In response 2 someone who said I should discuss maoris in the Prince room.
A Maori is an original inhabitant of New Zealand, they are of Polynesian stock like the Hawaiians and Tahitians (much a like with Maori). They first settled New Zealand about 700 to 1000 years ago, probably from the Cook Islands. The Moriori being eaten by maoris is a racist myth, they were later NZers who settled the Chatham islands aboout 600 years ago. Maoris ate and massacred them there about 1835 when they commandeered an English ship and sailed there, taking Morioris as slaves and food. The last Moriori died in 1933.
Maori were agriculturalists, but found only Kumara (sweeyt potato) and Taro grew in New Zealand, so they resorted to hunting birds such as the moa and fishing. Generally they were hunters and gatherers in the south. The early phase people lived in camps and later (1500-1850) they built pa (forts ) and whare kainga(villages). As population grew , they become masters at living in New Zealands cool maritime climate (a lot like Oregon and Washington coastal and Vancouver Juneau for the far south). But their population peaked at about 120,000 in 1750 and started to decline thru tribal warfare and population pressure. Central in the Maori heirachy were chiefs and great chiefs, whose power was sacred (tapu) and caused many a persons death for trivial transgressions. Also important were tohungas (priests) who were feared even by chiefs, they used their powers for good (noa) and bad (makutu) magic, they were also witchdoctors. Below them were warriors who defended them and the women and children and then slaves, who were captured war prizes, good for service then food, as after 1600 alot of protein was harder to find.NZ's island env soon depleted by Maori.
Europeans arrived in 1642 and then in 1769 Cook rediscovered NZ, but settlement didnt begin until 1814, when NZ was a good market for kauri spars, flax, seals and whaling and later wahines (female whores for Botany Bay).
The Maori were a set of separate tribes who had no written culture or metal tools, they were masters of carving and oratory and song.
Europeans came more and more and maori adopted pig and potato farming as well as guns and alcohol which started many tribal conflicts and the impact of European diseases ensured their numbers plummeted to 40,000 by 1896.
The traety of Waitangi was signed in 1840, and organised church settlements bef=gan. The Maori saw the rest of the 19th century, thru dying, being cheated out of land and treated as second class citizens.

More in a few hours.

NZ

[Edited 11/14/05 20:16pm]

Ocean said:

althom said:

they have the dole over there! Well I'll be!

2 of my best friends are maori chicks

althom said:

(#$*&^#*&^ who pushed ur button!!!

tane1976 said:

Most interesting...do continue!

Ocean said:

Natisse said:

PART 2Longer
Lands were bought at ridiculous prices equating to a few cents an acre from 1840 onwards, Maoris thought the treaty gave them protection from France, Spain and the USA, but the english version of it said, Maori were british subjects and their lands were the property of Queen Victoria. This lead to resistance and war from 1843 to 1846 and 1860 until 1872.
Maori knew to fight more effectively they had to fight as one people not tribes, so the Maori kingitanga (Royalty ) was formed a group of Tainui (A tribe) were made the rulers. The present queen is the sixth ruler. The wars were a stalemate, Britain was sending out reinforcements all the time and many died.
Finally by 1872 the last rebels were caught and dealt with and the nadir of Maoridom begins which lasted to the 1930s. There was bravery on both sides. The later 19th century saw Maori living in pa settlements in margibanal areas, whilst the interior was carved up and settledby Pakeha (white New Zealand) There was little interaction between either group. Maori at this stage were seen as a dying race with ancient customs and a prinmitive backward lifestyle, notably their pillow was being smoothed by the 'benevolent white man'.
About 1900 we get a change, the Maori became fashionable and there is a generation of leaders emerging bringing them into the modern world including Maui Pomare, Apirana Ngata, James Carroll and one u Americans may know Te Rangi Hiroa, the half maori famous archaeologist. these people spoke English were university educated and went around on so called civilisation crusades. They were like the Booker T Washingtons and W.E.B. Du Bois of the Maori people. So may blame them of being more white than Maori.

Also it is interesting to notice that all except Ngata (famous politician and on NZ $50 bill) were half castes. Intermarriage had been going since the whalers, so that by 1950 most Maori had some European blood in them. Until; 1966 such people were given the option as either living as a Maori or Pakeha.

