Good topic.

I think the reason for it is due to calvinist/protestant work ethic, which is fine, but some people take it to extremes, ie.

It is crazy to only get 2 weeks a year. It brings to mind Prince's comments on being 'indentured servants'. It also makes the term 'wage slaves' sound much more valid.

Its all to have more money to buy more goods, but what's the point if you don't have time to enjoy the fruits of your labour?

People give their lives to some companies only for them to turn around and fire you at a moments notice, so it's worth taking time out looking after your home life and family and not neglecting them.

Also, the US / worldwide tourism industry would definately do much better if vacation time was extended as people would take more holidays and spend more money, which would benefit the economy, so I don't really think anyone would lose out.

Here in the UK we get around 4-5 weeks paid leave but even that feels like nothing.

Studies have proved that people are more productive after a break not to mention the health and benefits to family.

[Edited 5/25/11 8:27am]

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Good topic.

I think the reason for it is due to calvinist/protestant work ethic, which is fine, but some people take it to extremes, ie.

It is crazy to only get 2 weeks a year. It brings to mind Prince's comments on being 'indentured servants'. It also makes the term 'wage slaves' sound much more valid.

Its all to have more money to buy more goods, but what's the point if you don't have time to enjoy the fruits of your labour?

People give their lives to some companies only for them to turn around and fire you at a moments notice, so it's worth taking time out looking after your home life and family and not neglecting them.

Also, the US / worldwide tourism industry would definately do much better if vacation time was extended as people would take more holidays and spend more money, which would benefit the economy, so I don't really think anyone would lose out.

Here in the UK we get around 4-5 weeks paid leave but even that feels like nothing.

Studies have proved that people are more productive after a break not to mention the health and benefits to family.

Ummmmm...if you work less, you have less money to spend.

Unless, of course, you advocate having the government mandate that companies pay people for doing nothing - which won't fly here.

Genesia said:

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Good topic.

I think the reason for it is due to calvinist/protestant work ethic, which is fine, but some people take it to extremes, ie.

It is crazy to only get 2 weeks a year. It brings to mind Prince's comments on being 'indentured servants'. It also makes the term 'wage slaves' sound much more valid.

Its all to have more money to buy more goods, but what's the point if you don't have time to enjoy the fruits of your labour?

People give their lives to some companies only for them to turn around and fire you at a moments notice, so it's worth taking time out looking after your home life and family and not neglecting them.

Also, the US / worldwide tourism industry would definately do much better if vacation time was extended as people would take more holidays and spend more money, which would benefit the economy, so I don't really think anyone would lose out.

Here in the UK we get around 4-5 weeks paid leave but even that feels like nothing.

Studies have proved that people are more productive after a break not to mention the health and benefits to family.

Ummmmm...if you work less, you have less money to spend.

Unless, of course, you advocate having the government mandate that companies pay people for doing nothing - which won't fly here.

Not necesarily...you just tell companies they have to pay the same but give people extra leave. Make it law.

Its crazy that there isn't free healthcare yet in the US and Obama has to be applauded for trying to change that and not give in to all the selfish republican scaremongering.

Of course I advocate companies having to pay holiday leave - why shouldn't they? If they expect a worker's effort day in day out, its' only fair they provide time for holiday for their mental and physical wellbeing. It will benefit the company long term via productivity gains and happier and more loyal employees.

There's no point earning lots of money if you have no time to spend and enjoy it.

[Edited 5/25/11 8:36am]

[Edited 5/25/11 8:38am]

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Genesia said:

Ummmmm...if you work less, you have less money to spend.

Unless, of course, you advocate having the government mandate that companies pay people for doing nothing - which won't fly here.

Not necesarily...you just tell companies they have to pay the same but give people extra leave. Make it law.

Its crazy that there isn't free healthcare yet in the US and Obama has to be applauded for trying to change that and not give in to all the selfish republican scaremongering.

