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PrintableEllisDee said: minneapolisgenius said: Even though the Clash were better musicians and had more staying power, I still have to go with the Sex Pistols. I just like their sound better personally.
i knew there was a reason why i loved you...  ... the clash were more musically varied, but they were also more inconsistent.. the sex pistols came in, released one studio album full of shit and anger without a bad song on it, and that's that... if the clash had stopped while they were on top ("london calling"), then i might think better of them.. but as it is, i only think of them as good, whereas i think of the pistols as great...
plus, johnny rotten is one of my all-time favorite people on the planet...  The Pistols only had one album in them anyway, of which the bulk of the best bits were written by Glenn Matclock. Sid Vicious was as musically talentless as he was a pathetic, cretinous, junkie poseur. Imagine what a complete dud a second album would have been, had they all stayed together. If you want proof, just look at what happened after Lydon had the good sense to leave. "Silly Thing", great as it is, is not "Submission" or "Seventeen" is it? The Clash, on the other hand, had a whole lot more to give. They remained a punk band even when they were playing "disco". The music may have changed, but the lyrics still had the same edge. "Magnificent 7" was a rap version of "Janie Jones", updated and uprooted to New York. The Clash never reformed. There was no "Rob Your Bank!" World Tour 1999. Joe was dead set against it. They didn't even perform at the private screening of "Westway To The World", despite all four of them being there and instruments having been set up for that purpose. They would have played again at the Hall of Fame, had Joe lived, but it would have been strictly a one off show. [This message was edited Sat Feb 28 14:01:48 2004 by Shapeshifter] There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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Shapeshifter said: EllisDee said: i knew there was a reason why i loved you... ... the clash were more musically varied, but they were also more inconsistent.. the sex pistols came in, released one studio album full of shit and anger without a bad song on it, and that's that... if the clash had stopped while they were on top ("london calling"), then i might think better of them.. but as it is, i only think of them as good, whereas i think of the pistols as great...
plus, johnny rotten is one of my all-time favorite people on the planet... The Pistols only had one album in them anyway, of which the bulk of the best bits were written by Glenn Matclock. Sid Vicious was as musically talentless as he was a pathetic, cretinous, junkie poseur. Imagine what a complete dud a second album would have been, had they all stayed together. If you want proof, just look at what happened after Lydon had the good sense to leave. "Silly Thing", great as it is, is not "Submission" or "Seventeen" is it? The Clash, on the other hand, had a whole lot more to give. They remained a punk band even when they were playing "disco". The music may have changed, but the lyrics still had the same edge. "Magnificent 7" was a rap version of "Janie Jones", updated and uprooted to New York. The Clash never reformed. There was no "Rob Your Bank!" World Tour 1999. Joe was dead set against it. They didn't even perform at the private screening of "Westway To The World", despite all four of them being there and instruments having been set up for that purpose. They would have played again at the Hall of Fame, had Joe lived, but it would have been strictly a one off show. [This message was edited Sat Feb 28 14:01:48 2004 by Shapeshifter] Sid Vicious WAS a talentless junkie that couldn't play for shit, but they still had one great album no matter who wrote their songs. I for one am glad they quit while they were ahead. It leaves me with memories of what I consider to be a really kickass album and somehow that makes it more special. "I saw a woman with major Hammer pants on the subway a few weeks ago and totally thought of you." - sextonseven | |
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Shapeshifter said: EllisDee said: i knew there was a reason why i loved you... ... the clash were more musically varied, but they were also more inconsistent.. the sex pistols came in, released one studio album full of shit and anger without a bad song on it, and that's that... if the clash had stopped while they were on top ("london calling"), then i might think better of them.. but as it is, i only think of them as good, whereas i think of the pistols as great...
plus, johnny rotten is one of my all-time favorite people on the planet... The Pistols only had one album in them anyway, of which the bulk of the best bits were written by Glenn Matclock. Sid Vicious was as musically talentless as he was a pathetic, cretinous, junkie poseur. Imagine what a complete dud a second album would have been, had they all stayed together. If you want proof, just look at what happened after Lydon had the good sense to leave. "Silly Thing", great as it is, is not "Submission" or "Seventeen" is it? The Clash, on the other hand, had a whole lot more to give. They remained a punk band even when they were playing "disco". The music may have changed, but the lyrics still had the same edge. "Magnificent 7" was a rap version of "Janie Jones", updated and uprooted to New York. The Clash never reformed. There was no "Rob Your Bank!" World Tour 1999. Joe was dead set against it. They didn't even perform at the private screening of "Westway To The World", despite all four of them being there and instruments having been set up for that purpose. They would have played again at the Hall of Fame, had Joe lived, but it would have been strictly a one off show. [This message was edited Sat Feb 28 14:01:48 2004 by Shapeshifter] ok... you say the bulk of it was written by a glenn as if that's a bad thing... ummm, let's see... what band was glenn matlock in..? oh yeah, that's right... the fuckin' sex pistols... and since the majority of the songs were already written before he left the band, it would make sense that he did write a good chunk of the album... no-one has ever denied this... glen matlock was the musical force and johnny rotten was the lyrical... i've never counted sid... sid does not play on "nevermind," and he was nothing more than a replacement member... and i honestly believe that if they had retained the original line-up, that they'd have had other good albums in them... but that said, i think it's part of the mystique that they came in and hit it and quit it... busted out one of the most influential albums of all time and were out like fat bitches in a game of dodge ball...  Mr. Ellis Dee-licious, the Official NPGigolo 
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The CLASH... SANDANISTA ,LOndon Calling, This Is Radio CLASH! I LOVE the CLASH! BIG AUDIO DYNAMITE is Really COOL also. | |
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EllisDee said: Shapeshifter said: The Pistols only had one album in them anyway, of which the bulk of the best bits were written by Glenn Matclock. Sid Vicious was as musically talentless as he was a pathetic, cretinous, junkie poseur. Imagine what a complete dud a second album would have been, had they all stayed together. If you want proof, just look at what happened after Lydon had the good sense to leave. "Silly Thing", great as it is, is not "Submission" or "Seventeen" is it? The Clash, on the other hand, had a whole lot more to give. They remained a punk band even when they were playing "disco". The music may have changed, but the lyrics still had the same edge. "Magnificent 7" was a rap version of "Janie Jones", updated and uprooted to New York. The Clash never reformed. There was no "Rob Your Bank!" World Tour 1999. Joe was dead set against it. They didn't even perform at the private screening of "Westway To The World", despite all four of them being there and instruments having been set up for that purpose. They would have played again at the Hall of Fame, had Joe lived, but it would have been strictly a one off show. [This message was edited Sat Feb 28 14:01:48 2004 by Shapeshifter] ok... you say the bulk of it was written by a glenn as if that's a bad thing... ummm, let's see... what band was glenn matlock in..? oh yeah, that's right... the fuckin' sex pistols... and since the majority of the songs were already written before he left the band, it would make sense that he did write a good chunk of the album... no-one has ever denied this... glen matlock was the musical force and johnny rotten was the lyrical... i've never counted sid... sid does not play on "nevermind," and he was nothing more than a replacement member... and i honestly believe that if they had retained the original line-up, that they'd have had other good albums in them... but that said, i think it's part of the mystique that they came in and hit it and quit it... busted out one of the most influential albums of all time and were out like fat bitches in a game of dodge ball... Only Johnny Rotten was "out like a fat bitch in a game of dodge ball". The others carried on, remember? "The Great Rock N Roll Swindle" soundtrack featured a good six or seven tracks recorded by Cook, Jones, Vicious and assorted vocalists. Cook and Jones went on to further wipe their arses on the Pistols's legacy by trying to recruit one Jimmy Pursey as a vocalist. He was in punk also-rans, Sham 69. Their name? The Sham Pistols - with no real trace of irony there either. There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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The Clash.
The Sex Pistols were a joke, a bunch of talentless tossers - the ultimate example of style over substance, marketing over music. The Clash could play, could write songs. Joe Strummer went on to have a good musical career. Lydon ended up swearing at Jordan in a jungle. | |
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Shapeshifter said: EllisDee said: ok... you say the bulk of it was written by a glenn as if that's a bad thing... ummm, let's see... what band was glenn matlock in..? oh yeah, that's right... the fuckin' sex pistols... and since the majority of the songs were already written before he left the band, it would make sense that he did write a good chunk of the album... no-one has ever denied this... glen matlock was the musical force and johnny rotten was the lyrical... i've never counted sid... sid does not play on "nevermind," and he was nothing more than a replacement member... and i honestly believe that if they had retained the original line-up, that they'd have had other good albums in them... but that said, i think it's part of the mystique that they came in and hit it and quit it... busted out one of the most influential albums of all time and were out like fat bitches in a game of dodge ball... Only Johnny Rotten was "out like a fat bitch in a game of dodge ball". The others carried on, remember? "The Great Rock N Roll Swindle" soundtrack featured a good six or seven tracks recorded by Cook, Jones, Vicious and assorted vocalists. Cook and Jones went on to further wipe their arses on the Pistols's legacy by trying to recruit one Jimmy Pursey as a vocalist. He was in punk also-rans, Sham 69. Their name? The Sham Pistols - with no real trace of irony there either. the sex pistols were no longer the sex pistols after johnny rotten, regardless of the name... and it's no surprise that the ONLY good songs on the "great r&r" are the ones that feature rotten... Mr. Ellis Dee-licious, the Official NPGigolo
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I like PUBLIC IMAGE LIMITED better than THE SEX PISTOLs. There were some great PIL songs in the 80's. | |
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1p1p1i3 said: The Clash.
The Sex Pistols were a joke, a bunch of talentless tossers - the ultimate example of style over substance, marketing over music. The Clash could play, could write songs. Joe Strummer went on to have a good musical career. Lydon ended up swearing at Jordan in a jungle. Wouldn't call the original Pistols "a joke", and they definitely were NOT talentless tossers (apart from Sid). Johnny Rotten/John Lydon was/is one of the greatest rock lyricists ever. Their original incarnation (with Matlock) COULD play and wrote some absolutely FANTASTIC songs ("Bodies", "Pretty Vacant", "Anarchy", "God Save the Queen" et al are great), BUT they had no staying power beyond one album. I know it's a matter of taste, but I think Joe Strummer produced very little of any worth on his own without Mick Jones and Topper Headon as foils. The latters's output was way more interesting. Topper's "Waking Up" album was, for the most part, excellent - and hugely under appreciated. Mick Jones's first Big Audio Dynamite album continued The Clash's musical tradition of being way ahead of contemporary music trends. Strummer produced very little material between 1985 and 1999 - one solo album, a couple of soundtracks, and that was it. When he did return it was with half-baked songs that sounded like a Clash tribute act trying to rewrite "Combat Rock". Lydon - who, by the way, was only on the Peter Andre Show for charity - was not only far more prolific than Strummer, he made two more hugely influential albums albums (PIL's debut and "Metal Box"), and has had a big hand in at least a dozen corking songs, the best of which is "Rise". There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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Shapeshifter said: 1p1p1i3 said: The Clash.
The Sex Pistols were a joke, a bunch of talentless tossers - the ultimate example of style over substance, marketing over music. The Clash could play, could write songs. Joe Strummer went on to have a good musical career. Lydon ended up swearing at Jordan in a jungle. Wouldn't call the original Pistols "a joke", and they definitely were NOT talentless tossers (apart from Sid). Johnny Rotten/John Lydon was/is one of the greatest rock lyricists ever. Their original incarnation (with Matlock) COULD play and wrote some absolutely FANTASTIC songs ("Bodies", "Pretty Vacant", "Anarchy", "God Save the Queen" et al are great), BUT they had no staying power beyond one album. I know it's a matter of taste, but I think Joe Strummer produced very little of any worth on his own without Mick Jones and Topper Headon as foils. The latters's output was way more interesting. Topper's "Waking Up" album was, for the most part, excellent - and hugely under appreciated. Mick Jones's first Big Audio Dynamite album continued The Clash's musical tradition of being way ahead of contemporary music trends. Strummer produced very little material between 1985 and 1999 - one solo album, a couple of soundtracks, and that was it. When he did return it was with half-baked songs that sounded like a Clash tribute act trying to rewrite "Combat Rock". Lydon - who, by the way, was only on the Peter Andre Show for charity - was not only far more prolific than Strummer, he made two more hugely influential albums albums (PIL's debut and "Metal Box"), and has had a big hand in at least a dozen corking songs, the best of which is "Rise". Lydon was on the show for himself, not for charity. He was there to get a bit of publicity and try and get some cash. BTW, quote me some of these "greatest rock lyrics"... I reckon I need educating... | |
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1p1p1i3 said: Shapeshifter said: Wouldn't call the original Pistols "a joke", and they definitely were NOT talentless tossers (apart from Sid). Johnny Rotten/John Lydon was/is one of the greatest rock lyricists ever. Their original incarnation (with Matlock) COULD play and wrote some absolutely FANTASTIC songs ("Bodies", "Pretty Vacant", "Anarchy", "God Save the Queen" et al are great), BUT they had no staying power beyond one album. I know it's a matter of taste, but I think Joe Strummer produced very little of any worth on his own without Mick Jones and Topper Headon as foils. The latters's output was way more interesting. Topper's "Waking Up" album was, for the most part, excellent - and hugely under appreciated. Mick Jones's first Big Audio Dynamite album continued The Clash's musical tradition of being way ahead of contemporary music trends. Strummer produced very little material between 1985 and 1999 - one solo album, a couple of soundtracks, and that was it. When he did return it was with half-baked songs that sounded like a Clash tribute act trying to rewrite "Combat Rock". Lydon - who, by the way, was only on the Peter Andre Show for charity - was not only far more prolific than Strummer, he made two more hugely influential albums albums (PIL's debut and "Metal Box"), and has had a big hand in at least a dozen corking songs, the best of which is "Rise". Lydon was on the show for himself, not for charity. He was there to get a bit of publicity and try and get some cash. BTW, quote me some of these "greatest rock lyrics"... I reckon I need educating... Lydon appeared on the show to raise money for an African environmental charity. Seriously. As for greatest rock lyrics - well, go listen to the key songs on "Never Mind the Bollocks", the first two PIL albums or the wonderful eco-punk song that's "Don't Ask Me". [This message was edited Sun Feb 29 9:08:40 2004 by Shapeshifter] There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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Shapeshifter said: 1p1p1i3 said: Lydon was on the show for himself, not for charity. He was there to get a bit of publicity and try and get some cash. BTW, quote me some of these "greatest rock lyrics"... I reckon I need educating... Lydon appeared on the show to raise money for an African environmental charity. Seriously. As for greatest rock lyrics - well, go listen to the key songs on "Never Mind the Bollocks", the first two PIL albums or the wonderful eco-punk song that's "Don't Ask Me". [This message was edited Sun Feb 29 9:08:40 2004 by Shapeshifter] You don't think the fame that goes with it had ANYTHING to do with it? If he wanted to raise money, there are plenty of ways to go about it. Still, good on him for giving some of the money coming his way to charity. And go on - quote me some lyrics!! Pick your fave. | |
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1p1p1i3 said: Shapeshifter said: Lydon appeared on the show to raise money for an African environmental charity. Seriously. As for greatest rock lyrics - well, go listen to the key songs on "Never Mind the Bollocks", the first two PIL albums or the wonderful eco-punk song that's "Don't Ask Me". [This message was edited Sun Feb 29 9:08:40 2004 by Shapeshifter] You don't think the fame that goes with it had ANYTHING to do with it? If he wanted to raise money, there are plenty of ways to go about it. Still, good on him for giving some of the money coming his way to charity. And go on - quote me some lyrics!! Pick your fave. "I was born with a plastic spoon in my mouth". There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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1p1p1i3 said: Shapeshifter said: Lydon appeared on the show to raise money for an African environmental charity. Seriously. As for greatest rock lyrics - well, go listen to the key songs on "Never Mind the Bollocks", the first two PIL albums or the wonderful eco-punk song that's "Don't Ask Me". [This message was edited Sun Feb 29 9:08:40 2004 by Shapeshifter] You don't think the fame that goes with it had ANYTHING to do with it? If he wanted to raise money, there are plenty of ways to go about it. Still, good on him for giving some of the money coming his way to charity. And go on - quote me some lyrics!! Pick your fave. "Hello?/Is it me you're looking for?" There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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Shapeshifter said: 1p1p1i3 said: You don't think the fame that goes with it had ANYTHING to do with it? If he wanted to raise money, there are plenty of ways to go about it. Still, good on him for giving some of the money coming his way to charity. And go on - quote me some lyrics!! Pick your fave. "I was born with a plastic spoon in my mouth". great lyric mate !!!, sorry i was never in2 the fall ! | |
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Shapeshifter said: 1p1p1i3 said: The Clash.
The Sex Pistols were a joke, a bunch of talentless tossers - the ultimate example of style over substance, marketing over music. The Clash could play, could write songs. Joe Strummer went on to have a good musical career. Lydon ended up swearing at Jordan in a jungle. Wouldn't call the original Pistols "a joke", and they definitely were NOT talentless tossers (apart from Sid). Johnny Rotten/John Lydon was/is one of the greatest rock lyricists ever. Their original incarnation (with Matlock) COULD play and wrote some absolutely FANTASTIC songs ("Bodies", "Pretty Vacant", "Anarchy", "God Save the Queen" et al are great), BUT they had no staying power beyond one album. I know it's a matter of taste, but I think Joe Strummer produced very little of any worth on his own without Mick Jones and Topper Headon as foils. The latters's output was way more interesting. Topper's "Waking Up" album was, for the most part, excellent - and hugely under appreciated. Mick Jones's first Big Audio Dynamite album continued The Clash's musical tradition of being way ahead of contemporary music trends. Strummer produced very little material between 1985 and 1999 - one solo album, a couple of soundtracks, and that was it. When he did return it was with half-baked songs that sounded like a Clash tribute act trying to rewrite "Combat Rock". Lydon - who, by the way, was only on the Peter Andre Show for charity - was not only far more prolific than Strummer, he made two more hugely influential albums albums (PIL's debut and "Metal Box"), and has had a big hand in at least a dozen corking songs, the best of which is "Rise". great response shapeshifter, u r bang on again !!! | |
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 even if i say so myself this has been a really good thread  | |
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danielboon said: even if i say so myself this has been a really good thread I second that. Some Prince fans have got great music taste. Others like Janet Jackson. There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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I'll give you a good reason why The Clash was better. Joe sang, screamed, and ranted with soul. Johnny just screamed and ranted with anger. Anger usually doesn't prevail in the end. Passion does. [This message was edited Sun Feb 29 17:59:51 2004 by NWF] NEW WAVE FOREVER: SLAVE TO THE WAVE FROM THE CRADLE TO THE GRAVE. | |
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NWF said: I'll give you a good reason why The Clash was better. Joe sang, screamed, and ranted with soul. Johnny just screamed and ranted with anger. Anger usually doesn't prevail in the end. Passion does.
[This message was edited Sun Feb 29 17:59:51 2004 by NWF] I think Johnny put his heart and soul into his songs, as much as Joe did. Their phrasing was, however, very different. Joe hectored, Johnny sneered. Don't forget that Joe was a seasoned pub circuit r'n'b singer (now, this was when it stood for rhythm and blues as opposed to what it stands for today ... ), Johnny had never been in a band before The Pistols. Joe had vocal training (albeit through practice), Johnny had none. He just opened his mouth and out it came, the way he felt it. Johnny was as passionate as he was angry. Listen to "Bodies" or "Holidays In the Sun" and you'll hear disgust AND a lot of pity there too. Then there's most of his stuff with PIL ... [This message was edited Mon Mar 1 1:39:29 2004 by Shapeshifter] There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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Hmmmm.
Well, John was a much better frontman than Joe in my opinion. However, The Clash were better musicaly. The Pistols were just pub rock. Without John they would have been awful. The Pistols made the classic singles but The Clash made the classic albums. John's best stuff was with P.I.L. "You know, you're the classic example of the inverse ratio between the size of the mouth and the size of the brain" | |
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danielboon said: sermwanderer said: The Clash all the way. I'm glad the Pistols happened etc., but who really sits around listening to Never Mind the Bollocks?
