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PrintableCarrieMpls said: gemini13 said: Evidently, I'm not the only one who disagrees. Are you trying to tell me that you've never lost your temper, and that y'all are just the most perfect parents? I asked you whether you had ever been deliberately alienated from your child's life? If not, then you can't understand the level of frustration. I can understand being frustrated, and losing your temper, sure. But you don't lose your cool like that with a child. You just don't do it. Frankly, I don't tolerate people who would treat me that way. And my expectations on how children should be treated are much, much higher than for myself. Carrie, do you have kids yet? 
They can drive you crazy sometimes. I think though, that he's hurt by the fact that he is, for all intents and purposes, following the court order. They most likely have court ordered, scheduled times to have phone contact, and it seems that Kim (who is known to have mental issues as well) is frustrating his contact. I'm tellin' 'ya, if this happened to you, you would be PISSED!!!! I'm always the devil's advocate here, so I'm trying to understand the motivation behind it, and trying to be sympathetic to the non-obvious side. Does that make sense? | |
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CarrieMpls said: gemini13 said: Evidently, I'm not the only one who disagrees. Are you trying to tell me that you've never lost your temper, and that y'all are just the most perfect parents? I asked you whether you had ever been deliberately alienated from your child's life? If not, then you can't understand the level of frustration. I can understand being frustrated, and losing your temper, sure. But you don't lose your cool like that with a child. You just don't do it. Frankly, I don't tolerate people who would treat me that way. And my expectations on how children should be treated are much, much higher than for myself. Sorry, but no matter how frustrated I get, I don't treat people like shit or call them immature names, especially children. I haven't been alienated from my child's life but I have been through things that many people would consider to be absolutely terrible and I still never acted like Alec did. It's funny how you imply that people who don't agree with what he did think they, themselves, are 'perfect parents'. It's like, if someone says they deal with things differently that you do you always get all defensive and accuse them of not being honest about it, or you brush it off as them thinking they are perfect. Like I said earlier, I sympathize with someone that is being alienated from their children but I don't have to agree with the way they handle that frustration. That's all I am saying. | |
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gemini13 said: CarrieMpls said: I can understand being frustrated, and losing your temper, sure. But you don't lose your cool like that with a child. You just don't do it. Frankly, I don't tolerate people who would treat me that way. And my expectations on how children should be treated are much, much higher than for myself. Carrie, do you have kids yet?
They can drive you crazy sometimes. I think though, that he's hurt by the fact that he is, for all intents and purposes, following the court order. They most likely have court ordered, scheduled times to have phone contact, and it seems that Kim (who is known to have mental issues as well) is frustrating his contact. I'm tellin' 'ya, if this happened to you, you would be PISSED!!!! I'm always the devil's advocate here, so I'm trying to understand the motivation behind it, and trying to be sympathetic to the non-obvious side. Does that make sense? No kids of my own, but 2 nieces, 2 nephews and I've volunteered helping children. I get what you're saying, but I still find it inexcusable. Sure, if I were him I'd be frustrated, upset, angry, at my wit's end. I would not, however, take it out on a child. Hopefully, this will be the wake up call he needs. No doubt he is utterly ashamed. Perhaps he can use this as a springboard for change. |
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mostbeautifulgrlntheworld said: CarrieMpls said: Exactly. There's no excuse for speaking to another adult that way, let alone a child, let alone your OWN child. What is WRONG with people?  I sometimes think that celebrities can get away with anything and are untouchable because they are who they are. Kayne West said in a song the following which I think is very true for some celebrities... But the people highest up got the lowest self esteem. The prettiest people do the ugliest things ~ Kayne West "All Falls Down." Im totally not condescending you, and I agree with what you are saying totally. but you sig speaks other words  I will love you forever and you will never be forgotten - L.A.F.  | |
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CarrieMpls said: gemini13 said: Carrie, do you have kids yet?
They can drive you crazy sometimes. I think though, that he's hurt by the fact that he is, for all intents and purposes, following the court order. They most likely have court ordered, scheduled times to have phone contact, and it seems that Kim (who is known to have mental issues as well) is frustrating his contact. I'm tellin' 'ya, if this happened to you, you would be PISSED!!!! I'm always the devil's advocate here, so I'm trying to understand the motivation behind it, and trying to be sympathetic to the non-obvious side. Does that make sense? No kids of my own, but 2 nieces, 2 nephews and I've volunteered helping children. I get what you're saying, but I still find it inexcusable. Sure, if I were him I'd be frustrated, upset, angry, at my wit's end. I would not, however, take it out on a child. Hopefully, this will be the wake up call he needs. No doubt he is utterly ashamed. Perhaps he can use this as a springboard for change. I feel sorry for his brothers. They appear to have no talent. | |
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NDRU said: sweet said: i think the length and the viciousness of the message is what made it sound so terrible
like he HATED her  imoabsolutely, and like she was an adult and he had been manipulated & used by her, when if anything she's been damaged by her parents. It honestly sounded laughable except that it seemed to be real. You think it's impossible for an eleven year old girl to manipulate? Come to my house.  My eleven year old daughter is a mastermind.
