Graycap23 said:

I will give Jerry West, however deferentially I can, my wrong opinion on the matter.

Graycap23 said:

I can't go there. Pip is in the conversation. A certified HOFer. But over Bird? As much as I hated Bird, and as much as I wanted Pip to join the Lakers for one last run, for all the reasons y'all said, I can't co-sign that.

Tell me one thing: Who is "they"? (NOTE: It's a set-up )


Says who? Find that source?



LOL! What?! C'mon, playa. Just stop. Now you're just reachin'. The FACT remains that they were in the 6th spot before they both went down. Plain and simple.


No. Now, see how easy it is to ask a question instead of making answers up for someone else jus to suit your side of the argument, playa?



LOL! Don't worry, bro, me and the fellas already call "Laker" fans like you "Shaqsexuals" and "Kobesexuals" so when I ran this by them that's the 1st thing we ALL said - "He has the symptoms of being a classic Shaqsexual." LOL! Now, I didn't wanna go there originally but since you did, I figured it was time to get my bang on, because that's what I was gonna originally call you instead of "Fan #2"



Nice try, but it ain't flyin' with me. No one BUT you sees it that way. Everyone that knows about that comment has NEVER called it a "challenge"..that's the Shaqsexual in you coming out, playa.



Well hell, that makes you the KING of the Laker fan club then, right, dawg? You get free season tix, huh? Box seats and all, along with floor seats next to Jack! LOL! You're killin' it now, dawg! That SURELY can't compare to 30 years of being a fan, eh? A REAL letter from Jerry West! Wowsers!



So, what, are you predicting that the Heat will win the 07-08 title?

namepeace said:

Kareem is the greatest Center of all time, but Hakeem has the greatest skills altogether for a center: Footwork, handles, post moves, Jater, and D. Kareem doesn't have better footwork or handles or jumper or D than Hakeem. Hakeem is the all time leader in blocks and steals for a big man.

KG and Kobe may become more real than people think.

namepeace said:

Yeah, most won't agree, but none can deny Pip's impact on the game and it rivals that of Larry Legend.

namepeace said:

The ONLY thing Bird had on Scottie was the last second shot skills and that jumpshot. Scotties would kill Bird DEFENSIVELY and running the point forward position.

Graycap23 said:

StoneCrib said:

Players.



Where'd they wind up? Plain and simple. You tell me. Would they have wound up that way with Shaq.

By the way, Mitch sent feelers to the Kings for a package deal for Shaq but it was nixed because they didn't want to trade Shaq in-conference. It was one of Shaq's preferred destinations. I get that from a Mark Heisler article from the L.A. Times dated July 9, 2004, which also mentions Kupchak feared that he was going to lose Bryant before the end of the FA signing period if O'Neal wasn't moved.



Too busy trying to "get your bang on" that you didn't correctly answer the question. Better with or without Shaq? It's a Shaq question, since as you said you wouldn't answer the Kobe questions. If it ain't that big a deal, besides getting in the convo in the first damn place, why not answer those Kobe questions?




You and the fellas using words like Shaqsexual, Kobesexual, and terms like getting your bang on, well . . .

Brother I was just talking basketball.

How you and your fellas get your "bang on" is between y'all.




No one BUT me, huh? No one else in the world sees it that way but me, huh?
Okay. If that's how it is, then that's how it is.

Shaqsexual, coming out . . . Ain't that kinda party man. You seem to venting a lot of frustrations . . . oh, I mean, getting your "bang" on.

When did this become about me if it ain't that important?



Too busy trying to punk someone out that you missed the point. You gotta come with better than that, Crib. Did I hit a soft spot? I say a few things about Kobe and this is what happens? Why are you so emotional about this that you'd try to "get your bang on"?

Weren't you the one who said you didn't have favorite players?

Is that the Kobesexual coming out in you?






No, Laker fan. We'll see where the Lakers are at that point.

I thought you were here to talk Lakers basketball.

Now you're talking about your "bang on" me, an alleged Shaqsexual. Gully.

Calm yourself. Put on an Coltrane record or something.

Go Lakers.
[Edited 6/13/06 15:13pm]

StoneCrib said:

No one denied that. If I think Bird's the best SF of all time, and Pip is in the top 5, then Pip is up there.

There ya go! Now ya learnin', pot'nuh! !


My bad, playa (But I did bang on you though, huh? LOL!) - No, the Lakers aren't better off NOW. Long term? YES.


You sure? Cuz it sounded kinda "O'Nealsexual" to me. Just praising Shaq and hateration on KB. Be a Laker fan, playa...not a fan of a player on ya team. Players come and go.


Um, who said it was about YOU? Kinda vain, ain't ya, pot'nuh? But this about you being a Shaquille O'sexual and not a Laker fan. (Now THAT bang hurt, didn't it? )



Oh. Ok. I GUESS that means "something" LOL! What, I don't know!

StoneCrib said:

:confused:

So I learned that players got better by learning from coaches? I thought I knew that in the first place.

I guess I can learn from myself.



This argument wasn't about me, but was about me being a Shaquille O'Neal sexual and not a Laker fan. I see.

What's this fixation with gay names and bangin' on other dudes, anyway? I thought you were a Grown Ass Man.





