting.

Now, why did you have to put that crap in about objective standards of good and evil? What does that have to do with anything? Why do the standards have to be objective to live that good life by them (I assume that's where you were going with that)?

minneapolisgenius said:

... from a guy with the word "genius" in his screen name.
[This message was edited Sun Sep 14 12:47:51 PDT 2003 by AaronMaximus]

AnotherLoverToo said:

to me, self esteem is believing that you are as good as anyone else. narcissism is trying make everyone else think that you're better

NikkiVail said:

That reminds me of a book I once read, called 'The Tyranny of Malice'. In one part of it, the author compares envy and narcissism, saying they're very similar. But someone who envies uses the strategy of "deflating" someone/something, while the narcissist "inflates" him/herself.

The author also said that narcissism makes a person incapable of having healthy, lasting relationships because it becomes so one-sided (all about the narcissist).

tackam said:

Human life is real, it exists, this is an objective fact. Behaviors are real, objective--they really do exist too. Certain behaviors really do enhance or degrade human life, objectively, in reality. I call these behaviors good and evil using human life as the standard.

Denial is evil. No question about it.

teller said:

I'm with you on the fact that human life exists, and behaviors exist. I'm not sure that it makes sense to say that certian behaviors "degrade human life".

If denial makes somebody feel better than acceptance, no matter how unlikely you think that is. . .how is it evil? I know, feelings aren't supposed to be the standard, but I can't figure out why anything else ultimately matters. Who cares about human life if the humans aren't enjoying it?

AaronMaximus said:

I am not a guy.

Goes to show how absorbed people become with themselves...

minneapolisgenius said:

guess so. or how uninvolved people are with certain others.

You fuckin armchair pyschologists and philosophers kill me

tackam said:

Nobody in denial is enjoying life. A man of self-esteem is proud and strong, not at war with reality like the man in denial.

rdhull said:

No "armchair" here--I'm well out on the front lines everyday. I just started this thread to get other people's input and opinions.

AnotherLoverToo said:

Uhm, ah... This article you were reading wouldn't happen to have been about Prince, now would it?

This thread is pure rubbish!!

The ORG is all about me anyway!

Chico319 said:

"Why is it always Chico, Chico, Chico!!"

:LOL:

AnotherLoverToo said:

I believe "NARCISSUM" is a TYPE of mental illness with the person being introverted, yet visioning very grand things about themselves that extend beyond the realm of reality. A person with self-esteem reacts with the human race, but exhibits confidence in the way they talk & work & other factors. Having self esteem gives one the ability 2 do his best in all he does. Self esteem comes from the doing of things sucessfully. narcissum is there 4 one who thinks very highly of themselves but has yet 2 prove the basis 4 his thinking.

When someone forgets that they aren't the only one who matters...

When image surpasses substance...