now, being British this man has no cultural relevance to my life but I have eyes.
And what my eyes are telling me is that no product that does that to the colour of your skin can be doing it any good.
It will not make your skin softer,if anything, it will make it rougher when it burns and scars you.
The only good than can come out of this is to draw more attention to the damage being done by such creams.
I was SHOCKED to learn that such well known and respected houses as Shiseido and Guerlan make skin lightening creams.
These expensive creams are less likely to damage your skin...but also less likely to give the desired effect.
The majority of people who buy lightening creams are buying cheap 'under the counter' products.
Products that are banned in most countries.
It's most often poor people being sold sub-standard, harsh, untested chemicals by someone who wants to make money.
Make out of someone's desire to change their appearance to a suit society they feel they can't get along in.
Plastic surgery is its own thing.
Get your nose fixed...your choice...the man fixing your nose is likely have had years of education and experience and you'll pay for that privilege.
It's the people trying to make their lives a better place through a hidden away cream, sold at the hair shop I feel for.
Those are the people that are being burnt and scarred, mostly unnoticed.

(sorry...I don't know where that all came from.I didn't know I felt so strongly about it)

SCNDLS said:

A "black" latino man lightening his skin is not similar to a white man or woman darkening their skin?

Not similar to a man/woman wearing clothes designed for the other gender?

Not similar to a man/woman changing their body to another gender?

It's his choice. Why the haterade?

Dauphin said:

No, it's not, and if you don't understand why it's not, I don't have anything else to say to ya.

SCNDLS said:

Are you afraid that he's ashamed of being dark skinned? The whole "black is inherently bad!" argument?

By you dismissing the comparison, I get the feeling you think it is okay for white people to blacken themselves up using bronzer, tanning beds, or sitting outside in the sun for hours and hours. That it's a form of praise and reparation for the thousands of years of oppression of darker skinned people.

Dauphin said:

SCNDLS said:

My sister is a book freak, and she read all those books before it became a movie, and explained the whole thing to me before I saw it. Love that movie.

Dauphin said:

people with light skin, who tan, or use bronzer etc... are generally not making an attempt to 'look black'.
they usually want to look like themselves after a holiday.
If you take an african and put him in the north pole his skin won't turn white!

MidasTouch said:

(Bolded part) You are absolutely correct. There was a documentary on this on tv about stores (most Asian beauty supply stores) selling these "cheap" unapproved by the FDA, bleach creams. It's damaging to the skin, and the chemicals get into the blood stream and can also hurt your vital organs. Many women have suffered from it, and some died from the side effects.

Dauphin said:

Nope... many people I know that lighten do so because they hate their own skin color. They actually believe if they are lighter they will find a better husband, job, etc. All of my friends that tan, do so because they want to look "healthier" and do it for a glow. I myself tan to even out my own skin tone, I am like the "after" Sammy and tan to the "before" (well maybe a shade or two lighter) darker Sammy every summer.

It doesn't take much for me to darken quickly, and I feel better when my skin tone is even and deeply tanned. My mother hates when I tan. she says I look like a "morena".
[Edited 11/12/09 19:14pm]

SUPRMAN said:

Dude, what is your problem? I hope you get it over it whatever the hell it is.

Dauphin said:

No because a white man/woman can lose their tan, it's not their permanent skin color.

Sure, Sammy could do what he chooses, with his skin, but the public has a right to express what they think about it, as well as you. Secondly, "no", discussing what Sammy did is not hateration/jealousy. The light skin/dark skin situation has affected many within the black community and other communities for years. Where many have been brainwashed that dark skin is unattractive, and much "negative, stereotyping is always associated with darker skin", and unfortunately there are many that believe that lie.

Not sure if you're aware of the doll test that have been given to Black children, where they were given the darker-skin doll and the lighter skin doll. Guess which doll these very, young girls picked as associating with "beauty?". Enough said. It's more damaging than you think. There is a world out there of darker-skinned people, whether it is in the U.S, India, Thailand, etc., that are consumed with self-hatred because they've been brainwashed. Question is, why is this becoming a global issue, and why are manufacturers/advertisers taking advantage of the insecurities of others and trying to convince them that "white, light is "better?"

Whether your skin is white or light, you take a sh*t, piss, and pass gas like everyone else. You have body odor, use deodorant to prevent the perspiration odor, get sick and die just like those of darker-skin, so why lie to people that "white/light" skin is better? What? They fly and sh*t gold or something?

I'm glad there are those that are not afraid to "talk outside the box". You are entitled to your opinions, such as everyone else that have an idea behind the reason Sammy decided to "whiten" his skin. A representative for Sammy said he was doing some rejuvenation to his skin? Rejuvenation my ass, more like colonization has his ass in a choke hold, to the point he tried to bleach the Black out of his skin. He can't hide the truth behind his intentions, no more than he can erase who he is or run away from himself.
[Edited 11/12/09 19:28pm]

Dauphin said:

Why should she be afraid that he may be ashamed of being dark-skinned? Point is, by him doing that people have a right to wonder if that was his reason for bleaching his skin. It's apparent if that is the reason, then he has some "inner issues" about his skin tone. Bleaching won't change his DNA nor will it erase his Negroid features. He's not a white man, and he will never be, point blank.

