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Thread started 05/12/10 5:37pm

DesireeNevermi
nd

GAY ACTORS CAN'T PLAY STRAIGHT? WHA?????

confuse I thought the job of any actor, regardless of sexual preference, was to bring to life a character from a story and convince the audience that he is that person. The job of an actor is to....ACT! Unless it's a full on sex scene (maybe harder to convince the audience if they know the actor is really gay), the gay actor playing straight does just a good a job as the straight actor playing gay. Yes or No? Discuss.


The Newsweek article:

Straight Jacket:Heterosexual actors play gay all the time. Why doesn't it ever work in reverse?

The reviews for the Broadway revival of Promises, Promises were negative enough, even though most of the critics ignored the real problem—the big pink elephant in the room. The leading man of this musical-romantic comedy is supposed to be a single advertising peon named Chuck who is madly in love with a co-worker (Kristin Chenoweth). When the play opened on Broadway in 1968, Jerry Orbach, an actor with enough macho swagger to later fuel years and years of Law and Order, was the star. The revival hands the lead over to Sean Hayes, best known as the queeny Jack on Will & Grace. Hayes is among Hollywood's best verbal slapstickers, but his sexual orientation is part of who he is, and also part of his charm. (The fact that he only came out of the closet just before Promises was another one of those Ricky Martin-duh moments.) But frankly, it's weird seeing Hayes play straight. He comes off as wooden and insincere, like he's trying to hide something, which of course he is. Even the play's most hilarious scene, when Chuck tries to pick up a drunk woman at a bar, devolves into unintentional camp. Is it funny because of all the '60s-era one-liners, or because the woman is so drunk (and clueless) that she agrees to go home with a guy we all know is gay?

This is no laughing matter, however. For decades, Hollywood has kept gay actors—Tab Hunter, Van Johnson, Anthony Perkins, Rock Hudson, etc.—in the closet, to their own personal detriment. The fear was, if people knew your sexual orientation, you could never work again. Thankfully, this seems ridiculous in the era of Portia de Rossi and Neil Patrick Harris. But the truth is, openly gay actors still have reason to be scared. While it's OK for straight actors to play gay (as Jake Gyllenhaal and Heath Ledger did in Brokeback Mountain), it's rare for someone to pull off the trick in reverse. De Rossi and Harris do that on TV, but they also inhabit broad caricatures, not realistic characters likes the ones in Up in the Air or even The Proposal. Last year, Rupert Everett caused a ruckus when he told the Guardian that gay actors should stay in the closet. "The fact is," he said, "that you could not be, and still cannot be, a 25-year-old homosexual trying to make it in the ... film business." Is he just bitter or honest? Maybe both.

Most actors would tell you that the biographical details of their lives are beside the point. Except when they're not. As viewers, we are molded by a society obsessed with dissecting sexuality, starting with the locker-room torture in junior high school. Which is why it's a little hard to know what to make of the latest fabulous player to join Glee: Jonathan Groff, the openly gay Broadway star. In Spring Awakening, he showed us that he was a knockout singer and a heartthrob. But on TV, as the shifty glee captain from another school who steals Rachel's heart, there's something about his performance that feels off. In half his scenes, he scowls—is that a substitute for being straight? When he smiles or giggles, he seems more like your average theater queen, a better romantic match for Kurt than Rachel. It doesn't help that he tried to bed his girlfriend while singing (and writhing to) Madonna's Like a Virgin. He is so distracting, I'm starting to wonder if Groff's character on the show is supposed to be secretly gay.
continue reading...
http://www.newsweek.com/id/236999
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Reply #1 posted 05/12/10 6:45pm

Genesia

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I'm not so sure this is a case of a gay actor not being able (or being allowed) to play straight. I think it's more than likely a case of an actor being so closely identified with a particular role that it's overshadowing his performance in this production.

For a play to be successful, there has to be a willing suspension of disbelief on the part of an audience. If the audience has a strong pre-conception regarding anything - an actor, the script - it can affect whether they are willing to "let go" and experience the play on its own merits.

I suspect that every time Sean Hayes steps on the stage, a certain percentage of the audience sees "just Jack." Fair? No. But understandable.

I'm going to get in trouble here, but I think Rupert Everett has a point when he says that gay actors should stay in the closet (unless, of course, they only want to do gay films or plays). But then, I think straight actors should stay in the closet, too. By that, I mean that any time the audience knows too much about an actor's real life, it is going to make it more difficult for the actor to get over in a role - especially if the character differs significantly from what audience members already know about the actor.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: cultivating an air of mystery - for an artist of any kind - definitely has its benefits.
We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
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Reply #2 posted 05/12/10 7:20pm

TheVoid

There are plenty of gay porn actors who play straight guys pretending to be gay-for-play, some convincing.
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Reply #3 posted 05/12/10 7:59pm

cborgman

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neil patrick harris has had no trouble at all.
Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
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Reply #4 posted 05/12/10 8:01pm

TheVoid

cborgman said:

neil patrick harris has had no trouble at all.

yup.


Neither has Tom Cruise
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Reply #5 posted 05/12/10 8:04pm

cborgman

avatar

TheVoid said:

cborgman said:

neil patrick harris has had no trouble at all.

yup.


Neither has Tom Cruise


fair enough.
Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
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Reply #6 posted 05/12/10 8:10pm

TheVoid

cborgman said:

TheVoid said:


yup.


Neither has Tom Cruise


fair enough.



I think the problem is that once they 'come out' it totally affects their career choices, even in the corporate world. I can't think of any upper level echelon managers in my previous company that was openly gay. And to make matters worse, the environment is hostile as fuck to gays and lesbians. You go to dinner or lunch with coworkers and they launch into marital conversation--"how's the wife?"... "congrats on her pregnancy.." "how are the kids?"... all things gays and lesbians are not permitted to do except in ...what, 3 states? lol

Tom isn't in the closet just cause he's ashamed of being gay (which I would assume he is considering the lengths he's going through to prove he's straight), but also because it affects his ...erm... bottom line. lol.

.
[Edited 5/12/10 20:11pm]
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Reply #7 posted 05/12/10 8:33pm

lazycrockett

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I said this over on the afterelton website.

I'm going to call it as I see here, I don't think for a minute that Setoodeh believes half the crap he wrote in those articles, I believe that he did it to create controversy to help sell magazines for a almost bankrupt up for sale Newsweek.
The Most Important Thing In Life Is Sincerity....Once You Can Fake That, You Can Fake Anything.
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Reply #8 posted 05/12/10 8:44pm

cborgman

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lazycrockett said:

I said this over on the afterelton website.

I'm going to call it as I see here, I don't think for a minute that Setoodeh believes half the crap he wrote in those articles, I believe that he did it to create controversy to help sell magazines for a almost bankrupt up for sale Newsweek.


yea, that article was shite.
Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
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Reply #9 posted 05/12/10 8:50pm

lazycrockett

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Though mad props to Kristin Chenoweth for a great smackdown response.

http://www.afterelton.com...d-newsweek



As a longtime fan of Newsweek and as the actress currently starring opposite the incredibly talented (and sexy!) Sean Hayes in the Broadway revival of “Promises, Promises,” I was shocked on many levels to see Newsweek publishing Ramin Setoodeh’s horrendously homophobic “Straight Jacket,” which argues that gay actors are simply unfit to play straight. From where I stand, on stage, with Hayes, every night — I’ve observed nothing “wooden” or “weird” in his performance, nor have I noticed the seemingly unwieldy presence of a “pink elephant” in the Broadway Theater. (The Drama League, Outer Critics Circle and Tony members must have also missed that large animal when nominating Hayes’ performance for its highest honors this year.)

I’d normally keep silent on such matters and write such small-minded viewpoints off as perhaps a blip in common sense. But the offense I take to this article, and your decision to publish it, is not really even related to my profession or my work with Hayes or Jonathan Groff (also singled out in the article as too “queeny” to play “straight.”)

This article offends me because I am a human being, a woman and a Christian. For example, there was a time when Jewish actors had to change their names because anti-Semites thought no Jew could convincingly play Gentile. Setoodeh even goes so far as to justify his knee-jerk homophobic reaction to gay actors by accepting and endorsing that “as viewers, we are molded by a society obsessed with dissecting sexuality, starting with the locker room torture in junior high school.” Really? We want to maintain and proliferate the same kind of bullying that makes children cry and in some recent cases have even taken their own lives? That’s so sad, Newsweek! The examples he provides (what scientists call “selection bias”) to prove his “gays can’t play straight” hypothesis are sloppy in my opinion. Come on now!

Openly gay Groff is too “queeny” to play Lea Michelle’s boyfriend in GLEE, but is a “heartthrob” when he does it in Spring Awakening? Cynthia Nixon only “got away with it” ’cause she peaked before coming out? I don’t know if you’ve missed the giant Sex and the City movie posters, but it seems most of America is “buying it.” I could go on, but I assume these will be taken care of in your “Corrections” this week.