My husband's 17 year old son never answers his phone when he is supposed to. His mother has completely lied to him and bribed him with gifts because she wants all of the control. | |
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JustErin said: CarrieMpls said: I can understand being frustrated, and losing your temper, sure. But you don't lose your cool like that with a child. You just don't do it. Frankly, I don't tolerate people who would treat me that way. And my expectations on how children should be treated are much, much higher than for myself. Sorry, but no matter how frustrated I get, I don't treat people like shit or call them immature names, especially children. I haven't been alienated from my child's life but I have been through things that many people would consider to be absolutely terrible and I still never acted like Alec did. It's funny how you imply that people who don't agree with what he did think they, themselves, are 'perfect parents'. It's like, if someone says they deal with things differently that you do you always get all defensive and accuse them of not being honest about it, or you brush it off as them thinking they are perfect. Like I said earlier, I sympathize with someone that is being alienated from their children but I don't have to agree with the way they handle that frustration. That's all I am saying. . [Edited 4/20/07 17:00pm] I will love you forever and you will never be forgotten - L.A.F. | |
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Children are children and as a responsible adult you keep the line between child and adult
My parents, if they were to have an *argument* they kept it away from us kids and dealt with it FROM us whatever frustrations they had in life ( and now I know there were sometimes alot, thats life, but we were never made aware) - we had a happy childhood, and if I did something naughty I was punished.. but I was never shouted at, called names or picked on because my parents were frustrated, angry with life, bills, family, their jobs whatever thats just wrong.. I will love you forever and you will never be forgotten - L.A.F. | |
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REDFEATHERS said: mostbeautifulgrlntheworld said: I sometimes think that celebrities can get away with anything and are untouchable because they are who they are. Kayne West said in a song the following which I think is very true for some celebrities... But the people highest up got the lowest self esteem. The prettiest people do the ugliest things ~ Kayne West "All Falls Down." Im totally not condescending you, and I agree with what you are saying totally. but you sig speaks other words We are talking about Alec "I am a dumb fuck Baldwin" not Lil' Kim the one who refuses to settle for the male double standard so my sig has nothing to do with this. | |
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mostbeautifulgrlntheworld said: REDFEATHERS said: Im totally not condescending you, and I agree with what you are saying totally. but you sig speaks other words We are talking about Alec "I am a dumb fuck Baldwin" not Lil' Kim the one who refuses to settle for the male double standard so my sig has nothing to do with this. I sometimes think that celebrities can get away with anything and are untouchable because they are who they are. Kayne West said in a song the following which I think is very true for some celebrities...
But the people highest up got the lowest self esteem. The prettiest people do the ugliest things o.k. but it still doesnt scream responsible.. and seems you have just contradicted yourself..
 [Edited 4/20/07 17:07pm] I will love you forever and you will never be forgotten - L.A.F. | |
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JustErin said: CarrieMpls said: I can understand being frustrated, and losing your temper, sure. But you don't lose your cool like that with a child. You just don't do it. Frankly, I don't tolerate people who would treat me that way. And my expectations on how children should be treated are much, much higher than for myself. Sorry, but no matter how frustrated I get, I don't treat people like shit or call them immature names, especially children. You've never treated anyone like shit? I don't believe you.
I haven't been alienated from my child's life but I have been through things that many people would consider to be absolutely terrible and I still never acted like Alec did. Yeah, I know, you've been through terrible things, but have never treated anyone like shit. There is nothing like being alienated from your own flesh and blood, so sorry, I still don't believe that you could possibly understand. It's funny how you imply that people who don't agree with what he did think they, themselves, are 'perfect parents'. When people use words like never, always, etc., I tend to not believe them, which is actually my prerogative, Erin. It's like, if someone says they deal with things differently that you do you always get all defensive and accuse them of not being honest about it, or you brush it off as them thinking they are perfect. I don't get defensive, but I do have opinions, and I will voice them. That's all I'm gonna say. Like I said earlier, I sympathize with someone that is being alienated from their children but I don't have to agree with the way they handle that frustration. That's all I am saying. And that's perfectly fine, but it seems you might have an imagined grudge against me, as you are often times rallying against me. That's cool. Pointless, but cool. | |
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REDFEATHERS said: mostbeautifulgrlntheworld said: We are talking about Alec "I am a dumb fuck Baldwin" not Lil' Kim the one who refuses to settle for the male double standard so my sig has nothing to do with this. o.k. but it still doesnt scream responsible.. [Edited 4/20/07 17:04pm] Ok so answer this...why is it ok for me to whore around and sleep with a bunch of women, but when a women does the same thing she gets called a whore? Responsible or not does that make any sense? | |
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mostbeautifulgrlntheworld said: REDFEATHERS said: o.k. but it still doesnt scream responsible.. [Edited 4/20/07 17:04pm] Ok so answer this...why is it ok for me to whore around and sleep with a bunch of women, but when a women does the same thing she gets called a whore? Responsible or not does that make any sense? It doesnt make any sense
Come again... I will love you forever and you will never be forgotten - L.A.F. | |
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REDFEATHERS said: mostbeautifulgrlntheworld said: Ok so answer this...why is it ok for me to whore around and sleep with a bunch of women, but when a women does the same thing she gets called a whore? Responsible or not does that make any sense? It doesnt make any sense
Come again... You are right it does not make any sense and it is just societies way of holding women down to a certian extent....society is fucked up in that way...call me a whore, slut, bitch, cunt or whatever, fuck if I wanna get fucked I am gonna get my ass laid. If men can do it then women can do it. | |
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mostbeautifulgrlntheworld said: REDFEATHERS said: It doesnt make any sense
Come again... You are right it does not make any sense and it is just societies way of holding women down to a certian extent....society is fucked up in that way...call me a whore, slut, bitch, cunt or whatever, fuck if I wanna get fucked I am gonna get my ass laid. If men can do it then women can do it. is this whats known as a thread jack?  due to the content i suggest you like this... | |
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sweet said: mostbeautifulgrlntheworld said: You are right it does not make any sense and it is just societies way of holding women down to a certian extent....society is fucked up in that way...call me a whore, slut, bitch, cunt or whatever, fuck if I wanna get fucked I am gonna get my ass laid. If men can do it then women can do it. is this whats known as a thread jack? I dunno.. I was talking about how adults should keep children innocent and not disclose their pent up issues infront of their kids..  I will love you forever and you will never be forgotten - L.A.F. | |
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REDFEATHERS said: sweet said: is this whats known as a thread jack? I dunno.. I was talking about how adults should keep children innocent and not disclose their pent up issues infront of their kids.. I think we are talking about two different things and it is not really working all that well... | |
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gemini13 said: NDRU said: absolutely, and like she was an adult and he had been manipulated & used by her, when if anything she's been damaged by her parents. It honestly sounded laughable except that it seemed to be real. You think it's impossible for an eleven year old girl to manipulate? Come to my house. My eleven year old daughter is a mastermind.
My husband's 17 year old son never answers his phone when he is supposed to. His mother has completely lied to him and bribed him with gifts because she wants all of the control. yes I do believe they can manipulate, but we're supposed to be the grown ups here. If they're fucked up it's because they're the victims of manipulation, not the other way around. If she's been made that way by her mother (like you say about your 17 year old) Alec should take it out on her mother, and win his daughter's respect with something other than rage & insults. But I admit that message is the extent of my knowledge of that specific situation. Maybe in context it's something else. My Legacy
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gemini13 said: JustErin said: Sorry, but no matter how frustrated I get, I don't treat people like shit or call them immature names, especially children. You've never treated anyone like shit? I don't believe you.
I haven't been alienated from my child's life but I have been through things that many people would consider to be absolutely terrible and I still never acted like Alec did. Yeah, I know, you've been through terrible things, but have never treated anyone like shit. There is nothing like being alienated from your own flesh and blood, so sorry, I still don't believe that you could possibly understand. It's funny how you imply that people who don't agree with what he did think they, themselves, are 'perfect parents'. When people use words like never, always, etc., I tend to not believe them, which is actually my prerogative, Erin. It's like, if someone says they deal with things differently that you do you always get all defensive and accuse them of not being honest about it, or you brush it off as them thinking they are perfect. I don't get defensive, but I do have opinions, and I will voice them. That's all I'm gonna say. Like I said earlier, I sympathize with someone that is being alienated from their children but I don't have to agree with the way they handle that frustration. That's all I am saying. And that's perfectly fine, but it seems you might have an imagined grudge against me, as you are often times rallying against me. That's cool. Pointless, but cool. I don't have a grudge against you, I don't even know you.
Someone disagrees with you and that means they have something against you? Like I said, if people have a different perspective than yours, you dismiss it as bullshit. But you're right, that's your prerogative. | |
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NDRU said: gemini13 said: You think it's impossible for an eleven year old girl to manipulate? Come to my house. My eleven year old daughter is a mastermind.
