I'd like to share some experiences I have made recently and read what you have to say about them. Advice, explanations, opinions etc.

Now, we all know that I'm basically a bad, evil, careless motherfucker, so this might surprise some of you, but there a moments when I feel extreme empathy for other people. Not the usual empathy you feel when you see someone poorer than you or a sick little bad cat, but the kind of empathy that's extremely uncomfortable and makes you feel more emotional than you even want to feel.

I'll give two examples:

Today in the train, on my way home, I was sitting close to an older man who was reading a book. He held the book close to his face and opened his eyes only a little, moved his head from left to right with every line. He had a rucksack with all kinds of child-like things on it - teddybears etc. I could tell by the way he moved that he probably had some kind of minor (mental) handicap. I watched him closely and could tell that he was reading poetry. The way he was reading it, with the book literally an inch away from his face, quickly and desperately moving his head to get to the next line as quickly as possible, made me feel all weak inside. I don't know why, but I wanted to know more about him, know his story, know what was wrong with him and why and I wanted to connect with him on a friendly level, but I didn't know how. Then I had to get off the train...

Last week I was also sitting in the train, on my way to uni, and a black man sat down opposite of me. He looked out of the window and I could see tears running down his cheek and his eyes being all swollen, even though he tried not to show it. I don't know why, but I could tell he was extremely lonely and that he felt betrayed. I wanted to help him. He stood up to get off the train and I didn't hesitate and simply touched his arm, looked at him and said "keep your head up, man, I know you can do it" and he nodded and went away. First I felt relieved to have done something, but moments later I started to feel extremely uncomfortable and angry with myself. I'm usually a very private person who I also very careful about and respecting other people's privacy. How could I assume my words would mend his pain? Who gave me the right to interfere and tamper with other people's lives? If someone had said those words to me I probably would even have felt a bit offended and hemmed in.

Why do we feel empathy?

Do you know that feeling?

What do you do in situations like that?

What would you have done?

Were my reactions "correct"? Was I right to share "support" or was I right to be angry about my interfering?

It's really aggravating, because I usually think about those people for days, even if I know I'll probably never see them again. I think about how they live, whether they are happy, their past and what I should/could have done to help them. Funnily, I usually don't give a flying fuck about most people around me, but some individuals just touch me deeply and I don't know if I really want that...

changed "pity" to "empathy"

[Edited 1/19/12 3:44am]

We feel pity because we are social creatures and wired to connect with others - even the misanthropes and fiercely independent spirits.

We also see ourselves in others, and when someone is lost or in pain we tend to project ourselves onto them and subconsciously start thinking about how we would feel in that situation, or how we would want to be treated.

Your reactions were normal, but because you are in your early twenties, hyper-self-aware and still figuring out who you're going to be in relation to the world around you, you are over-analyzing both your reactions and these unfamiliar feelings. Which is also normal.

PunkMistress said:

We feel pity because we are social creatures and wired to connect with others - even the misanthropes and fiercely independent spirits.

We also see ourselves in others, and when someone is lost or in pain we tend to project ourselves onto them and subconsciously start thinking about how we would feel in that situation, or how we would want to be treated.

Your reactions were normal, but because you are in your early twenties, hyper-self-aware and still figuring out who you're going to be in relation to the world around you, you are over-analyzing both your reactions and these unfamiliar feelings. Which is also normal.

Christ, can I get a reading?

These are good questions, and things that people don't usually think about much. I think humans, especially as part of the animal kingdom, are fascinating.

Number23 said:

PunkMistress said:

We feel pity because we are social creatures and wired to connect with others - even the misanthropes and fiercely independent spirits.

We also see ourselves in others, and when someone is lost or in pain we tend to project ourselves onto them and subconsciously start thinking about how we would feel in that situation, or how we would want to be treated.

Your reactions were normal, but because you are in your early twenties, hyper-self-aware and still figuring out who you're going to be in relation to the world around you, you are over-analyzing both your reactions and these unfamiliar feelings. Which is also normal.

Christ, can I get a reading?

Yeah, me next.

evil ppl dont feel pity .. since you felt compassion, kindness n shit does that make u a softer evil motherfucker now ?

[Edited 1/17/12 12:04pm]

[Edited 1/17/12 15:27pm]

Is it really pity? Or compassion?

Because pity, by definition, is about feeling grief or concern for someone who's suffering. It doesn't sound like the man you saw was really suffering - just in his own world. (And even if he's suffering by your standards, I doubt he'd think he was.)

Compassion is more a feeling that you share the troubles of another - and having the inclination to help them, in some way.

You know who I always pity?

Da foo's.

It had to be done.

if im on the train its either goin to work in LA or a gig at staples or nokia ..n i just put on my ipod n look out the window .. nothing else exists xcpet the view my comfort n the music.

In answer to the question - I don't know. I guess it's just a human response. An understanding and a need to heal.

I remember when I was in London with you - I think we were on a tube train and you spoke then about all the hundreds of people around us and all the different stories to be told. I never really bothered looking at people like that before. Now I often think about that.

Pity is destructive, Compassion is constructive.

Turn that pity into Compassion and you might feel differently inside about situations. People, every single one of us, have the answers inside.

Pity is feeling sorry for someone, Compassion is lending empathy and concern without making someone a victim.

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Pity is destructive, Compassion is constructive.

Turn that pity into Compassion and you might feel differently inside about situations. People, every single one of us, have the answers inside.

Pity is feeling sorry for someone, Compassion is lending empathy and concern without making someone a victim.

Dave1992 said:

I'd like to share some experiences I have made recently and read what you have to say about them. Advice, explanations, opinions etc.

Now, we all know that I'm basically a bad, evil, careless motherfucker, so this might surprise some of you, but there a moments when I feel extreme pity for other people. Not the usual pity you feel when you see someone poorer than you or a sick little bad cat, but the kind of pity that's extremely uncomfortable and makes you feel more emotional than you even want to feel.

I'll give two examples:

Today in the train, on my way home, I was sitting close to an older man who was reading a book. He held the book close to his face and opened his eyes only a little, moved his head from left to right with every line. He had a rucksack with all kinds of child-like things on it - teddybears etc. I could tell by the way he moved that he probably had some kind of minor (mental) handicap. I watched him closely and could tell that he was reading poetry. The way he was reading it, with the book literally an inch away from his face, quickly and desperately moving his head to get to the next line as quickly as possible, made me feel all weak inside. I don't know why, but I wanted to know more about him, know his story, know what was wrong with him and why and I wanted to connect with him on a friendly level, but I didn't know how. Then I had to get off the train...

Last week I was also sitting in the train, on my way to uni, and a black man sat down opposite of me. He looked out of the window and I could see tears running down his cheek and his eyes being all swollen, even though he tried not to show it. I don't know why, but I could tell he was extremely lonely and that he felt betrayed. I wanted to help him. He stood up to get off the train and I didn't hesitate and simply touched his arm, looked at him and said "keep your head up, man, I know you can do it" and he nodded and went away. First I felt relieved to have done something, but moments later I started to feel extremely uncomfortable and angry with myself. I'm usually a very private person who I also very careful about and respecting other people's privacy. How could I assume my words would mend his pain? Who gave me the right to interfere and tamper with other people's lives? If someone had said those words to me I probably would even have felt a bit offended and hemmed in.

Why do we feel pity?

Do you know that feeling?

What do you do in situations like that?

What would you have done?

Were my reactions "correct"? Was I right to share "support" or was I right to be angry about my interfering?

It's really aggravating, because I usually think about those people for days, even if I know I'll probably never see them again. I think about how they live, whether they are happy, their past and what I should/could have done to help them. Funnily, I usually don't give a flying fuck about most people around me, but some individuals just touch me deeply and I don't know if I really want that...

I so understand this.

I think empathy is positive and constructive. I can't appreciate people who, with time, show they don't have any. I avoid their company. I think it's healthy and helps us connect with others. Even if only on a spiritual level, when we simply don't know what to say/do, but do give our energy by thinking about someone and wishing them well. It makes us more alive and aware.

However, constantly saying you feel sorry for someone/nearly everyone, being loud about it, just so that people think you are so good is something I can't stand.

I would never want anyone to feel I feel sorry for them, because that might feel humiliating. I try to approach people I feel for from the somehow "same" level, not from a superior position. All this can be quite complicated, as it's hard to find the right words.

It may be different with strangers, but privacy is another important thing, yes. There is, for instance, a man whose company and personality I grew very fond of and whom I feel a certain compassion for, as I happen to know quite a few things about him. Sometimes I can't decide whether to say something about things that hurt him, when he briefly mentions them, or not. While I'm afraid that doing so would invade his privacy, on the other hand I'm afraid I'll come across as simply uninterested/passive, if I just don't say anything. However, as there seems to be a natural understanding between us, I believe he knows I care, as I often give him my time and show my love.