Whereas we got The Clash, London Calling, Sandanista, Give 'em enough rope..... hey my henke loving friend !!! ive been listening 2 NMTB sinve i was 14 years old i'll b 40 in march and i'm still listening !!! one of my all time fave's !!! so sorry i do sit around listening 2 it ...naw,, jump around listening 2 it !!! u couldnt sit through the bollocks now could ya ??? ps every time i hear the intro 2 pretty vacant , it takes me right back to my bedroom in 1978 , i can c myself staring at the 7in picture sleeve, theres a bus on it going 2 "no fun" i always usta wonder wre that f**kin bus was goin
gothenburg here we come !!! henke's last minute goal made all the difference ! how did they beat the dutch/germans ....mystery ??? [This message was edited Fri Feb 27 6:17:52 2004 by danielboon] Yeah, well mabye if I was around at the time I'd think different, so point taken. For me it is more of a pivotal moment than a record. I remember being about 14 too when I first heard White Riot. Now that was a white light. Fantastic This season just keeps getting better Danny ma bhoy! Could we possibly tie the league up at castle greyskull? And yeah, that Teplice mob were poor, they may have put top class Euro teams out, but lets be honest, they are hardly the Celts!!! U going on Sunday? Not cheap, but another oppurtunity to laugh at the huns? Priceless “If I can shoot rabbits/then I can shoot fascists” | |
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sermwanderer said: danielboon said: hey my henke loving friend !!! ive been listening 2 NMTB sinve i was 14 years old i'll b 40 in march and i'm still listening !!! one of my all time fave's !!! so sorry i do sit around listening 2 it ...naw,, jump around listening 2 it !!! u couldnt sit through the bollocks now could ya ??? ps every time i hear the intro 2 pretty vacant , it takes me right back to my bedroom in 1978 , i can c myself staring at the 7in picture sleeve, theres a bus on it going 2 "no fun" i always usta wonder wre that f**kin bus was goin
gothenburg here we come !!! henke's last minute goal made all the difference ! how did they beat the dutch/germans ....mystery ??? [This message was edited Fri Feb 27 6:17:52 2004 by danielboon] Yeah, well mabye if I was around at the time I'd think different, so point taken. For me it is more of a pivotal moment than a record. I remember being about 14 too when I first heard White Riot. Now that was a white light. Fantastic This season just keeps getting better Danny ma bhoy! Could we possibly tie the league up at castle greyskull? And yeah, that Teplice mob were poor, they may have put top class Euro teams out, but lets be honest, they are hardly the Celts!!! U going on Sunday? Not cheap, but another oppurtunity to laugh at the huns? Priceless yes i'll b there sunday , i actually managed 2 get a ticket 4 my girlfriend ..her 1st old firm game  , ur right bout the pricing seems silly complaining cos we bought the fuckin tiks, but how can they justify £19 europe and £29 scots cup ?? if we were playin any other team in the league the tiks would b £10 cheaper so my friend we r being robbed !
wotabout the huns they gotta pay it knowing they will get humped
do u kno any good celtic forums ? orgnote me if u do pls thanx. i reckon it'll b 3/4 - 0 , on sunday u never kno it mite even b more they r rotten just now | |
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danielboon said: sermwanderer said: Yeah, well mabye if I was around at the time I'd think different, so point taken. For me it is more of a pivotal moment than a record. I remember being about 14 too when I first heard White Riot. Now that was a white light. Fantastic This season just keeps getting better Danny ma bhoy! Could we possibly tie the league up at castle greyskull? And yeah, that Teplice mob were poor, they may have put top class Euro teams out, but lets be honest, they are hardly the Celts!!! U going on Sunday? Not cheap, but another oppurtunity to laugh at the huns? Priceless yes i'll b there sunday , i actually managed 2 get a ticket 4 my girlfriend ..her 1st old firm game , ur right bout the pricing seems silly complaining cos we bought the fuckin tiks, but how can they justify £19 europe and £29 scots cup ?? if we were playin any other team in the league the tiks would b £10 cheaper so my friend we r being robbed !
wotabout the huns they gotta pay it knowing they will get humped
do u kno any good celtic forums ? orgnote me if u do pls thanx. i reckon it'll b 3/4 - 0 , on sunday u never kno it mite even b more they r rotten just now Funny u should mention Celtic forums, me and my mate were talking about how there are no decent Celtic ones. So I don't know I'm thinking more than 3/4, especially with 'Ice' Berg and his outburst. I reckon we'll send them home to figure out to keep Hearts at bay 
from Henriks Tongue Just to bring this thread back on track! “If I can shoot rabbits/then I can shoot fascists” | |
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