Similarly, thousands of people have traveled from all over the world to enjoy Hayes’ performance and don’t seem to have one single issue with his sexuality! They have no problem buying him as a love-torn heterosexual man. Audiences aren’t giving a darn about who a person is sleeping with or his personal life. Give me a break! We’re actors first, whether we’re playing prostitutes, baseball players, or the Lion King. Audiences come to theater to go on a journey. It’s a character and it’s called acting, and I’d put Hayes and his brilliance up there with some of the greatest actors period.

Lastly, as someone who’s been proudly advocating for equal rights and supporting GLBT causes for as long as I can remember, I know how much it means to young people struggling with their sexuality to see out & proud actors like Sean Hayes, Jonathan Groff, Neil Patrick Harris and Cynthia Nixon succeeding in their work without having to keep their sexuality a secret. No one needs to see a bigoted, factually inaccurate article that tells people who deviate from heterosexual norms that they can’t be open about who they are and still achieve their dreams. I am told on good authority that Mr. Setoodeh is a gay man himself and I would hope, as the author of this article, he would at least understand that. I encourage Newsweek to embrace stories which promote acceptance, love, unity and singing and dancing for all!
The Most Important Thing In Life Is Sincerity....Once You Can Fake That, You Can Fake Anything.
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Reply #10 posted 05/12/10 8:51pm

cborgman

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good on her.
Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
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Reply #11 posted 05/12/10 10:16pm

InsatiableCrea
m

avatar

lazycrockett said:

Though mad props to Kristin Chenoweth for a great smackdown response.

http://www.afterelton.com...d-newsweek



As a longtime fan of Newsweek and as the actress currently starring opposite the incredibly talented (and sexy!) Sean Hayes in the Broadway revival of “Promises, Promises,” I was shocked on many levels to see Newsweek publishing Ramin Setoodeh’s horrendously homophobic “Straight Jacket,” which argues that gay actors are simply unfit to play straight. From where I stand, on stage, with Hayes, every night — I’ve observed nothing “wooden” or “weird” in his performance, nor have I noticed the seemingly unwieldy presence of a “pink elephant” in the Broadway Theater. (The Drama League, Outer Critics Circle and Tony members must have also missed that large animal when nominating Hayes’ performance for its highest honors this year.)

I’d normally keep silent on such matters and write such small-minded viewpoints off as perhaps a blip in common sense. But the offense I take to this article, and your decision to publish it, is not really even related to my profession or my work with Hayes or Jonathan Groff (also singled out in the article as too “queeny” to play “straight.”)

This article offends me because I am a human being, a woman and a Christian. For example, there was a time when Jewish actors had to change their names because anti-Semites thought no Jew could convincingly play Gentile. Setoodeh even goes so far as to justify his knee-jerk homophobic reaction to gay actors by accepting and endorsing that “as viewers, we are molded by a society obsessed with dissecting sexuality, starting with the locker room torture in junior high school.” Really? We want to maintain and proliferate the same kind of bullying that makes children cry and in some recent cases have even taken their own lives? That’s so sad, Newsweek! The examples he provides (what scientists call “selection bias”) to prove his “gays can’t play straight” hypothesis are sloppy in my opinion. Come on now!

Openly gay Groff is too “queeny” to play Lea Michelle’s boyfriend in GLEE, but is a “heartthrob” when he does it in Spring Awakening? Cynthia Nixon only “got away with it” ’cause she peaked before coming out? I don’t know if you’ve missed the giant Sex and the City movie posters, but it seems most of America is “buying it.” I could go on, but I assume these will be taken care of in your “Corrections” this week.

Similarly, thousands of people have traveled from all over the world to enjoy Hayes’ performance and don’t seem to have one single issue with his sexuality! They have no problem buying him as a love-torn heterosexual man. Audiences aren’t giving a darn about who a person is sleeping with or his personal life. Give me a break! We’re actors first, whether we’re playing prostitutes, baseball players, or the Lion King. Audiences come to theater to go on a journey. It’s a character and it’s called acting, and I’d put Hayes and his brilliance up there with some of the greatest actors period.

