Cerebus said:

phunkdaddy said:

Your analysis just don't add up. What NBA rule says that just because you're a top

5 or 10 player you can't join another top player in the game for a common goal of

winning a title? Was their any whining when Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen joined Pierce in

Boston. Kobe Bryant that same season was whining to get traded before Pau Gasol

came aboard for peanuts and Derrick Fisher came back. Bron never whined to leave Cleveland. He gave them seven years. He was a free agent period. Carmelo Anthony all

but orchestrated his trade from Denver to New York to play with another star Amare

Stoudemire. Where was the outrage? It is really pointless to bring up Jordan, Bird,

Johnson, Barkley(really as he did the same shit and actually whined his way out of

Philly and Phoenix) because it's comparing apples to orange. These guys didn't have

free agency the way as we know it today in the NBA so we'll never know whether some

of those guys would have joined each other. It would be like comparing Plan B(NFL) of

the early 90's to the current free agency system in the NFL as we know it now.

I'm gonna have to agree with phunkdaddy here. LeBron stayed for seven years. AFTER he made it to the finals his owner did little effort to bring in the players that would make that team better. LeBron gave him plenty of time to do it, too. But when he didn't do it, and it was clear he wasn't going to, LeBron went to someplace where those players wanted HIM instead. I think everything he did was fine, OTHER than that damn tv show. The last two years of his life would have been completely different if he had just quitely gone to Miami in the off season.

Speaking of Cleveland's owner Gilbert, that arsehole! Time to bring up his near exact quote when LeBron left..."We will win a NBA championship way before this self anointed King will win one"!

Really Gilbert, ESPN should be replaying that quote now Cleveland didn't even make the playoffs! He looks like a real fool now with that quote (open mouth insert foot)

[img:$uid]http://h8.abload.de/img/basketballboshchampagtf0am.gif[/img:$uid]

Cerebus said:

phunkdaddy said:

Your analysis just don't add up. What NBA rule says that just because you're a top

5 or 10 player you can't join another top player in the game for a common goal of

winning a title? Was their any whining when Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen joined Pierce in

Boston. Kobe Bryant that same season was whining to get traded before Pau Gasol

came aboard for peanuts and Derrick Fisher came back. Bron never whined to leave Cleveland. He gave them seven years. He was a free agent period. Carmelo Anthony all

but orchestrated his trade from Denver to New York to play with another star Amare

Stoudemire. Where was the outrage? It is really pointless to bring up Jordan, Bird,

Johnson, Barkley(really as he did the same shit and actually whined his way out of

Philly and Phoenix) because it's comparing apples to orange. These guys didn't have

free agency the way as we know it today in the NBA so we'll never know whether some

of those guys would have joined each other. It would be like comparing Plan B(NFL) of

the early 90's to the current free agency system in the NFL as we know it now.

I'm gonna have to agree with phunkdaddy here. LeBron stayed for seven years. AFTER he made it to the finals his owner did little effort to bring in the players that would make that team better. LeBron gave him plenty of time to do it, too. But when he didn't do it, and it was clear he wasn't going to, LeBron went to someplace where those players wanted HIM instead. I think everything he did was fine, OTHER than that damn tv show. The last two years of his life would have been completely different if he had just quitely gone to Miami in the off season.

This.

Not to mention what UptownNY said...who willingly goes TO Cleveland? Nobody.

Not only that...it isn't like James planned and orchestrated the whole media spectacle even though he went along with it and has since admitted his missteps last season. Wade and Riley, (it's common knowledge down here that they get what they want), actuallly had a lot more to do with it than he did. They justified it by donating the ad revenue from the tv show and the money raised from the locally televised party to several charities, so I suspect many people felt okay about going along with the program at the time.

At the end of the day James, like many others before him, is learning as he goes. Being born to a sixteen yr old single mother and not going to college probably didn't prepare him for a whole lot but so far it seems he's made better choices than lots of others similarly situated.

Anyhoo, I agree with your suggestion that there's better things to discuss here...namely basketball, so that's all I will say about the LBJ show.

Timmy84 said:

Yeah it's unfair to think Lebron was acting like a bitch when there were other folks were acting way more bitchy than he was. Give the man credit, he almost gave Cleveland a championship and now he helped to give Miami another one (with help from Wade and Bosh and the supporting cast - I see you Juwan! ). We should just let it go... and give credit to where it's due plus give it up to Oklahoma for a great season. Hope they make the finals again. Or if not them, Chicago.

Thank you. We don't wanna lose sight of the fact that the whole team stepped up and made this happen...Bosh, Battier, Chalmers, and what about Miller? It was a pretty solid team effort, which is what I liked the most about it.

OKC is a young squad and I expect good things as they mature and develop as a team the same way the Heat had to do. That is why I wasn't too distressed last season when the "three kings" didn't bring home the ring because as I kept telling folks, it takes more than bringing the stars together. In order for things to happen the players need time to gel to the point where they can perform like a well oiled machine.

This is damn hard work, not magic... That's what the players say and I believe them.

Cerebus said:

uPtoWnNY said:

If I was Lebron, I wouldn't give a flying fuck what strangers think, long as I have family & friends, but that's just me. Just be great and win.

Did you see Mark Cuban tear Skip "Douchenozzle" Bayless a new asshole today on First Take? It was pretty great. He said players aren't thinking about what reporters and fans say about them. They just think about being prepared to win. He said a lot of other great stuff, too. And it was about damn time somebody did it. I loved how Stephen A Smith just sat there quietly. Sorry, I'm type-babbling. I just hate what those two have done to that show, so it was great to see somebody who actually knows what goes on tell them how wrong they are.

Bayless....is clueless.

babynoz said:

Timmy84 said:

Yeah it's unfair to think Lebron was acting like a bitch when there were other folks were acting way more bitchy than he was. Give the man credit, he almost gave Cleveland a championship and now he helped to give Miami another one (with help from Wade and Bosh and the supporting cast - I see you Juwan! ). We should just let it go... and give credit to where it's due plus give it up to Oklahoma for a great season. Hope they make the finals again. Or if not them, Chicago.

Thank you. We don't wanna lose sight of the fact that the whole team stepped up and made this happen...Bosh, Battier, Chalmers, and what about Miller? It was a pretty solid team effort, which is what I liked the most about it.

OKC is a young squad and I expect good things as they mature and develop as a team the same way the Heat had to do. That is why I wasn't too distressed last season when the "three kings" didn't bring home the ring because as I kept telling folks, it takes more than bringing the stars together. In order for things to happen the players need time to gel to the point where they can perform like a well oiled machine.

This is damn hard work, not magic... That's what the players say and I believe them.

Because it is true. U cannot win at sports without putting in the work.

Damn right you have to put in the work - you have to add something to your game every year. How you come back from playoff failure is critical. Look how long it took Wilt, Jordan, West, Dr J,, Isaiah, Drexler, Hakeem, Kidd, Shaq, Lebron, etc., to finally get that ring. Magic, Larry & Kareem won their first titles early in their careers, but they had playoff failures too. It's part of the process.

I'm looking forward to seeing how young cats like Durant, Westbrook, Griffin come back next season. If I'm Blake Griffin, I'm spending my summer with Hakeem. His advice to Lebron was "keep attacking".

uPtoWnNY said:

Damn right you have to put in the work - you have to add something to your game every year. How you come back from playoff failure is critical. Look how long it took Wilt, Jordan, West, Dr J,, Isaiah, Drexler, Hakeem, Kidd, Shaq, Lebron, etc., to finally get that ring. Magic, Larry & Kareem won their first titles early in their careers, but they had playoff failures too. It's part of the process.

I'm looking forward to seeing how young cats like Durant, Westbrook, Griffin come back next season. If I'm Blake Griffin, I'm spending my summer with Hakeem. His advice to Lebron was "keep attacking".

U really can't count Magic, Bird or Kareem. Look at the teammates they had as young players. They were the final piece 2 a pie already built.

I just saw what you cats were talking about. I fucking LOVE Mark Cuban! All Shit Bayless is good for is sucking off Tim Tebow.

Astasheiks said:

Cerebus said:

I'm gonna have to agree with phunkdaddy here. LeBron stayed for seven years. AFTER he made it to the finals his owner did little effort to bring in the players that would make that team better. LeBron gave him plenty of time to do it, too. But when he didn't do it, and it was clear he wasn't going to, LeBron went to someplace where those players wanted HIM instead. I think everything he did was fine, OTHER than that damn tv show. The last two years of his life would have been completely different if he had just quitely gone to Miami in the off season.

Speaking of Cleveland's owner Gilbert, that arsehole! Time to bring up his near exact quote when LeBron left..."We will win a NBA championship way before this self anointed King will win one"!

Really Gilbert, ESPN should be replaying that quote now Cleveland didn't even make the playoffs! He looks like a real fool now with that quote (open mouth insert foot)

Wow. He said that?! Talk about gullible. Must hurt...

Dag Gum right he said it; I recorded and saved it, I'm going to find it and make a video spoof off of it!

Graycap23 said:

uPtoWnNY said:

Damn right you have to put in the work - you have to add something to your game every year. How you come back from playoff failure is critical. Look how long it took Wilt, Jordan, West, Dr J,, Isaiah, Drexler, Hakeem, Kidd, Shaq, Lebron, etc., to finally get that ring. Magic, Larry & Kareem won their first titles early in their careers, but they had playoff failures too. It's part of the process.

I'm looking forward to seeing how young cats like Durant, Westbrook, Griffin come back next season. If I'm Blake Griffin, I'm spending my summer with Hakeem. His advice to Lebron was "keep attacking".

U really can't count Magic, Bird or Kareem. Look at the teammates they had as young players. They were the final piece 2 a pie already built.

But neither the Lakers or the Celtics were winning titles before those 2 arrived.

Seattle was on the verge of a dynasty before Magic arrived. He put an end to it

before it ever got started and the Lakers became a dynasty. Magic led the Lakers to a championship in his rookie season. Unheard of.

But even the great ones like Magic can struggle. In 1981, LA lost the opening round to Houston. I give them a pass in 1983 - they were banged up. At full strength, they weren't beating Philly. But they choked in 1984 against Boston. Magic and Worthy made critical mistakes in that series - Magic was being called 'Tragic Johnson' by the media. But he went on to win three more titles.

I predict the young Thunder will come back with a vengeance.

How quickly people forget the Lakers were struggling even WITH Magic... it took a whole team to make it work. Why'd you think it took Michael Jordan seven years to win his first one? Because he didn't have a team to really back him up. Once he did, it was on. That's what won Miami. Not just because of its star players but because of the whole team and its coach. As been said Oklahoma's a REAL YOUNG team so they have chances to grow.

phunkdaddy said:

Graycap23 said:

U really can't count Magic, Bird or Kareem. Look at the teammates they had as young players. They were the final piece 2 a pie already built.

But neither the Lakers or the Celtics were winning titles before those 2 arrived.

Seattle was on the verge of a dynasty before Magic arrived. He put an end to it

before it ever got started and the Lakers became a dynasty. Magic led the Lakers to a championship in his rookie season. Unheard of.

So was 6' 9" point guards. That team had Wilkes, Kareem, Nixon, and a lot of established NBA players. Don't pretend like it was just Magic. He was the last piece they needed, not the 1st.

[Edited 6/26/12 5:50am]

Anybody know how much the players win per playoff game? Or how the playoff pay is determine? Do they get more for conference championships and then even more for The Finals?

Timmy84 said:

How quickly people forget the Lakers were struggling even WITH Magic... it took a whole team to make it work.

Remember, Magic & Larry faced stiffer competition than Michael did. None of the teams the Bulls faced in the finals were as good as those great Celtic/Laker teams of the 80s or that awesome Philly squad from '83.

Astasheiks said:

Anybody know how much the players win per playoff game? Or how the playoff pay is determine? Do they get more for conference championships and then even more for The Finals?

There is a playoff pool that is used to pay all the teams that make it to the post season.

For the Finals there is a bonus given to the winning and losing team. This money is seperate from the playoff pool. Obviously the winning team gets a larger bonus.

However, both the pool and bonus monies are paid out to the teams. I'm not sure how much of it goes directly to the players. Definitely not all of it. It's their job to get to the playoffs and win titles (if they can) and they already get paid very well for that.

uPtoWnNY said:

Timmy84 said:

How quickly people forget the Lakers were struggling even WITH Magic... it took a whole team to make it work.

Remember, Magic & Larry faced stiffer competition than Michael did. None of the teams the Bulls faced in the finals were as good as those great Celtic/Laker teams of the 80s or that awesome Philly squad from '83.

Yeah it's crazy when you think about it. When Michael started winning championships, it was kinda like when Mike Tyson was knocking motherfuckers out all the time...

Lol......

Timmy84 said:

uPtoWnNY said:

Remember, Magic & Larry faced stiffer competition than Michael did. None of the teams the Bulls faced in the finals were as good as those great Celtic/Laker teams of the 80s or that awesome Philly squad from '83.

Yeah it's crazy when you think about it. When Michael started winning championships, it was kinda like when Mike Tyson was knocking motherfuckers out all the time...

U play

Whom u play

When u play them.

Simple as that.

But the quality of play during Magic & Larry's heyday was plain sick. The NBA has never been as good as it was during the 80s - that's all I'm saying.

uPtoWnNY said:

But the quality of play during Magic & Larry's heyday was plain sick. The NBA has never been as good as it was during the 80s - that's all I'm saying.

If if were so good, why did the Lakers wind up in the Finals almost every single year?

(it was good though)

^ You don't think the Lakers had tough competition then? Really?

Graycap23 said:

Lol......

Timmy84 said:

Yeah it's crazy when you think about it. When Michael started winning championships, it was kinda like when Mike Tyson was knocking motherfuckers out all the time...

U play

Whom u play

When u play them.

Simple as that.

Riiiight. Few gave them the run for their money (Knicks, Suns, Sonics, the Trail Blazers when they faced them in the finals)...

Timmy84 said:

^ You don't think the Lakers had tough competition then? Really?

They were tough but how tough were they? They Lakers played in 9 title rounds.......

Graycap23 said:

Timmy84 said:

^ You don't think the Lakers had tough competition then? Really?

They were tough but how tough were they? They Lakers played in 9 title rounds.......

Depends on how hard the Lakers played. It wasn't like they were smooth sailing and shit. You remember their injuries? Those boys played HARD mane!

Cerebus said:

Astasheiks said:

Anybody know how much the players win per playoff game? Or how the playoff pay is determine? Do they get more for conference championships and then even more for The Finals?

There is a playoff pool that is used to pay all the teams that make it to the post season.

For the Finals there is a bonus given to the winning and losing team. This money is seperate from the playoff pool. Obviously the winning team gets a larger bonus.

However, both the pool and bonus monies are paid out to the teams. I'm not sure how much of it goes directly to the players. Definitely not all of it. It's their job to get to the playoffs and win titles (if they can) and they already get paid very well for that.

Interesting info you do have. Now google should provide how much these players actually get...

Graycap23 said:

uPtoWnNY said:

But the quality of play during Magic & Larry's heyday was plain sick. The NBA has never been as good as it was during the 80s - that's all I'm saying.

If if were so good, why did the Lakers wind up in the Finals almost every single year?

(it was good though)

Simple: Magic Johnson

Need we really even debate this

Timmy84 said:

Graycap23 said:

Lol......

U play

Whom u play

When u play them.

Simple as that.

Riiiight. Few gave them the run for their money (Knicks, Suns, Sonics, the Trail Blazers when they faced them in the finals)...

I thought the Suns played them tough even winning a game in Chicago but

not having Cedric Ceballos that series really killed any chance they had of

someone at least someone making MJ work hard for a basket.

phunkdaddy said:

Timmy84 said:

Riiiight. Few gave them the run for their money (Knicks, Suns, Sonics, the Trail Blazers when they faced them in the finals)...

I thought the Suns played them tough even winning a game in Chicago but

not having Cedric Ceballos that series really killed any chance they had of

someone at least someone making MJ work hard for a basket.

Yeah Charles couldn't carry that team. Strangely enough I was actually rooting for Phoenix that year! But of course I cheered when Chicago won because it meant a third championship for MJ. I was a fan of Jordan then.