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PrintableEfan said: Just out of curiosity, if this four-year-old boy wanted to grow his hair long but his parents wanted to cut it, whose side would you support?
interesting question!!! I buzz cut my guys, but if any one of them, even Max last year when he was four, asked me not to, to let him grow it long, I would have asked him why, listened to his reasoning, probably been delighted that he was even thinking about it and let him!  | |
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SCNDLS said: johnart said: There that is again. Shouldn't we learn to express ourselves in ways other than what we wear?? I would think this beneficial and right down fundamental. Sure many of us love clothes and creating our own looks, but this should be something that comes from knowing how to express our individuality in other ways first. It really is a sad statement IMO that we should claim not being able to express ourselves except through clothing. Or that it should rank so high a necessity in expressing who we are.  I agree completely. How does your clothing impede your ability to express yourself? On the flip, a student's clothing or appearance can negatively impact the learning environmnet for others.
I really wish all schools would institute unifomrs. So many parents spoil and indulge their kids with material things that stripping away all of that surface shit could possibly reduce this annoying sense of entitlement I see in a lot of kids today. Thank. You. I agree with both of you. I made these same points in a similar thread. Kids need structure and guidance as much as they need outlets to express themselves...it's called balance. Prince, in you I found a kindred spirit...Rest In Paradise. | |
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SCNDLS said: johnart said: This, as well, is an actual "thing"/phenomenon occurring. Educational institutions have actually had to find ways to deal with this. Different approaches and such. One being, that since it's no longer good enough for many students that there are rules so the institution has to approach by way of getting the student to "buy"  into it. As if complying by the rules is something the student is choosing to do for the institution.
That is just plain bullshit. I'm sorry. My best friend is a high school teacher and the stories he tells me about dealing with these spoiled/privileged kids then not getting any support from the parents who think the sun shines outta their babies asses are RIDICULOUS! They don't think they have to do their assignments or abide by the rules. He has to cajole them into doing their work then if he fails them he has to hear shit from the principal who is concerned about their rating. 
So many of his students are now failing in college and whining about how the professors don't stay after them to do their work or offer extra help. Uh, that's cuz you're an adult now junior. Oh yes, it's always the educator's fault, (from both ends:parents and admin) don't you know? Even those who go way out of their way to help students achieve. | |
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babynoz said: SCNDLS said: I agree completely. How does your clothing impede your ability to express yourself? On the flip, a student's clothing or appearance can negatively impact the learning environmnet for others.
I really wish all schools would institute unifomrs. So many parents spoil and indulge their kids with material things that stripping away all of that surface shit could possibly reduce this annoying sense of entitlement I see in a lot of kids today. Thank. You. I agree with both of you. I made these same points in a similar thread. Kids need structure and guidance as much as they need outlets to express themselves...it's called balance. | |
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SCNDLS said: cborgman said: awesome. the rule is sexist and archaic. it serves no function other than to support forced gender roles that pretty much became antiquidated about 45 years ago.  And that same rule is not unique to nor was it invented in Mesquite.granted. but why blame these parents for standing up against such a stupid rule? Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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Efan said: cborgman said: it's a sexist rule. it has no application or reason to exist other than supporting archaic gender roles. hell yes, fight the system of sexism, same as you would fight the system of racism or homophobia. I guess...but what if he wants to wear a dress to school? And while the parents may want to fight the system of sexism, I still don't think it's fair for them to use their son as a prop in that battle. If the son were 14, I'd be far more inclined to be completely on your side on this. I'm not exactly sure at which age the line would be crossed, but I think a four-year-old isn't really making valid decisions about his own appearance, and the parents are throwing him into the ring for their own reasons. what reasons could they have? what do they stand to gain from this? a book deal? movie rights? Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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SCNDLS said: Here's some video
http://www.myfoxdfw.com/d...er-haircut So, which is it? Is he growing the hair for a wig or is cuz he's always worn his hair long?
[Edited 1/13/10 11:03am] what differenc does it make? why does a 4 year old have to justify long hair to the world? Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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SCNDLS said: PurpleJedi said:
You're gonna have to grow a thicker skin to partake in the P&R slugfests. Making a point, I was, young padawan. I live in one of the wealthiest counties in the world (on Long Island) and I am surrounded by a growing number of American youths that come from affluent households BUT have no f*cking clue as to how to deal with real life. Their parents have coddled them from crib to college and they graduate with useless degrees working crappy retail jobs that barely pay for the maintenance on the BMW that mommy & daddy bought them. In school, (my wife is a T.A.) kids of all income brackets are learning that the rules don't apply to them. They can't even be scolded anymore lest they develop deep psychological traumas. Then when they go out in the real world and have to come to terms with the fact that they aren't the center of the universe, they implode. Blind subservience is bad, but a rebel without a cause is much worse. True that. Not to mention that all this coddling and rule bending is leading to a virtually useless workforce incapable of taking criticism on their job performance and following company rules and policies. These are constant complaints from managers and supervisors with younger workers because so many been raised to believe they are special. omg... how has this discussion gotten to this point where people are certain the kid's going to be a total bum because he has long hair? Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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SCNDLS said: JustErin said: Ya, if they really feel strongly about this, balls up and just say the truth. It's ok to just not agree with it, you don't have to come up with bullshit answers to gain silly sympathy. I wonder how the schoolboard would deals with other religions, like a Punjabi student and his hair...would he have to braid it exactly how they wanted as well...?  I didn't see any mention of it in the dress code. Maybe they handle that on a case by case basis. that's because the rules provide no exceptions. i listed them earlier. Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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PurpleJedi said: Shorty said: This rule however is completely ridiculous.
In YOUR opinion, of course.  well, so far, no one has really defended the rule's existance that i've read. take a stab. Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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Efan said: Just out of curiosity, if this four-year-old boy wanted to grow his hair long but his parents wanted to cut it, whose side would you support?
his parents. a parent always has say over their kids, even if for moronic reasons. i can't really imagine any logical reason why they would say no, but... his parents. Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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cborgman said: Efan said: Just out of curiosity, if this four-year-old boy wanted to grow his hair long but his parents wanted to cut it, whose side would you support?
his parents. a parent always has say over their kids, even if for moronic reasons. i can't really imagine any logical reason why they would say no, but... his parents. what if he wanted to grow a goatee | |
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ZombieKitten said: cborgman said: his parents. a parent always has say over their kids, even if for moronic reasons. i can't really imagine any logical reason why they would say no, but... his parents. what if he wanted to grow a goatee once he hits far enough into puberty about 12 or more years from now? at 16 or 17, good damn luck parents. towards the end of the parenting cycle, i would imagine one has to really choose their battles wisely. but i;m not a parent. if i was, i would let my 16 or 17 year old grow a goatee, sure. Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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meow85 said: CarrieMpls said: It's all a bunch of BS. As long as it's not harming anyone, who the hell cares?
I'd have my child in a different school in a heartbeat.
While dress codes are nothing but pure, unadulterated meaningless bullshit -and they ARE -something like this is not worth the fight. The parents should put the kid in a school with an administration that doesn't get a kick out of enforcing arbitrary rules for the sake of having rules. As for the school board itself? Those folk need a kick in the teeth. I can think of a huge list of things they should be concerning themselves with before fussing over a four year old's hair. Maybe doing something nutty like ensuring the kid is educated or something. I don't know. ----- Co-Sign. Some people on this board need to stop living like it is the 1950s. Who gives a rat's ass how long a kids hair is now a days. I can see being made to wear acceptable clothing but keeping a kid out of class because of their hair is silly. | |
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First, I have never beaten or whipped my kids. Second, I have always allowed them to be their "own person" as long as it didn't jeopardize their safety or anyone else. Once two of my boys wanted to dye little pieces of their hair with peroxide. I helped them. They each liked different styles of clothing and I made them what they wanted even if I thought it looked ridiculous. I never made each of them be just like the other or dress the same way. My daughter wanted different colored jewels glued into her hair at age 15. I let her do it until she thought it wasn't cool anymore. My next to youngest son wanted his jeans painted with all types of weird designs...a NY skyline, peace symbol, make love not war, etc. I did it for him and he wore them to school.
