tinaz said:

If cunts get dismissed and bitches get a raised eyebrow, what do Proverbs 31 women get?

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Just trying to get some insight on the positive side.

I wasn't inferring that anyone call someone a Proverb.

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Proverbs 31 is in the Bible. It's a good read if you've never read it. Just gives a wonderful perspective of the other side of the bitch, cunt, ho, coin. It's a Proverb about a virtuous woman.

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I guess the equivalent would be, son of a virtuous woman rather than son of a bitch or cunt.

I most certainly don’t consider the term “bitch” a badge of honor or pride. It’s a derogatory term men use to put women down. When men call another man a “bitch” they are implying they are weak and like a woman, which is supposed to be a bad thing.


I get that some women think they’re taking the word back to turn it into a positive thing, but it doesn’t cut it for me. It’s still a vulgar term.

[Edited 10/2/13 6:17am]

BobGeorge909 said:

^i gotcha. Who's to say there aren't virtuous things about being a bitch, a cunt,for a ho. Shedding shackles placed on an individual by society to achieve goals that can benefit said society is virtuous IMO. Strong identities of self, womanhood, and sexuality r seen as assets by many today. And some may say its a virtuous act to reclaim them after centuries of oppression... Teehhe...iden'tities'

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Hopefully, you're joking but I'm not sure. I think you are (hence the teehee).

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I don't see the Proverbs 31 woman as a woman in shackles. Far from it. She's the one who has truly embraced God, her identity, her womanhood and her sexuality in it's proper (and godly) context. She's not the one wearing chains.

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The chains are reserved for bitches, hos and cunts.

Tempest said:

BobGeorge909 said:

Tempest said:

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Hopefully, you're joking but I'm not sure. I think you are (hence the teehee).

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I don't see the Proverbs 31 woman as a woman in shackles. Far from it. She's the one who has truly embraced God, her identity, her womanhood and her sexuality in it's proper (and godly) context. She's not the one wearing chains.

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The chains are reserved for bitches, hos and cunts.

Chapter 31 of the Book of Proverbs in the Hebrew Bible is presented as advice which Lemuel's mother gave to him, about how a virtuous king should reign, and also detailing the attributes of a virtuous wife or ideal woman. The second section of text of this chapter directs women to be industrious and fear the Lord. The woman is the topic of numerous Bible studies and Christian women's ministries. I read that approach it seeing that what is seen as virtuous can very easily change with time.

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Yes, I know what the Proverb is about.

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Well I guess you and I have a difference of opinion regarding virtue changing with time. Societies, cultures and communities may change but the Word of God doesn't change. I don't allow society to tell me (or define for me) what's virtuous and what's not virtuous. The virtues listed in that Proverb are as valid and unchanging today (in God's eyes) as they were when they were written down.

Tempest said:

BobGeorge909 said:

Tempest said:

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Yes, I know what the Proverb is about.

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Well I guess you and I have a difference of opinion regarding virtue changing with time. Societies, cultures and communities may change but the Word of God doesn't change. I don't allow society to tell me (or define for me) what's virtuous and what's not virtuous. The virtues listed in that Proverb are as valid and unchanging today (in God's eyes) as they were when they were written down.

I suppose I can't argue with the word of god. It always seems to at as a thought process ender for me. I don't like that. Someone's interpretation of how something happened or didn't happen, should be or shouldn't be from two thousand+ years ago, ending a thought process today....r things really that black and white? I see these as things that should forever be changing...as we and our world does.

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That's maybe where you an I differ Bob. I prefer black & white. A firm foundation that can never be moved or broken. You prefer an ever changing slippery slope.

Tempest said:

tinaz said:

Sorry, that was hard to read... My reply is screwed since an update... What I said was............ So, I googled this proverb... To me, its saying as long as a woman works her ass off, and does everything a man wants, only then is she worthy of his love... .... And the "word" didnt come from god, but from his mother...

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That's not how I read the Proverb at all. The Proverb has nothing to do with earning anyone's love. It's a commentary on the virtues of a woman who fears the Lord and is industrious. It has nothing to do with earning anyone's love or doing everything a man wants. I think maybe you're missing the point of the Proverb. It's God centered, not man centered. She loves and serves the Lord. In doing so, she is virtuous and her worth is above rubies. In other words, she's of great worth & value (& rare I might add). She's not trying to earn anyone's love or affection. Her affection, faith and focus is God centered therefore making her a good catch for the King. Obviously, if her heart and affections are God centered, she will also make a terrific wife.

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Makes perfect sense to me.

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Obviously, if the King isn't God centered as well, he won't recognize the virtues of a god fearing woman. He may in fact always be looking at & hooking up with bitches, cunts & hoes.

Tempest said:

BobGeorge909 said:

Tempest said:

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That's not how I read the Proverb at all. The Proverb has nothing to do with earning anyone's love. It's a commentary on the virtues of a woman who fears the Lord and is industrious. It has nothing to do with earning anyone's love or doing everything a man wants. I think maybe you're missing the point of the Proverb. It's God centered, not man centered. She loves and serves the Lord. In doing so, she is virtuous and her worth is above rubies. In other words, she's of great worth & value (& rare I might add). She's not trying to earn anyone's love or affection. Her affection, faith and focus is God centered therefore making her a good catch for the King. Obviously, if her heart and affections are God centered, she will also make a terrific wife.

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Makes perfect sense to me.

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Obviously, if the King isn't God centered as well, he won't recognize the virtues of a god fearing woman. He may in fact always be looking at & hooking up with bitches, cunts & hoes.

So a woman who benefits the world around her with her behaviors but doesn't do it for god nor cares about god is unvirtuous? In actors terms, the is motivation important, or just the results.

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Bob, we're discussing how God sees things. Not man.

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From a biblical perspective, just because you "do good things" from a worldly perspective doesn't make you virtuous. A Satanist can "do good things", many Atheists "do good things" and Hitler was capable of "doing good things" however from God's perspective, that's doesn't make a person virtuous (in His eyes). Remember, it's His eyes that matter. Fearing God is the greatest of all virtues if you're looking at things from a biblical and eternal perspective.

Tempest said:

bitch has joined a handful of derogatory terms whose offensiveness is a matter of convenience...generally I find that the person who thinks of it as a proud moniker is also the same person that disputes the label if it isn't self imposed...it's become one of those "I'm proud to be a (insert term here) but you better never call me that" words

BobGeorge909 said:

Tempest said:

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Bob, we're discussing how God sees things. Not man.

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From a biblical perspective, just because you "do good things" from a worldly perspective doesn't make you virtuous. A Satanist can "do good things", many Atheists "do good things" and Hitler was capable of "doing good things" however from God's perspective, that's doesn't make a person virtuous (in His eyes). Remember, it's His eyes that matter. Fearing God is the greatest of all virtues if you're looking at things from a biblical and eternal perspective.

No... YOU'RE discussing that. I never intended this thread to turn into bible study. But I was working with what I got. I'm attempting to discuss the use of words like that a world where every doesn't believe in or care about god and/or his/her/it's opinion in regards to these words to a great degree...I see that closer to the reality I'm working with and its the avenue I desire....but I'm working with what I get. The discussion is still stimulating. Man? I'd prefer people ...surely a woman's point of view when discussion gender centric terms is important. I realize its context there in terms of pronouns...but to use it in this instance seems out of place. It eludes to something I see loosing strength these day...a male centric society and vocabulary. [Edited 10/2/13 7:38am]

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My impression was you wanted an honest answer from me based on Proverbs 31 since that was what we were discussing in relation to virtue. Sorry.

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You go ahead with your discussion and thoughts about whatever it is you want to ponder and wherever you want to go with those thoughts. K? I'll quietly excuse myself from this thread.

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Have a great day!

orger said:

Tempest said:

I've noticed that most women who wear the bitch badge with pride are fucking idiots.

JustErin said:

CarrieMpls said:

I most certainly don’t consider the term “bitch” a badge of honor or pride. It’s a derogatory term men use to put women down. When men call another man a “bitch” they are implying they are weak and like a woman, which is supposed to be a bad thing.


I get that some women think they’re taking the word back to turn it into a positive thing, but it doesn’t cut it for me. It’s still a vulgar term.

[Edited 10/2/13 6:17am]

I completely agree with Carrie's comments. Why would anyone want to be called a bitch? It's just another way to make a derogatory comment about someone. It's not cool at all. All these so called "terms of endearment" are bullshit. People who accept these terms are losers IMO.

Empress said: