An article from the very talented but puff-piece writer Alison Samuels . . .

Black Like Whom?

Justin Loses CredNewsweekApril 5 issue - Has Justin Timberlake's all-access pass to the black entertainment universe been revoked? Few white artists have enjoyed as much support among African-Americans as Timberlake, thanks to a debut solo CD jammed with classic R&B and tracks produced by the likes of hip-hop maestro Timbaland. Just last year he was nominated for best male artist at the Soul Train Music Awards, and he performed during the ceremony to raucous applause, cementing his status as a less-talented version of reigning R&B prince Usher. But some believe he showed his true color after Janet Jackson's wardrobe infamously malfunctioned at the Super Bowl—and, in their view, allowed her to take all the heat for what happened. "If I do recall, there were two people on that stage," says actress-rapper Queen Latifah. "He loses a lot of my respect for not taking responsibility for his actions. I think that was real shady on his part."

Timberlake, who had a brief fling with Jackson last year, laughed off the boob-baring brouhaha at first. But as soon as it exploded into a scandal, he began making appearances on talk shows during which he issued sniffling apologies and implied that he was the unwitting victim of a planned publicity stunt. Tellingly, some think, he never once spoke out in Jackson's defense. It was particularly galling to those who believe that Timberlake has become rich off urban culture. "It's just maddening because he was as black as black could be until Super Bowl night," says a close friend of Jackson's. "In his mind, he was as black as 50 Cent because he knew the words to a Marvin Gaye song. He rolled in both worlds, living it up. But as soon as something went wrong, we got a chance to see how white he really was. He left Janet hanging big time, and she's still hurt by that."

Let the fallout commence. After Timberlake agreed to cohost Motown's upcoming 45th-anniversary show on ABC with Lionel Richie, black activist groups launched a phone and e-mail protest. "[His selection] is a cultural insult to the black community," says Najee Ali, executive director of Project Islamic Hope. Timberlake soon bailed out, citing a scheduling conflict.

—Allison Samuels

I'm always intrigued by articles such as this one. "Let's do a story on how the 'black community' has revoked Justin Timberlake's honorary black status."

Maybe it was never as cut-and-dry as all that, Newsweek.

Before the Super Bowl, a lot of black people weren't feeling Timberlake. We resented his misappropriation of cultural styles and symbols, and we felt like he was just pulling an Elvis/Madonna/Vanilla Ice/Eminem: exploiting white, "mainstream" America's simultaneious, dualistic love of traditionally black styles but distrust of blacks themselves. (Forgive the generalization.)

So, no, some of us saw Timbaland's production as a mere update of Maurice Starr's production for the New Kids on the Block (showbiz, paying the bills).

None of this diminishes whatever sincere interest JT may have in classic soul or R&B, but I find it funny that someone who seemed so professionally close to the Jackson family (publicly idolizing Michael, performing with N'Sync at MJ's MSG concerts, dating Janet) would have responded the way he did after the Super Bowl incident. (Again, it all appeared to have been showbiz.)

A lot of blacks who'd resented Timberlake, at that point, were like: "See? We told you he was a fake." Then had the nerve to try to evoke Stevie Wonder at the Grammies a few weeks later. Rocking behind an electric piano while playing (merely) a simple chord progression.

But, the Newsweek article glosses over the distinction between black people giving JT a "pass" and buying his records in droves, and JT exploiting black styles to be popular with young, nonblack consumers and getting the majority of his support from them.

I suspect more whites are responsible for his success (regardless of his musical connections) than the article would suggest. As a result, it implies a stronger relationship between JT and black consumers than I believe exists. But, they needed an "edgy" article that relied upon their flawed premise.
[This message was edited Tue Mar 30 15:18:43 2004 by ThreadBare]

I disagree Thread. I think Justin really marketed himself to the black community with appearances on 106 and park, etc. I thin he wanted the love of the community and I think he messed up. Although I don't think he thought about what his response would/should be after the incident and I don't think its a black/white issue per se, but that he simply didn't do the right thing in this situation.

does that make sense....sometimes i type stuff when i'm hungry or sleepy.

ThreadBare said:

There are some small but pointed distinctions that can be drawn among those artists. Madonna always portrayed herself as a pop artist but her early singles were flavored with R-&-B. Em was essentially a product of Dr. Dre -- an ironic role reversal, with the black producer exploiting the talents of the white performer. But Em has bona fide talent. Same, to an extent, with JT and the Neptunes/Timbaland, as you mentioned, at least the black folk are getting paid. JT obviously angled Justified to be this generation's Off The Wall.




Yeah, he was going for his bona fides on Grammy night. He should have just performed the song. I never thought Justin was fake per se. But the SB thing made me re-evaluate.



Significant distrinctions and good points. Altho IMHO, Alison Samuels is a glorified puff-piece writer who deserves an opportunity to do more substantive stuff.

i think the point he should have made was that the african american community accepted justin....thus giving him credibility within the mainstream suburban communities that want to be "hip" like that..

you know, the same foo's that make eminem a top seller...

JT sold out an entire race of people by his actions after the Super Bowl deal??? Who'd a thought it??

Supernova said:

It's clear to me for two reasons! I'll just give you the intials. B and W.

I think Justin should lose his man "pass". He's a pussy ass bitch!

Supernova said:

I think the reaeson most of it was laid on Janet is cuz it was her boob! All in all, Justin did the wrong thing here and now he's paying for it. I think the effect would have been similar if he were black as well.

Supernova said:

Fuck a Justin Timberlake. Stand up and be a man about it, JT. Stand up and say how it's fucked up that you snatched an article of clothing off a woman which some of us found a wee bit misogynist. Stand up and apologize to Janet Jackson for hanging her out to dry. fucking punk.

ThreadBare said:

Elvis, yes, I can understand your line of thinking. Vanilla Ice and Eminem? Yes. But Madonna is a dance/pop artist. How is she "exploiting white, "mainstream" America's simultaneious, dualistic love of traditionally black styles but distrust of blacks themselves"?

I take issue with the fact that you seem to paint all white artists playing "black" music with the same brush: they're exploitive racists and nothing more? I don't think so. You cite Vanilla Ice (who had a 5-minute career) and Eminem (who, yes, is a *gasp* good lyricist), but it's clear that the R&B, rap and hip-hop world is very much dominated by black artists. Eminem and Vanilla Ice are at best "pop" rappers. But no, I can't see any foundation to the claim that Elvis (or anyone else) was exploitive simply BECAUSE he was influenced by black music. The Spanish invented the guitar - are we to say that Jimi Hendrix and Prince can't pick it up (or if they do, they're "exploiting" the Spanish) because they're black?

I'm always amused that people consider Justified an R&B record. At its heart, it is dance/pop. From the synths of "Cry Me A River" to the "Holiday"-lite "Rock Your Body" and the flamenco touches on "Senorita", this is a production landscape that no self-respecting R&B artist would be caught dead in. Justin is an asshole, but he is not (and never was) an "R&B artist". He is guilty of selling out Janet, but the media is more guilty because they allowed it to happen (and we all know why). Hope that makes sense.
[This message was edited Wed Mar 31 8:52:51 2004 by VoicesCarry]

ThreadBare said:

Exactly. This is what is basically comes down to. Very well said.

VoicesCarry said:

Madonna enjoyed a fairly dualistic career spent mining the latest marginal, usually minority-driven crazes and introducing them along in her latest incarnation (hairstyle, beau, scandal, etc.), flirting with "ethnic, exotic" styles and fusing them with her slickly produced dance style and unreliable voice. From her black church scene in "Like a Prayer" to voguing to her latina look in "La Isla Bonita" to the hentai designs that drew so much attention -- Madonna's made a career on getting the hottest producers and ethnic looks and making the resulting products very much her own. But even her most consistent look remains "all-American" --- the bottle blonde, Monroe-ish bombshell. But hey, I'm no bell hooks, who broke her down far more eloquently than I'm doing right now. Maybe you've read this before --> http://stevenstanley.trip...donna.html



Not what I was doing, VC. I listed 4 specific entertainers who have relied fairly heavily on black influences in the establishment of their images and styles, ranging from the farcical (Vanilla Ice) to the genuinely talented (Eminem). I didn't make the generalization that you inferred.

Nope. Not I. Not when, on this board, you'll find me raving about Nikka Costa, Anastacia, Diana Krall, Nichole Nordeman, Harry Connick Jr., Teena Marie (whose stuff i admire but don't buy), Paula Cole, even Madonna on occasion (when she showcases her voice correctly, as in "Take a Bow," things work out well) or blues(y) guitarists Phil Keaggy, Eric Clapton, Stevie Ray Vaughan, Doyle Bramhall II, Johnny Lang, Pat Methaney, Steve Winwood or John Mayer. No one has to pass some cultural credibility litmus test with me. Artistry is artistry. But, let's not be blind about the way some folks have gained their own crossover appeal.



I never characterized his work, so I'm assuming you're no longer addressing me at this point.


(A guitarist's edit...)
[This message was edited Wed Mar 31 13:14:03 2004 by ThreadBare]

TheOrgerFormerlyKnownAs said:

WORD. BITCH-ASS.

ThreadBare said:

I still don't agree with your assessment of Madonna (I don't believe she's exploited culture to make her music - her image is another matter, but then many artists are guilty of that, including Tupac; additionally, the "Like A Prayer" video was an indictment of racism if you watch it again - she wasn't exploiting it), but thanks for clarifying your other points. And, no, the final paragraph was not addressing you, just the inane white column writers who believe Justin to be the savior of R&B.
[This message was edited Wed Mar 31 13:37:59 2004 by VoicesCarry]

pimpdoutt said:

Sorry to say, but I'm gonna have to go along with you guys on this one. I was a fan of JT all the way up until the Superbowl deal happened and at first I thought maybe Janet did use Justin as a vehicle to take the heat off Michael and when JT played victim I felt for him, but then somebody said yeah, but he wasn't playing the victim right after it happened when he bragged to the reporter "yeah we had to give them somethin' to talk about" after that I realized that he thought it was ok at first to do what you just did to boost your ladies man reputation, but as soon as the FCC was talking about messin with your millions, then you want to cry to your mama like you did on Punk'd. Janet invited him to perform with him and he accepted and I'm sure that he knew what was gonna take place. I believe he took the opportunity because he wanted to outdo the Britney-Madonna kiss at the VMA's. He was probably tired of seeing them everywhere and tired of people constantly talking about Britney and once again he wanted to prove his adulthood and shed the Mickey Mouse Club/N'Sync bubblegum image and get R rated, but it backfired. I too have lost it for Justin Timberlake. Do us all a favor and go back to N'Sync.

the most intriguing thing about this article is that it implies there is supposed to be solidarity among black people that what went on at the SuperBowl was alright, and that Janet should get a pass, as if this were a pressing race issue.


hmmm seems kind of offensive to me.

TurnItUp said:

i find it amusing that all these mickey mouse club members are going all out to look like cheap skanks. most people can be comsidered an adult without kissing another woman on stage, mud wrestling like a whore, or tearing off a 37 year old woman's breast covering. maybe they should try acting mature instead of slutty and then people will respect them.

jessyMD32781 said:

you will note, of course, that in the 2 main examples there, there were veteran pop divas involved/initiating the incidents. it's not a matter of age or newness of their careers.

togdog said:

As far as I'm concerned, how I feel about it has nothing to do with race. As far as them thinking there's this solidarity among balck people, they oughta stop talking generalizations.

TheOrgerFormerlyKnownAs said:

i agree. but that seems to be the tone of the article.

TurnItUp said:

word. that bitch-ass needs to go back to the mickey mouse club with the rest of the little boys. i still can't believe he'd let janet take the fall like that. but y'all know it ALWAYS comes back around.