Lastly, as someone who’s been proudly advocating for equal rights and supporting GLBT causes for as long as I can remember, I know how much it means to young people struggling with their sexuality to see out & proud actors like Sean Hayes, Jonathan Groff, Neil Patrick Harris and Cynthia Nixon succeeding in their work without having to keep their sexuality a secret. No one needs to see a bigoted, factually inaccurate article that tells people who deviate from heterosexual norms that they can’t be open about who they are and still achieve their dreams. I am told on good authority that Mr. Setoodeh is a gay man himself and I would hope, as the author of this article, he would at least understand that. I encourage Newsweek to embrace stories which promote acceptance, love, unity and singing and dancing for all!


i love Kristin so much clapping
cream.
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Reply #12 posted 05/12/10 10:59pm

Timmy84

lazycrockett said:

Though mad props to Kristin Chenoweth for a great smackdown response.

http://www.afterelton.com...d-newsweek



As a longtime fan of Newsweek and as the actress currently starring opposite the incredibly talented (and sexy!) Sean Hayes in the Broadway revival of “Promises, Promises,” I was shocked on many levels to see Newsweek publishing Ramin Setoodeh’s horrendously homophobic “Straight Jacket,” which argues that gay actors are simply unfit to play straight. From where I stand, on stage, with Hayes, every night — I’ve observed nothing “wooden” or “weird” in his performance, nor have I noticed the seemingly unwieldy presence of a “pink elephant” in the Broadway Theater. (The Drama League, Outer Critics Circle and Tony members must have also missed that large animal when nominating Hayes’ performance for its highest honors this year.)

I’d normally keep silent on such matters and write such small-minded viewpoints off as perhaps a blip in common sense. But the offense I take to this article, and your decision to publish it, is not really even related to my profession or my work with Hayes or Jonathan Groff (also singled out in the article as too “queeny” to play “straight.”)

This article offends me because I am a human being, a woman and a Christian. For example, there was a time when Jewish actors had to change their names because anti-Semites thought no Jew could convincingly play Gentile. Setoodeh even goes so far as to justify his knee-jerk homophobic reaction to gay actors by accepting and endorsing that “as viewers, we are molded by a society obsessed with dissecting sexuality, starting with the locker room torture in junior high school.” Really? We want to maintain and proliferate the same kind of bullying that makes children cry and in some recent cases have even taken their own lives? That’s so sad, Newsweek! The examples he provides (what scientists call “selection bias”) to prove his “gays can’t play straight” hypothesis are sloppy in my opinion. Come on now!

Openly gay Groff is too “queeny” to play Lea Michelle’s boyfriend in GLEE, but is a “heartthrob” when he does it in Spring Awakening? Cynthia Nixon only “got away with it” ’cause she peaked before coming out? I don’t know if you’ve missed the giant Sex and the City movie posters, but it seems most of America is “buying it.” I could go on, but I assume these will be taken care of in your “Corrections” this week.

Similarly, thousands of people have traveled from all over the world to enjoy Hayes’ performance and don’t seem to have one single issue with his sexuality! They have no problem buying him as a love-torn heterosexual man. Audiences aren’t giving a darn about who a person is sleeping with or his personal life. Give me a break! We’re actors first, whether we’re playing prostitutes, baseball players, or the Lion King. Audiences come to theater to go on a journey. It’s a character and it’s called acting, and I’d put Hayes and his brilliance up there with some of the greatest actors period.

Lastly, as someone who’s been proudly advocating for equal rights and supporting GLBT causes for as long as I can remember, I know how much it means to young people struggling with their sexuality to see out & proud actors like Sean Hayes, Jonathan Groff, Neil Patrick Harris and Cynthia Nixon succeeding in their work without having to keep their sexuality a secret. No one needs to see a bigoted, factually inaccurate article that tells people who deviate from heterosexual norms that they can’t be open about who they are and still achieve their dreams. I am told on good authority that Mr. Setoodeh is a gay man himself and I would hope, as the author of this article, he would at least understand that. I encourage Newsweek to embrace stories which promote acceptance, love, unity and singing and dancing for all!


nod nod nod
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Reply #13 posted 05/12/10 11:10pm

johnart

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La Chenoweth is just fuckin awesome. cool
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Reply #14 posted 05/12/10 11:13pm

johnart

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Oh, and for the record, it's funny to me that this should be about theatre because when I watch something on stage I just assume the males are big ole fudge-packin bottoms. I know it's wrong, but that's just me. shrug
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Reply #15 posted 05/13/10 4:35am

joseph8

cborgman said:

neil patrick harris has had no trouble at all.


dude is funny as hell lol and you'd never know he was gay if he didn't come out.
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Reply #16 posted 05/13/10 4:39am

Genesia

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johnart said:

Oh, and for the record, it's funny to me that this should be about theatre because when I watch something on stage I just assume the males are big ole fudge-packin bottoms. I know it's wrong, but that's just me. shrug


falloff
We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
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Reply #17 posted 05/13/10 8:35am

johnart

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joseph8 said:

cborgman said:

neil patrick harris has had no trouble at all.


dude is funny as hell lol and you'd never know he was gay if he didn't come out.