By 1930 the Maori had grown in size and were moving to the cities, more spoke English and were giving up pa life, also their bravery was commented on in the World Wars. This period Maori were more accepted by whites, and by the 1940 Centennial the mission was to promote race relations and equality of the Maori with the white cousin. However it was a myth that survived, Maori still went to native schools which had a paternilistic attitude towards them (Men were trained as farmers, and women as domestic help) it is here they can be compared to Black Americans. Also Maori had difficulty getting houses, jobs and even entrance to movieds theatres. A few got into sport and entertainment and that was it. maori were still seen as the exotic others by the mainstream.
The 1950s saw a mass movement into the citiesa s jobs and industries boomed, NZ was the third richest country in 1957 after USA and Australia. maori ended up with unskilled labour and factory jobs and living in planned suburbs of state housing like projects. There was a rise in teenage pregnancies, violence, gambling, prison material, poor education etc as the forcible immersion into western culture continued.
Compounding these factors was the start of recessions in the 70s and the arrival of Pacific Islanders mostly from Western Samoa, Tonga and the Cooks to work alongside Maoris.

The third and final part tommorrow. Where i link Maori and Black Americans together

althom said:

The number of MAAORI ON THE DOLE HAS dropped from 25 % in 1991 to 7% today, mocking the Maori is not the response I want from this. Like all indigenous people we have problems adjusting to. But not all Maori are dole bludgers. we have Maori in every profession, we have even had a Maori Governor and a Maori deputy Prime minister, Another New Zealand P.M (Norman Kirk) had his quarter Maori ancestry disclosed after he died. Please dont judge.

tane1976 said:

he means no offense ...hes just picking on me

I don't know all that much about the Maori today, but I really enjoyed the movie Once Were Warriors. It wasn't a very flattering portrayal though, so I'm assuming that the Maori feel it was unfair?

retina said:

absolutely BRILLIANT movie have you seen the sequel "What becomes of the broken hearted"? ...as for the unfairness I'm not sure the Maori's I've ever spoken to of it have said life can be like that in some places but I don't know many at all,so...

I LOVE the movies though fucking awesome movies

Natisse said:

No, I never saw the sequel. partly because it received so-so reviews, but mostly because the first movie was so fantastic that I didn't want to risk having my overall impression ruined.

When I saw the first one the screenwriter was there to talk about it afterwards (it was at Stockholm Film Festival). The first thing she said was "Anyone feel like a beer?". There was of course a lot of laughter in the audience, not only because they had been drinking so much beer in the movie, but also because the whole viewing experience had been such a powerful punch in the stomach that people probably had been thinking that they needed a beer to sort out their thoughts.

THE MAORI PART 3

The last part bought us up to postwar urbanisation. Part of this movement to the cities the expectation Maori should live like whites, this was very equivalent to intergration in the states from the 60's onwards. maori lived mostly in lower end accommodation, state houses (NZ Projects), halls, boarding houses, Maori hostels for boys learning trades. A few lived in middle class suburbs, known as pepperpotting, but mostly planned suburbs were set up outside maincentres with names like Mangere, Otara, Porirua, Petone, Aranui, Hei Hei and Flaxmere full of mosdtly unemployed and unskilled MAORI AND Pacific labourers. Schools and pubs were disportionately high in these areas.
From 1973 onwards, Maori and Pacific people lost jobs more than everyone else, so that by 1991 the unemployment rate of Maori was 25% compared to 7% for non maori. By 1990 50% of all prisoners in New Zealand were Maori, yet they made up 12% of the population.
Added to this the low educational statistics, most maori have no Schhool certificate (equivalent to 10th grade) and many are functionally illiterate. We have a benefit here called the DPB for unmarried mothers, nearly all are Maori and Pacific women, Most Maori men are in lockdown, on the dole or dead. Maori have poor health, half still smoke, they are more likely to gamble, most child abuse involves poor maori families, unemployment for Maori is still twice the average rate, incomes are lowest with Maori and Pacific peoples. Like Balck americans increasingly 'liberal' governements have created an underclass of people dependent on benefits (welfare). maori and Pacific women are more fertile than other women here and have more babies and younger than whites.
Many third world diseases like Meningitis and Tubercolosis are common amongst these people due to overcrowding and poor sanitation. Once were Warriors was not a racist stereotype, it was the real life replay of many Poor New Zealander upbringings (mostly Maori, but many White families too here), including mine, my mother could not watch the movie as it boought back too many memories.
The only improvements have been a cultural renaissance, since 1972 the goverment has promoted a Maori language revival and now we have immersion schools for young Maori, we also have a Maori television channel, which of course involves a lot of Prince on the music show, Prince has a huge following amongst New Zealand Maori and gays.
There has also been widescale intermarriage of Pakeha and Maori since the 1960s so now nearly 1,000,000 of 4 million New Zealanders have some Maori blood, most have under half maori and reputedly no full blooded ones survive, many are 3/4 or 1/2 though.
And there is a Waitangi land court since 1975 which has actually given back to tribes some land stolen in the 1800s. There is also a tribal registartion authority trying to get urban Maori in touch with their tribe. The other positive face of Maoridom are the estimated 40-50% that arent in once were warriors type surroundings and live like other NZers. These people are normalised and respected here. I am one of them.
Some argue culture renaissances are not the solution to Maori problems today, and tribalism is definitely not a good thing, look what it has done in Africa.
Maori fit into black culture as like in America they are a brown underclass in society in general (but many are not eg Condalezza, Oprah, Prince). Only maori werent bought there. I heard Blacks are more likely to be in prison than whites, die younger, have worse health, makke less money and be on welfare. Also they have a rich musical heritage, Maori was an oral culture so the songs have surevived to this day, Maori are also adept at singing and the guitar is a favourite adopted instrument. Many maori like and imitate rap and black music. The bad side being the adoption of gangsta culture, we have Maori and Pacific gangsta rappers, with cars, jewels bitches all that shit and Crip style gangs (eg Mongrel Mob, Scribe, Mareko, Respecting Brown Colours, Tribesmen etc) and gangsta rappers festooned with tattoos and rapping in Maori, along with drive by shootings. Parts of large cities are no go areas for whites because of this Maori poverty. Also Provinces of Northland and East Coast have a lot of poor unemployed illiterate Maoris living a semi nomadic existence.
many Maori also like American black ghetto culture as we have people giving babies names like Tyreece, Shamika, Dominiqua, Jayreem, Shanice and Rashawn etc.
Some local music even goes against, a Samoan rapper in NZ has a lyric adressed to Pacific homeboys "Keep it Pacific, not African".

So to conclude thats what I mea about Maori stuff, like African American people we have been ripoffed and judged by white men for too long, but its only now people are realising some of the blame actually lies with us and not white people.
Keep it brown!

retina said:

That movie was really well done...the second was good too ..I have never heard any Maori's say it was unfair ....and I'm related to a few

That movie was really well done...the second was good too ..I have never heard any Maori's say it was unfair ....and I'm related to a few [/quote]


U just heard one now, the movie was aimed at all New Zealanders, where we noticed that abuse and alcoholism are the by products of a welfare state, and just as many if not more white families here are struck by many of (bar the racial factors) the same problems.
Its just that the movie was based on Maori family, in a book written by a Maori Author (Alan Duff) that alot of people assumed all Maoris were like that. My family wasnt we were poor, but my stepfather from the age one, never abused us, and as for books, I never got toys, but if it was a book I always got it. My stepfather who has no kids of his own, raised me as his own, did things with me, answered questions and taught how 2 speak Maori and about the culture I am part of, and he was a big black Maori called JAKE.

tane1976 said:

..it is sad if people start to think that is what all Maori's are like ....of course its not ...there is so much beauty and culture .....I am proud to be from such a beautiful country
[Edited 11/17/05 0:27am]

Ocean said:

Wow ure close, a Prince fan within 2,000 ks of me!!!!!

tane1976 said:

me too! I'm in Melbourne

tane1976 said:

Of course I don't think all Maoris are like that.

I just thought that maybe Maoris reacted strongly against it because they felt it wasn't accurate at all (and I'm not only talking about the alcohol and the abuse). That can happen when a movie tries to capture the feel of a whole culture in ninety or so minutes.

But I guess it wasn't completely off the mark, which is good to hear.

Ocean said:

The view from where I used to live in NZ

Ocean said:

you lived on a island?

Christopher said:

...yeah the north island lol .....that was the view from the lounge window (except higher up..we lived on a hill above this area).....looking towards the south island..(very faint in the background)