It could be that your words mean nothing to him, and it could be that, regardless of his reaction, they might make a difference. I know the uncomfortable feeling and understand you would maybe feel offended in his position (I think I would, too), but you also showed that you, somehow, care, without any selfish intention. Regardless of what happenned afterwards, actually telling him something was, at that moment, generous and sincere and perhaps something not many people (myself included) would do. Again, all this is very delicate and everything you've felt is completely legitimate, in my opinion.

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Pity is destructive, Compassion is constructive.

Turn that pity into Compassion and you might feel differently inside about situations. People, every single one of us, have the answers inside.

Pity is feeling sorry for someone, Compassion is lending empathy and concern without making someone a victim.

Yes, so well said

I couldn't agree more, it's what I always say, but I just couldn't translate it properly, so I didn't elaborate my post as much as I probably would have if it wasn't in English! I think the difference between pity and empathy is rather big, and it's something I often think about.

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Pity is destructive, Compassion is constructive.

Turn that pity into Compassion and you might feel differently inside about situations. People, every single one of us, have the answers inside.

Pity is feeling sorry for someone, Compassion is lending empathy and concern without making someone a victim.

Now if we could only ( we = people in general ) intentionally and actively switch self pity to SELF COMPASSION ~ what a wonderful and healthy switch that would/could ( is ! ) be

Number23 said:

PunkMistress said:

We feel pity because we are social creatures and wired to connect with others - even the misanthropes and fiercely independent spirits.

We also see ourselves in others, and when someone is lost or in pain we tend to project ourselves onto them and subconsciously start thinking about how we would feel in that situation, or how we would want to be treated.

Your reactions were normal, but because you are in your early twenties, hyper-self-aware and still figuring out who you're going to be in relation to the world around you, you are over-analyzing both your reactions and these unfamiliar feelings. Which is also normal.

Christ, can I get a reading?

Shaddap!

When I feel pity for someone, yes I'm fully aware that that's what it is.

And I keep it to myself. No one wants to be the object of anyone's pity, and they definitely don't want to know about it if they are.

Dren5 said:

When I feel pity for someone, yes I'm fully aware that that's what it is.

And I keep it to myself. No one wants to be the object of anyone's pity, and they definitely don't want to know about it if they are.

That bolded part is for damn sure.

jon1967 said:

evil ppl dont feel pity .. since you felt compassion, kindness n shit does that make u a softer evil motherfucker now ?

[Edited 1/17/12 12:04pm]

[Edited 1/17/12 15:27pm]

Ieuw, I hope not!

Genesia said:

Is it really pity? Or compassion?

Because pity, by definition, is about feeling grief or concern for someone who's suffering. It doesn't sound like the man you saw was really suffering - just in his own world. (And even if he's suffering by your standards, I doubt he'd think he was.)

Compassion is more a feeling that you share the troubles of another - and having the inclination to help them, in some way.

Yeah... reading through the posts here made me rethink about the actual semantics of the words "pity" and "grief". It's actually both a bit of both and nothing of either. And difficult to explain...

I look at someone or talk to someone and something about them deeply touches me and almost tears a hole into my heart. I want to make them feel good, connect with them and show them my love and friendship. It's not only people who feel "helpless" or "sad". It's also people who are very sincere and honest with themselves, who may have got through some very hard times but do not make a huge drama because of it, who managed to overcome difficulty. Yeah, it's usually (emotionally) sincere people I want to feel connected with on a deeper level.

Lisa10 said:

In answer to the question - I don't know. I guess it's just a human response. An understanding and a need to heal.

I remember when I was in London with you - I think we were on a tube train and you spoke then about all the hundreds of people around us and all the different stories to be told. I never really bothered looking at people like that before. Now I often think about that.

It's nice you remember moments like that. It's usually the quiet moments on the train when I think about that. When noone says a word to anybody, people just walk in and out of the train and you can hear nothing but the train moving. They all look somewhere else and hardly any of them is showing emotion. I know that I'm a part of that puzzle too - I just sit there and look out of the window, even if I'm in the tube. But sometimes someone catches my eye and I start thinking about their story and why they're here...