Of course I advocate companies having to pay holiday leave - why shouldn't they? If they expect a worker's effort day in day out, its' only fair they provide time for holiday for their mental and physical wellbeing. It will benefit the company long term via productivity gains and happier and more loyal employees.

There's no point earning lots of money if you have no time to spend and enjoy it.

This is so laughably unrealistic. Who the hell is going to pay for all this?

I get 3 weeks paid vacation a year.

No, I cannot take more than 1 week at a time.

...and 3 weeks is the company MAX.

Genesia said:

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Not necesarily...you just tell companies they have to pay the same but give people extra leave. Make it law.

Its crazy that there isn't free healthcare yet in the US and Obama has to be applauded for trying to change that and not give in to all the selfish republican scaremongering.

Of course I advocate companies having to pay holiday leave - why shouldn't they? If they expect a worker's effort day in day out, its' only fair they provide time for holiday for their mental and physical wellbeing. It will benefit the company long term via productivity gains and happier and more loyal employees.

There's no point earning lots of money if you have no time to spend and enjoy it.

This is so laughably unrealistic. Who the hell is going to pay for all this?

I'm not sure why your views have suddenly changed, seeing as you were earlier advocating extra leave from your work.

It's not unrealistic, it's done in every 1st world country apart from the US. LOL

You obviously need to travel more

[Edited 5/25/11 9:17am]

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Genesia said:

This is so laughably unrealistic. Who the hell is going to pay for all this?

I'm not sure why your views have suddenly changed, seeing as you were earlier advocating extra leave from your work.

It's not unrealistic, it's done in every 1st world country apart from the US. LOL

You obviously need to travel more

Please do not twist my words. At no time did I advocate additional company-paid leave. I said I take a week without pay - by choice. Big difference.

And let's look at the finances of those "1st world" countries, shall we? They're in the tank - in large measure because of all the "freebies" their governments dole out. People in Europe pay insane taxes to make all that possible. Thanks, but no thanks.

I'd rather make my own decisions about what I value - and sock away a little more to pay for my unpaid time, than have my hard-earned wages stolen to pay for for other peoples' whims.

Genesia said:

TheFreakerFantastic said:

I'm not sure why your views have suddenly changed, seeing as you were earlier advocating extra leave from your work.

It's not unrealistic, it's done in every 1st world country apart from the US. LOL

You obviously need to travel more

Please do not twist my words. At no time did I advocate additional company-paid leave. I said I take a week without pay - by choice. Big difference.

And let's look at the finances of those "1st world" countries, shall we? They're in the tank - in large measure because of all the "freebies" their governments dole out. People in Europe pay insane taxes to make all that possible. Thanks, but no thanks.

I'd rather make my own decisions about what I value - and sock away a little more to pay for my unpaid time, than have my hard-earned wages stolen to pay for for other peoples' whims.

The finances of the US are worse than a lot of Europe right now so I wouldn't get on your high horse about that. Mostly due to the bankers and to the military.

The reason the countries are in debt is nothing to do with paid leave,

this has been given for decades when the economies were fine, its to do with the banking crisis and too much public spending, although a lot of this was lost to paying out the bankers.

NOTE: The companies themselves pay leave not the government, considering the profits most companies make that is nothing for them.

Its so dumb when people argue against things that would benefit them, example paid company leave, healthcare free at the point of delivery.

Its your loss if you people think that way.

[Edited 5/25/11 9:34am]

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Genesia said:

Please do not twist my words. At no time did I advocate additional company-paid leave. I said I take a week without pay - by choice. Big difference.

And let's look at the finances of those "1st world" countries, shall we? They're in the tank - in large measure because of all the "freebies" their governments dole out. People in Europe pay insane taxes to make all that possible. Thanks, but no thanks.

I'd rather make my own decisions about what I value - and sock away a little more to pay for my unpaid time, than have my hard-earned wages stolen to pay for for other peoples' whims.