I have two sons who are great artists. One works at a gallery in downtown Chicago. The other is a dental technician downtown and managed to find a cool boss who lets him wear his long braids at work. No problem. One son is a musician and his creativity amazes me sometimes. He dresses the most conservative out of all my children. Although I had rules and school came first, I never saw the harm in letting them be who they wanted to be. And as I look at them now and the awesome people they have become, I think I did okay. I may have been overcompensating for my childhood, where I didn't get to express anything at all...but I'm happy with the way they turned out. "Let love be your perfect weapon..." ~~Andy Biersack | |
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laurarichardson said: meow85 said:
While dress codes are nothing but pure, unadulterated meaningless bullshit -and they ARE -something like this is not worth the fight. The parents should put the kid in a school with an administration that doesn't get a kick out of enforcing arbitrary rules for the sake of having rules. As for the school board itself? Those folk need a kick in the teeth. I can think of a huge list of things they should be concerning themselves with before fussing over a four year old's hair. Maybe doing something nutty like ensuring the kid is educated or something. I don't know. ----- Co-Sign. Some people on this board need to stop living like it is the 1950s. Who gives a rat's ass how long a kids hair is now a days. I can see being made to wear acceptable clothing but keeping a kid out of class because of their hair is silly.
50 years outdated gender roles... [Edited 1/13/10 16:43pm] Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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noimageatall said: First, I have never beaten or whipped my kids. Second, I have always allowed them to be their "own person" as long as it didn't jeopardize their safety or anyone else. Once two of my boys wanted to dye little pieces of their hair with peroxide. I helped them. They each liked different styles of clothing and I made them what they wanted even if I thought it looked ridiculous. I never made each of them be just like the other or dress the same way. My daughter wanted different colored jewels glued into her hair at age 15. I let her do it until she thought it wasn't cool anymore. My next to youngest son wanted his jeans painted with all types of weird designs...a NY skyline, peace symbol, make love not war, etc. I did it for him and he wore them to school.
I have two sons who are great artists. One works at a gallery in downtown Chicago. The other is a dental technician downtown and managed to find a cool boss who lets him wear his long braids at work. No problem. One son is a musician and his creativity amazes me sometimes. He dresses the most conservative out of all my children. Although I had rules and school came first, I never saw the harm in letting them be who they wanted to be. And as I look at them now and the awesome people they have become, I think I did okay. I may have been overcompensating for my childhood, where I didn't get to express anything at all...but I'm happy with the way they turned out. they sound like fine upstanding gentlemen. Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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cborgman said: SCNDLS said: True that. Not to mention that all this coddling and rule bending is leading to a virtually useless workforce incapable of taking criticism on their job performance and following company rules and policies. These are constant complaints from managers and supervisors with younger workers because so many been raised to believe they are special. omg... how has this discussion gotten to this point where people are certain the kid's going to be a total bum because he has long hair? I'm not talking about this kid, and neither is Purple if I'm not mistaken, just a general state of things as I see it. | |
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SCNDLS said: cborgman said: omg... how has this discussion gotten to this point where people are certain the kid's going to be a total bum because he has long hair? I'm not talking about this kid, and neither is Purple if I'm not mistaken, just a general state of things as I see it.well, then why does this point keep getting brought up in this thread if it has no bearing? Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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cborgman said: SCNDLS said: I'm not talking about this kid, and neither is Purple if I'm not mistaken, just a general state of things as I see it.well, then why does this point keep getting brought up in this thread if it has no bearing? Cuz this is GD and we've been known to wander. Why don't you  | |
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SCNDLS said: cborgman said: well, then why does this point keep getting brought up in this thread if it has no bearing? Cuz this is GD and we've been known to wander. Why don't you 
yea, it's me that's bringing the crazy to this thread. Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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cborgman said: SCNDLS said: Cuz this is GD and we've been known to wander. Why don't you
yea, it's me that's bringing the crazy to this thread. If you can't see how the discussion moved from being specifically about this kid to other school-related issues, then yeah, you're just being argumentative for no good reason. 
You coulda easily just commented and offered an opinion on what Purple, JohnArt, myself and others were talking about which clearly wasn't about this kid's hair. Instead, you opted to be the hall monitor and get your panties in a bunch cuz the convo deviated. It's just not that serious. | |
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SCNDLS said: cborgman said:
yea, it's me that's bringing the crazy to this thread. If you can't see how the discussion moved from being specifically about this kid to other school-related issues, then yeah, you're just being argumentative for no good reason.
You coulda easily just commented and offered an opinion on what Purple, JohnArt, myself and others were talking about which clearly wasn't about this kid's hair. Instead, you opted to be the hall monitor and get your panties in a bunch cuz the convo deviated. It's just not that serious. it isn't serious to you, yet you freak out over use of the word redneck and question my texas youth because of it? physician, heal thyself. [Edited 1/13/10 17:59pm] Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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cborgman said: SCNDLS said: If you can't see how the discussion moved from being specifically about this kid to other school-related issues, then yeah, you're just being argumentative for no good reason.
You coulda easily just commented and offered an opinion on what Purple, JohnArt, myself and others were talking about which clearly wasn't about this kid's hair. Instead, you opted to be the hall monitor and get your panties in a bunch cuz the convo deviated. It's just not that serious. clearly it is serioous to you, yet you freak out over use of the word redneck and question my texas youth? Freaking out? Hardly. I always comment anytime I see some dumbass generalizing and stereotyping going on (as you can see right now in the thread about visiting other countries), which is what you did, by labeling an entire town as "redneck" due to a singular incident YOU had. That doesn't make it fact and it's just as ignorant as someone painting all blacks, latinos, or whites with a broad brush due to one negative encounter.
Again, it was obvious some of us were talking about other education-related challenges, yet you felt the need to chastise instead of adding to the conversation.
I bet you purposely drive in the left lane at or below the speed limit to keep others from speeding past you too, huh? | |
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SCNDLS said: cborgman said: clearly it is serioous to you, yet you freak out over use of the word redneck and question my texas youth? Freaking out? Hardly. I always comment anytime I see some dumbass generalizing and stereotyping going on (as you can see right now in the thread about visiting other countries), which is what you did, by labeling an entire town as "redneck" due to a singular incident YOU had. That doesn't make it fact and it's just as ignorant as someone painting all blacks, latinos, or whites with a broad brush due to one negative encounter.
Again, it was obvious some of us were talking about other education-related challenges, yet you felt the need to chastise instead of adding to the conversation.
I bet you purposely drive in the left lane at or below the speed limit to keep others from speeding past you too, huh?
classic. [Edited 1/13/10 18:10pm] Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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well, i can tell this thread is just gonna turn into dumb bullshit from this point on.
enjoy.  Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton | |
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cborgman said: well, i can tell this thread is just gonna turn into dumb bullshit from this point on.
enjoy.  | |
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cborgman said: Efan said: I guess...but what if he wants to wear a dress to school? And while the parents may want to fight the system of sexism, I still don't think it's fair for them to use their son as a prop in that battle. If the son were 14, I'd be far more inclined to be completely on your side on this. I'm not exactly sure at which age the line would be crossed, but I think a four-year-old isn't really making valid decisions about his own appearance, and the parents are throwing him into the ring for their own reasons. what reasons could they have? what do they stand to gain from this? a book deal? movie rights? Unfortunately just a brief mention in the news is reason enough for some folk nowadays.  | |
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johnart said: cborgman said: what reasons could they have? what do they stand to gain from this? a book deal? movie rights? Unfortunately just a brief mention in the news is reason enough for some folk nowadays. Ummm balloon boy??? Why folks wanna act like parents using their kids for attention is so far fetched? | |
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cborgman said: well, i can tell this thread is just gonna turn into dumb bullshit from this point on.
enjoy. Come on man. 
Just because we all have strong differing views on this doesn't make the entire discussion bullshit. | |
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