The macho pig dude from Frasier was another out gay actor who successfully played straight.
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Reply #18 posted 05/13/10 9:00am

dseann

Rock Hudson did it for years on McMillan and Wife, Darren did it for years on Bewitched ... come on ... I know many married men who act straight with their wives and their families for years and have them fooled (I include them because they're playing a role here).
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Reply #19 posted 05/13/10 9:06am

DesireeNevermi
nd

My gaydar went to code red when I saw and heard Sabertooth...I mean Sedooteh. shrug He was on Joy Behar and Savage was giving the opposing argument. I'm confused though, why there should be a difference between audiences of film and stage and how they would react to an openly gay actor playing a straight role. hmmm Are films more personal to people? I find myself giving more authenticity to a stage character than a film character.
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Reply #20 posted 05/13/10 9:07am

Genesia

avatar

dseann said:

Rock Hudson did it for years on McMillan and Wife, Darren did it for years on Bewitched ... come on ... I know many married men who act straight with their wives and their families for years and have them fooled (I include them because they're playing a role here).


I see your point. But the guy who wrote the article was talking about openly gay actors. These guys were, to Rupert Everett's point, in the closet.
We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
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Reply #21 posted 05/13/10 9:23am

dseann

Genesia said:

dseann said:

Rock Hudson did it for years on McMillan and Wife, Darren did it for years on Bewitched ... come on ... I know many married men who act straight with their wives and their families for years and have them fooled (I include them because they're playing a role here).


I see your point. But the guy who wrote the article was talking about openly gay actors. These guys were, to Rupert Everett's point, in the closet.


Put it this way. A good actor has no problem playing any role they choose. I go to the movies or the theater based on the storyline not on who's playing what. All I ask for in return, is the best effort of the actors.
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Reply #22 posted 05/13/10 9:27am

tatocorcu

johnart said:

joseph8 said:



dude is funny as hell lol and you'd never know he was gay if he didn't come out.


The macho pig dude from Frasier was another out gay actor who successfully played straight.

So were Frasier's dad and brother
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Reply #23 posted 05/13/10 9:44am

johnart

avatar

tatocorcu said:

johnart said:



The macho pig dude from Frasier was another out gay actor who successfully played straight.

So were Frasier's dad and brother


Was his dad? I couldn't remember.

I knew about his brother, but let's face it, every straight dude he plays is kinda gay-ish anyway. lol
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Reply #24 posted 05/13/10 9:45am

DesireeNevermi
nd

johnart said:

tatocorcu said:


So were Frasier's dad and brother


Was his dad? I couldn't remember.

I knew about his brother, but let's face it, every straight dude he plays is kinda gay-ish anyway. lol



nod Even the fish man from Hellboy...and he only did the voice!
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Reply #25 posted 05/13/10 9:48am

johnart

avatar

dseann said:

Genesia said:



I see your point. But the guy who wrote the article was talking about openly gay actors. These guys were, to Rupert Everett's point, in the closet.


Put it this way. A good actor has no problem playing any role they choose. I go to the movies or the theater based on the storyline not on who's playing what. All I ask for in return, is the best effort of the actors.


A good actor doesn't have a problem playing any role they choose.
I think the problem comes when the $$$ folk behind a production won't take a chance on casting them in such roles regardless of how well they might perform.
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Reply #26 posted 05/13/10 9:50am

Genesia

avatar

dseann said:

Genesia said:



I see your point. But the guy who wrote the article was talking about openly gay actors. These guys were, to Rupert Everett's point, in the closet.


Put it this way. A good actor has no problem playing any role they choose. I go to the movies or the theater based on the storyline not on who's playing what. All I ask for in return, is the best effort of the actors.


Honey, you're talking to an actor. I don't disagree.
We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
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Reply #27 posted 05/13/10 9:57am

johnart

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Genesia said:

dseann said:



Put it this way. A good actor has no problem playing any role they choose. I go to the movies or the theater based on the storyline not on who's playing what. All I ask for in return, is the best effort of the actors.


Honey, you're talking to an actor. I don't disagree.


Genesia gets cast as straight dudes all the time. ALL the time.
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Reply #28 posted 05/13/10 10:10am

Genesia

avatar

johnart said:

Genesia said:



Honey, you're talking to an actor. I don't disagree.


Genesia gets cast as straight dudes all the time. ALL the time.


brick







Actually, I did - once. redface
We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
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Reply #29 posted 05/13/10 10:14am

johnart

avatar

Genesia said:

johnart said:



Genesia gets cast as straight dudes all the time. ALL the time.


brick







Actually, I did - once. redface


lol
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