The finances of the US are worse than a lot of Europe right now so I wouldn't get on your high horse about that. Mostly due to the bankers and to the military.

The reason the countries are in debt is nothing to do with paid leave,

this has been given for decades when the economies were fine, its to do with the banking crisis and too much public spending, although a lot of this was lost to paying out the bankers.

NOTE: The companies themselves pay leave not the government, considering the profits most companies make that is nothing for them.

Its so dumb when people argue against things that would benefit them, example paid company leave, healthcare free at the point of delivery.

Its your loss if you people think that way.

[Edited 5/25/11 9:34am]

Yeah, well...those defense costs are (in large measure) because we spent a lot of money defending other peoples' weak asses for a century or more. You can thank the generous people of the United States for your six weeks of vacation, dude.

"Too much public spending." What the heck do you think that means? It means the government has gone broke paying for benefits it had no business taking on or mandating in the first place. Where do you think the money for that "public spending" comes from? "Public spending" = tax money.

"It's so dumb to argue against" more government-mandated, corporate-funded vacation? You know what's really dumb? Arguing in favor of policies that, if implemented, might result in me losing my job entirely because employment costs would rise as a result. I'd rather have a paycheck than a paid vacation.

Genesia said:

TheFreakerFantastic said:

The finances of the US are worse than a lot of Europe right now so I wouldn't get on your high horse about that. Mostly due to the bankers and to the military.

The reason the countries are in debt is nothing to do with paid leave,

this has been given for decades when the economies were fine, its to do with the banking crisis and too much public spending, although a lot of this was lost to paying out the bankers.

NOTE: The companies themselves pay leave not the government, considering the profits most companies make that is nothing for them.

Its so dumb when people argue against things that would benefit them, example paid company leave, healthcare free at the point of delivery.

Its your loss if you people think that way.

[Edited 5/25/11 9:34am]

Yeah, well...those defense costs are (in large measure) because we spent a lot of money defending other peoples' weak asses for a century or more. You can thank the generous people of the United States for your six weeks of vacation, dude.

"Too much public spending." What the heck do you think that means? It means the government has gone broke paying for benefits it had no business taking on or mandating in the first place. Where do you think the money for that "public spending" comes from? "Public spending" = tax money.

"It's so dumb to argue against" more government-mandated, corporate-funded vacation? You know what's really dumb? Arguing in favor of policies that, if implemented, might result in me losing my job entirely because employment costs would rise as a result. I'd rather have a paycheck than a paid vacation.

You seem to be implying that the US subsidies vacation for other countries, that is not true.

If you want to live like that be my guest but you are arguing against what would benefit you as a person and as a country. Hell even you asked for extra leave but you won't be paid.

If you lived in Europe you WOULD be paid so you would benefit.

It may cost tax to have better public services like healthcare but you only have to look at countries like France with good healthcare, a good road network, good leisure facilities, lots of holiday etc to see what benefits this has to society. This is more than can be said for the US.

You wouldn't lose your job as it would become LAW so all companies would have to abide by it. If you believe that you would that's pure republican propaganda. In general Companies make a lot of profit, why shouldn't they pay their employees time off?

[Edited 5/25/11 11:01am]

Genesia said:

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Good topic.

I think the reason for it is due to calvinist/protestant work ethic, which is fine, but some people take it to extremes, ie.

It is crazy to only get 2 weeks a year. It brings to mind Prince's comments on being 'indentured servants'. It also makes the term 'wage slaves' sound much more valid.

Its all to have more money to buy more goods, but what's the point if you don't have time to enjoy the fruits of your labour?

People give their lives to some companies only for them to turn around and fire you at a moments notice, so it's worth taking time out looking after your home life and family and not neglecting them.

Also, the US / worldwide tourism industry would definately do much better if vacation time was extended as people would take more holidays and spend more money, which would benefit the economy, so I don't really think anyone would lose out.

Here in the UK we get around 4-5 weeks paid leave but even that feels like nothing.