You'll figure it out.

Why am I not surprised?


It wasn't...until your blatant hateration for Kobe and your blinded love for Shaq shone through in true Shaqsexual fashion.

StoneCrib said:

Because you said I got a point I made in the first place.




That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
[Edited 6/13/06 16:02pm]

Um. What is that sentence trying to say?



That's kinda how I feel about that sentence in bold.

StoneCrib said:

Here's what was said.

NP: I happen to believe that players and coaches can make players better.

SC: You need coaches to teach and strategize. If the player himself doesn't accept the teaching or the strategy, it goes for nothing. Again, it falls back on the player himself to accept the teaching and strategy.

NP: And if they accept the teaching and the strategy, then that. . . makes . . . them . . . b-e-t-t-e-r.

SC: Tell me one thing: Who is "they"? (NOTE: It's a set-up )

NP: Players.

SC: There ya go!

So coaches are needed to teach and strategize, and players become better in the process. That was the point. Unless of course you believe that teaching is needed from the coaches, but that teaching by the coach doesn't make a player better.




See above.
[Edited 6/13/06 16:11pm]

Exactly. And it's up to the player HIMSELF to internalize those teachings. So if the student isn't willing to learn...who does it fall on? = The student. So again, ONLY the player can make himself better if he decides to internalize and agree to be taught.

PLAYOFF SERIES: NBA finals; Mavericks lead 2-0.

If they keep slowing down Shaquille O'Neal and the Miami Heat the way they did in the first two games of this series, the Dallas Mavericks will be returning home as NBA champions.

O'Neal and the Heat have many adjustments to make if they want to join the Mavericks back in Dallas, going into Game 3 of the NBA finals needing to quickly turn things around or see their season come within one game of ending very abruptly.

StoneCrib said:

It's a distinction without a difference.

But for the teaching of the coach, the player can't get better.

july said:

The Heat's perimeter defense is lacking and Shaq isn't hitting FTs. If that continues, it'll be the Mavs, not the Pistons, that celebrate on the Heat's floor Thursday night.

namepeace said:

When was Shaq ever hittin his FT's. WEll, The Pistons for sure won't be.
D wade and The Heat definitely got to do something. They are getting beat.

namepeace said:

Who told you that nonsense? There are tons of players that improve on their own. You think MJ's talent and skills came SOLELY from just being coached?

That's exactly why I say what I say - The responsibility is on the player to get better NOT the coach. Either the player has the work ethic or IQ or he doesn't. Period.

StoneCrib said:

As through this whole thread, you're taking things out of context.

MJ was the GOAT because of MJ. But he credited both Dean Smith and Phil Jackson with contributing to his success. Here's what he had to say about Dean Smith:

"Coming out of high school I had all the ability in the world but I didn't know the game. Coach taught me the game, when to apply speed, how to use your quickness, when to use that first step, or how to apply certain skills in certain situations. He gave me the knowledge to score 37 points a game and that's something people don't understand."

“Coach taught me the game. . . . He’s like a second father to me.”

I know you don't believe everything you read, but unless you can disprove it, it's right here.

http://users.adelphia.net...smith.html

http://www.randomhouse.co...0375758805

MJ would likely have been great without them both. He was great before Phil came along. But he was that much better because of them. It doesn't mean that the great player is slaw without the coach. It just means he's better than he would have been otherwise.




Again you're splitting hairs. The player's responsibility is to get better. But as you yourself said, a coach is needed to teach. Teaching only makes one better.

Most people get ahead in this world with some help. They choose to accept it or not.
[Edited 6/13/06 19:55pm]

july said:

Tuesday, Jun 13, 2006

Dallas 96
At
Miami 98 Final

DAL: D. Nowitzki 30 Pts, 7 Reb, 1 Ast
MIA: D. Wade 42 Pts, 13 Reb, 2 Ast

Mavericks lead series 2-1

OH MY DAMN!! I know anyone who left that arena early is kicking themselves That was a great last 2 minutes!! I cannot miss the next game, I missed the other two.

I don't really know why but despite wanting Alonzo to get a ring SO bad, I'm rooting for Dallas

Thank you. Case closed.

CalhounSq said:

Or changed the channel.

By the middle of the 3rd quarter I could've sworn Miami had blown it.
So I flipped over to watch the Ken Burns documentary...



...Unforgivable Blackness: The Rise and Fall of Jack Johnson


For some reason, I flipped back just in time to see Miami up by 1 with Dwayne Wade on the line for 2 with very little time left on the clock.


tA

Tribal Disorder

http://www.soundclick.com...dID=182431

theAudience said:

That doc was fucking FANTASTIC

CalhounSq said:

Indeed. Definitely goes on the "must cop" list.

So as not to get a foul called, gotta figure a way to do a post on the documentary on the music forum.
Maybe i'll use Wynton's reluctance to use any of Miles' music.

Plus, don't want to get caught in the crossfire of namepeace & StoneCrib's version of WWIII.





tA

Tribal Disorder

http://www.soundclick.com...dID=182431

theAudience said:

I know, huh? We've been goin' at it!

The Heat won by the skin of their teeth. I dont expect them to win again.