My husband's 17 year old son never answers his phone when he is supposed to. His mother has completely lied to him and bribed him with gifts because she wants all of the control. yes I do believe they can manipulate, but we're supposed to be the grown ups here. If they're fucked up it's because they're the victims of manipulation, not the other way around. If she's been made that way by her mother (like you say about your 17 year old) Alec should take it out on her mother, and win his daughter's respect with something other than rage & insults. But I admit that message is the extent of my knowledge of that specific situation. Maybe in context it's something else. 
well said.. kids are kids.. no matter who brings them up, it comes down to them learning respect morals, and rules. If you bribe kids you are in a no win situation.. if you cuss at kids they will only learn to cuss back at you.. they learn the smallest things from your attitude to how you hold yourself, and it can be corrected.. they just need rules, consistency and routine, any change from that will undoubtedly complicate matters.. I will love you forever and you will never be forgotten - L.A.F. | |
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never mind. [Edited 4/20/07 18:35pm] | |
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This thread has really escalated!  | |
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| Ok, I just heard the whole thing and I honestly don't see anything wrong with what he said. Obviously the girl thinks she's runnin' shit | |
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Pathetic situation. | |
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I just gotta watch 30 Rock now... | |
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| His apology was pathetic. He basically said that he was taking out his frustration, regarding the divorce and custody battle, on his daughter... No excuse for that. This situation isn't his daughter's fault. | |
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ThreadBare said: I just gotta watch 30 Rock now...
You should already be watching it. | |
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ThreadBare said: I just gotta watch 30 Rock now...
A few things: I was kidding when I said I like him more now... Never heard he beat his ex wife, but if his temper is legendary I wouldn't put it past him... Raising your voice is one thing, but to call her a "pig" is just mean - I'd be crushed if my dad was mean to me @ that age... yea, I'm thinking she's a brat. Still, no excuse... I think whoever leaked this thought he was getting too much attention lately, w/ the hit show & awards & all... Kim was NOT last seen in friggin' Batman! Hell, didn't she win her Oscar WAY AFTER that shit? Anyway, I saw her in something that came out 2 years ago (or so)...
I will not stop watching 30 Rock 
. [Edited 4/20/07 22:58pm]  I never met you, but I LOVE you & I will forever!! Thank you for being YOU - my little Princey, the best to EVER do it | |
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Yes Kim won an Oscar for LA Confidential, which she thanked her husband for during the speech.
Really though WTF cares?? What parent/child relationship does NOT have ups and downs?? Baldwin lost his temper and was OMG human, how fucking dare him. For a moment take a step back and look at your childhood, all of it wasn't sunshine and flowers, you pissed off your parents and your parents pissed off you. "I HATE YOU" was said towards a parent by everyone on this thread at sometime or another when they were a child, and I'm sure you slammed a door. I'm not saying that Baldwin is the best parent in the world, but really when you look at it whoever released the tape to tmz.com says alot more bout being manipulative than some father losing his temper cause he had cleared his schedule and excused himself to call his daughter. and just a thought. What was the recorded greeting that Ireland, thats the daughter, left for Daddy in the first place. Funny thats not in the leaked tape now is it?? The Most Important Thing In Life Is Sincerity....Once You Can Fake That, You Can Fake Anything. |
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lazycrockett said: Yes Kim won an Oscar for LA Confidential, which she thanked her husband for during the speech.
Really though WTF cares?? What parent/child relationship does NOT have ups and downs?? Baldwin lost his temper and was OMG human, how fucking dare him. For a moment take a step back and look at your childhood, all of it wasn't sunshine and flowers, you pissed off your parents and your parents pissed off you. "I HATE YOU" was said towards a parent by everyone on this thread at sometime or another when they were a child, and I'm sure you slammed a door. My parents never threatened me. I'm quite sure I never threatened them. There was anger and arguments, but never anything like this. No long messages or diatribes about how much of a pig I was or anything like that. This was bizarre to the say the least IMO. Anger was expressed in short bursts, and it would end. I'm not saying that Baldwin is the best parent in the world, but really when you look at it whoever released the tape to tmz.com says alot more bout being manipulative than some father losing his temper cause he had cleared his schedule and excused himself to call his daughter. No excuse for that message. This wasn't just a parent losing his temper. The message was too long for that. Plus he threatened his daughter... This guy has issues. and just a thought. What was the recorded greeting that Ireland, thats the daughter, left for Daddy in the first place. Funny thats not in the leaked tape now is it?? The greeting for the voicemail? Why would that reveal anything? Or did Ireland first leave a message for Alec? | |
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