Studies have proved that people are more productive after a break not to mention the health and benefits to family.

Ummmmm...if you work less, you have less money to spend.

Unless, of course, you advocate having the government mandate that companies pay people for doing nothing - which won't fly here.

Ummmmm...when you work yourself to death, you have nothing to spend.

I've been here almost 9 yrs... I'm up to 20 vacation days per year, and everyone gets 12 Sick days and 2 Personal days to use per year. As long as it doesn't pass 50, you can roll over unused vacation days into the next yr.

I don't know if we have a cap on how much vacation time you can take at once, but I feel guilty taking just a couple of days; we're soooo short staffed.. have been the whole time I've been here -- but b/c I "never" take vacation, and I usually "have to" work from home when I'm sick, this yr I have 47 vacation days, 12 sick days, 2 personal days - and they give us the week between Xmas & New Yrs off. we have to "pay" for 2 of those 5 days so that's when I use the Personal days. If any of the 12 Sick days don't get used, they go into a 'reserve' in case you end up on disability (including maternity time) or something.. I have 41 reserved sick days.

Last yr was a 'milestone' b'day so I took 2 weeks off (my supervisor nearly choked but, he couldn't deny it - and he knows I deserve it...) ~ I did feel guilty the first few days, but, I was so burnt out, that faded fast

CarrieMpls said:

Genesia said:

It's obvious you haven't spent any appreciable time in the midwest. We do have seas - they're called The Great Lakes.

[Edited 5/24/11 13:41pm]

Minnesota is known as the land of 10,000 lakes. There are more miles of shoreline here than California, Florida and Hawaii combined. And we border the largest of the great lakes, Lake Superior - the largest freshwater lake in the world by surface area (3rd largest by volume).

Yes, I know all that and I have spent enough time in Minnesota to make a judgment, I have good friends there, been there a couple of times ( long enough to know, because, you know, we DO get a lot of vacation time over here ) and some of my friends have a house boat, so I´m quite familiar with the lakes, and while I really enjoyed my stay there and really love the genuinely nice people of the Twin Cities, I´m sorry to say that those freshwater lakes don´t even come close to living in places that are in close proximity to the ocean, or warm and sunny most of the time.

I´ve lived or spent a lot of time in many different countries, especially countries with a warm climate and beautiful beaches (Thailand, Costa Rica, the Aegean region /westcoast of Turkey, Cuba,France, Spain etc.etc.) and I stand by what I (jokingly) said. Like I said, I have nothing but love for Minnesota and really enjoy being there but if I had to live there permanently with just two or three weeks vacation, I´d fall into a serious depression.

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Genesia said:

Yeah, well...those defense costs are (in large measure) because we spent a lot of money defending other peoples' weak asses for a century or more. You can thank the generous people of the United States for your six weeks of vacation, dude.

"Too much public spending." What the heck do you think that means? It means the government has gone broke paying for benefits it had no business taking on or mandating in the first place. Where do you think the money for that "public spending" comes from? "Public spending" = tax money.

"It's so dumb to argue against" more government-mandated, corporate-funded vacation? You know what's really dumb? Arguing in favor of policies that, if implemented, might result in me losing my job entirely because employment costs would rise as a result. I'd rather have a paycheck than a paid vacation.

You seem to be implying that the US subsidies vacation for other countries, that is not true.

If you want to live like that be my guest but you are arguing against what would benefit you as a person and as a country. Hell even you asked for extra leave but you won't be paid.

If you lived in Europe you WOULD be paid so you would benefit.

It may cost tax to have better public services like healthcare but you only have to look at countries like France with good healthcare, a good road network, good leisure facilities, lots of holiday etc to see what benefits this has to society. This is more than can be said for the US.

You wouldn't lose your job as it would become LAW so all companies would have to abide by it. If you believe that you would that's pure republican propaganda. In general Companies make a lot of profit, why shouldn't they pay their employees time off?