Aelis said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Pity is destructive, Compassion is constructive.

Turn that pity into Compassion and you might feel differently inside about situations. People, every single one of us, have the answers inside.

Pity is feeling sorry for someone, Compassion is lending empathy and concern without making someone a victim.

Yes, so well said

I couldn't agree more, it's what I always say, but I just couldn't translate it properly, so I didn't elaborate my post as much as I probably would have if it wasn't in English! I think the difference between pity and empathy is rather big, and it's something I often think about.

Yeah, I agree. But it's also feeling sensitive about something/someone. In my case it's often old people who are happy and still live a "normal" life, who go out and enjoy themselves and approach other people with a smile in their faces. Those people are by no means sad or weak and don't really need compassion, but still they often make me feel extremely sensitive and emotional and I want to connect with them, somehow, even if it doesn't mean anything to them...

Dave1992 said:

Aelis said:

Yes, so well said

I couldn't agree more, it's what I always say, but I just couldn't translate it properly, so I didn't elaborate my post as much as I probably would have if it wasn't in English! I think the difference between pity and empathy is rather big, and it's something I often think about.

Yeah, I agree. But it's also feeling sensitive about something/someone. In my case it's often old people who are happy and still live a "normal" life, who go out and enjoy themselves and approach other people with a smile in their faces. Those people are by no means sad or weak and don't really need compassion, but still they often make me feel extremely sensitive and emotional and I want to connect with them, somehow, even if it doesn't mean anything to them...

Mhm. It often comes down to that; feeling sensitive about someone/something, out of reasons that are often not simple to explain; simply feeling touched and wanting to connect.

Basically, it's also what I was talking about in my example, wanting to connect and show love and friendship, being touched by something you feel in a person.

Aelis said:

Dave1992 said:

Yeah, I agree. But it's also feeling sensitive about something/someone. In my case it's often old people who are happy and still live a "normal" life, who go out and enjoy themselves and approach other people with a smile in their faces. Those people are by no means sad or weak and don't really need compassion, but still they often make me feel extremely sensitive and emotional and I want to connect with them, somehow, even if it doesn't mean anything to them...

Mhm. It often comes down to that; feeling sensitive about someone/something, out of reasons that are often not simple to explain; simply feeling touched and wanting to connect.

Basically, it's also what I was talking about in my example, wanting to connect and show love and friendship, being touched by something you feel in a person.

It's a really complicated feeling, because somewhere I feel embarrassed and extremely exposed feeling that way, as if it was some kind of weakness, giving other people an opportunity to hurt me. But then again, I am happy I can "feel" for other people, too, even though I've always been a terrible mysanthrope.

PunkMistress said:

We feel pity because we are social creatures and wired to connect with others - even the misanthropes and fiercely independent spirits.

We also see ourselves in others, and when someone is lost or in pain we tend to project ourselves onto them and subconsciously start thinking about how we would feel in that situation, or how we would want to be treated.

Your reactions were normal, but because you are in your early twenties, hyper-self-aware and still figuring out who you're going to be in relation to the world around you, you are over-analyzing both your reactions and these unfamiliar feelings. Which is also normal.

Sounds negative, or at something you think I would be better off without being. How come?

Dave1992 said:

Aelis said:

Mhm. It often comes down to that; feeling sensitive about someone/something, out of reasons that are often not simple to explain; simply feeling touched and wanting to connect.

Basically, it's also what I was talking about in my example, wanting to connect and show love and friendship, being touched by something you feel in a person.

It's a really complicated feeling, because somewhere I feel embarrassed and extremely exposed feeling that way, as if it was some kind of weakness, giving other people an opportunity to hurt me. But then again, I am happy I can "feel" for other people, too, even though I've always been a terrible mysanthrope.

I think I know what you mean, though

PunkMistress said:

Dren5 said:

When I feel pity for someone, yes I'm fully aware that that's what it is.

And I keep it to myself. No one wants to be the object of anyone's pity, and they definitely don't want to know about it if they are.

That bolded part is for damn sure.

PunkMistress said:

Dren5 said:

When I feel pity for someone, yes I'm fully aware that that's what it is.

And I keep it to myself. No one wants to be the object of anyone's pity, and they definitely don't want to know about it if they are.

That bolded part is for damn sure.

I'm strange in that sometimes I fee a great deal of empathy, while other times, I know that I should, but I don't feel anything.