Secondly, white people choosing to tan or being out in the sun for a while and ending up with a tan, has nothing to do with years of oppression against people of color period.
[Edited 11/12/09 21:30pm]

PDogz said:

Well said PDogz of all ironies, uh?

That's what I meant when I said, "Mr. SoSa must be one miserable sapp". This goes far far depper than wanting to look "white" and I almost certain the 'skin bleaching" won't bring him peace of mind. I recall someone else who fucked up his face MJ, after all the plastic surgeries he still avoided looking into the mirror. Oh well.

2elijah said:

So true, after winter my skin colour resembles casper so a light tan during summer gives me a nice glow. I've never associated tanning to any oppression towards other ethnics.

Dauphin said:

ok no one is allowed to put down a whole race of people,i agree with the over-tanning thing,thats racial shame too
but obviously if hes changing his skin colour,hes saying that everyone with that skin colour is wrong,and theres nothing biologically disproportionate about being darker
[Edited 11/12/09 20:44pm]

PanthaGirl said:

I hear you. I don't know where Dauphin gets that impression. He/she doesn't seem to understand that for many in the black community, this light skin vs dark skin thing is deep, unfortunately. Has absolutely nothing to do with white people tanning.

This colorstruck sh*t happens inside of many black families as well as outside of it. Spike Lee's movie, "School Daze" pretty much touches on the topic, but not as in depth as it should have. I have 2 light-skin sisters, trust and believe they were treated better and favored, by friends and others, because of their complexions. Most of the time, I ignored it, but it used to bother me when I was younger. But they are my sisters and I love them, and never let people come between me and my siblings because of that. I got tired of people asking "why do you look different?" (in complexion) than my two sisters, yet we look alike in the face, and have the same exact biological parents, in which my parents are my complexion. I actually had someone said to me "What a difference" when I introduced them to my sister, and that was just 5 years ago. I pretended I didn't know what they were talking about and just ignored them. Today, that doesn't bother me when people look "in wonder" because I am happy with who I am.

It pretty much is a taboo topic many don't like to talk about, and it is sad that it happens, but it does. Now Sammy has the right to do as he pleases, no one is disputing that, but what he did is all too familiar to many, and some in that "many" I'm talking about, know exactly what I mean.
[Edited 11/12/09 21:19pm]

TD3 said:

Exactly, for some it is "deeper than skin deep", more of a psychological/insecurity issue, and Sammy will probably keep doing this bleaching thing, until he really damages his health.

paisleypark4 said:

Sammy looks like he belongs in this group

TD3 said:

I'm mostly just disappointed that Sammy felt like he needed to change anything in order to enhance his appearance. Though his appearance was not as "shocking" in the video interview that he did a few days ago for that Spanish station as in the still photo posted in this thread. But at the end of the day, Sammy is responsible for Sammy's happiness. We all have our issues.

why do some white people pay good money to go excessively bake themselves darker with cancerous light products anyway?

because they know that darker skin does look really pretty

Maybe Sammy's new look will grow on me. Because I felt the same way at first when Mike Tyson put that tattoo on his face. I was like... "Mike no! What have you done?!?". But now, I think it looks good on him.

SCNDLS said:

While there might be some crossovers here and there on a few things...maybe, I have to agree with Ms. SCNDLS. Not the same thing.

WTH do transvestites have to do with self-hatred anyway??? Transvestism is a fetish.

Transsexuals?? A person being born in the wrong body, who has to undergo and pass an insane amount of psychological testing before they can change their gender? How does that compare to skin bleaching???

My personal feeling is that Sammy looked great with dark skin. However, he looks a lot like the J Lo's husband Marc Anthony with his lighter skin. He looks good now too.

Reverse discrimination is just as bad as straight up discrimination. Maybe you think he's saying that lighter is better. But it's just as bad as saying darker is better.

It's a personal opinion, and it's why you have culture clash with people in other countries. If you take two people of the same "race" ( an entirely different discussion) and locale, and one is darker than the other, it was probably because one of them would be outside working manual labor rather than being inside. It's the difference between posh and blue collar.

Yes that logic eventually extends to racism as well. However, the root cause is CLASS bias. That a person isn't smart enough to be rich enough to avoid working long hours in the sun.

If you read the interviews that Sosa has given, you'll see that racism is not the motivation, but CLASSISM. Yes classism can take on the mask of racism. I don't see that here.

Dauphin said:

You are right that you are entitled to your personal opinion, but I don't agree that Sammy looks better, but that's my personal opinion. He looks ridiculous, and his complexion is nothing like Marc Antony's. Marc's skin is smooth, and there's not a thing wrong with Marc's complexion, but Sammy's is blotchy, and it not as "fair" as Marc's complexion.

I really would like to see the interview some said Sammy had recently, to see an image of him other than the photos posted here. In my opinion, Sammy is saying lighter is better, and that doesn't mean because some people don't like it and that he should have kept his complexion, that they are saying darker skin is better. That's not the point at all. Point is, why go to the extreme of trying to take the melanin out of your skin if you didn't harbor a dislike for your skin tone in the first place. When white people get a tan, it is not a "permanent" thing, but more of a cosmetic or temporary reason, and not for the purpose of "trying to be black". But when you attempt to bleach the melanin "out: of your skin, that is intentional, to remove it, permanently.

Quite frankly, in my opinion, anyone who goes to the length of erasing their dark skin color, is harboring some form of self-hatred, and that is due to experiences of racial prejudice. Light skinned blacks face racial prejudice too. Sammy going "lighter" unnaturally will not stop his experince of racial prejudice. There's poor whites, poor light-skinned/darker skinned blacks, as well as non-blacks of various non-white race groups. There's also rich whites, light-skinned Blacks and darker-skinned Blacks.

Classism can happen without racism, no skin color required to be poor or rich. If you have wealth, you just have it.

Oprah is rich;Bill Cosby is rich, and many darker-skinned people are rich, yet they all still experience some form of racial prejudice.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this issue respectively.
[Edited 11/13/09 11:20am]

2elijah said:

Then why not ask Sammy why he did it. He said, in his interview, that he was undoing years of working out in the sun (to paraphrase). You guys are trying to turn Sammy into a racist, and blame it on the prevailing culture of racism. Of course it exists. But it goes hand in hand with Gender discrimination, Sexual discrimination, etc.

I am seeing the reverse discrimination in full effect here. Rather than saying something like "oh Sammy! I preferred your darker complexion!" it's "damn Sammy, you are a self-hater!"

Why can't it be as simple as I liked your hair longer! I liked your skin paler! I liked your boobs smaller! I liked it when you wore short skirts! I liked it when you used eye liner on your bottom lids! I loved your old beard! I like it when you shave your chest and arm hair! I prefer it when you keep the chocha bald! I liked your cock circumsized!

etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.

Why can't we say "I liked you darker, but you seem happier lighter. Whatever floats your boat, bro."

Think what you like. Discuss it how you like. Don't be suprised that I'm calling out reverse racism. And yes, I thought School Daze was one of the most poignant films of it's time. Just like DU's No Nose Job.


Edit: I just reread your edited post where you tightened up your points. I do agree that Self-hate could (and likely is) at play. I'm just calling out how people address it with reverse racism.

Also, Sosa's face was blotchy as hell before His tan was totally uneven on his face, and he has acne scaring and wrinkles. Obviously, a lot of that will be more visible by lightening up his skin. Seems like he's willing to throw a ton of money at himself. Ever think that his issue is too much self love?
[Edited 11/13/09 11:25am]

Wow, this has me thinkin what the hell is Mark Mcgwire up to these days..

Dauphin said:

Sammy is not a "racist" because he chose to erase the melanin in his skin. I don't see what being "racist" has to do with it. Self-hatred and being racist are two different issues. I also don't see this as a reverse-racism issue, because that is not what it is, just because you don't want to hear others asking why he bleached his natural skin color away. You do not have to believe that self-hatred for one's complexion exists, but it does, like it or not.

He didn't erase his DNA, he bleached his skin color. You're saying he did it because of years of being in the sun. Newsflash...Sammy is from the Dominican Republic, born in a "tropical" place where there is full sun. This is why no one is falling for that BS line. Has it ever occurred to you that he will never admit his real reason for doing this? It's embarrassing for him too do so. He was never originally that complexion, and this is why many folks question his reason for such a "drastic" change.

I can't say if he will be happier at the complexion he is now, but if he is, how pathetic, that he could not embrace his original skin as much as he embraces his lighter skin. That speaks volumes. Anyway, I'm not trying to force my opinion on you, it is what it is, and I hope Sammy is happy, but I don't have to like what he did to his skin, and he doesn't have to care whether I or anyone else does, but remember that as much as he is entitled to his opinion or right to do what he wanted with himself, the public has a right to voice their opinions about it as well, and they will, whether you or I want to hear what they have to say about it or not.

Life goes on.
[Edited 11/13/09 11:34am]

Dauphin said:

Only in a perfect world that didn't have the ugly history(and still does) of light=desirable/dark=negative.

uPtoWnNY said:

True. I'm probably being too optimistic. I recognize the reality, and acknowledge the history. I'm just so ready to move past it all.

Dauphin said:

I wish we could too, but look around you, especially the image makers.