[Edited 5/25/11 11:01am]

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Genesia said:

Yeah, well...those defense costs are (in large measure) because we spent a lot of money defending other peoples' weak asses for a century or more. You can thank the generous people of the United States for your six weeks of vacation, dude.

"Too much public spending." What the heck do you think that means? It means the government has gone broke paying for benefits it had no business taking on or mandating in the first place. Where do you think the money for that "public spending" comes from? "Public spending" = tax money.

"It's so dumb to argue against" more government-mandated, corporate-funded vacation? You know what's really dumb? Arguing in favor of policies that, if implemented, might result in me losing my job entirely because employment costs would rise as a result. I'd rather have a paycheck than a paid vacation.

You seem to be implying that the US subsidies vacation for other countries, that is not true.

If you want to live like that be my guest but you are arguing against what would benefit you as a person and as a country. Hell even you asked for extra leave but you won't be paid.

If you lived in Europe you WOULD be paid so you would benefit.

It may cost tax to have better public services like healthcare but you only have to look at countries like France with good healthcare, a good road network, good leisure facilities, lots of holiday etc to see what benefits this has to society. This is more than can be said for the US.

You wouldn't lose your job as it would become LAW so all companies would have to abide by it. If you believe that you would that's pure republican propaganda. In general Companies make a lot of profit, why shouldn't they pay their employees time off?

Speaking of propoganda - what you bolded is pure Democrat/Labor nonsense.

Of course, the US subsidizes the social spending of other countries. We do so by shouldering the burden of defense spending. Money that doesn't have to be spent on defense can be spent elsewhere - like on cradle to grave social programs.

This is why you have generations on the dole in the UK. If you just get stuff (free child care, free health care, unlimited welfare) without having to work for it, what incentive is there to work? You might as well sit on your arse and collect the earnings of others.

[Edited 5/25/11 13:22pm]

Genesia said:

TheFreakerFantastic said:

You seem to be implying that the US subsidies vacation for other countries, that is not true.

If you want to live like that be my guest but you are arguing against what would benefit you as a person and as a country. Hell even you asked for extra leave but you won't be paid.

If you lived in Europe you WOULD be paid so you would benefit.

It may cost tax to have better public services like healthcare but you only have to look at countries like France with good healthcare, a good road network, good leisure facilities, lots of holiday etc to see what benefits this has to society. This is more than can be said for the US.

You wouldn't lose your job as it would become LAW so all companies would have to abide by it. If you believe that you would that's pure republican propaganda. In general Companies make a lot of profit, why shouldn't they pay their employees time off?

Speaking of propoganda - what you bolded is pure Democrat/Labor nonsense.

Of course, the US subsidizes the social spending of other countries. We do so by shouldering the burden of defense spending. Money that doesn't have to be spent on defense can be spent elsewhere - like on cradle to grave social programs.

This is why you have generations on the dole in the UK. If you just get stuff (free child care, free health care, unlimited welfare) without having to work for it, what incentive is there to work? You might as well sit on your arse and collect the earnings of others.

[Edited 5/25/11 13:22pm]

What well if you're really ill you cannot work, try telling someone with a terminal illness that they can't have healthcare if they can't work....THAT IS SICK

The US spends on defence to further its own interests, it does not really benefit other countries (has it benefitted Iraq and Afghanistan?) and even if it does, it benefits the US more, you would be naive to think otherwise. You already spend billions of dollars on the military when this could be spent on social programmes, so you wouldn't even NEED to raise taxes.

Anyway Genesia your argument is totally illogical as you said yourself you've had to sacrifice a week's pay for a holiday - so you are someone that would benefit from this. It's nothing to do with higher taxes and state intervention (republican scaremongering) - it just means employers would have to provide more for their staff.

It is said that American employees are overpaid compared for a similar job in Europe, perhaps the lack of benefits and holiday is why.

[Edited 5/25/11 14:11pm]