i'm pretty much bolted in closet..which is hard..and sometimes easy.

baroque said:

oh no!!!

johnart said:

yup, he can't leave his ass alone!

I want kids in every colour and in every sexual inclination.

Well, perhaps not a ballooner, because that could potentially lead to pretty awkward situations at other kids' birthday parties.

I really don't know - yet.
But if one of them is, or if they all are it's ok just as long as they're happy!

A friend of ours has a very butch daughter - the mother is in denial she keeps on pushing that poor girl to do ballet. It's very awkward for the child who just does not want to be there and insists she would prefer kicking a soccer ball!

The mother has admitted no child of hers will be gay! I just shake my head and she says I’m too casual with these things!

my friend's little girl used to stimulate herself all the time, once under the glass dinner table for all to see the doctor/psychologist had told her not to reprimand her for it since it might damage her sexuality! Once she was old enough my friend asked her to only do it in private.

I've got three girls. If the father of the bride is expected to pay for the weddings, I'm hoping they're all gay!

ZombieKitten said:

Well, this touches my own research interests. On a more serious note - although take this as just some random person rambling on the internet - reprimanding her about it would have been a perfectly normal approach. Many modern day psychologists seem to be unjustly afraid of any potential notions of traumas, whilst a certain amount of traumatic events and prohibitions in regards with sexual impulses are only a part of normal development. Sounds like the girl hadn't entered to so-called "latency period" when the autoerotic behaviour of early childhoos is suppressed for a certain number of years, until it re-emerges as masturbation / early sexual explorations later on. I'm just sayin'.

Then again, I learnt everything I know from this guy:

mcmeekle said:

ZombieKitten said:

That's it.

I've started leaving lesbian pamphlets lying around the house.

mcmeekle said:

you can probably pick up little wedding cake ladies cheap "as is" if the little man broke off.

ZombieKitten said:

I try and steal them at every wedding I go to.

I've got a 20 stone red-head and a black lady so far. Might need to do a little match-making to make those work.

It's a tough subject because no one is willing to do any proper wide-scale documenting on it either (a larger study that would document the results in a longer time-frame as well). Practically speaking, infantile sexuality doesn't really exist in the eyes of the science world today. Cases like these are always seen as exceptions or deviations, as something that cannot be that easily covered by the the larger, standardized theory they're utilizing. So the reactions of doctors / psychologists who've been trained in the most dominant psychiatric schools of today usually just seem to pass off any personal impressions they have of the subject as a professional's view, even if they weren't basing their views on much anything (the theories lack any metapsychology that would ground such assertions to begin with). Unfortunately I'm just afraid there isn't much of a theory or research backing up such instructions in these cases.

I'm hardly qualified to pass off any proper instructions for anyone in that regard either, I just tend to personally have a negative reaction to most cases of doctors seeing reprimanding and prohibition as something that would automatically damage the child. She might turn out just okay in the end though, not that I would be able to give any predictions on that regard myself either.

I think then they make the decision (if a case crops up) to better be safe than sorry I guess.

ZombieKitten said:

I guess you're right, yes. It still functions as some sort of a restriction though, so functionally it would at least cover some of the same ground.

coming from the perspective that I do, our line of thinking just would emphasize that during a certain phase in development the kid should learn that access to pleasure - especially bodily pleasure - isn't something they can take for granted. This really would not be that different from the kids who simply cling onto either of their parents for physical intimacy even when they are too old for it. What "will happen in the future" is just speculation though, our theory isn't terribly good for giving accurate predictions either. All we know is that people will come to complain about such things to an analyst later on and expect him to offer a solution.

Sorry for ruining the day and attempting to speak about more serious issues.

johnart said:

yup, he can't leave his ass alone!

how early can you teach that though? I thought it made sense that my friend was told as soon as her kid could understand she could tell her to only do that in private, any earlier and a smack on the hand or "NO!" might make it a BAD thing like touching the stove or running out onto the road?
[Edited 9/15/09 4:06am]

ZombieKitten said:

Oh, okay. I've misunderstood the kid's age. Yeah sure, you can't really make them stop if they don't understand speech yet - and at that stage there shouldn't be a need for it, as far as I know. Self-exploration of the body and stimulation of course provides the basis for the development of the erogenous zones themselves and how the individual will come to relate to these parts of the body, so in that sense a prohibitive effort too early on could be indeed damaging (although whose sexuality wouldn't be in one way or another "damaged" if we're brutally honest about it). All I was saying is that in a gradual sense the access to pleasure by too direct means should be preferably hindered by the parents, or at least by the other parent. Here you would probably have a case where the self-stimulation has found its, uhm, right target a bit too effectively. So it's more of a problem for the parents really, but "adaptation to reality" should however be also carried out by the parents actions as well. If there's been too much closeness with the mother - that would be the stereotypical case. Guess it would be a bit too easy an explanation for some individuals though.

All I can say with my knowledge basis is that if the same thing or its variation continues after the age of 3-4 then you could say there's something of a problem, but kids should pretty much automatically enter the latency period with maturation as well (they would seem to seek authority elsewhere if the parents can't provide it in a sufficient manner, something to rebellion against). Otherwise we're talking about having developed something of a fixation, which usually continues to subsist despite any conscious effort to make it stop. This is a girl however, the subjective relation to the genital area should however develop in bit different manner than with boys (that's just my view as a student of that gentleman of whom I posted video footage above). I should emphasize that I'm not an expert on child psychology or psychoanalysis. Of course I've had to study these things for the larger picture to make more sense, but I lack all practical experience altogether. Whatever I might know (or have misunderstood) comes from trying to understand the bigger picture, which focuses on communication taking place during psychiatric sessions and certain aspects of rhetoric employed in psychiatric texts. etc.


Sorry once more of having spoilt a day, and a thread. :winkfreudwink: